Jim, I need your help.

[accordlx]

I am considering switching to Koni's vs. my current Tokico Blues. What are the pros and cons of each shock side by side? Which has the longer cartridges and and what in your opinion is the better shock for my lowered car. I like the Tokicos but really need an expert opinion. Im considering the factors of durablity, handling, and ride comfort in my decision.

Thanks,

Chris

BTW, I run Ractive coilovers lowered 3" in the front and 2 1/2" in the back, and have the Prelude front A arms. I also use the LX-i swaybars front and back on my LX.

[Jims 86LXI HB]

Hmmm, loaded questions:D

Well none of the struts avaible for our cars have shorter bodies or piston rods. Well their is a way to get adjustable koni sports,...for a price. $1050, which do have shorter front bodies.

Side by side the koni's are going to be a firmer sturt,..period. Since tokico did not have any specs regarding compression or rebound, I cannot offer any help their. However, in reading countless poster from owners of these struts and emails I get, I can form no other opinion that they are barely stiff enough for duty with lowering springs. You say you like your tokico's, but I would find it hard to beleive that they don't bounce in the front over bumps. Especially when the most common comment on H.P.'s is that they are soft in the front. The koni's banished the bounce I was getting with my Bilsteins and gave me a firm ride that only get's bad over the type of bumps that you'd want to slow down for no matter what. The koni's also made the car feel much more sporty, tossible. But in all this I have to say that even these struts have left me wanting more at times, more dampning power and more spring stiffness. Since I have damaged my front koni's I have elected to send my front Bilsteins off to be re-valved stiffer. It's only costing me $110 to do it. I recommend that you wait for me to get them back and on the car and try them out. I am hoping that they will out perform the koni's. I will report my finding's with the revalved bilsteins when I evaluate them fully.

If their are any points I missed or If I generate more questions in your mind, please ask them.;)

[Jims 86LXI HB]

I'm curious, why are you considering switching? What has you thinking this?

[accordlx]

I was going to write a long drawn out answer to this question but after thinking about it for a while, it comes down to one thing.

1) The Tokicos are just not stiff enough for me up front.

I am not getting a lot of bounce like I did with the KYB's but it still is too much. Im not getting a sloppy ride by any means but they just don't feel right. Since upgrading my suspension, I also seem to be going thru front tires like there is no tomorrow. This wasn't happening with the KYB's either and that is the only thing I have changed up front lately. I know that this could be caused by many different forces such as my weight bias and my driving style but the more I drive with them on, the less I like em'. Don't get me wrong. IF you drive like a normal person, these would do fine but I still drive like I have my BMW so this will not do. Maybe they are totally shot and I need new ones but this would be an indication of a very short life. ... Like less than 30,000 miles. That is why I was interested in a shorter shock that allows more use of the entire shock body vs. just the last few inches.

[Jims 86LXI HB]

I was going to write a long drawn out answer to this question but after thinking about it for a while, it comes down to one thing.

Umm are you feeling ok, cause I've NEVER seen you pass on a Long aswer:D :stick: Yeah I hear ya on why your thinking this. The koni's would really be a better choice. But like I said you may want to wait for me to get the revalved Bilsteins back and tested before you do anything. I sent them out this tuesday, btw. Well just in case you were curious here's the link to the place that offers their own custom Koni sport struts with shorter front bodies and piston rods. The are avaible either single or double adjustable and they can taylor them based on your spring rates
http://www.opmmotorsports.com/honda.html#Honda86-88Accord
I just wish they didn't cost so much. :rolleyes:

[OldSchoolSwap]

Originally posted by accordlx
That is why I was interested in a shorter shock that allows more use of the entire shock body vs. just the last few inches.
That is a verry good point! However having a shorter body, wouldn't that give the front end a higher potential of bottoming out?
Although we do have rubber bump stops in the shock's shaft, reducing the body of the shock may increase oil pan damage.

right?:confused:

[Jims 86LXI HB]

That is a verry good point! However having a shorter body, wouldn't that give the front end a higher potential of bottoming out?

But it is exactly that kind of lowness that is the driving point behind shorter bodied struts being a good idea. 1.) The number on thing that will kill a strut in a lowered car is bottoming out the strut. 2.) I have to wonder if when we run our cars with drops lower than 2.5" if we are asking the struts to perform in a operating range they weren't designed to do all the time? I just wish it wasn't so darned expensive to get shorter bodies. You can send Koni struts to Koni to be made into shorter struts for $65 per strut plus the cost of parts (found that out today while talking to gordon at koni today:smokin: ). Oh and $25 per strut to make them EXTERNALLY adjustable.

[OldSchoolSwap]

Originally posted by Jims 86LXI HB


You can send Koni struts to Koni to be made into shorter struts for $65 per strut plus the cost of parts (found that out today while talking to gordon at koni today:smokin: ). Oh and $25 per strut to make them EXTERNALLY adjustable.

Not bad! I'll be looking into that as well.

But my question still remains.... Woudn't your oil pan take the extra torture since there's more suspention travel being available?
I for one took off all my rubber bump stops on the shock's shaft giving it more shock travel, and BOY what a mistake! My oil pan split in half about 2 weeks later.
I got the bump stops back on and the oil pan has never suffered a scratch since then again.
Not to mention that ride quality was alot worse because the bump stops weren't there to absorb the bumps!!! (I guess thats why they call them bump stops!) :stupid:
Either way, i'm still trying to picture this. Sounds to good to be true.:)

[accordlx]

Here is a simple solution to that problem. Install metal skid plates under your car. Take a piece of Sheet metal and rivet it to the inside of the dust shield under your car. This will protect the leading edge of the tranny and the oil pan from kissing the ground. It will not prevent dents in the oil pan on my car but has taken the place of the worn out parts on the dust cover. This project took me all of a half an hour after taking out the 2 dozen screws that hold that damn dust shield. I have a particularly wicked driveway that I scrape on every morning and my little mod has probably saved me from replacing the oil pan several times.

PS. The bump stops do help alot. I tried my car without the bump stops for one day and put them right back in. That one day cost me a new set of shocks because I blew the cartridges in my front KYB's thinking I was creating more suspension travel. The only thing I did was make it easier to blow my cartridges.

[89accordhb]

Well Chris ... maybe I should look into the skids plates for the bottom of my car, I did take a metal rod to my tranny @ 75 MPH that cost me $2000 ... hmm

And if you ditch the rear Tokicos maybe you will hook me up, since I have GR-2s back there right now.

When are you coming down to the Nati?

See my new toys:
http://www.thepaul.net/car/images/car%20side.jpg
http://www.thepaul.net/car/images/camber_kit.jpg

[accordlx]

Great to see the arms!! I can't come down this weekend though, I have weekend passses to the Memorial Golf Tournament this weekend.

I gotta see Tiger Woods win his 4th straight!! He's 7 strokes back right now but anything's possible.

PS. I still have the GR-2's on the back end of my car. They seem to be fine back there.