Fuel Economy

[StillAHondaFreak]

Ok huys, before anybody burns me, i know there are a few posts on this subject matter, but im going a differnt direction here.

I am going to state some facts about MY CAR and see what kind of response/ answers I can get.


OK, I have to drive 45 minutes to and from work every week (M-F every oter week, M-TH every other week) I have been getting what I ASSUME (had to cover my butt incase this is normal) really crappy MPG's Ive dont some "little shit" to try to help the problem ; New NGK plugs, Oil Change. Checked Air pressure. (AT THE END OF THIS POST I WIL LIST MY "MODS") and havent noticed a difference, heres the wierd part tho, When I drove to work this morning, it took me almost a 1/4 tank, but when I drove home (after driving aroud running errands) It only took me a 1/8 of a tank!!!! Im assuming that this was because the car was properly wamed up and the choke was open, I dunno. As far as the choke, the previous owner was a frigin retard and Jerry Rigged the choke because it supposedly wasnt working. He bypassed whatever was supposed to operate the choke, and installed a toggle switch on it.

I will tell you up front Im a EFI VTEC guy who ran out of luck, but still had enought luck to end up with a Honda.

I dont know a mother f*&^%$# thing about carbs, Never had one, never worked on one, never wanted to.

Any who, heres my question, what the hell can I do to improve my gas mileage? (im not being cheap, but at 2 bucks a gallon, thats 30 bucks to fill er up)

I am getting an alignment tomorrow after work, so dont mention that, and I have new Plugs, so dont mention that either.

Ok, heres a list of my "MODS" (please note I just got the car 3 weeks ago, so dont put me on blast, I didnt do it!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Pacesetter Headers
Pacesetter Catback exhaust
NO AIRFILTER (just started a new job, getting a filter tomorrow)
New fuel filters (2)

I replaced both of these this weekend, the little one near the carb was ok, but the main filter, near the tank, literally had black gas in it!!!!!!!!!!
New NGK plugs (yesterday)
Oil change with 20/50 (yesterday)
NATURES WEIGHT LOSS PLAN : Rusty as hell!!!
ok, i think thats everything that could relate to gas mileage, please let me know,

Thanks,
Tim

oh, BTW, I drove to and from work today never going p[ast 3000 rpm either way. I was driving like a little old lady from passidina!!!

Ok, ive ranted lond enough, ill let you know how the alignment went.

Talk to you guys tomorrow.

(somebody please post so i dont look like I was talking to myself)

[k-roy]

Damn that sucks. It looks like you got a lot of the bases covered. Try tuning the carb and trying out a few differant settings. There is a thread in the howto section about it. Another thing to check out would be the catalytic converter, it may be clogged.

[Andrew]

Damn that sucks. It looks like you got a lot of the bases covered. Try tuning the carb and trying out a few differant settings. There is a thread in the howto section about it. Another thing to check out would be the catalytic converter, it may be clogged.

Isn't the 'No Vaccuum" Mod supposed to increase gas mileage and HP?

Air conditioning will kill your gas mileage as well.

Do you have a body in the trunk? The extra weight can be a biotch on your fuel economy.

[Not like a rock]

Hey, check them 02 sensors, eh.

[smufguy]

U did not give us the exact numerical mpg on your car. Carbs tend to run lean and its suprising you say u get bad gas milage. Even i, with an EFI, get around 32-35 mpg on a highway, and 22-25mpg on a city driving (bad traffic in NJ, kinda like NYC). So give us what exactly ur mpg is.

[Magny]

they say that lean conditions give us better gas milage and rich conditions give us more power, so they usually set it smack dab in the middle of those 2 curves or more towards the gas milage side for all cars.

[Moodybluesr]

What's the deal with the 20w50 oil? A thicker vicosity like that could drop the mpg a little bit... Honda recommends 5w30 or at most 10w30 if you live in a warmer climate (i guess Florida would qualify :D ).

[shepherd79]

here is what i would do if i was you:
1. pump the tires to 30-32 psi on cold tire.
2. get the carb rebuild kit and rebuild the carb or get a new rebuild carb from autoparts store.
3. do the vacuum removal only if you don't have emissions.
4. if you don't have emissions get rid of catalityc converter.

