problems wiht my car, help me confirm my thoughts...

[Vanilla Sky]

ok, when my motor gets hot, my enginge will almost stop working... it's acting like it's predetonating... i let the car cool and it's does fine until it gets hot again... i thought this was a fuel problem, but i think i have that ruled out...

so, yesterday, i figured i needed to see if i could get my coolant bled again... air city... nothing but air pockets... was like (water=w, air =a) wwwaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwawwaaaawaaaaawwaww...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/IMG00010.jpg

so, do you think cooling is my problem? i have an 88 DX auto with the vacuum line removal done, somewhere between stage 1 and 2...

after i bled my coolant again, it didn't seem to predetonate, but it still diesels at shutdown...

if this is my problem, why is there so much air in my system? the water pump is brand new, but all the hoses and radiator aren't... could i have a blockage? i wasn't having the predetonation problem until i changed water pumps...

sorry for the somewhat long post, but i felt the need to explain my situation properly...

thanks in advance

[snow_man_20]

did you over heat it by chance?? I know a blown head can somtimes put air in your cooling system and not have water in your oil. Not good but might not be the case. usualy the air pockets work there way out not causing to many "hot spots"

[Robs89LXi]

Did you check/change your thermostat?

[Blkblurr]

You must have a leak it your system somewhere. When you get the predetonation how hot is it?

[shepherd79]

do you bleed your system when the car idles?
do thins. fill up the overflow catch can somewhere in the middle.
warm up car untill fans kick in.
connect the tube you have and open the valve. you will see some air and some coolant come out. now, rev the motor to about 2-2.5 K. you should see the constant stream of water.
Make sure you have your heater turned on.
when running motor at 2K tighten the screw. you should be done. the system should be sealed unless you have a leak somewhere.
even if your overflow tank is empty, it will suck air into the system, so keep it full.
the other thing, change the thermostat, and run one of those Preston flush chemicals.
they work great for me.

[Vanilla Sky]

ok, i didn't change the thermostat, so i guess i'll do that... and i wasn't doing this with the heater on... i'm a dumbass and didn't do that... and i'll probably go ahead and flush with a chemical, too...

thanks for the pointers...

and i have thought of the headgasket... i need to have my compression checked... i am rebuilding a head anyway, so it's not gonna be that big of a deal...

[HondaBoy]

maybe your already doing this, but when i've refilled my system, when getting the air out i leave the radiator cap off until i'm finished. like i'll fill it letting the bubbles come out of the bleeder screw, tighten when the water comes out with no bubbles, then run the car for a while letting bubbles come up out of the radiator. works for me. about the dieseling, that is odd. maybe its just a coincidence, but could it possiblely be the timing needing to be reset? i know before i got the timing on my engine reset, it'd diesel after warming up.

[Oldblueaccord]

ok, i didn't change the thermostat, so i guess i'll do that... and i wasn't doing this with the heater on... i'm a dumbass and didn't do that... and i'll probably go ahead and flush with a chemical, too...

thanks for the pointers...

and i have thought of the headgasket... i need to have my compression checked... i am rebuilding a head anyway, so it's not gonna be that big of a deal...

I bleed mine like shepard does.

Does your vaccum advance seem OK?

wp

[Vanilla Sky]

ok, i bled as per alex's instructions, and i'm good on that front, the car is running tops, but it still diesels... i'm thinking it's bad gas... i tuned my timing down and i still get it... maybe i need to turn my timing up? i really could use a timing gun...

but like i said, car is running tops now... now to figure my grinding that sounds to me like a bad wheel bearing... i'm the only one that says it's a wheel bearing, everybody else says it's my brakes or my dust shield... if it's my bearing, i'll go ahead and upgrade my front brakes becaus i have the 88 LXi knuckes sitting out back...

are there any other things that sound like a bad wheel bearing? it's a grinding/screeching noise that gets worse as i heat my brakes up... bad caliper? bad rotor? help me with this, too...

thanks again in advance

[Oldblueaccord]

ok, i bled as per alex's instructions, and i'm good on that front, the car is running tops, but it still diesels... i'm thinking it's bad gas... i tuned my timing down and i still get it... maybe i need to turn my timing up? i really could use a timing gun...

