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prozacposterboy
04-01-2004, 01:21 PM
I drive for a living and I listen to a particular talk radio show in the mornings.. they were speaking of OPECs decision to cut back oil production... IE.. higher gas prices for everyone... expect $3 a gallon at the pump... its almost $2 where im at right now.. .



White House Urges OPEC Reversal

Wednesday, March 31, 2004



WASHINGTON — White House officials urged Kuwait (search) and the United Arab Emirates (search) to try to reverse OPEC's (search) decision Wednesday to reduce oil production, a move sure to drive up gas prices and intensify a volatile election-year issue. Both countries already had opposed the production cut.

President Bush expressed disappointment with the decision by the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (search) to cut its production target by 4 percent. Bush's spokesman blamed Senate Democrats for stalling Bush's plan to drill for more domestic oil and to conserve energy.

White House press secretaryScott McClellan (search) said the administration was in steady contact with officials in oil-producing countries, arguing that "producers should not take steps that harm American consumers and our economy."

The White House and the Bush re-election campaign went after Democratic John Kerry (search), contending that the party's presumptive nominee for president would raise gas taxes.

Kerry once mentioned in a newspaper interview the idea of an additional 50-cent-per-gallon federal gasoline tax. He never offered legislation for such a tax and has since rejected the idea. Still, the Bush campaign has seized on the comment in recent days.

"That would cost you another $5 or more every time you fill up the tank," Bush told donors at a fund-raiser Wednesday night. "For that kind of money at least he ought to offer a free car wash."

The re-election team arranged events in Florida, Pennsylvania, Ohio, West Virginia and Wisconsin to highlight the effect on ordinary citizens if gas taxes were to climb even more. It is also airing a television commercial saying Kerry has supported increasing gas taxes in the past.

Kerry, in a statement Wednesday, blamed high gas prices on what he said was Bush's failure at diplomacy.

"In 2000, Bill Richardson went to OPEC leaders and successfully worked with those countries to increase production and decrease the price of gas for American consumers," Kerry said, referring to President Clinton's energy secretary.

"Today, George Bush was unable to achieve that same goal. Not only has George Bush let the gas prices spiral out of control, but he's squandered America's ability to do anything about it," the Democrat said.

National security adviser Condoleezza Rice (search) talked with Kuwait's foreign minister, Sheik Mohammed Al Sabah, about OPEC during a previously scheduled meeting marking that country's designation as a major non-NATO ally.

White House officials also called the emirates' ambassador, Asri Said Ahmad al-Dhahiri.

Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates had proposed postponing the production cut, but Saudi Arabian Oil Minister Ali Naimi and the majority of ministers prevailed in their effort to reduce the ceiling to 23.5 million barrels per day.

"I affirmed our position that higher oil prices at this stage, especially at this level, is not something that my government would like to see," the Kuwaiti foreign minister said after meeting with Rice. "This is not in the best interest of Kuwait," because economic instability could threaten international financial markets, where Kuwait is heavily invested, he said.

In 2000, candidate Bush had pledged a get-tough response to higher oil prices from OPEC.

"What I think the president ought to do," he said in January 2000 in New Hampshire, where heating oil prices were soaring, "is he ought to get on the phone with the OPEC cartel and say, 'We expect you to open your spigots!'"

Wednesday, the president confined his efforts to the public statement of disappointment, and let aides take up the matter with like-minded Kuwait and the United Arab Emirates. Bush did not telephone foreign leaders himself. The White House said officials had spoken recently to Saudi Arabian officials.

McClellan said Secretary of State Colin Powell (search) and Energy Secretary Spencer Abraham (search) were talking to counterparts in oil-producing countries, but officials in those departments declined to identify them.

McClellan blamed Senate Democrats for blocking Bush's energy plan for three years. Without Bush's plan to increase petroleum drilling and energy conservation, "we continue to go from crisis to crisis," McClellan said. Although Bush's fellow Republicans control the House and Senate, Democrats have used "procedural moves" to block the plan, he complained.

A recent Energy Department analysis said that even if Congress had agreed to drilling in Alaska, a major element of Bush's energy plan, the impact on oil prices would be less than 50 cents a barrel.

The White House said Bush will not stop pumping oil into the nation's strategic reserves because the effect on prices would be negligible and the reserves need to be brought to full capacity.

Kerry has called on Bush to divert that oil to the marketplace and urged the administration to pressure OPEC into providing more. Bush has done nothing with OPEC to reduce prices, Kerry said.

