got a new motor. help me formulate a plan of attack!!!

[bobafett]

ok so i just picked up goldy's old 30.000 mile motor, and its sitting on the floor in my garage. between my tired old motor. and his fresh motor, i want to get a nice young one going, and i plan to polish up the head and intake and TB, and if i get brave i will try to get some port work done.

questions are:

which head is better, BT head, or a20a1 head? i know the carbed block will have 9.2:1 compression, compared to 8.8:1 of my 86 block. i plan on using his block, and i just want to know if i might as well use his head too....

also i need to know from the people who have pulled it off, will the 3g tb fit on the b16 intake manifold and if not, whats a cheap way to get a tb that WILL fit, (no there arent any at the junkyards)/

im not planning on turboing the accord anymore, i just want to put my interior back in, rebuild a motor, wring a little more power out of it, and get a new clutch, then i will just drive it for a daily driver while i build the s13.....

i havent done a compression test on this motor yet ,but im pretty sure its got good compression.

what parts should i look into replacing on this motor? (keep in mind its already a low miles motor so its not got 250k like my motor does)

anyway after new clutch and motor put in, with the port work i plan on doing im hoping for 15.7 ish... as long as i break into the 15's i will be happy. and i know i can do that....

any pointers for me?

of course imma do water pump timing belt and clutch. but i dont know what else i should bother tackling.

[nswst8]

But I will be following this thread this should be interesting reading. Good luck with this project I have a B20a black top I'm looking to put in next year sometime.
Phil :cheers:

[NXRacer]

just make sure all your seals and stuff are good. Now would be a good time to replace your lower main seals as well as your thermostat and fuel injector seals and stuff. I know from previous experience its a good idea to replace all the seals, gaskets and parts like that that can go out now before you get the motor back in the car. ESPECIALLY if the motor has been sitting around for a while.

[Robs89LXi]

Ditto what NX said. Clean everything you can clean, flush out your cooling ports, change all your seals, get your flywheel turned and take before and after pics :). By the way, is the difference in compression because of the blocks, or the head designs for the engines you mentioned? Good luck with the project.

[bobafett]

yeah the motor has been sitting for well over a year. maybe close to a year and a half.... :( it was sitting outsite, but everything that could be plugged was, and it still has oil in it. hehehe

i guess i will start attacking this fucker with the wire brush and get it prepped for paint too heheh

i wonder if i can get a seal kit from honda... prolly set me back a shit load but oh well. i like honda parts!

[AZmike]

Ditto what NX said. Clean everything you can clean, flush out your cooling ports, change all your seals, get your flywheel turned and take before and after pics :). By the way, is the difference in compression because of the blocks, or the head designs for the engines you mentioned? Good luck with the project.

I've read that the compression ratio is determined by the pistons and that the heads and blocks are pretty much identical, but I haven't cross-referenced the part numbers to check.

[smufguy]

Chris the A20A1 head is different in two things

1) Different cam shaft
2) different exhaust valve size (bigger than the A20A3)

So keep the A1 head and get the A3 or BT camshaft. I dont know if the A3 camshaft and the BT are the same. and the A20A1 has 9.1:1 compression. :)

Like mike mentioned. the compression is dtermined mainly by the piston head shape. dome, trough, etc...

IF your numbers on the compression test is too high or too low. Then its most likely the valve overlap period is screwed up. Adjust it, get a test again and see how it comes out.

Just get a 4g accord TB like Starter did and follow his how-to on the project central and get urs done. I dont recommend a B16 intake manifold cause u only get the true power out of it in the top end and if u got emissisons ( i doubt cause ur in WA) then with no EGR u will fail as u know.

So keep his block, and head, get ur cam in place of his. Drop the baby in and ur good to go. :) sucks that u still got the 86 intake manifold. no dual stage and secondaries for you so. boooooooooooo :)

[bobafett]

heheh i like the single stage manifold better anyway... according to all of seans flowbenching it works better when ported out anyway.... actually the 86 manifold and the b16 manifold are fairly similar in design, only that the b16 uses larger shorter and more direct runners to get to the head.

yeah i plan on using my delta cam anyway, but if the carbed accord had bigger exhaust valves thats a plus anyway! ;)

the bad news is this:
i pulled off the plates that he had blocking the ports on the head, and there was standing water in the intake ports, and it looked like the valves were all rusted to shit. :( the worse news is there is maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaajor rust in the cylinder walls, and one of them had 4" of water in it. the other had about 1/2" of water, and the other two were just caked with carbon build up. :(

im not sure if the damage from the rust is going to render the block useless, but i may just bore it out a little bit and get myself a 2.2L a20 ;)

i took a wire brush the the bottom side of the head, and all the rust that appeared to be on the bottom of the valves went away, but i havent been able to get in there because i havent taken the valves out... is there a trick to it? i havent checked my haynes or chilton manuals, but i doubt they show how to remove the valves and valve springs....

but it pisses me off cause it will end up costing me like $600 by the time im done, just to rebuild my "daily driver" and that money was supposed to be going towards a down payment for my s13~

anyway i havent pulled the pan to see how the crank looks yet, but im hoping i can salvage this block once i get it honed out and maybe bored. :)

[smufguy]

that sucks the cyl walls are rusted. I would say just take the head and the block apart, get the block honed out and the shit removed, then put it back yourself.

With boring out, u might be inching towards 2.1L (maybe) but not anything else. 2.2L is only when u stroke it out and that means ur crankshaft needs to be ground out. So thats a bummer.

as for the rusted valves, i would say just take the heard apart with your buddies and clean the shit outta em and put it back. stockies are steel valves if im not mistaken so its not like the valves are gonna break. its just the rust coatin.

Hope things work out for you Chris. good luck bro.

[NXRacer]

it should be fine if the block is honed and the head/valves are bead blasted as long as the rust didnt do too deep of pits in the cylinder walls and stuff.

[shepherd79]

the rust is not a problem.
just spray some lubricant, let is sit overnight and rotate the engine a few times.
you can clean the carbon very easy.
i would take the A20A1 head and remove the valves and remove the carbon with dremel. than take the valves and grind them into seat.
when i rebuild my motor, i took BT block, and A20a1 head. rebuilded the head and it is running better than any other EFi 3G i drove. the last time i did the compression i got 155psi at each cylinder. I think it is good for that motor.

[bobafett]

yah everyone says the rust is not a problem, but this is serious rust. not like a little bit of rust colored metal, i mean there is like 1/8" thick of rust bubbles... i already played with oil and liquid wrench, it cleans up some of the carbon. but doesnt help with the bad rust....

[NXRacer]

sounds like you're SOL chris. kinda like justin is right now. . . . .

[smufguy]

all i can say is, THAT SUCKS. worst part is, it has to happen to you???? Feel bad for u bro. Hopefully if u can wait till the end of this year, u can have my engine, no tranny tho.

[bobafett]

hahah yeah i dunno what to do. the whole point of this motor was it shouldnt have been left outside, if it hadnt, i would have a SWEEEEEET motor...

oh well. i may just rebuild my block and use his a20a1 head, or if i feel like the performance gain is worth it i will bore the motherfucker out.

the thing is: i wanted to buy a 240 and spend all my money on the sr20det.... not the lame a20 lol!

turns out i will have a shitload into the accord, which i didnt want to do... we will see, maybe i can come up with a good solution...