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shepherd79
03-28-2004, 01:27 PM
OK,
well, today is very nice day, so i figured why not try it.
i got spare 3g map sensor, cut the plug off and solder it to 4G accord map sensor. the sensor i got came out of 4g coupe.
here are weather conditions for today: 63 deg sunny.
here is what i have done to my car so far: headers, no cat, Dynomax muffler, K&N filter (stock replacement, i still have stock plastic air intake). Accel coil, 4G injectors.

i ran two test, one after another. the results are amazing. it has a lot more power. the bottom end between 2K -3K is very nice and it pulls hard all the way to 6K with ease.

i will have more testing done through out next week. i want to see what my gas mileage will be. i will keep you guys posted.

my final word: DO IT!!!!. it is cheap and it is easy to do.
just get spare 3G map sensor and 4G map sensor. connect the plug from 3G sensor to 4G sensor and connect the vacuum lines. it is that easy.

P.S. because 4G sensor is diff, it won't mount inside the box. so i just mounted on the side of the box by using the screw that holds one corner of that black box.

guaynabo89
03-28-2004, 03:48 PM
Did you check to see if your old map sensor was faulty? That might have had something to do with it.

But then again I had someone very reputable tell me this a while back, of course I havent tried it yet. Still have the two wiring harnesses sitting in a box with a 93 civic map sensor. The reason for this being is, that I was told that the later model map sensors were less touchy to large cams than the older ones. For what reason I dont know, maybe just a better part.

Keep us informed cause maybe it'll make me go splice up the harness that I got sitting around and try it.

Oh and newer hondas have the map sensor directly on the throttle body in case someone is interested.

shepherd79
03-28-2004, 03:57 PM
my map sensor was working properly.

1988starter
03-28-2004, 04:11 PM
Yea go me for figureing that out

Justin86
03-28-2004, 04:35 PM
Well looks like another trip to the pick and pull for me. :D

bobafett
03-28-2004, 11:52 PM
snag a 2nd one while u are at it! !! :)

Justin86
03-29-2004, 11:57 AM
well they I guess you will be driving down for the meet and make the exchange, unless you want me to mail it to you???????

smufguy
03-29-2004, 07:32 PM
Yea go me for figureing that out

you deserve the credit bro. Thats a serious project IMO. When i get a chance, im gonna go get one myself. but you got the overbore 4g TB tho, not the stock one right? bastards :D.

Also Alex and you, What does this swap actually tell your computer and how does it actually boost performance? Does it widen the range of the fuel maps by actually reading more incoming air? or do they do it more accurately. How about a MAP sensor from a 5th gen? does it make any difference? Those were F23s right? anywho, props to you alex and You are always recognized starter (your name is chris right?)

bobafett
03-29-2004, 07:34 PM
justin whats up with that meet? i might be able to make it on the friday, but not on sat or sun.... i could do something on thursday as well

1988starter
03-29-2004, 07:37 PM
you deserve the credit bro. Thats a serious project IMO. When i get a chance, im gonna go get one myself. but you got the overbore 4g TB tho, not the stock one right? bastards :D.

Also Alex and you, What does this swap actually tell your computer and how does it actually boost performance? Does it widen the range of the fuel maps by actually reading more incoming air? or do they do it more accurately. How about a MAP sensor from a 5th gen? does it make any difference? Those were F23s right? anywho, props to you alex and You are always recognized starter (your name is chris right?)

Yea I have a 4th gen over Bore TB huge difference but still a little weird on idle nut I am working on it. BTW I origonally went 4th gen because I was adapting a 4thgen TB so I have no idea abou the 5th gen map.

BTW you were close on the name it is Corey :D

smufguy
03-29-2004, 07:57 PM
Yea I have a 4th gen over Bore TB huge difference but still a little weird on idle nut I am working on it. BTW I origonally went 4th gen because I was adapting a 4thgen TB so I have no idea abou the 5th gen map.