Mike's89AccordLX
04-01-2004, 01:39 PM
Well I hate this....every single week its another stupid excuse for raising the gas prices. And since I can only put premium gasoline into my prelude this really does affect me since premium is usually 10 cents more than regular gas. I don't think I will vote for Bush. It's going to be my first time to vote this coming election and well I don't want to have an incompetent leader. I don't pay attention to any commercials by either side. I will watch the debates b/c that's where any relevant info is discussed. I really don't understand why some 3rd world country is refusing to sell us oil. I mean come on doesn't the US do enough for every one else? I think the standard for living should be raised so then we could afford to spend $3 for a fricken gallon of gas. I'm not going to be too happy paying $48 to fill up my Honda! This is so stupid, I feel that every distributor should be able to name their own price but seriously there needs to be something done where is just one price all the time. I wouldn't mind paying $1.60 a gallon or $1.50 a gallon. But it really pisses me off is when they drop it to $1.35 then jack it up to $1.85. I mean seriously make up your damn minds. I think there should just be a set price and then after 5 years or so then that price should be re-evaluated. I think that would be better for everyone that way. Then it would stop all of this non-sense crap about this.


-Mike


This is my opinion and I'm 19 and I don't know everything so I may sound ignorant sometimes, but this is what I feel and I'm not affraid to say it.

DanLXI88
04-01-2004, 02:02 PM
Well I hate this....every single week its another stupid excuse for raising the gas prices. And since I can only put premium gasoline into my prelude this really does affect me since premium is usually 10 cents more than regular gas. I don't think I will vote for Bush. It's going to be my first time to vote this coming election and well I don't want to have an incompetent leader. I don't pay attention to any commercials by either side. I will watch the debates b/c that's where any relevant info is discussed. I really don't understand why some 3rd world country is refusing to sell us oil. I mean come on doesn't the US do enough for every one else? I think the standard for living should be raised so then we could afford to spend $3 for a fricken gallon of gas. I'm not going to be too happy paying $48 to fill up my Honda! This is so stupid, I feel that every distributor should be able to name their own price but seriously there needs to be something done where is just one price all the time. I wouldn't mind paying $1.60 a gallon or $1.50 a gallon. But it really pisses me off is when they drop it to $1.35 then jack it up to $1.85. I mean seriously make up your damn minds. I think there should just be a set price and then after 5 years or so then that price should be re-evaluated. I think that would be better for everyone that way. Then it would stop all of this non-sense crap about this.


-Mike


This is my opinion and I'm 19 and I don't know everything so I may sound ignorant sometimes, but this is what I feel and I'm not affraid to say it.

What you said makes sense to me. They also have raised natural gas prices here in Ohio. It's almost double what it was. It's such BS that we need to depend on some FUBAR little 3rd world country that gets rich off us Americans.

88accordhb
04-01-2004, 02:04 PM
at times like this, makes me glad to drive our little economizers. it's bout 2.27 for premium here in sanjose, ca. sux man! my friend spends bout 50 a week for his small block 69 stang. but then he drives alot. he wants to get his 89 lxi back from his friend. sold it bout a year ago.

Silver86LX
04-01-2004, 04:23 PM
It getting ridiculous. I think everyone should start driving mopeds. :kekeke:

88accordhb
04-01-2004, 04:41 PM
It getting ridiculous. I think everyone should start driving mopeds. :kekeke:
YOu bastard! it's koo you suggest ideas and stuff, but don't suggest dumb ones! I f'ing HATE HATE HATE mopeds. Hey are freakin sooo annoying. these dumb buttmuckers guys keep driving up and down my neigborhood, and each time...i just want to chase them down, beat them a little, tie their hands and feet up, then get back to my house, start my 3g, drive back across the street and run them over, ARRGG i swear i hate those things sooo much man :burn: :mad:

Sean
04-01-2004, 05:46 PM
You know some of the increased demand over the last decade has been fueled by sevral changes in industry.

First theres a larger Gas consuming vehicle called an SUV. there hugely popular/profitable built with 30yr old truck technology artificially jacking up the price of oil and gasoline by increasing demand.

OPEC is smart to consider the long term effects of the higher levels of fuel consumptionwhere will there econonmy be when they run out of crude oil in 20-30yrs. they wont have one. better to maintian the flow at a sustianable level and develope alternative energy sources.put your self in there shoes. feast today or starve tommorow or keep eating while you figure out a better way.

