B18A Intake Manifold on A20A

[bboipinoy112]

need answers and clarification.

-b18a manifold fits with drilling.
-how would you go about the vacuum hoses and such?
-would you plug it up the same way it looks on the a20x manifold?
-has anyone done this allready? who? pics? how to?

thanks. i allready have the b18a manifold and its sitting at my dads gerage right now. any info would be nice on how i would go about doing the swap. flame get mad. tell me to search. say whatever. but ive searched and nuthing has came up on how to do it.. just came up on 'if you can or cant' . thanks - junior -

[maka_RTH]

to see how well it will fit, get a intake manifold gasket for the accord, and then put it on the end of the b18 manifold to see where holes would need to be drilled and stuff, make sure the ports line up correctly(although they'll be a bigger diameter on the manifold). as far as hooking it up and will it fit.., i'm not entirely sure..., haven't done this yet.

[bboipinoy112]

to see how well it will fit, get a intake manifold gasket for the accord, and then put it on the end of the b18 manifold to see where holes would need to be drilled and stuff, make sure the ports line up correctly(although they'll be a bigger diameter on the manifold). as far as hooking it up and will it fit.., i'm not entirely sure..., haven't done this yet.

yea ive read so many posts about the gasket thing lol. but none about actually doing it or beyond the gasket part. if the b18 manifold has bigger ports. . should i just port the head to match up to the manifold also?

[HC_LXi]

need answers and clarification.

-b18a manifold fits with drilling.
-how would you go about the vacuum hoses and such?
-would you plug it up the same way it looks on the a20x manifold?
-has anyone done this allready? who? pics? how to?

thanks. i allready have the b18a manifold and its sitting at my dads gerage right now. any info would be nice on how i would go about doing the swap. flame get mad. tell me to search. say whatever. but ive searched and nuthing has came up on how to do it.. just came up on 'if you can or cant' . thanks - junior -

hey greets :) about the intake manifold i did it like a week ago and its pretty easy you only have to drill 2 holes a little lower from the stock ones from the runner #1 and the #3.its pretty easy cause ell the other holes lines up.here is a pic for u to usi for a reference :rockon:

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid140/pa63afa72bb743b0fdeac5f5ddfadfc51/f6eadfa2.jpg

[HC_LXi]

i forget to tell that mines is from a b18B but its the same.

P.D-sorry me english :rockon:

[bboipinoy112]

holy jesus ... what about the vacuum lines?

[geesnow]

do u notice any power gains??

[maka_RTH]

as for the bigger ports on the manifold, you can just get you head port-matched for the manifold. this is recommended anyways for optimum flow. and if you got the money, you may as well get your head port and polished at the same time, along with the intake manifold.

[smufguy]

okay, if your worried about your vaccum lines, here is the solution. Get one of the vaccum distribution units. Its a big ole round thing with places for you to plug in hoses. You will have to get some "T" connectors and go from there, if you dont wanna spend big bucks.

[HC_LXi]

okay, if your worried about your vaccum lines, here is the solution. Get one of the vaccum distribution units. Its a big ole round thing with places for you to plug in hoses. You will have to get some "T" connectors and go from there, if you dont wanna spend big bucks.

That's exactly what i did use 2 T's for all the vaccums.

[NXRacer]

um, i thought it was a bad idea to port out the intake part of the head because honda makes them in just a way that it helps mix the air/fuel mixture. If you port out the intake ports, dont you have to 'texture' them to make sure it works like its supposed to?

[smufguy]

you port match it to the manifold, never on the head. but if a quality head work is done where oversized valves and longer valves with cams that have higher duration and greater lift will compansate for it. but like caleb mentioned, u dont wanna blindly mess with the intake side of the head, be careful how much u take off and just polish the crap outta it.

[night]

im actually about to do this too. honestly you dont even need to drill the 2 bolts. all the other bolts are fine and more than enough.
after i rebuilt my motor i didnt feel like fighting to get the bottom bolts, so i left em off, had no leaks or probs now for almost 3000 miles

[smufguy]

for NA you should not have problems with it leaking. But under boost. Well u are better off doing everything right. Also, Drilling the extra holes is not a pain, just mark them right, take it to a drill press or a mill and ur done in about 15 to 20 mts.

[bboipinoy112]

DAMN!. . getting our intake manifold is a bitch.... arg gar garr ! . but its off. 4 hours of fun. now i know how to take it off with out pain next time. maybe still pain, like busted fingers and chunks of skin taken off do to stupid 10mm bults that are tight as hell... why are the 10mm bolts harder to take off then the 12 14 17 19s ? anyways. yea... there is alot things going on when taking the manifold off. but hey. the intake manifold is going in.

edit- snap-on tools are the shit. everyone should go buy some. replace your peice of shit craftsmans with snap-ons .... oh and swivel sockets and rachets are the SHIT!.. basic swivel socket and rachet set, couple extensions(3in,6in'rs), saved my life. if i was stuck with the ORDINARY tool set . . . who knows :pc:

[A20A1]

Yeah certainly get the distribution unit... or make one out of a 1/2" - 5/8" pipe with little 5/32" nubs for the vacum lines... It should get rid of problems caused by diminished vacuum signal.