[Robs89LXi]

Are you judging by your gas gauge? You know, they are not always pefectly calibrated. It may seem like you are using more when starting from full.

[StillAHondaFreak]

Ok guys, I dont have the exact MPG as of yet, i am getting my alignment done at 4 after work, then Im gonna fill er up and head home, then Ill fill er up again and get a reciept and do the math and let you know.

BTW, The cat isnt a problem, it was clogged, but now its just a casing!!! Hollowed it out last weekend.

I think it has something to do with the fact that the previous owner was an idiot and wired the choke to a toggle switch, cause first thing in the morning, itll idle at like 2k rpm, but once it warms up, the idle drops down to 850 where it should be.

Like I said in the opening post, i think I may have it figured out, when its warm, it only takes like 1/16th of a tank, so it should be around 1/8th a tank round trip, better by half!!!!

This morning, i started the car before i got ready for work and let it idle for about 15 min, but it was still idleing at 2k rpm, but heres the wierd part, when i shut it of to take my spare out and use the key on my keychain, which took all of about 7 seconds, it was idling at 850 when i turned it back on. WTF???

Anyways, it only took me like 1/16 of a tank to get in this morning, so im guessing i should warm it up, shut it off, restart it, and do that in the mornings, and again when I leave.

OK well, gotta get back to work, ill check in with you guys when i get home this evening.

Thanks for all your help.

Tim

[smufguy]

well fast idle under warm up at 2k is good. Not to be alarmed. even the efi warm up idle speed is at 1.5K so i am confident that the 2k is perfect. check ur air filter and see how its going. It could also be an egr problem cause if ur dumping more fuel, which is more exhaust gas gettin in your combustion chamber or ur O2 sensor is just messed up and thinks ur running too lean. Check everything out and see how it goes. It shoudl be okay.

[cvergi01]

Your choke is working fine. When the car is cold the butterfly closes and idles at apporx 2k. after it warms up the butterfly opens...850 you usually have to tap the gas to bring the idle down or something to reset the butterfly ie:turn the car off then back on. But tapping the gas is better. check your mixture and ask a20a1 he is the carb god

[StillAHondaFreak]

ok guys, I filled up after work, then filled up as soon as i got home, went 47 miles on 1.27 gallons, so i figured it out to be 37 MPG. That is alot better than what I was getting, but I know it should be higher.

smufguy: I got the car with no air filter, just bought one, putting it in when I get done here, how could the o2 sensor affect my mileage? Its carbed, so i dont see how it could change anything, I know on my 5g civic, it affected it, but that car was FI, so the air fuel mix was configured through the ecu.

I dont mean to be a smart ass, bt I know for a fact that theres not gonna be a little asian midget jumping out of the O2 sensor with a little screwdriver to tune the carb!!! I think the only purpose of the O2 sensor on a carbed car is to trigger the dummy light if it sees a too rich or too lean condition, or if it just goes out all together.

I dunno, just my .02

Im getting the alignment redone tomorrow, the ignorant bastard that did it only made one friggin adjustment, and actually made the pull worse, unfortunately my friend was off today, so i didnt dare say anything, but itll get redone tomorrow and hopefully that will help alittle bit.

I will look into the O2 sensor just out of curiousity.

Im only doing one thing at a time, why spend 300 dollars to fix a 3 dollar problem right?

OK, gonna go put in that filter. Check back later,

Tim

P.S. I dont remember who asked me why I was running 20/50 oil, but its simple, 10/30 leaks out and I dont feel like rebuilding right now, its not that I cant or dont want to so much as the oil pan is rusty, just like every other friggin thing on the car, and i dont want to risk any damage to the motor till I have at least a "new" oil pan.

[shepherd79]

that is actually very good gas mileage. i don't think you can get any better.
i have EFI right now and i am getting 40 miles per gallon in highway, and my old carbed accord was getting 37 on highway.
the carb can never perform as good as EFI when it comes to gas mileage.

