Run For The Hills Its A Tranny Swap!

[RedneckRicer]

Due to severe auto tranny problems AKA Aamco. i went nuts and blew $200 to buy another 88 accord sedan that got hit so hard its shorter than a hatchback:stick:, and its hiding a sweet little 5 speed in it, and i'm gonna drag that out and drop it in mine. The parts car is an LX and mine is an LX-i all the difference is that mine looks like a sedan and has the PGM-FI. so what differences am i not seeing if any? i have 2 complete cars so i should have all the parts i need to swap the tranny (Hopefully) and to make new pipe to bypass my CAT :D . anyways, i was wondering if you guys could tell me how big of a nightmare i'm getting into. any help would be great

[pimp86LX]

i think theres a how- to for this bud, check it out

the auto to manual i don't think is too too complicated, but i bet it can be a little time consuming

[YK86]

My write up is in the how-to section. I did the swap about 2 1/2 years ago. 88LXI68 just finished it a couple days ago. We both pretty much agree it's a 5/10 on difficulty.

[RedneckRicer]

good good, cuz i was talkin to some local tranny guys, which seem to like to blow smoke certain places and they were tellin me there was too much computer stuff for " someone with your mechanical ability, and should only be handled by our technicians " i guess undoing bolts and reattaching things is more complicated than rebuilding motors :rolleyes: i heard that the speedo was different, that the auto was electronic and the 5speed was cable driven.... that true? cuz i was gonna swap the dash anyhow, but just wondering all the same. but now that i know this, i'm thinkin i'll tackle that this week.... cuz i'm stuck driving my deceased granny's '99 forester..... the green import tank and nothin compared to a 3g.... guess they sorta grow on ya eh? thanks for the help!:super:

[jteuton]

i've been wanting to do this but the cheapest quote i got on a used tranny was 550 dollars with a 6 month warranty. Does this sound reasonably?...That doesnt' include any of the other parts

[YK86]

That's too high I think. I can get used trannies in the 120,000 mile range with 4 month warranty for about $250 US

[RedneckRicer]

i guess i'm lucky then, cuz i picked up a whole car for $200, i'd say look around at some tow truck companies or scope out peoples back yards and see if you can find a munched 3g with a 5 speed, because once you've got what you want out of it you can always take it to a junkyard. and sell parts off the car to where you've made more than you paid for it. i paid 200 and already sold 250 in parts off of it. so in a way i'm gettin paid 50 to swap my tranny. but i also live out in the boondocks and have room for a munched car to sit around for a few months without neighbors pitchin a bitch about it too

[foxracer22]

Well i guess i got real lucky cause i bought a wrecked 87 Lx-i so i could get the tranny to put in mine. I got the tranny, motor and some body parts for 80 bucks.

[RedneckRicer]

:wtf: well i started draggin out the auto tranny today but my Halfshafts won't come out. i undid the notched bolt, and followed haynes. but ain't nuthin happening, what'd i do?

[YK86]

You have to swing out the whole lower part of the front suspension (just pop out the lower balljoint from the arm) to get the axle to come out of the hub. You then take a flathead screwdriver and pry out the axle right where it goes into the tranny and it will click. Then pull out the axle.

[RedneckRicer]

i got it all to click and come outta both, but i couldn't get it to just drop out. i was praying i wouldn't have to mess with the suspension, but ah well, i guess i'll get it over with tomorrow, thanks for the help!

[RedneckRicer]

:stupid: just to make sure i don't damage anything, and to at the very least, double check.... i unbolted the lower balljoint and assuming its a tapered fit, such as a tie rod end, you have to hit the metal around it to pop it loose....tried that, and i still can't get that lower ball joint stud to come loose of the lower control arm.....what do i do?:banghead:

[AZmike]

If a hammer isn't working you can use either a'tie rod end puller' (not the big fork thing, it's a small tool that works sort of like a scissors jack to push the stud out of the hole). Another tool to try is a 'bearing puller'. It has a few arms that grab on to the suspension and a bolt in the center that you turn until it breaks the stud loose. I recently changed my tie rod ends. Those things were tight. Also, leave the nuts on loosely. That way when the parts break loose, nothing goes flying. If you have an Autozone nearby, they lend tools for free (buy tool, use it, return it and get all your money back).

Hope that helps. Good luck. I can't stand driving automatics.