but like i said, car is running tops now... now to figure my grinding that sounds to me like a bad wheel bearing... i'm the only one that says it's a wheel bearing, everybody else says it's my brakes or my dust shield... if it's my bearing, i'll go ahead and upgrade my front brakes becaus i have the 88 LXi knuckes sitting out back...

are there any other things that sound like a bad wheel bearing? it's a grinding/screeching noise that gets worse as i heat my brakes up... bad caliper? bad rotor? help me with this, too...

thanks again in advance


does the bearing feel loose at all if you shake the tire at 12 and 6 position one wheel off the ground? My driver side grnds a little at really slow speeds. Its a combo of the slotted rotors and the new type EBC pads. Im still gonna change to SS brake lines. I bought new stockers today to take over to the hose place to have them made.

wp

[Vanilla Sky]

it felt smooth with no play when i put it in, but i'll be sure to check my brakes, too...

and it does do it at any speed, you just have to listen closer for it

[Vanilla Sky]

damn think is back to dieseling... somewhere i heard the timing beolt can be a problem? i don't see how, but eh, might be worth a shot... engine seems to be cool enough when running... what do you guys think i should do? i'm hoping to have access to a timing light soon, so that might help me out...

what about spark plugs that are too hot? even when i unplug my coil it still continues to diesel...

[smufguy]

i had the problems with the car dieseling when i had the carb due to carb flooding, not that it longed for a while cause i killed the car and ditched the stupid carb after my accident. Do u think a bottle of gas treatment would help u? also try getting gas from a good station like sunoco or bp or mobil. I get my gas from this new mobile station 4 blocks down my house all the time despite the price. Also, are ur spark plugs fouled and also check ur O2 sensor.

im not too much of a carb freak, but its the least i can try and do :)

[Vanilla Sky]

well, i'm running emissionsless, so the O2 sensor isn't gonna change anything...

i do need to try good fuel... the fuel i have is sonoco, but form a shit station... and it's thier crap gas, too...

i should go ahead and change my sparkplugs, too... just for good measure

[AccordEpicenter]

hmm sunoco is usually pretty good quality gas, usually better than mobil

[Vanilla Sky]

this sunoco is an old coastal station that i've had contaminated fuel problems with...

[Oldblueaccord]

this sunoco is an old coastal station that i've had contaminated fuel problems with...


also if your idle is high you could cause a desiel situation.

wp

[Vanilla Sky]

idle is fine when it warms up... i thought of that one, too... when the idle is low enough that it cuts off itself, then i don't have this issue... think it's a carb issue?

here's my cyl 3 spark plug for you guys to read:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/5461e615.jpg

looks "normal" to me...

[A20A1]

Didn't read all the posts but did you remove the manifold heater... the coolant lines to the intake manifold? and or Did you remove the coolant line to the base of the carb or is that connected?
Are the gaskets for the cab new?
As for deiseling... did you adjust the carb at all? do you have any vacuum idle diaphragms hooked up? Is your choke hooked up?

You really should get a timing light... but you can adjust the timing by opening the distribtor cap and looking at the rotor along with the cam gear and flywheel allignment.

Overflow tank... I have never overheated and I don't use and overflow tank.

[smufguy]

here's my cyl 3 spark plug for you guys to read:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/5461e615.jpg

looks "normal" to me...

that plug is way too clean to come out of a combustion chamber. USually they all have soot or look brown when they are pulled from the head with good combustion chamber. but urs look like it was not even burning. If its lean, they would look too pale golden or something, cant really explain. but yeah something is different. U get spark on all cables and ur rotor is fine right? also i would say if the weather is cold it happens plenty.

[shepherd79]

idle is fine when it warms up... i thought of that one, too... when the idle is low enough that it cuts off itself, then i don't have this issue... think it's a carb issue?

here's my cyl 3 spark plug for you guys to read:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/5461e615.jpg

looks "normal" to me...

just by looking at that spark i can tell you you are running lean and HOT.
first, you may want to adjust the carb. If you want my old redrilled carb, let me know.
second, i would get 88-89 LXI plugs, they are one step colder and should hold up better.
third, dieseling can be caused by many things, 1. carbon build up. when it gets hot, carbon starts glowing and ignite the fuel. use B12 cleaner. it works great. 2. as I said, you have adjust the the mixture screw properly. your idle valve may be sticking. 3. check your timing. get timing light and check it.