BTW you were close on the name it is Corey :D

[email protected] << thats your email right? you signed my guestbook. thanks man. hahahaha, Ill remember you now ;)

1988starter
03-29-2004, 09:34 PM
[email protected] << thats your email right? you signed my guestbook. thanks man. hahahaha, Ill remember you now ;)
well I am glad you remember but my E-Mail is [email protected]

riced_roach
03-29-2004, 11:26 PM
What does this swap actually tell your computer and how does it actually boost performance? Does it widen the range of the fuel maps by actually reading more incoming air? or do they do it more accurately. How about a MAP sensor from a 5th gen? does it make any difference?

fuel mapping is all predetermined and bases a/f mixture on vacuum signal. If theres more pep it may either on the lean side or rich side of 12:1 a/f ratio. Real dyno time is required to see where the curve meets optimal performance but this may disregard any fuel trimming for emissions purposes. So in other words it may create more NOX or high in CO and HC readings.

shepherd79
03-30-2004, 04:07 AM
who cares about emission crap. i don't have them here.
the map sensor sends the signal on how much fuel the car needs. in this case it sends a signal for more fuel. it is a good start, but that is not enough fuel.
our cars were leaned out a lot.

oh gas milage, well it went to hell. it is alright untill i floor it.

smufguy
03-30-2004, 05:47 AM
who cares about emission crap. i don't have them here.
the map sensor sends the signal on how much fuel the car needs. in this case it sends a signal for more fuel. it is a good start, but that is not enough fuel.
our cars were leaned out a lot.

oh gas milage, well it went to hell. it is alright untill i floor it.


as long as it gives 20 mpg on a city i aint complaining cause thats what i am getting for heavens sake. I dont know what could be wrong, leaking injectors maybe??? anyway, i wanna see and feel how this extra boost feels like, i feel like my car does not move in high rpm which is what its supposed to do in High rpm with stock intake, but i sure as hell it wont choke after the 4g map sensor.

1988starter
03-30-2004, 07:45 AM
I noticed about a 1 mile to the gallon loss

86LXItooFAST4me
03-30-2004, 08:05 AM
if it is getting bad gas mil with the 4g map, would there be a way to maybe have a male and female plug on both maps for the 3g and 4g and interchange them when ever you want the extra pep. would this be possible or would you have to reset your ecu every time you change them? just an idea?

86LXItooFAST4me
03-30-2004, 08:07 AM
oh, n/m if its only 1 mpg lost, i thought it was more than that from what shephard said. my bad

1988starter
03-30-2004, 08:07 AM
I have mine set so I can switch them at will 2 vac lines 2 connectors ect

1988starter
03-30-2004, 08:12 AM
I check mine every week and I noticed I went from 25.6 to 24.8 MPG

86LXItooFAST4me
03-30-2004, 08:33 AM
so when you change yours out do you reset your ECU?

shepherd79
03-30-2004, 09:30 AM
you don't have to reset ECU.

Justin86
03-30-2004, 11:21 AM
justin whats up with that meet? i might be able to make it on the friday, but not on sat or sun.... i could do something on thursday as well
Yea I have class thursday until 2:30 so after that I'm game and NXRacer will be down here too, maybe you can help us with our little project for thursday night. Should be lots of fun and good video :D


who cares about emission crap. i don't have them here.
the map sensor sends the signal on how much fuel the car needs. in this case it sends a signal for more fuel. it is a good start, but that is not enough fuel.
our cars were leaned out a lot.

oh gas milage, well it went to hell. it is alright untill i floor it.
Yea and I'm thinking that since I pulled all my emission crap and P&P the TB it has been running a little rich and the high performance backfire was my first clue about it. Maybe this 4G MAP sensor will help bring my a/f back to normal.