[jteuton]

when i lowered my dodge dakota....i literaly had to beat the shit out of the lower control arm till the ball joint came out of the spindle....about 25 licks with a 3lb hammer

[monsonhonda]

i put a 2x4 on the arm and the other end on the ground, and jumped on the mother f*cker, came out after all 220lbs of me kicked its ass

[RedneckRicer]

well after some serious afghan engineering i got the mofo outta there, speedo sensor covered me in beautifully coffee brown utterly torched ATF. took a shower.... i'm gonna do a little R&R on the engine bay... aka clean up all aamco's mess from a leaky transaxle. nice grease all over. as well as when i pulled back the shield for the exhaust i got about 2lbs of gravel on my chest. so in the intrest of keeping my car clean, i'm gonna so to say, douche the undercarriage. i'm gonna be picking all of your brains and praying for posts when i start the 5 speed conversion though... thanks in advance:bow:

[RedneckRicer]

Okay, i'm done working for the week, i've got the auto tranny all the way out, along with all the shifter stuff. i'm gonna work on the other car tonight, pulling out the tranny, or at least some pedals and shifter. but what i really wanna know is.... why do i need an ECU? there was one wire to the tranny that was for the starter....which i'm guessing is pretty universal. there were wires for the shifter, but i was presuming that it was for the dash indicator, the light for the indicator, and such things.... question is... what does the ECU have to do with any of it? its a carbed car that has my 5 speed, and i'm fuel injected.... but what does the motor's fuel input have to do with a difference in the transmission?:wtf:

[jteuton]

ohhh....so your going to need an ecu out of another car...I do know the computers are setup with different timing and fuel curves but i wouldn't i know why. The 'automatic' computer uses data from the switch on the side of the shifter to tell it what gear your in and then it makes a healthy decison based on that. In drive....then the car isn't starting.....in second instead of drive....it switches table...but with a 5 speed things are certainly different...i wish somebody knew all the answers who could help

[RedneckRicer]

there were wires on the shifter for the auto, but for the stick.... theres a whole lot of nothing. no wires for the shifter or tranny.... guess i'll see why i needed that ECU when it gets up and goin eh?

[jteuton]

your 'auto ecu' is going to look for inputs where you don't have anything hook too (the automatic gear switch) and its going to be interesting to see how it responds. Let me know if you go with a 5speed ecu so i can know if i get ripped buying one of them too

[GreenMachine]

You have to fool the auto cpu, by leaving the device attached to the shifter in the nuetral setting, by doing that you should be fine with the auto cpu cause it'll just think your in nuetral.:D

[jteuton]

ok....i had a little time to mess with it when i got off today (about an hour or so). I pulled the speedo gear out and took the cooler hoses off. Removed the battery and a whole bunch of other junk in the way. I removed the Throttle valve cable. I got through most of the shifter inside the car. I accidently pulled the casing off the starter so its in two pieces now. (Any Ideas how to get it back together?) And thats it so far. I tried breaking the hub nuts loose to no avail. Them bitches are on there. I'll have to get my bodybuilding friend to come over and tear them off. So what should I do next? I was trying to make this more easier on my friend who's doing this for me on Saturday so he won't have to mess with stuff i should be able to take care of. I heard the next step is to remove the torque convertor cover and remove the bolts holding it to the flywheel.....but where in the hell are them bolts at?......also how much do you think the auto weighs compared to the manual.....thankyou thankyou...for the replies

[RedneckRicer]

The weight difference i'd say is.... Oprah to a crackhead, the auto being oprah. the torque converter cover is right below the left hand side of the engine block, theres a brace with 4 bolts in it you have to remove, as well as the center cross member, then its right behind that little rubbery mount

[RedneckRicer]

i was lookin over lastnight's 130AM wrap up, and i found theres 2 wires sticking out of my 5speed....what are they for? cuz my harness doesn't have them......

[GreenMachine]

hmmmm..... maybe backup lights. I'll check on my car tommorow and see if I can't see exactly what there for !:bh:

[RedneckRicer]

lol, thanks. they're the two coming out of the tranny and they go to (at least on a carbed 88) the two plugs by the battery.... i tracked 'er down. but from there i know not where it goes.

[88LXi68]

the two wires are for reverse lights. if you look in the how to it says 1 wire goes to a 12volt source and the other to the green wires near the auto shifter for the reverse switch. Also guys, dont forget to get the manual transmission starter. The auto one wont bolt up right.