[smufguy]

with the top torque rod outta the way, it should take u no less than 20 mts to pull the manifold out. Atleast thats how long it took me when i had to change the gasket.

[bboipinoy112]

hMmmm. well. it coulda been faster. but it was at my pace of sitting and talking. and getting a bolt off and then talk again. so yea.

[Hash_man_Se_i]

im curious to see the gains with a stock b18 manifold. I have considered an aftermarket manifold myself.

[bboipinoy112]

im curious also. when i ran my car at the tracks with shortram, monza muffler and no weight red. i hit 16.7s-8s. so yea. after this swap with the hybrid integ tranny. i will head out to the tracks on the 13th. and we will see what the 2 swaps will do together.

[bboipinoy112]

how much HP do you think it will bump me up, if any ?

[smufguy]

i guess you guys did not follow up on search the old threads. cause this was already discussed. The power gains are hard to say if you dont have engine mods, like a camshaft, more fuel and other stuff. This is because, the B series manifold is designed for making power in the higher rpm, where these B series motors make their power obviously. So u will loose a lot of low end, i mean a lot. This swap on the manifold is only advised if u got motor work done with a rebuilt block, worked on head, cams, high cr pistons and what not to utelize this manifold. BUt for forced induction, this is the way to go.

[joker2]

Actually, you won't loose that much low end and if you think that you've lost too much there are was of compensating that... I run a b16 mani. but I also have the works done to my engine so I might not be able to give a fair accessment for the stock guys... I can tell you this, you will definitely feel it on the top end... The car feels like it will pull for days.... :)

[Swap_File]

I found a B18B at the junkyard, and grabbed the intake. Here are pictures of it next to my extra A20A3 intake.

http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/6262/122505night001large2xu.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night001large2xu.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/7315/122505night002large0ac.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night002large0ac.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/1179/122505night003large1pa.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night003large1pa.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/6412/122505night004large8dk.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night004large8dk.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/9449/122505night005large0lg.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night005large0lg.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/1410/122505night006large3cz.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night006large3cz.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/2382/122505night007large1md.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night007large1md.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/1037/122505night008large6jx.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night008large6jx.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/1863/122505night009large2oo.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night009large2oo.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/611/122505night011large9xn.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night011large9xn.jpg)

Note the two locations that need holes drilled, and note the one bolt hole and two coolant lines that would be unused.

[Swap_File]

There is a limit of 10 pictures per post, so here are the rest:

http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/6939/122505night012large1rv.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night012large1rv.jpg)http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/7269/122505night013large8vu.th.jpg (http://img433.imageshack.us/my.php?image=122505night013large8vu.jpg)

Notice how the B18B intake dips less than the A20A3 intake, and it also ends up being taller.

[newaccorddriver]

hmm, i got a B16A2 intake manifold, its missing the thing on the back, i think its the fast idle valve. is there anything i can really do about that? i never really liked starting it up at 2000rpm, so will this be my chance to block it off and let it idle at start up like normal?

[AccordEpicenter]

swap, are the ports the same size or a little bigger on the b18 intake? Ive heard soo much talk about portmatching and shit but they look the same... whats the deal?

[AccordEpicenter]

they look that way in the pic but i dont think they are actually a different size... thats what im trying to find out

[Accordtheory]

The non vtec manifold will not cause you to lose your low rpm torque. The ls makes more torque than the a20, with less displacement. I'm glad to finally see people trying to use the ls manifold instead of the b16, one far less suited to the a20..

I just went outside and held up my ls IM gasket aginst my a20 head, which I port matched to fit the aebs manifold. The gasket matched, so the ports are the same between the b16 and ls manifolds. Mostly the top of the a20 port needs to be enlarged to match. I think if you don't port match the head, you won't get anything like what you should get from the swap.

[Accordtheory]

And oh yeah, people who polish intake ports haven't read much about porting.."boundary layer separation" is desirable. You don't want your fuel settling out onto the walls of the ports and then dripping into the chamber..a rougher texture discourages the fuel from sticking to the walls as it flows past

[getready]

I'm trying to convert to obd1 (soon). I'm putting in a b18b (2000 ls) nonvtec manifold, f22 distributor, and a20a3 head. I'm using a p75 (94 integra ls) ecu.