LX-i BOY
03-30-2004, 12:31 PM
hey riced roach i dunno what you are talking about if the air fuel ratio is 12:1 like you were talking about that would be lean teh stociometric ratio for the best of everything is 14.7:1 for air-fuel,

bobafett
03-30-2004, 08:42 PM
yeah thursday night i might be down ;) then i could make it for the friday portion of the celebration

smufguy
03-30-2004, 09:04 PM
hey riced roach i dunno what you are talking about if the air fuel ratio is 12:1 like you were talking about that would be lean teh stociometric ratio for the best of everything is 14.7:1 for air-fuel,

14:1 on avg is the Stoich and anything less as in 12:1 is rich (less air, same fuel) compared to 16:1 (more air same fuel). The mass of air is greater when the a/f ratio is 16:1 which makes the mixutre leaner and the mass of air is smaller when the ratio is 12:1 so what riced_roach said was right. I would have mine running a lil leaner with adv timing for better response, not to mention all carbs tend to lean out.

thegreatdane
03-31-2004, 01:58 PM
I just changed my map sensor to a 4g map sensor today too. Like shepherd I've also noticed a gain in the 2-3K rpm range and maybe a bit more power in the above 5K rpm range but I'm not quite sure about that one. Only engine mods are short ram with Green Filter and Champion spark plug wires.

86LXItooFAST4me
03-31-2004, 02:13 PM
you could probly make a kit with the 4G map and adapters and sell, i would buy one just because im to lazy to go get shyte myself

buish
04-03-2004, 05:14 PM
can someone post pics on how to do this mod please?

shepherd79
04-03-2004, 06:51 PM
what kind pictured do you need?
it is very simple.
you get the 4G map sensor, get the 3G plug (from map sensor), connect the wires between the plug and the sensor.
plug it in and run the vacuum line from the sensor to the stock place on intake manifold.

smufguy
04-03-2004, 08:35 PM
alex, does the 4th gen prelude have its Map sensor outisde? im thinking of using that if i can. Can i use the Map sensor from a 4th gen accord DX or is it a different part number for the LX and EX? EX might be different right?

1988starter
04-03-2004, 10:03 PM
If you want pics look in my throttle body thread in project central that is where I first mentioned it and posted it.

shepherd79
04-04-2004, 04:07 AM
i don't know about the prelude. if you don't see any box that has vacuum lines comming out of it, it must be outside than.
4G should have 2 diff sensors, one that will end with 1770 and the other 1771. i tested both of them and they are no diff.
i did pick up a second get teg MAP sensor. i am gonna try run that and see if there is any diff.

guaynabo89
04-04-2004, 07:39 AM
alex, does the 4th gen prelude have its Map sensor outisde? im thinking of using that if i can. Can i use the Map sensor from a 4th gen accord DX or is it a different part number for the LX and EX? EX might be different right?


later model hondas have the map sensor directly bolted to the top of the throttle body.

riced_roach
04-04-2004, 09:46 AM
all of you guys are getting excited over map sensor swaps. Well if you dyno it first then show us the dyno report. I know alot of guys that buy mod chips (not MAP but similar idea) for domestics to imports and they all have different results. A friend of mine bought an expensive "custom" programed chip and after going on the dyno he lost hp. He had to get the EEPROM burnt again to get maximum performance.

My point is blindly putting on a MAP sensor isn't gonna make a huge improvement and also it will have different fuel curves as the original one. I say dyno the car first then proceed in telling others to do so based on facts and NOT seat of your pants testing.

shepherd79
04-04-2004, 10:57 AM
well, if you are so opinionated, why don't you get one and test it for us. Some peple don't have dyno around them.
I know that the closest dyno around here is about 40-50 minutes away.

smufguy
04-04-2004, 04:05 PM
riced_roach, alex and corey were not saying it just for fun. Besides, i know i can rely on their words cause i have been here long enough to have that opinion. Besides, this thing can be got from the junkyard for like 5 bux, so its not really a big deal to get all excited about man.

buying chip alone is not gonna do stuff to your car, and this is if you get it from a 'no-name' brand, but its tested that on BMWs for example, ACShnitzer chips do work. So u cant say chips dont work either. It all depends on who u get it from. Besides, your friend, i dont know what he was driving, but if it was an import, a piggyback always works.

cutting my lecture short, a dyno chart does not always needed to be provided to prove something like this. Heck, even sean does not have a damn Dyno Sheet on his website, but ppl are buying from him arent they?

Justin86
04-04-2004, 05:44 PM
Beside it's not really a expensive mod so even if it dosen't work the way you want it to, it's not like it is a big loss or anything.