The other factor is the proliferation of Air travel. Jetlinners use lots of oil. in fact it would be more cost effective and energy efficient for you to drive a SUV like a ford exscursion and stuff 10 people in it then it would be to fly 150 people the same distance. even though it would take 15 Fords to do it they would use 1/3 the oil.

Long hual trucking and shipping.

International trade has pushed the shipping industry to use mroe and more diesel sucking boats that literally guzzle 60 gallons of diesel a yard. Long hual trucking has increased fuel demand. Things used to be transported by rail. a very effective means of moving frieght albiet not as fast a truck but liveable no the less.

So things to consider

Nuclear powered shipping vessels.
More short hual trucking and a big investment in rial.
More diversity in energy production. Looking at nuclear as being genrally less poluting even though the waste is hard to deal with weve got enough uranium to power the world for a millenium at 100x the current use of electric.

also stop using fossil fuel and refine the millions of tons of hydrogen thats already being produced by nuclear fissions plants around the world.

just random thoughts i have on the subject.

88accordalltheway
04-01-2004, 05:54 PM
then jack it up to $1.85.
wtf, thats nothing, try $2.15 down here in la, yea its a b*tch, suppost to go over 3 bucks here in the summer....... ITS A BIG GAME FOR THE MEDIA

bobafett
04-01-2004, 06:07 PM
i cant wait... fuckers....

at least i get 27mpg lol

Silver86LX
04-01-2004, 06:38 PM
YOu bastard! it's koo you suggest ideas and stuff, but don't suggest dumb ones! I f'ing HATE HATE HATE mopeds. Hey are freakin sooo annoying. these dumb buttmuckers guys keep driving up and down my neigborhood, and each time...i just want to chase them down, beat them a little, tie their hands and feet up, then get back to my house, start my 3g, drive back across the street and run them over, ARRGG i swear i hate those things sooo much man :burn: :mad:

Chill out. It was just a joke.

Anyways I do see rising prices of gasoline as a serious topic. The only reason why it's been rising so much over the past few years is because we are now realising that within our lifetimes we're going to run out of oil. The demand for oil is only going to increase over the next decades due to he fact that developing nations are only now catching up to the rest of the world and more people within those coutries are buying cars. We must find other sources of energy before we have a major energy crisis on our hands.

Another thing to consider is that North Americans have it pretty easy when it comes to paying for gasoline. Oyvind Ryeng said in another post that he's paying the equivalent of $5.40 USD per gallon.

Oyvind Ryeng
04-01-2004, 07:06 PM
Yes, right above $5 per gallon (premium). That is my you don't see any huge trucks with 8-liters displacement & 1 mile per gallon fuel consumption here in Norway. Actually, we have one Ford Lightening truck here in Tromsø (60.000 inhabitants) , and one Dodge Ram SRT10, or what's-it's-name. Those two trucks are driven by spoiled-sons-with-rich-fathers, so they don't have to worry about the cost of fuel. The large majority of cars here are small and mid-size cars with 2 litres or lower displacement; it's actually kind of sad. We got one single car that is capable of 10-second-runs in the quarter mile, that is a 1965-somethine Chevelle Wagon, that is not driven on the the street, even if it has been approved by the Norwegian DMV and has a license plate. Anyway, the cost of fuel in Norway is insane, you North-Americans have NOTHING to complain about.

88accordhb
04-01-2004, 07:10 PM
Yes, right above $5 per gallon (premium). That is my you don't see any huge trucks with 8-liters displacement & 1 mile per gallon fuel consumption here in Norway. Actually, we have one Ford Lightening truck here in Tromsø (60.000 inhabitants) , and one Dodge Ram SRT10, or what's-it's-name. Those two trucks are driven by spoiled-sons-with-rich-fathers, so they don't have to worry about the cost of fuel. The large majority of cars here are small and mid-size cars with 2 litres or lower displacement; it's actually kind of sad. We got one single car that is capable of 10-second-runs in the quarter mile, that is a 1965-somethine Chevelle Wagon, that is not driven on the the street, even if it has been approved by the Norwegian DMV and has a license plate. Anyway, the cost of fuel in Norway is insane, you North-Americans have NOTHING to complain about.
HOLY CRAP...i'm glad i live in the states no matter how high our gas prices are. wait...wait...is that 5 norwegan dollars or us? either way...sorry for that situation bro. GEEZ!

