What engine?

[Justin86]

Ok so I have a choice between a B18C1 or a B18C5. I can get either onw for a good price. I don't have the money to install everything right now but for the deal I'm getting on the engine and tranny I can't pass it up.

[NXRacer]

C5 without a doubt!

[markmdz89hatch]

well, I'm guessing the C1 would be considerably less expensive, not to mention you'll have enough trouble with the OBD conversions with either one. Of course the C5 has better hp numbers, but the C1 is a force to be reconned with as well.

[Justin86]

Well no one has done the C5 swap so I'm really thinking about it.
Sorry NXRacer but if I buy this engine I won't have enough money to by a kit of juice from you.

[‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›]

Originally posted by Justin86
Well no one has done the C5 swap so I'm really thinking about it.
Sorry NXRacer but if I buy this engine I won't have enough money to by a kit of juice from you.

The reason nobody has done it is because...... It's because it's expensive. The engine is OBD-2 and the Accord is "PRE-OBD". Your Best would be Either a JDM B16a or a C1 Block with a B16head. Get some CTR internals & Valve Train and you have yourself a Poorman's TypeR.

[NXRacer]

Dude, justin, save your money and do a turbo kit man.

[Justin86]

Originally posted by NXRacer
Dude, justin, save your money and do a turbo kit man.
I would but the about of power you get out of the A20 turbo would not be as much as I want. 200-300hp might be ok for some people but not for be.

[NXRacer]

you better have an ASS load of cash to get more then 200-300 hp out of any motor..........

[Justin86]

Originally posted by ‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›
The reason nobody has done it is because...... It's because it's expensive. The engine is OBD-2 and the Accord is "PRE-OBD". Your Best would be Either a JDM B16a or a C1 Block with a B16head. Get some CTR internals & Valve Train and you have yourself a Poorman's TypeR.
What about the GS-R. WickedAccord pulled it off and you are all most there right. With that you just do an OBD-1 set up. Why can't I do the same with the C5 type R. Both of those engines are OBD-2 and can be switched to OBD-0 or 1.
I'm going to completely rebuild the engine in order to turbo it so all the internals, cams, etc will be swaped out for better.

[Justin86]

Originally posted by NXRacer
you better have an ASS load of cash to get more then 200-300 hp out of any motor..........
that is why I'm saving up my money and have a good job.:) I got about $3K for a month of work. How many other 18 yr old college students make that much.

[NXRacer]

well then i guess you do have an assload of cash coming in. hope you are able to do the swap. that would be pretty sick.

[‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›]

Originally posted by Justin86
What about the GS-R. WickedAccord pulled it off and you are all most there right. With that you just do an OBD-1 set up. Why can't I do the same with the C5 type R. Both of those engines are OBD-2 and can be switched to OBD-0 or 1.
I'm going to completely rebuild the engine in order to turbo it so all the internals, cams, etc will be swaped out for better.

Well Wicked was running a "PRE-OBD" Setup with a PR3 Ecu and I am Running an OBD-1 Setup with an $1100 wire harness and P28 Ecu. So if you buy a c5 for about 4k, your going to spend money on parts you don't need. ( Tranny, Ecu, Axles, ) Then you have to replace the distributor, Alternator, Half shaft, Motor Brackets, buy a Cable Tranny and the other lil things ur going to need. Then you have to worry about the wire harness. For The Record! I completed my swap.

[Justin86]

Last I heared Wicked was changing to OBD-1 cause he keeped distroing ECU's or something. How is it that I'm spend money on parts I don't need ( Tranny, Ecu, Axles,) distributor, Alternator, Half shaft, Motor Brackets, buy a Cable Tranny. Why would I need to replace the Place Racing mounts, half shaft, and there is a kit for a hydro to cable tranny conversion. Why do you have to spend #1100 on the harness. The one place racing makes should do the job, otherwise is it basically useless.

[i.c.]

even if its hard c5 man!

[‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›]

Originally posted by Justin86
Last I heared Wicked was changing to OBD-1 cause he keeped distroing ECU's or something. How is it that I'm spend money on parts I don't need ( Tranny, Ecu, Axles,) distributor, Alternator, Half shaft, Motor Brackets, buy a Cable Tranny. Why would I need to replace the Place Racing mounts, half shaft, and there is a kit for a hydro to cable tranny conversion. Why do you have to spend #1100 on the harness. The one place racing makes should do the job, otherwise is it basically useless.

Wicked wanted to change, he now has gone into bigger and better things.. Place Racing made him and the other guys a "PRE-OBD' Harness. Well U can't use the tranny, OBD-2 ecu suck.. U wont use the axles that come with the engine. THE PLACE RACING MOUNTS do not and I REPEAT do not mount up with the motor brackets. I thought you said you did ur homework on all of this? You should know all this info by now.