1988starter
04-04-2004, 06:02 PM
riced_roach, alex and corey were not saying it just for fun. Besides, i know i can rely on their words cause i have been here long enough to have that opinion. Besides, this thing can be got from the junkyard for like 5 bux, so its not really a big deal to get all excited about man.



Damn I wish it was like 5 bucks I got raped for 45

shepherd79
04-04-2004, 06:37 PM
it burned hole for me. $10 for each sensor. plus i had to get the plugs.

riced_roach
04-04-2004, 08:08 PM
I'm not being opinionated. I'm merely trying to put some input on how doing mods may not reap the benefits you are seeking. I fully understand the theory behind all components on an engine. When an engineer designs the fuel curve of a map sensor based on vacuum signals, displacement of combustion chamber and fuel injectors etc etc they are taking account that the car is used for daily driving purposes, fuel economy and exhaust emissions. Blindly adding a Map sensor to a different engine is NOT an educated or calculated method of producing HP. I've been there and done alot of SHIAT in my time and I've seen alot of "interesting" stuff in my time. By adding a different map sensor MAY or MAY NOT improve performance. This is the sole reason for me to say DYNO it.

I do not disagree that a chip can improve HP. Oh SMUFGUY it was a 347 stroker (stroked 302ci)in a 92 5.0 mustang. This chip was suppose to improve HP but it went backwards. Actually the original chip was installed in the EEC IV computer and the HP went up dramatically. BUT seat of your pants testing didn't indicate a loss in HP but I bet a 1/4 mile time would of indicated it by the MPH of the timeslip.

My point to people who seek info from forums such as this. READ BETWEEN THE LINES and do research and more research. Also please note that modifications to the engine will also effect this "MAP Sensor SWAP" so some may see a difference and some may not. Believe the hype or have faith in a swap. Proof can also be provided by a increase or decrease of MPH in the 1/4 mile. But please note WOT (wide open throttle) is just getting a small part of the fuel curve when doing the 1/4 mile. You may find that at specific rpm you will loose HP compared to using a stock MAP sensor.

BUT dont believe me 'cause I dont know what I'm talking about and I am simply opinionated.

smufguy
04-04-2004, 08:45 PM
$10 is not that bad, but $45 you got butt raped dude. the guy said he would give it to me for 5 bux and i can come and get it anytime i want. ;)

Strugglebucket
04-04-2004, 09:31 PM
How do those wires match up? I looked at a 4g map and it had pink, turqouis, and white. The 3g has pink w/white stripe, blue w/white stripe, and white w/blue stripe.

1988starter
04-05-2004, 04:11 AM
$10 is not that bad, but $45 you got butt raped dude. the guy said he would give it to me for 5 bux and i can come and get it anytime i want. ;)


Yea the least he could have done is given me some KY with the anal reaming

as for the wire colors check after the plug on the 4th gen harness the colors should match up

shepherd79
04-05-2004, 04:15 AM
it is easy to connect. white to white, blue to blue, and red to red.

AccordEpicenter
04-05-2004, 07:21 PM
arent the 4th gen and 5th gen sensors the same?

Sabz5150
08-20-2004, 09:49 AM
Are the wire colors the same for both the 3g and 4g sensors?

shepherd79
08-20-2004, 12:47 PM
they are almost correct. but they have the same layout. you can't screw this up trust me. if you still have questions, PM or IM me.

1988starter
08-20-2004, 03:26 PM
I also have a kit for salee in the market place

smufguy
08-20-2004, 11:09 PM
they wires are exactly the same except for just one i guess.

Sabz5150
08-22-2004, 02:32 PM
$3.38 with both plugs.

Sabz5150
08-26-2004, 12:29 PM
Got the new sensor installed (Thanks Shepherd!) and it does what has been said. A bit of increase to the bottom end and an overall smoothness to the engine.