[RedneckRicer]

i made the same mistake and pulled the starter peice out of the housing, so i was planning on using the standard one anyhow, so out of that huge @$$ plug for the auto shifter, i need to use but ONE green wire? please tell me its so, lol

[jteuton]

dammit all too hell.....i knew i should have got the starter too....but they wanted extra....dammit....I'm still not seeing any cover....it all looks like one piece to me. I've already unscrewed four bolts that are by the vents (slash marks) but nothing budged. Your not talking about the bolts that look like they go into the block are you? How important is it to unbolt the torque converter first. Can't you unbolt it after you pull the tranny down?.....Oh also will the speedo gear work or should I have got that too.......whew

[RedneckRicer]

ya gotta unbolt the torque converter, because it bolts to the flex plate which bolts to the motor. and you can't unbolt that with the tranny on. while under the car with that cross member from front to back out. you should be able to see a part of the tranny that sticks down like 3-4" farther than the engine block. there should be small bolts, the bottom few are 12mm the top two are 10mm if i remember right. they're in a black cover that goes against the tranny. you might have to wiggle it back and forth to get it to pop loose, but theres 2 10mm bolts up top that ya can't see too well, it took me a awhile to get 'em

[jteuton]

i'll try it and let you know.....have you took a look at the lightened flywheels at optionautosalon. I think i'm going to spring for one of them. They are a bit pricey though at 390 dollars but they have a removable lining in them that makes it where you never have to resurface them. It sounds cool. It says they only fit 88 and 89 lxi.....so i hope it works. Has anybody had any experience with them. Another thing....how did you end up getting the lower control arm off the ball joint....did you have to use a puller? Did you take off the tie rod as well?....Thanks...maybe we can help each other through this.

[RedneckRicer]

it took some serious afghan engineering but i got it apart. my accord the bottom balljoint WOULD NOT come loose. but it came apart fine on the other. i didn't mess with the tierods, i left them attached, sorta helped support the rotor. i'm gonna get back to working on it wednesday, starting on the clutch pedal, and shifter linkage.... which sucks some serious... yeah, because i have to drop the exhuast on the cars to loosen/tighten the bolts for the shifter plate. but if i see any more complications i'll let ya know. BTW.... theres a green w/ black, and a yellow wire for those reverse lights.... which does what?

[jteuton]

ok i got to work on it again for an hour after work today (damn this sucks) and i got the torque converter cover plate off i think....well its some sorta of cover over the backside of the driveplate. There are little 10mm screws on the backside of the driveplate/flywheel....looking back towards the tranny.....are these the ones that secure it to the torque converter. Ok....did you have to take both axles out. I got the hub nut and suspension off the drivers side but i don't understand how the drive axle comes out without tearing the little boot on the backside of the rotor.....damn i hope the manual ain't as hard to put in as taking this one out.....shessshh

[RedneckRicer]

okay, theres 8 bolts on the torque converter you gotta take out. and the drive shafts come out like this: you have to get a screwdriver or something wedge shaped like that ( i used an old school tire tool with the spoon for hubcars ) you put that between the round peice and the rotor. theres a small gap but prying in between will make it come loose. you gotta do that same thing to the end in the tranny, but it comes out a lot easier.

[RedneckRicer]

by the by, i got my clutch and brake pedals in today, gonna work on getting the shifter linkage in. the pedals, make ya wanna run away pulling your hair out and doin this...:flipa: but i put on some 'racing pedals' they don't look too bad, maybe i'll get un lazy and get some pics some day. now all i need to do is to get the tranny in and hook up the shifter!

[jteuton]

Well it's got to come out sooner or later. No matter which bolts i take out i will get to all of them. So you did both axles? Or can you leave the passenger one secured to the rotor since your reusing it? I'm guessing i need to just take both out and get it over with. I have to rotate the engine i believe to get the bolts out i'm looking at. I'm hoping I don't have to do anything to the exhaust since I just got all the piping done. My automatic shifter came out just fine. Oh by the way how many mounts hold this stupid thing. I've got the one out that rests on the crossmember directly beneath it. I knows their's one on the passenger fender well. Now the one up front by the radiator looks like its just for the engine. I can't really tell about the one in the very back it looks like its supporting both. And also the mount with a bar that comes over the top of the engine looks like its attached but i'm not sure. So how many mounts did you have to take off?:bow: :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:

[RedneckRicer]

i pulled both axles, and that top mount is secured to the tranny... and you do have to turn over the motor to pull all the bolts in the TC ( too lazy to type torque converter anymore) but if i remember right there were 3 mounts, the passenger side fender mount (which stays out, the 5 speed doesn't use it) the top motor / tranny mount. and then the crossmember you had to remove to get to the TC bolts. aside from that theres bolts up the front and top of the bell housing. remove those and the drive shafts. and the speedometer hoses and cable (which is held in by a clip) and make sure you drain your ATF out and i'd say leave the plug out overnight. because it all comes outta the drive shaft holes when you pull those, or so it did on my 5 speed. aaannnndddd the hoses off the speedo unit will incessantly drip so i'd get some rags if you're concerned about the surface upon which you're working. i slacked for awhile tonight and haven't got the linkage in.....but i'm debating on whether or not to pull an all nighter again to get 'er done. we'll see later i guess, lol

BTW.... my theory on replacing swinging pedals is still :crying:

[88LXi68]

The installation of pedals SUCK!!! Make sure you get the WHOLE pedal assembly from a 5spd, dont just add the actual pedals.