[Justin86]

Originally posted by ‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›
Wicked wanted to change, he now has gone into bigger and better things.. Place Racing made him and the other guys a "PRE-OBD' Harness. Well U can't use the tranny, OBD-2 ecu suck.. U wont use the axles that come with the engine. THE PLACE RACING MOUNTS do not and I REPEAT do not mount up with the motor brackets. I thought you said you did ur homework on all of this? You should know all this info by now.
Then why the fuck do they claim all of this shit works. I have never read about this stuff before other wise I would be so joy ful about this swap. I though the only tough part besides finding the money is the electrical. SO I can't use the tranny. Why, they make a hydro to cable conversion. What is wrong wuth place racings axles. Does the harness even have the right plugs for the engine?
Where would I read about some of these problems cause I have only seen the electrical probs. (links)

[‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›]

Originally posted by Justin86
Then why the fuck do they claim all of this shit works. I have never read about this stuff before other wise I would be so joy ful about this swap. I though the only tough part besides finding the money is the electrical. SO I can't use the tranny. Why, they make a hydro to cable conversion. What is wrong wuth place racings axles. Does the harness even have the right plugs for the engine?
Where would I read about some of these problems cause I have only seen the electrical probs. (links)

The how-to is incomplete. Pri axles work, not the ones that usually come when u buy a motor. Unless you are planing to buy a C5 long Block. Most engines come with extra shit you don't need, just so they can charge you a lil more. the 86-89 Accord is a "PRE-OBD" car, so Place Racing makes it easy for you and makes a "PRE-OBD" harness. Now if you want PRI to make u an OBD-1, that is going to cost more. then the harnesss runs to the passenger side, and our Ecu's are on the Driver's side....just a whole mess of shit!

[Justin86]

Originally posted by ‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›
The how-to is incomplete. Pri axles work, not the ones that usually come when u buy a motor. Unless you are planing to buy a C5 long Block. Most engines come with extra shit you don't need, just so they can charge you a lil more. the 86-89 Accord is a "PRE-OBD" car, so Place Racing makes it easy for you and makes a "PRE-OBD" harness. Now if you want PRI to make u an OBD-1, that is going to cost more. then the harnesss runs to the passenger side, and our Ecu's are on the Driver's side....just a whole mess of shit!
Ok that helped a lot. So the OBD-1 harness will cost be $1100 and that runs back to the ECU or do I have to incorpate that. Then there is the mounts. So don't even buy PRI mounts and have custom ones made. I'm not sure on what exactely comes with the motor. I belive it is everthing you need to drop it in. I'm not to sure on where this guy gets is motors but he wants $700 for it. Other people have got engines from him and a guy I work with is getting one, that is how I found out. This huy is like 30 something and his dad owns an big Ford dealership in Grants Pass, so he has got connections.

[‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›]

Originally posted by Justin86
Ok that helped a lot. So the OBD-1 harness will cost be $1100 and that runs back to the ECU or do I have to incorpate that. Then there is the mounts. So don't even buy PRI mounts and have custom ones made. I'm not sure on what exactely comes with the motor. I belive it is everthing you need to drop it in. I'm not to sure on where this guy gets is motors but he wants $700 for it. Other people have got engines from him and a guy I work with is getting one, that is how I found out. This huy is like 30 something and his dad owns an big Ford dealership in Grants Pass, so he has got connections.

No No No.. My Harness cost $1100.. My whole car is OBD-1. The initial harness was $550, but it was a Stand alone Harness. Ok Last Time.. Your are going to Need PRI MOUNTS, PRI AXLES, PRI SHIFT LINKAGE. YOU NEED TO REPLACE THE MOTOR BRACKETS ON THE ENGINE. YOU NEED A T-BRACKET. A FEMALE HALF SHAFT..DATS IF U BUY A C5.. $700 for a C5 sound 2 low. Are u sure is a c5? what's wrong with it?

[Coroncho80]

Originally posted by ‹^› ‹(•¿•)› ‹^›
$700 for a C5 sound 2 low. Are u sure is a c5? what's wrong with it?


$700 for a C5 is dirt cheap. Something must be wrong with it ....... It's gotta be! I've been around and I never found it that cheap; unless is hot and they wanna get rid of it.

[Justin86]

I'm thinking the engine is stolen, but this guy has got engines for other people and his Dad is a big figure in Grants Pass so he should be for real. He said it will be a USDM C5 engine.
So I need the female half shaft, T-bracked, engine brackets, and a complete wire harness.