Kevin
08-28-2004, 10:38 AM
I have a MAP sensor from 96 integra-OBD 2?? Will that work?? I wired it up but the car ran shitty and through a code. Not sure if i skrewed up or is it just because the MAP is obd2.

shepherd79
08-28-2004, 12:45 PM
check your wirring. it is eather you wired wrong or you can't use it

Kevin
08-29-2004, 10:33 AM
Ya-I had it wired backwards. It seems to run better at higher Rpm. I got a complete GSR obd2 throttle body for FREE. :)

smufguy
08-29-2004, 08:54 PM
hey kevin, Nice hatchie u got there. LIke the rims, looks like one of the lug nuts is missing on ur front tire :). and whats up with the big ass pic on your sig bro? didnt u read the rules? :)

Kevin
08-29-2004, 08:56 PM
thanks-Ya i cant figure out how to resize the stupid picture!!

Low Tek
09-01-2004, 10:33 PM
damn man.. I gotta get me one of these.. time to goto local yard hehehe.. shepard, if I can't seem to find me one, think you might be able to "hook a brotha up" lol

AccordAddict
09-04-2004, 08:30 PM
shit this sounds awsome. does it cause any harm to your engine? and will the oxygen sensor add more air to the extra fuel thats being delievered? basically i cut off the 3g sensor off the sensor wire, and then cut off the sensor off the 4g sensor wire, and wire them together?

shepherd79
09-05-2004, 03:16 AM
shit this sounds awsome. does it cause any harm to your engine? and will the oxygen sensor add more air to the extra fuel thats being delievered? basically i cut off the 3g sensor off the sensor wire, and then cut off the sensor off the 4g sensor wire, and wire them together?
listen to your self. you don't even sound like a person that knows anything about the cars. get yourself a manual and read.
the map sensor changes the fuel curve depending on the vacuum present in intake manifold.
it has nothing to do with oxygen sensor. oxygen sensor measures the volume of CO in exhaust and that tells ECU how rich or lean your car is running. it has nothing to do with adding more air or fuel.

smufguy
09-05-2004, 06:28 AM
shit this sounds awsome. does it cause any harm to your engine? and will the oxygen sensor add more air to the extra fuel thats being delievered? basically i cut off the 3g sensor off the sensor wire, and then cut off the sensor off the 4g sensor wire, and wire them together?

i will presume that ur statement was just a sarcasm

jonrichert
09-05-2004, 10:17 AM
shit this sounds awsome. does it cause any harm to your engine? and will the oxygen sensor add more air to the extra fuel thats being delievered? basically i cut off the 3g sensor off the sensor wire, and then cut off the sensor off the 4g sensor wire, and wire them together?

http://members.shaw.ca/j.richert/pimpslap.gif

Slavic
09-05-2004, 02:08 PM
the map sensor changes the fuel curve depending on the vacuum present in intake manifold.
it has nothing to do with oxygen sensor. oxygen sensor measures the volume of CO in exhaust and that tells ECU how rich or lean your car is running. it (oxygen sensor) has nothing to do with adding more air or fuel.I was under the impression that the task of the oxygen sensor was to "tell the ECU how rich or lean your car is running" (what the air to fuel ratio is) exactly in order for the ECU to adjust the air to fuel ratio (that is add more or less fuel making the mixture richer or leaner) based on the information supplied by the oxygen sensor, meaning therefore that the oxygen sensor has a whole lot to do with adding more or less fuel (but not air). That is the sole purpose of it being there. But I'm new to this so feel free to point out where I'm mistaken.

shepherd79
09-05-2004, 02:47 PM
there were versions of EFI 3 geez without oxygen sensors. i know paul in moscow had aerodeck without oxygen sensor.
oxygen sensor does tell ECU what the condition of the mixture. in reality, stock ECU has it is fuel map set. so oxygen sensor won't change it. if you run air/fuel gauge on stock EFI 3g you will see that it is running rich on the top.
actually every EFi car setup to run rich on the top. that is why Apexi SAFC or HKS super AFR can control how much fuel can be sent. with Apexi or HKS you can modify fuel curve to achive perfect air fuel ration through out the power band.

Slavic
09-05-2004, 04:54 PM
in reality, stock ECU has it is fuel map set. so oxygen sensor won't change it.I didn't say that the oxygen sensor will change the map. I don't fully understand what the map/sensor is or it's purpose. I'm trying to dispute your statement that "it (oxygen sensor) has nothing to do with adding more air or fuel."

