recap--no start

[mark]

I been working on this problem for awhile now ... I'll give everyone an update to clarify the thread.

When the key is turned to the #3 position, there is no clicking at the solenoid. Every circuit has 12 volts that I can find, except the solenoid wire. It is carrying 4 volts at the solenoid terminal.

The starter can be jumped, and the engine starts in less than a second, runs fine after that.

No codes in ecu

battery---new

battery cables---new, cleaned ground points on wheel well and frame by clutch cable

starter--new, block cleaned before install

key switch--new, 12 volts on #3 position

harness from key switch to underdash fuse box---new, 12 volts on ignition
wire when key is turned to #3 position

ground points---cleaned from battery to block & head to frame (new ground wire from head to frame)

Clutch switch has no volts, but is grounded. I jumped the switch, still no start.

The only thing I can't locate is the starter relay. And it is grounded by the clutch switch.

Any ideas on this.....

[shepherd79]

there are no outside starter relay. the relay is build into the starter.
i would say check the fuses under the hood and under the dash.

[mark]

All the fuses are good and carry volts and ground. Guess I'll start tracing wires.

No offense, but the chilton manual shows a "starter-out" relay that is grounded by the clutch switch. It's located somewhere after the underdash fuse box and before the harness terminal in front of the battery. Could it be located behind the radio next to the heater harness?

Or am I misreading the diagram?

[HondaBoy]

man, i hope you get your SE-i working fine. hope to see it fixed up!

[POS carb]

if u are showing 4 volts at the starter you probably have a bad ground, check the connections at the starter again!

[smufguy]

What kinda Starter is it? Pick one out of the 4 listed here

Hitachi 0.8 Kw
ND 0.8 Kw
Nippon Denso 1 Kw or 1.4Kw
ND 1 Kw or 1.4Kw

Cause the relay is nothing than the solenoid itself with the "Built in Relay".

All i can say is go to pauls website and go to his shop manual, go to Engine Electrical and download the Starter section. Its the pages 24-22 up till 24-34. Have fun. :D

[mark]

What kinda Starter is it? Pick one out of the 4 listed here

Hitachi 0.8 Kw
ND 0.8 Kw
Nippon Denso 1 Kw or 1.4Kw
ND 1 Kw or 1.4Kw

Cause the relay is nothing than the solenoid itself with the "Built in Relay".

All i can say is go to pauls website and go to his shop manual, go to Engine Electrical and download the Starter section. Its the pages 24-22 up till 24-34. Have fun. :D

I missed his web address, could you send it?

The starter relay is located behind the radio, on top of a little grey box. You'll only find it if you look behind the radio from the passenger side. It's invisible from the drivers side. It's a 4-pin Denso relay, 2 blk/wht's going in, a blk/grn leading out to ground for the clutch switch, and another "blk,wht" leading out to the selonoid. The blk/wht leading out has no volts, the other 3 have 12 volts.

I checked the local part stores, no luck matching the relay, must be a dealer item, so I guess I'll be heading to the boneyard in the am if the dealer price is to high.

Wish me luck on this one? I've been down a month.

[shepherd79]

we are telling you, there are no outside relays. it has build in relay into solenoid.
download the honda shop manual and read http://www.pauldesign.ru/honda/shopmanual.html

[smufguy]

I know the relay you are talking about. its the relay for your clutch switch in turn for the starter. Anyway. If you closed the clutch switch and it still would not start, go to a junkyard and pull that relay out and try it man. Seems like you know which is at fault and i dont know the reason why u dont troubleshoot it. My lx used have that black relay u are talking about. right above the brake like warning control box or whatever that grey thing is and when i got the lx-i wiring harness, it did not come with one nor a clutch switch connector. and hense my car starts without having the clutch depressed.

[Vinny]

could someone please explain this relay to me. I'm lookin in the electrical service manual and all it shows is the battery, underhood fuse box fuses 21 and 35, a connection through the dash fuse box, to the ignition switch then back through the dash fuse box then basically striaght to the starter solenoid on the starter. Nowhere does it show the clutch switch at all, which makes sense because both my accord start with the clutch in, out whatever even after trying 4 diff JY clutch switches. I think all the clutch switch is for is the cruise anyways. All its says for manual tranny is "bypass coupler" where on the auto it list a neutral safety switch.

[smufguy]

Vinny, some 5spd 3gs came with the clutch switch and some like mine did not. The ones with the clutch swtich have a four prong relay right above the grey box (Brake failure module or something). This grey box is located under the center console as u know. Its right above it bolted on the side of the box. Its a black relay. I wish i can get u a pic of it. It looks similar to the Cigarette lighter relay i suppose.

[mark]

Well, no luck with the relay today. My buddy at the boneyard gave me 2 of them, neither helped with starting, same results as original relay.

Can the relay be bypassed by connecting the incoming and outgoing blk/wht wires or even before the wires split to the relay?

[smufguy]

i would say change the whole starter and see if it works. Seems like ur not getting power to the starter or the relay as u say. Try that. Swap the whole starter unit and see if that would work. Also. chekc all the connections on the starter itself and the wires going to it. It highly unlikely that the problem cant be found.

[mark]

ok, I put my new starter back and recleaned the block on, same results. I'm getting kinda quick at that by now. Both starters can be jumped and the motor cranks right off.

Then I tried something else. I left the relay under the radio off to see if there were volts at the solenoid when I turned the key to start, and there were volts. Could that mean the clutch switch has lost ground?

I'm going to clean the battery grounds on the sidewall and block again. Then, try to find the ground for the clutch switch. It should be around the clip before the key switch wires split into the relay.

[Vinny]

so you're getting low voltage on the push on spade connector that attatches to the starter? But you do have 12 volts on the terminal lug connection at the starter?

[mark]

Yep, to both. Working back from the solenoid, I get 4-5 volts on the solenoid wire at the terminal connection and back to the harness in front of the battery at that connector. That's as far back as I can find the solenoid wire. The harness then dissappears into the sidewall, probably going into the firewall, but I don't know where.

From the key switch, there are 12v on all 3 positions, in fornt of and behind the underdash fuse box. Also, 12v going into the clutch switch relay(also called starter relay).
Any help? Thanks.

[cruznz]

if you think you have found the right starter-cut relay,...disconnect it and run a jumper wire to by-pass it , make sure you connect to the right wire for the solenoid, then check your voltage at the solenoid again

[mark]

Yep, it's the connector to the relay. I ran a jumper wire between the hot wire and the solenoid wire, and cranked off the engine.

I'm going to place a posilink connector to hookup those two wires and bypass the clutch relay, cap off the ground wire for the clutch relay and be done with it, for good.

[cruznz]

glad to hear you got it sorted.........