[ryan88lxi]

usdm c5? i thought those were jdm only, im probably wrong though

[Coroncho80]

Originally posted by ryan88lxi
usdm c5? i thought those were jdm only, im probably wrong though

Yep, you're wrong :D


If I'm not mistaking the JDM is the B18C-R and the USDM is the B18C5.

[Justin86]

Oh well still pretty much the same exact engine. About a 3hp difference.

[B2FiNiTY]

They are not the same.

Even the usdm 97-98 b18c5 motors are different.

97-98 have a less agressive intake cam but less strict emissions.

The 00-01 have a more agressive intake cam to make up the power lost from more strict emissions.

The JDM 98 spec R has a better flowing 4-1 header, higher compression, and a tranny with a higher final drive, 4.785 vs 4.40.

The price reflects these changes.

If you are afraid of the engine being hot then ask for the VIN, run it on carfax and that should give you a pretty good idea.

If he won't offer the VIN or the vin is not there, then it is 99% hot. Stay away from it.

[Justin86]

Yea there is small differences but when you get down to the basics they are the same that is why they are both B18C

[B2FiNiTY]

What do you mean b18c? Those differences aren't small IMO. The 98 spec compared to the usdm is night and day due to the tranny, header and higher comp.

B18C gsr or itr?

Or are you saying b18c(r) and the b18c5?

[Justin86]

I'm talking about the Type R engines. There is only a difference of 3hp. That isn't a big difference. A CAI can give you bigger gains. So the comp is a tad higher and the tranny has one gear that is a different ratio. Who cares. I'm going to rebuild the entire engine and replace the stock cams, pistons, etc to compensated for the higher hp and the turbo.
The only thing I need to worry about is what I need to put the engine in and get it running. I don't give a shit if the JDM C5 has higher compression then the USDM CR.:flipa:

[B2FiNiTY]

The compression is the least of the goodies for the 98 spec. The best thing about it is that the tranny has a higher final drive which will out accelerate the usdm.

1-2-3 gears are the same but the 4th and 5th gears have gsr gearing. Plus the header makes another big difference.

If you are going to rebuild and turbo it, wouldn't a gsr motor be more practical!? I don't see why you should spend the extra money for something great stock and then tear it completely down again.

[Justin86]

Originally posted by B2FiNiTY
The compression is the least of the goodies for the 98 spec. The best thing about it is that the tranny has a higher final drive which will out accelerate the usdm.

1-2-3 gears are the same but the 4th and 5th gears have gsr gearing. Plus the header makes another big difference.

If you are going to rebuild and turbo it, wouldn't a gsr motor be more practical!? I don't see why you should spend the extra money for something great stock and then tear it completely down again.
Well for the price I'm getting it at it wouldn't make much difference. Like said before this guys probably gets hot engines but hey like I say "drive it like you stole it" and "it isn't against the law unless you get caught."

[Justin86]

Ok so here is the big question. What exactely is the big difference in the C1 and C5. The trannys are a little different (ratios). What about the instal process. This is what I'm most worried about. Different parts you need and the electrical differences. Since i'm going to change everything internaly it is just the external componets (wires, brackets)

[B2FiNiTY]

If you do buy a stolen motor, I hope you do get caught, get your car impounded, and go to jail.

People like you just encourage theives to steal cars and ruin it for all the real car people out there. :mad:

I'm reluctant to answer your question but just to help a car guy out...

94-95 USDM GSR have oil coolers which 96-01 GSR motors don't have. All 97-01 usdm itr motors come with oil coolers.

94-95 is OBDI.
96-01 is OBDII.

The 00-01 ITR motor has a more agressive intake cam compared to the previous years.

When comparing the gsr motor to the itr motor, the internals are almost completely different. Different valvetrain, pistons, rocker arms, crank, intake manifold etc.

Night and day.

As installing goes... the biggest thing is just OBDI and OBDII otherwise it is very similar.

[86AccordLxi]

Don't buy stolen shit if you know it's stolen or even if you suspct it's stolen!!! Not to hijack the thread or anything but that's very uncool!!! Please reconsider buying a stolen motor as someone spent a lot of time and money to buy it originally. What goes around, comes around.....

Alex

[Justin86]

So installing the GSR and Type R motors will be pretty much the same except the wire setup. That was one of my biggest unanswered questions.
Alex I don't know if the engine is stolen or not. I kind of assumed it from the price the guy wanted. It could be or maybe not.???

[B2FiNiTY]

you COULD find out if you wanted to by geting the VIN if he even supplies one. If he does not, then it's 99% stolen...

[Justin86]

Yea I need to call him to see if he has any C1 engines. Since by th time I get done with the engine you won't be any orginal C1 or C5 parts left and the C5 is much harder to wire up. Running with the C1 OBD1 will be much easier the messing with the OBD2.