I was told in my thread, exactly what Accordtheory just said, that you will actually gain low rpm, exactly what i want. I got a quote from inlinepro (shop around here, they're also online inlinepro.com) saying it'll cost 900 to port and polish the head, and to port match the manifold. I'm doing this sometime in january, if you're all still wondering, i'll take plenty of pictures and i'll note the differences.

[Accordtheory]

$900 to port and polish a head to the manifold?? I pm'd you, did you already find a fuel injected head?

[Accordtheory]

Someone should post up a pic of the carb head with the b series IM gasket on it, to show how much you would have to modify the ports, or if it's possible at all to make it work. Or if you don't have the gasket, just throw up a good pic of the ports..

[getready]

Accordtheory, yeah 900, i need to start saving.. I could always take it to vertex..

I'm still looking for a head, but havent found any. I know you have one, but youre hella far. You're my for-sure thing if everyone decides to be lame around here and steal all the good head from the junkyard before i get there.

I have my b18b mani if you want me to take some pics of it for you. I have to take pics for frankie89 anyway

[getready]

http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_64_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_65_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_66_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_67_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_68_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_69_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_70_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_71_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/5/web/2165000-2165999/2165114_73_full.jpg
2000 Acura Integra LS ... hope this helps someone, i just uploaded a lot of pics :)

[Swap_File]

swap, are the ports the same size or a little bigger on the b18 intake? Ive heard soo much talk about portmatching and shit but they look the same... whats the deal?

I didn't have an intake gasket to compare the two intakes with, but I took a caliper and measured the port sizes, port spacing, and spacing between the bolt holes and the ports.

I do not think any port matching would be needed; the ports seem to be identical.

[AccordEpicenter]

ok thanks thats what i was thinking!

[Accordtheory]

I didn't have an intake gasket to compare the two intakes with, but I took a caliper and measured the port sizes, port spacing, and spacing between the bolt holes and the ports.
I do not think any port matching would be needed; the ports seem to be identical.
The ports between what two heads? The a20 and the ls are Not identical..

And getready, need I remind you that I've already ported my head to match the B series manifold..but go ahead, waste your $900...

[Accordtheory]

Anyone have a pic of the ports on the carbed a20 head..?

[Swap_File]

The ports between what two heads? The a20 and the ls are Not identical..

Well, other than the two holes that need to be drilled, and the extra bolt hole and 2 coolant lines that will not be used, the ports (on my B18B intake) seemed to be the same size and in the same location as the ports on my spare A20A3 intake.

I can go and double check it today.

[w00tw00t111]

Accordtheory I have a carb head but, not in my possestion. *accords in the paint booth* As soon as I get my car back Im converting to EFI *most likely OBD1 but not sure*Im buying all my parts on New Years Day bc theres a half off sale at a local junkyard.Should I just go ahead and get the EFI head? Would this help at all in the EFI swap?

Think about this guys...why not use a b18 mani that is meant for lower end power? If thats a concern at all that should help.Long runners=high end and short runners=low end correct? I really like the design of the venom intakes although they are a tick out of my price range.Theyre geared towards low end I think. Just my .02

[Accordtheory]

Accordtheory I have a carb head but, not in my possestion. *accords in the paint booth* As soon as I get my car back Im converting to EFI *most likely OBD1 but not sure*Im buying all my parts on New Years Day bc theres a half off sale at a local junkyard.Should I just go ahead and get the EFI head? Would this help at all in the EFI swap?
Think about this guys...why not use a b18 mani that is meant for lower end power? If thats a concern at all that should help.Long runners=high end and short runners=low end correct? I really like the design of the venom intakes although they are a tick out of my price range.Theyre geared towards low end I think. Just my .02

When someone posts a pic of the carb head's intake ports, you'll know if you should get an a20a3 head or not.. I remember believing that the carb a20 head does not have provisions for the injectors, but now i don't remember why I thought that. Hence waiting for the pic.

As far as the runner length/size, play around with a computer design program for designing ported sub boxes, and you'll see how the port diameter/ length affect the volume (volumetric efficiency) at a certain frequency (rpm). Longer=lower frequency, lower rpm.

[carotman]

All A20A heads are the same. If the A20A1 was any different, I wouldn't have been able to do the EFI conversion.

[w00tw00t111]

All A20A heads are the same. If the A20A1 was any different, I wouldn't have been able to do the EFI conversion.
Good deal carotman! I was asking b/c this sunday I'm going to go get all the parts for the EFI conversion and I really wasn't looking forward to removing the head but I was going to do whatever it takes. Although...a P&P would be nice to have ;) I might do it anyways!

[Accordtheory]

Damn it..who the hell told me the carb head doesn't have the raised top of the port for the injectors! Now I look like an ass, because I told getready that he needed to change to an a20a3 head. Oh well, fuck it..

[getready]

well, thats good news for me. So i can just rebuild my a20a1 head and it'll be alright? I dont understand how this'll work, but i guess i'll find out soon enough..