Oyvind Ryeng
04-01-2004, 07:16 PM
No, 5 USD. We use "Crowns" here, one litre of premium is like 10 Crowns, that equals to about 38 Crowns per gallon.

prozacposterboy
04-03-2004, 09:47 AM
I konw what you all mean... My truck has 2 18 gallon tanks on it but suprizingly gets about 20 miles to the gallon. The honda is always on jackstands so i cant rate its mpg. :-)

I dont buy the "Oh the SUVs are taking up all the Gas, roads, expences ..exc exc.. " You gotta think... gas guzzling trucks and vans have been out there for YEARS. My 85 truck gets about 20 the the gallon... as a new SUV gets about the same (16 - 20) .. if you look at alot of cars.. the MPG hasnt changed between models much at all. Our cars get about what, 24-26 to the gallon? A new Accord gets about 30-32? . Whoopdeedoo. I get so tired of hearing that the SUVs are going to be the death of American Civilation.

The prices with other countries compaired to here? You gotta thing we have like 500 million people here (just a crazy guess I have no clue) as compaired to 50 million in some other forign country. Alot more people to purchage gas so the prices are a bit lower. I can uderstand prices going up with inflation over the years, but look at the pump next time and you'll see that little sticker that shows you just how much PER GALLON the government is raping you for. Then prices go up even more and all they can say is "oh I dont know why? " Screw that.

We get our gas from various parts of the world, OPEC isnt just the only one. Canada and Argetnina are the other two main ones. Argentina is in a type of civil war right now, so thats going to affect our prices (which is why its $2 or so pre gallon currently.)
OPEC is stopping production of oil for one reason. Its Saudi Arabia and they dont like the White Devil. They know that this can cripple our econemy, oh and it will. You gotta keep in mind, its not just US getting screwed at the pump, its EVERYONE. The bread man bringing your grocery store its pastries and bread good. The airlines that are already suffering will have to raise prices again. YOur local postal man (and we cant forget the Parcel Service) who have to pay more to drive for their deliveries. The shit rolls downhill. If the prices go this high, you can expect another depression, in my personal opinion. History does repeat itself. Ever hear about the gas shortages of the 70s? Remember the pictures of people lining up days away, just to get some fuel? Gas had to be purchaced by your address; odd addresses had premission to get fuel on odd days of the week.

How about those apples?

P.

prozacposterboy
04-03-2004, 09:52 AM
....oh... and that [email protected] in california is due to those tree hugging hippy fucks that add MTBE to our gas, ruining our engines HOPING it'll make the enviroment better. Sorry to say (and i know some of you hate this) but a clean, emission compliant engine WITHOUT MTBE its a hell of alot better then with it.

Oh and one more thing to shit in your cheerios about. Starting 2008 california is starting to measure C02 our your tailpipe at emmissions stations. OUr cars are now causing the greenhouse effect and automobiles in general will be the death of us.. ..gotta love it...

BMS
04-03-2004, 12:11 PM
you mean that they're gonna have stops to check CO2? Like weigh stations except smog stations?

prozacposterboy
04-03-2004, 06:22 PM
no...it'd be an added gas to measure at your bi-anual smog check. Given a certian limitation like y our o2, nox, and hydrocarbons...so you can guess with more limitations, they're (the goddamned government) trying to phaze out more of our older cars on the road....

BMS
04-03-2004, 06:41 PM
oh right. i thought you meant they'd randomly check emissions for the fun of it.

AQcz
04-04-2004, 12:11 PM
Gas prices are crazy. Super is like $2.11 or more here in NY. Crazy

Cheeseburger
04-04-2004, 12:32 PM
gas here is 2.07 for 87 it took $30.38 to fiil here up

TWOLOUDNPROUD
04-04-2004, 12:40 PM
Here in Nor Ca 2.16 for premium it cost me $30.00 to fill up :uh: I miss the 80s $0.87 for gas the good days :sadwave:

Silver86LX
04-04-2004, 12:44 PM
As of last night 87 octane was going for $0.769 CDN ($2.21 USD per gallon).

Jonessoda27
04-04-2004, 08:51 PM
!! What? 30 dollars? thats nuts. isnt it supposed to be like 15 to fill up?

Busted_Blue
04-04-2004, 11:31 PM
update for san francisco:

2.15 for regular!!!! ate about 8.5 gallons for $18 bucks. :( This was the cheapest I could find (76)

Around other places, it was about 2.25 for regular. Premium was about 2.55!!!! Makes me wonder if I even want to drive anymore. =\

Oyvind Ryeng
04-05-2004, 12:45 AM
I don't understand how you guys can complain about the prices of gas.
I have to pay US$5 per gallon (premium).