While I agree it has absolutely nothing to do with adding air (it's a NA engine to begin with) which is where AccordAddict's statement was off, I'm arguing and it is my understanding that the oxygen sensor indeed has a lot to do with adding fuel since the ECU fine tunes the mixture based on the data it receives from the oxygen sensor.

What's the point of there being an oxygen sensor and it sending info to the ECU if the ECU doesn't use that info to adjust the mixture accordingly at least to the degree where the oxygen sensor input is only used for fine tuning it? What else is it there for? What is it's purpose if not that? Why did my fuel consumption improve then when I replaced the bad oxygen sensor?

Slavic
09-05-2004, 05:22 PM
Are you saying the ECU pretty much goes by the map alone and the oxygen sensor is there only as a feed back to prevent/correct too lean of a mixture or something if that happens for some reason and the fuel consumption improvement once the oxygen sensor is replaced is there only because the ECU works in a non optimal safe mode of a sort if the oxygen sensor is non functional? I'm just trying to figure this out.

smufguy
09-05-2004, 10:10 PM
Oxygen sensors are not needed to run an Internal Combustion Engine.

The only reason you need them, is to run the engine at its optimal efficieny and to abide with certain emission parameters.

Oxygen sensors generate voltage depending on how much oxygen is present in the exhaust gas and the ECU uses this voltage to match it up with its built in map and supplies the fuel as such. and this is regulated by the injectors of how much fuel is needed.

Engines run richer at the higher engine speed (rpm) is because thats when u get more air in and to compensate for it, u need to add more fuel. (Stock engines are designed to run rich on the top end, but with AFCs and aftermarket goodies, this can be modified).

Your car performs better with a new oxygen sensor compared to the old shitty one is because the new one puts out the right voltage under any engine load and is easily matched by the ECU to add/reduce fuel. But the old shitty one, puts out crazy voltage and hence misguides the ECU there by leading to a shitty running engine(car).

yes, if one of the feedback sensors that is required for optimal/normal functioning of an engine goes bad, the ECU will revert back to its safe/limp mode to get the car moving. It will not be efficient or desirable, but it will get you to the nearest shop than leaving you completely standard. This is done basically by using the engine's speed (RPM) and the ECU uses its preloaded map of the "assumed air/fuel ratio" leading to a poor operating car. This is often done in conjunction with ignition retardation.

AccordAddict
09-06-2004, 06:46 PM
well in that case, do you know where the oxygen sensor is i wanna replace mine with a new one so my car doesnt run shitty anymore.

smufguy
09-07-2004, 04:07 AM
well in that case, do you know where the oxygen sensor is i wanna replace mine with a new one so my car doesnt run shitty anymore.

its right on the exhaust manifold. since ur a 86 efi, u only have one.

Slavic
09-07-2004, 04:49 AM
AccordAddict, When I researched it I red about some racer using the same oxygen sensor for 18 years or something like that and cleaning it with lemon juice (citric acid). My memory is not clear on this and I didn't bookmark it.

If you do decide to change it and want to save some $ get a universal bosch one for $16-19, not the one made for our car particularly $35-40. The only difference is that the universal one comes with only a wire while the replacement one has proper length wire and the right plastic connector. I didn't mind connecting 2 wires for $20+.

AutoZone will rent you the oxygen sensor socket set for free.

smufguy
09-07-2004, 09:41 AM
wow cleaning with lemon juice. thats a new one. I have read and been told that we cannot and should not clean the O2 sensors and they are real sensitive to cleaning or spray agents. Strange that lemon juice does not affect it. can we use lime juice instead? :)

adams86lxi
09-13-2004, 05:26 PM
hmm i was thinking the other day about this. Does anyone know if this would work? Since i have a b20a in my accord and most of the stuff from the prelude is similar i wonder if i were to get a map sensor from a 88-91 prelude it would work good with the b20a? Does the 88-91 preludes have the map sensor on the throttle body? Or does it have it in a gay ass vaccum box?
I wonder if this would give me a good gain with the b20a and i also have no idea if it would connect up as easy as the 4th gen accord one does?