[jteuton]

Well is there any way to get the axles out than popping of the lower control arm. The balls won't give in. I tried beating the hell out of the lower control arm but I couldn't find a good spot to hit it so that idea is:toilet: . I finally ordered a aluminum flywheel. It cost me so much i thought i was going to have to:badass: a bank. Well it looks like when i get the axles out i can begin to take the tranny out. I hope the pedals ain't as hard as yall say....if so then :barf: . Is there any other pointers yall can point out i would apprectiate the hell out of it. By the way I owe yall a few:beer: . Till tommorrow when i get back down on all fours and act like a :banghead: again

[RedneckRicer]

hey! i got it all done about 4 AM this morning.... and its all good, EXCEPT THE GD CLUTCH CABLE!:mad: :mad: :mad:

something so small stops the whole operation, it blows. WEll i had to cut the sleeve as the how to says, it says 3-5" i cut 2 1/2" and all of the sudden, my cable is wwaaayyy too long, after attempting to space the linkage because at first the clutch wouldn't completely disengage and then it wouldn't engage, and now my cable is wasted because it pulled the metal peice by the firewall into the sheath for the cable..... so i guess i'm SOL til i go buy another and even then i dunno if i can get it to work right :( you guys know anyway to fix this shyt?

[88LXi68]

Ok like I said, you have to swap the WHOLE pedal assembly into the auto. Mine did the SAME thing before I realized that the 5spd assembly has the bracket already there for you and makes it perfect. Attached are both pedal assemblys. On the left is the automatic assembly. On the right the 5spd. Notice on the 5spd assembly the top left corner. You run the clutch cable throught that hole. The metal sleave on the clutch cable then seats itself into the hole.
http://images.cardomain.com/installs/210000-210999/210989_68_full.jpg

http://images.cardomain.com/installs/210000-210999/210989_67_full.jpg

[RedneckRicer]

i was thinking i would, but from the looks of it, i thought it was spot welded in. i didn't see a way to get it out without tearing apart the whole dash, which i really don't wanna do.

[jteuton]

Holy flying cow shit. I just got my manual and parts deliver straight to my front door and it looks like a biznitch. I don't think I've ever tried anything this hard. First off the drive axles don't seem right. I can wiggle the end around in the boot and it doesn't feel like cv joints are right. Should I feel a little resistant and some kind of mechanical movement. I bet they broke the bastards taking them out. I got the whole pedal assembly and it should have a sign on it that reads:wtf: . How about this shift linkage....there are two long fucking rods. I have never seen a 5 speed hooked up before so I have no clue where any of this shit will bolt up. I wish I had the advantage of taking it out also. Anyways the clutch looks shot to the :toilet: so i think there has been some abuse. The computer looks way different. It has a black lid (mine was silver) and has accord/prelude on it. The starter look totally fucking different too. Where in the hell do you fun the clutch cable. Where does the long rod with bolt hole through it on the shift linkage go? Where's my beer? How in the hell did I get myself into this?

[jteuton]

:crying: :crying: :crying:

[88LXi68]

Originally posted by jteuton
Holy flying cow shit. I just got my manual and parts deliver straight to my front door and it looks like a biznitch. I don't think I've ever tried anything this hard. First off the drive axles don't seem right. I can wiggle the end around in the boot and it doesn't feel like cv joints are right. Should I feel a little resistant and some kind of mechanical movement. I bet they broke the bastards taking them out. I got the whole pedal assembly and it should have a sign on it that reads:wtf: . How about this shift linkage....there are two long fucking rods. I have never seen a 5 speed hooked up before so I have no clue where any of this shit will bolt up. I wish I had the advantage of taking it out also. Anyways the clutch looks shot to the :toilet: so i think there has been some abuse. The computer looks way different. It has a black lid (mine was silver) and has accord/prelude on it. The starter look totally fucking different too. Where in the hell do you fun the clutch cable. Where does the long rod with bolt hole through it on the shift linkage go? Where's my beer? How in the hell did I get myself into this?


