Here's a new one (Head Gasket?)

[mowery]

Background: So the time had come to fix *all* the oil leaks at once, and the best course of action was to pull the engine in order to do so. Front Main seal, Rear Main seal, diff axle seals, oil pan gasket, oil pump gaskets, pcv breather o-ring and tubes, etc. etc. Also throw a new clutch kit on it while it's out, and also clean up 16 years worth of grease and grime.

[So I'm very careful with the engine on the hoist, and I'm using an equalizer. Engine floats right out no problem, and I get it on the stand with no drama.]

Everything goes TOO well: Not a single broken or rusted nut or bolt. Amazing. There's usually at least *something* that goes wrong, but not this time.

(And I'm extremely careful with the crank/cam positions while doing the front seal in order to not mess up the timing, etc.)

Right. So get the engine back together, into the car, and everything else hooked up.

It won't start.

Confirm that there's fuel flow, spark at the plugs, and triple check the timing. Everything looks fine. But the engine is spinning *WAY* too easy. Put a ratchet on the crank pulley and find that I can spin the engine by hand with hardly any resistance at all. Hmmm.

Quick compression test shows about 60 psi or less across the board. (Engine showed 195 in all four just two months ago...)

I now suspect maybe I somehow managed to bend the valves, and they aren't seating right. So I start trying to diagnose a bent valve problem.

One method I tried was the compressed air into each cylinder while it is at TDC and listen for air. WELL, lo and behold, when I put air into the No. 1 cylinder, air comes out the other three spark plug holes!!! I can also hear it coming out the oil drain holes in the top of the head!!!

HUH?

The question: (finally) Has anyone ever experienced a head gasket failure as a result of pulling the engine?? I'm gonna start taking the head off tonight to investigate further. The only thing I can think of is that the weight of the engine was just too much for the tired old original head bolts and they stretched just enough to lose their seal on the tired old original head gasket. Big fear is that the head may have warped, or even internally cracked. There's no leaking of oil or coolant on the outside of the head, but since the car won't start there's no mixing of oil and coolant visible yet.

Am I missing something else here?

thanks.

[Dibbs]

Are you saying you hoisted the engine by the head? Cause if so I could definatly see the head losing it's seal. You never removed the head in this whole process right?

[mowery]

I used the factory hoist points: One on the upper right side of the head, and the other on the trans housing. Correct, I never touched the head bolts while the engine was out.

[Dibbs]

Oh I wasn't sure if you had it hanging by the head only (sounded strange). Anyway, I've heard stranger things but that shit's not supposed to happen if you used factory hoist points and didn't yank the hell out of it while taking it out. Since you're in the mood, you might as well take the head to a shop to have it pressure checked and make sure there's no bent valves, cracks etc. If all is well, slap a new head gasket and new head bolts (if you got the cash) and see where that gets you.

[TINBOAT]

Are you positively sure that the cam timing is correct ? From what I have read so far in your post, that's about all I can come up with. As for air coming up from oil drain holes, how much air is leaking out ? (this is coming from air passing by the piston rings and going into the crankcase, otherwords, blow-by)...try shooting a little oil into each plug hole and re-pressurize, this should tell you generally how bad the rings are, a little 'hiss' aint too bad.
I would also pressurize the cooling system and look for signs of trouble there. You would really have to 'Ham fist' the head to stretch the bolts long enough to break the gasket seal, but again, with the mileage on the engine, that head gasket will have become quite brittle.
Otherwise, my bet is the cam timing, it can be a bitch if yer out a couple of teeth, and cause most of the symptoms you are describing.
Let us know how you make out !!!

[mowery]

Update:

I tried a new head gasket (Fel Pro) with the original head bolts: Still no compression.

(I *know* I had the timing set right. I checked it a thousand times in a thousand ways. Trust me.)

I measured the head bolt length, head thickness, gasket thickness, and depth of the bolt holes in the block and noticed that there was hardly any leftover room at the bottom of the holes in the block when the bolts were in. Could the bolts have stretched just a fraction and then been bottoming out when I tightened them the second time?

Anyway, I took the head to the shop for inspection. Nothing serious was wrong. No bent valves or cracks, and minimal warpage. So I had them clean it up, dress the valves, put on new stem seals, and mill the head flat.

Bought a new Honda head gasket and new Honda head bolts, and put it all back together. She's running fine now!

(measurements with the new bolts, gasket, head, etc. this time showed I had about 3/16 inch free at the bottom of the holes)

Lesson learned: Be careful pulling a high mileage engine out by the factory head hoist point with everything original still intact. I'd stongly suggest attaching the sling to the block at the front of the engine block directly using the engine mount or a/c mounting holes.