Slavic
09-14-2004, 12:04 AM
wow cleaning with lemon juice. thats a new one. I have read and been told that we cannot and should not clean the O2 sensors and they are real sensitive to cleaning or spray agents. Strange that lemon juice does not affect it. can we use lime juice instead? :) Not the post I mentioned, but here are some quotes:

Ive read that citric acid is quite safe to clean O2 sensors. (http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=24;t=000527;p=1#000 007)

I think that you will have to clean the O2 sensor about every oil change to keep it working properly. You can do this apparently with simple lemon juice and salt mixed together ( same thing works great at getting stains off enamel baths). (http://www.aimoo.com/forum/postview.cfm?id=308930&CategoryID=918&ThreadID=1110375&tolast=yes#bottom)

rustlude87
07-19-2006, 06:08 PM
so I recently put the map sensor on my prelude and what a difference it made wow lots of torque beyond 4 grand, and would it be ok to put the sensor on a 2nd gen integra? kill the gas mileage?

gfrg88
07-19-2006, 07:26 PM
so I recently put the map sensor on my prelude and what a difference it made wow lots of torque beyond 4 grand, and would it be ok to put the sensor on a 2nd gen integra? kill the gas mileage?


gas mileage will go down just a tiny bit, but youll feel a difference in power, youll see more of a difference if you have other mods like i/h/e.

mkymonkey
07-19-2006, 08:05 PM
i lost lots of mpg when i did this...when i removed it...it all came back up..but then my o2 sensors went so...:(

895spdforfree
07-19-2006, 10:02 PM
i did it and i noticed the engine idled/ran smoother, and just gave an overall smoothness to the powerband, maybe 1 hp increace haha, well i only got a short ram so yeah..

rustlude87
07-20-2006, 06:05 AM
like our motors are 2.0 but you know the inetgras are 1.8, and the map sensor is from a 2.2 won't it just dump fuel in the integra? like a lot more than us

mkymonkey
07-20-2006, 06:26 AM
thats what i would assume ^^^

smufguy
07-20-2006, 11:58 AM
like our motors are 2.0 but you know the inetgras are 1.8, and the map sensor is from a 2.2 won't it just dump fuel in the integra? like a lot more than us

a Map sensor checks the vaccum in your manifold and thus adjusts your ignition, not the fuel delivery. The fuel delivery is taken care of by your fuel pressure regulator which increases or decreases your fuel pressure. IF the vaccum is high (closed throttle aka idling, or at high load) it increases the advance on ur ignition timing (also at high engine speed and WOT) and at normal mode, it retards the timing.

so a map sensor does not add fuel as you know.

thegreatdane
07-22-2006, 05:41 PM
ehhh the map sensor is just a sensor. It doesnt do jack shit. And it certainly doesnt correct the ignition timing on a car with mechanical ignition correction.

It reads the vacuum or pressure in the intake manifold so that the ecu knows where in the fuel table to look up how much fuel to inject. That's the simple side of the story..

MessyHonda
12-19-2006, 12:39 PM
ok i did this mod like 2 weeks ago. it was very easy the wires almost had the same colors. so i crimped them on and went to plug it in....i did notice it has a lil extra pull all the way to redline. but i also notice that my MPG went down...im geting 25mpg and 80% of that is highway driving under 75mph. with my stock map senson i would get close to 32 mpg....so yeah it took a big dump on gas...anyways you cant beat a free mod...and dyno results would be cool.

mike10562004
06-24-2007, 05:58 AM
dose it matter which one the b18 d16 b16?