[Versanick]

same heads, different intakes with the bs motor and a20x motor

interchangeability is easy

[getready]

so, you take the carb off and replace with injectors? seems a little too easy, or i'm completely retarded.

[smufguy]

You are not completely retarded, you just did not look at the Projects section. You just replace the manifolds.

[88Accord-DX]

So no one feels retarded, I'll post some pics of my A20A1 head for comparison next week.

[Swap_File]

Here are more pictures:

B18B Intake against A20A3 Head
http://img425.imageshack.us/img425/6548/car004large2od.th.jpg (http://img425.imageshack.us/my.php?image=car004large2od.jpg)http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/6858/car2003large3hu.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=car2003large3hu.jpg)http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/883/car2005large8cd.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=car2005large8cd.jpg)http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/1511/car2006large2im.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=car2006large2im.jpg)http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/3650/car2007large4ty.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=car2007large4ty.jpg)

A20A3 Intake Side of Head
http://img463.imageshack.us/img463/2458/car2001large6za.th.jpg (http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=car2001large6za.jpg)

[carotman]

If the A20A1 head didn't have those holes for the injectors, it would be impossible for us to do the EFi conversion without swapping the heads. (which is a big pain in the butt)

There are some differences in the heads but the intake and exhaust ports are just the same.

[smufguy]

aside from the Exhaust valve length (longer on the A1) and the different camshaft profile (not sure abotu the cam gear) the head is the same between the A1 and a3.

[newaccorddriver]

ive just got my intake mainfold gasket and ive compared it to the B16A2 intake manifold ive got. apparently only 5 of the holes actually match up... ive got to drill 5 other holes, is that normal? all the ports match up though, but why does the gasket have holes between the runners when theres nothing flowing through them?

[Bglad420]

Bolt holes probably..........

[speedpenguin]

just read this whole thread. good info!
i'm switching to EFI early this spring, so just to clarify for my feeble mind, can i take this to mean i can use the B18 (instead of the A20A3) intake manifold when i do the swap? sounds like an awesome idea.

[smufguy]

yes speedy you can do it. just gotta splice some wires or just swap the sensors themselves, but as you know, ur not gonna have much low end.

[speedpenguin]

i thought the B18b gave you a gain in low end

[w00tw00t111]

Not to totally switch this subject but, since I'm wanting a good powerband for drag racing *1/4 not 1/8* then what would be best for our cars? Higher Low end so that you get power*and for that matter torque* off the line or is having a slight delay until you reach 3500-4000 and then just make sure that when you upshift you land back in the powerband more preferable. I've wondered the same thing about cars w/ root blowers vs. turboed. The blower is going to be making max boost from the moment you lay your foot on the peddle where as the turbo will *most likely* make much higher peak hp but, it will take it much much longer to get there...Which is better for drag racing? I mean it seems like both have their advantages as well as disadvantages.

Thanks hopefully this can somewhat clear the air as to what's better for our cars depending upon what you'll be doing w/ it.

[Accordtheory]

The blower is going to be making max boost from the moment you lay your foot on the peddle where as the turbo will *most likely* make much higher peak hp but, it will take it much much longer to get there...
That's not the way I understand it to be, I have always understood boost to be a function of rpm with superchargers. In other words, boost increases with rpm until you have some type of bypass valve open. When you floor the pedal, you don't have the same amount of boost at 1500rpm as you do at 5500. However, I haven't built anything with a supercharger..yet. I imagine all of the variables can be played around with.
With a turbo, you have nothing, then that nice evil whistling, then tirespin. When you engage the next gear, your turbo is still pushing whatever boost your wastegate is set to, provided you know how to shift and have a blow off valve. A turbo will always put down more average power over the powerband than a supercharger for other reasons too. When I say powerband, I mean the rpm band between shifts under maximum acceleration, not necessarily street driving.

[sporkHSP]

With a turbo, you have nothing, then that nice evil whistling, then tirespin.
then you sir need better tires.

[newaccorddriver]

then you sir need better tires.


slicks arent practical enough.

to keep this thread back on the topic i have a question. i got a B16A intake manifold and im pretty sure there is a drop in low end power. what im wondering is, will having a turbocharger compensate the power thats lost in the lower rpms?

[gfrg88]

whats up with everybody and lower rpm's???

with turbo i think your going to lose even more lowend, but it also depends what kind of turbo you get....

[Sporno]

so i im going to the junkyard this weekend and alll i need to get is the B18A intake manifold and the fuel rail and im good to go. how much do u think its gonna cost for those parts?:help:

[247shuer247]

bumpity bump

[CHAR POW]

yes speedy you can do it. just gotta splice some wires or just swap the sensors themselves, but as you know, ur not gonna have much low end.

smufguy do i understand you have a header for sale ?