[StillAHondaFreak]

OK, thats the first good news ive heard in a while, i dont know what the mileage was because i was so pissed about using a 1/4 tank to get to work and back, that i never topped it off, but concidering that it is now taking me roughly 1/16 of a tank (the needle barely moved!!!) thats only 1/4 what I was using, so im guessing my mpg was around 9.2 mpg!!!!! ANd it was something as stupid as letting the car warm up, turning it off (or mabey burping the throttle as someone said earlier) and restarting!!! :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh:

Anyway thanks for all your help guys, I really appriciate it.

OK, real quick, should I still complete the rest of my tune up? Or should I be happy with my MPG and leave it the hell alone (as my father put it; "OK, you're getting good mileage now, leave it the hell alone unless it goes back down!!!)

All i have left are wires cap and rotor, and the fuel pump sock, but im not looking forward to that one!

[shepherd79]

you can leave it alone. you won't nottice much gain after you change spark plug wires and dristributor cap and rotor.

[StillAHondaFreak]

filled up today after using 1/2 a tank.

went 319.5 miles on 9.1 gallons

calculated out to 35 mpg with both highway and city driving.

Not too bad, lost 2 mpg by driving in the city.

This is good right??? I dont think ill get it any better, the 2004 civics are "only" getting 38 mpg highway

Tim

[StillAHondaFreak]

BTW:

WTF would the o2 sensor on a carbed engine do??????

Im thinkin its just for a check engine light.

I may have mentioned this earlier, but i never got any input.


Thanks,
Tim

[StillAHondaFreak]

hey guys, I have my MPG up pretty good, but im one of those people who just has to tinker with shit, Cant leave well enough alone(I get it from my Father, he's the same way)

So heres my question, other thatn the fuel lines themselves, and the fuel pump strainer, i have replaced everything fuel related on the car.

Should I go ahead and replace the fuel pump strainer?? Its only like 6 bucks and it'll only take about an hour since I dont have to drop the tank to get to it.

Please respond to this and have all your fellow members reply too.

(ill more than likely do it, unless someone can convince me not too.)
(keep in mind the fuel that came out of the main filter was literally black!)

Thanks,
Tim

[AccordEpicenter]

you mean the sock in the tank? I wouldnt see the need unless you had a serious amount of garbage floating around in your tank still... If the filters are new and you have no problems... id say dont touch it. BTW nice gas milage, i thrash my car and still get 30+ mpg

[StillAHondaFreak]

yea, im pussy footin it around and getting 38 MPG highway and 34 City/ Highway.

I figured my mileage for the last tank I used (I took that mofo to the bare bottom of the tank!) and Even though I did a few redline-shifts, I still got 32 MPG, so, im not complanin, I just know that at 2 bucks a gallon, Theres got to be 1 more MPG hiding somewhere.


BTW, did you notice that I said when I changed the filters that the main (right next to the tank) filter was so dirty that the fuel that came out of it was literally black?????


Tim

[browntimdc]

BTW:

WTF would the o2 sensor on a carbed engine do??????

Im thinkin its just for a check engine light.

I may have mentioned this earlier, but i never got any input.


Thanks,
Tim

Your carb has a solenoid that varies the air/fuel ratio. I think it bleeds air into the emulsion tubes. So there is a closed loop system just like EFI.

[StillAHondaFreak]

cool, someone finally answere the o2 question


update, I am now getting 31 mpg city, and i swear to god, i have reciepts to prove it, im getting 57.8 mpg highway!!!!!

I will never say another bad thing about carbs.

[Magny]

ya know, I'm glad you guys are getting high gas milages and such but mine is still gas guzzling like a mofo. I still only get about 200 miles a tank with my stick 12.9 gallon tank, may be 13.9, not sure. I changed the fuel pump to a new one cause the original was only doing a measly 1.2 psi (car still ran, don't know how) to a new one pushing 3.4 psi. changed the filters while changing the pump. checked all vaccum lines on and around the carb, no leaks so far. removed the filter recently cause it was so badly clogged up, gotta get a new one soon. charcoal canister is obviously working still considering I passed emissions. and as for my a/f gauge giving me a reading of 9 out of 10 bars, I know my a/f mixture is almost extremelt rich, but passed it with the emissions like that. so obviously I must of overlooked something, so can someone help me out with this!!!!

[StillAHondaFreak]

gonna im you, see if we cnt figure that shit out for you