MessyHonda
06-24-2007, 07:09 AM
i forgot to post my findings......i finally got around to dyno it with a stock and an 4th gen sensor

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v650/Messybone/LX-i/messyhondadyno.jpg

so i gained 2hp and 4 pounds of torque to the wheels...not bad for a thing you can swap in 30 secs

frantik
06-24-2007, 12:33 PM
yeah but is the 1-2hp gain worth the 10mpg loss in fuel efficiency? seems like the map sensor is more like something you want for track day than for daily driving :dunno:

A18A
06-24-2007, 05:32 PM
well since they are easy to swap, you could just rig up a switch or something so you can just choose between which one you want with a flick of a switch :)

russiankid
06-24-2007, 06:28 PM
well since they are easy to swap, you could just rig up a switch or something so you can just choose between which one you want with a flick of a switch :)
Good idea.

frantik
06-24-2007, 07:38 PM
how do you switch the vacuum hoses? or do you just split them? and i think thats a lil much for a 2hp boost.. i can put on a red H badge and get more hp :kekeke:

A18A
06-24-2007, 07:44 PM
^thats what i thought of the whole map sensor idea from the start :)

Oldblueaccord
06-24-2007, 10:23 PM
Messy whats your setup motor wise?

Those are great numbers. I wish there was A/F ratio to show what was up. That would tell us if the Map sensor was richening the fuel or it was just a better sensor then your original.

I was wondering too if the ECU needed to be reset to take advantage of the change.


wp

frantik
06-24-2007, 10:59 PM
he's got an intake, exhaust and adjustable cam gear, plus the map sensor.. i think thats it :dunno:

skycam_313
06-24-2007, 11:11 PM
makes more sense...

MessyHonda
06-25-2007, 09:56 AM
yeah but is the 1-2hp gain worth the 10mpg loss in fuel efficiency? seems like the map sensor is more like something you want for track day than for daily driving :dunno:



im running my stock one right now....i only put in the 4th gen one to see if there was any difference. now...i know there is one.


Messy whats your setup motor wise?
Those are great numbers. I wish there was A/F ratio to show what was up. That would tell us if the Map sensor was richening the fuel or it was just a better sensor then your original.
I was wondering too if the ECU needed to be reset to take advantage of the change.
wp

yeah fitz is right...i only have teg Intake, full exhuast with high flow cat and muffler, adjustable cam gear...it has no markings so i tired to adjust it to OEM specs but i think its more like -1 retard, blaster coil. thats it for now....i already have plans to rebuild the upper half of the engine. i have most of the parts. i got a friend that can help me do an OBD1 swap...im looking for 130-140whp after im finished.

'A20A3'
07-02-2007, 10:49 AM
does anyone have any pictures of this please?

does this mean i get to toss my stupid black box under the hood?

frantik
07-02-2007, 01:49 PM
haha no the map sensor is just one small item inside the black box

it's connectected to the wire with the 4 connections that goes into the black box on the front side to the left

coope
07-03-2007, 06:47 PM
dame this thread is old but i did i it and got a lot more top end now i can hit 130 and it's easy only took 5mins

Strugglebucket
07-03-2007, 08:49 PM
Messy whats your setup motor wise?
Those are great numbers. I wish there was A/F ratio to show what was up. That would tell us if the Map sensor was richening the fuel or it was just a better sensor then your original.
I was wondering too if the ECU needed to be reset to take advantage of the change.
wp
i seem to remember seeing a graph somewhere in the shop manual of the voltage output of the map sensor corresponding to the amount vacuum. if i can find that, maybe the same thing is listed in the 4g manual and then we'd know if there is any difference.

Ichiban
07-03-2007, 08:54 PM
does this mean i get to toss my stupid black box under the hood?

What else, other than the MAP sensor, is in the hellbox that is required for proper functioning of the ECU? I'm surprised that the MAP sensor is not mounted directly to the intake manifold.

Strugglebucket
07-03-2007, 09:30 PM
umm, there's the variable solenoid for the egr lift control, solenoid for the vac advance, and the solenoid for the intake manifold secondary runner butterflies if the car is 88/89. there might be one more but i can't remember right now.

'A20A3'
07-04-2007, 11:36 AM
umm, there's the variable solenoid for the egr lift control, solenoid for the vac advance, and the solenoid for the intake manifold secondary runner butterflies if the car is 88/89. there might be one more but i can't remember right now.

thanks for that advice man. i have no EGR anymore(i put aluminum plates on the IM where the valve is and where the pipe from the exhaust hooks up)so i guess i can get rid of that solenoid...and possible tuck and hide all the other necessary BS somwhere else...hmmmmm...

i got my 4G MAP sensor yesterday, still gotta put that on too.