LOL Thats what I was saying when I first started, I was totally regretting it. But once the tranny is hooked up its like damn the hard part is done. Lemme see if I can help you. About the axles, I have no idea what they should feel like. I never thought to. The pedals are hard because you have to crawl under the dash and remove the 5 or 6 nuts then you got wiggle it around maybe drop the steering rack. The pedals are time consuming. The shift rods are the easiest part. You have to rods. both go to the tranny and you will easily be able to see where each hooks up too. This is because they both have different ends. BTW if you want a short shifter install it now while the shift rods are out of the car. Even if the clutch was ok I would replace it any way just because you dont wanna have to pull it out 3-4 months down the road. Get a clutch you will be happy with because I went cheap and I hate this SOFT clutch. My computer was silver as well. You may want to check honda part #s on that. If you want I can get you a 5spd silver one for pretty cheap. The starter is very different than the auto one. It has a different mounting design.

If you have more questions PM me or hit me up on AIM "thefranchise96"

[RedneckRicer]

quick question..... do i have to drop the brake pedal if i take out that mount for the clutch cable?

[jteuton]

I got a good question too.....can the pedal assembly come out without droping the steering column?......i got my driver's drive axle out today after the balljoint literally kicked my ass. I got my revenge though. Very scray thing here. The axles are the same length.....wtf.....they look identical and i'm positive this axle came out of a manual.....so whats up?

[88LXi68]

The passenger side axles are the same. The driver side is slightly different. look at the ends. You will notice the slightest little difference in the way the splines look. I dont think you can take the pedals out without dropping the rack.

[jteuton]

The Honda gave birth tonight to a auto tranny weighing in around 100 lbs. I left the auto linkage on it and tied it around the bumper of my truck and drove it around. Payback is a bitch. Well its awaiting implant of the manual. One question i don't see the cooler lines for the manual like the auto had going to the radiator so wtf? Also why does the clutch pedal have a switch above it? And to get the pedals out you have to take the steering wheel off or is there a trick to seperating the shaft or something. I mean how in the hell does that come apart? Thanks again.....time to have a beer and congratulate myself......anyone want an auto for free???

[88LXi68]

Originally posted by jteuton
The Honda gave birth tonight to a auto tranny weighing in around 100 lbs. I left the auto linkage on it and tied it around the bumper of my truck and drove it around. Payback is a bitch. Well its awaiting implant of the manual. One question i don't see the cooler lines for the manual like the auto had going to the radiator so wtf? Also why does the clutch pedal have a switch above it? And to get the pedals out you have to take the steering wheel off or is there a trick to seperating the shaft or something. I mean how in the hell does that come apart? Thanks again.....time to have a beer and congratulate myself......anyone want an auto for free???

The manual doesnt have any cooler lines. You have to plug the lines up. The switch above the clutch pedal is for the manual park-neutral switch. You dont have to worry about that though. If you unscrew the shroud under the steering wheel you will see a couple of bolts and brackets that will you allow to let the whole rack hit the floor. this then gives you enough room to manuever the pedals out.

[RedneckRicer]

Off work again, so now i getta go scrounge junkyards for a clutch cable. but i wanna know... do you have to mess with the gas pedal at all to remove and replace this bracket? from the pics it looks somewhat like the upper connection on the throttle pedal... am i up too late and seeing things or is it right?:stupid:

[88LXi68]

The whole assembly comes off, so yes you have to take the throttle cable off the pedal too. A new cable from Honda isnt too expensive. I paid $27 for one.

[jteuton]

So Redneck.....how did your swap come out? Any problems? Did the ecu work for you? Did you end up swaping pedal assemblies?....Did your manual tranny have any vacuum hoses coming from it? Me and 88lxi were talking about it the other day and he probably knows by now but did your tranny have a little rubber hose coming off it? I'm waiting on my flywheel and clutch.....it'll probably be antoher week before they come in though....it sucks

[RedneckRicer]

i gave in and bought an ECU today, $65 bucks. got another clutch cable $10 , put it and the correct bracket for the pedals out of a 5 speed car, got it all together, stepped on the clutch, snap, crackle, pop and a :wtf: . all the linkage / cable is good, except the fork for the throwout bearing comin outta the tranny..... its completely and utterly loose. i guess my throwout bearing let loose, its brand new, or the spring broke or the forks came out of the spring... but i'm gonna go ahead and TAKE OUT the 5 speed tranny..... again:crying: :crying: :crying: unless theres another way i can fix it, lol, which i doubt. i'm thinking when i finish i'll drive it awhile, drop it for 2500 and get me a old skool musclecar. get me a pickup or something, i can't handle all the BS from this car

[RedneckRicer]

well it turns out it was the return spring...snapped in half... what a joy, i spent a couple hours tonight trying to wrestle the tranny back in .... but no go, its all lined up and everything, i have the alignment tool.... but as for why the hell it won't go back together i dunno