[Oldblueaccord]

just by looking at that spark i can tell you you are running lean and HOT.
first, you may want to adjust the carb. If you want my old redrilled carb, let me know.
second, i would get 88-89 LXI plugs, they are one step colder and should hold up better.
third, dieseling can be caused by many things, 1. carbon build up. when it gets hot, carbon starts glowing and ignite the fuel. use B12 cleaner. it works great. 2. as I said, you have adjust the the mixture screw properly. your idle valve may be sticking. 3. check your timing. get timing light and check it.


Gap looks too big for one. yeah id run colder plugs the NGK 5 's i think they are. I dont like how the grnd stap isnt over the tip completely either. Shows the gap aint right or the plug is just manufactured bad.
Picture be better straight down really you need to look at the ground strap,insolator and even the first thread. I got a blurb on reading plugs I'll look around for it.

http://www.dragstuff.com/techarticles/how-to-read-plugs.html



Yeah high idle will cause deisel at shut off.

What they used to do on domestics carbs back in my day was have what they called a dashpot. When you turned the key on this little plunger thing would push on the linkage and give you idle. As soon as you shut off the key it would drop back so the car wouldn't desiel (run on). Try looking around a j-yard on older carbed cars/trucks from the 70's. They all had em it was real common.


wp

[POS carb]

black plugs are rich. white plugs are usually a blown gasket. air in your radiator while you run the car is a blown head gasket (or a seal on the water pump but you'd see water leaking).
dieseling is usually caused by a bad seal in the intake system (manifold/carb/throttle body/vacuum hose/high idle setting can act as a leak)

get a vacuum gauge, that will help.

if you partially cover the carb barrel and the rpms go up then you are also lean

I think you do have a fuel problem , maybe raising your carb float level would help your lean problem, I'd try that first, counter clockwise turn should raise the fuel level.

[Vanilla Sky]

ok, these are LXi plugs...

i fixed the air in my coolant system problem (i wasn't bleeding it correctly)

our manual cars do still have a dashpot system

i thought when you ran lean you ran hot...

the plugs are gapped a bit on the large side, but i'll just replace them with new plugs...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/0f26566c.jpg

high-res pic, so 56-k beware

oh, and i have my coolant lines still in place, but the carb heater has been punched out

so you guys think i've got 2 problems? too lean and i've got a spark plug problem? then the desieling is a carb issue, like too high of an idle, possibly timing?

[shepherd79]

well, you defintly have fuel problem. you have to make that carb run rich
another problem is dieseling and i am sure it is caused by too much timing. i had the same problem on my old LX. i just had to put timing back to stock and it fixed the problem.

[Vanilla Sky]

well, i hope to be able to borrow a timing light tomorrow...

can low timing cause a dieseling problem, too?

oh, and i'm pretty sure my timing belt is worn a bit (i think it's time ot replace it myself)... any chance that this can cause any of this shit?

[Oldblueaccord]

well, i hope to be able to borrow a timing light tomorrow...

can low timing cause a dieseling problem, too?

oh, and i'm pretty sure my timing belt is worn a bit (i think it's time ot replace it myself)... any chance that this can cause any of this shit?


Timing have to pretty retarded to make it actually kick back outta the carb. It would have hardly any power .

Yeah get new plugs i dont like that strap.


wp

[Vanilla Sky]

hmm, seems i have a misadjusted dashpot system on my car...

i've got a small list of things i plan on doing tomorrow... getting to be a long list... eh, i htink what i've got listed will fix what problems i have, though

[A20A1]

use lx plugs... you want the correct heat range.

Dashpot / idle control diaphragm same thing...

[Vanilla Sky]

wow... i just pulled my plugs, and they are really worn... garbage can for them... they also aren't an even color (one insulator is very pale, two are medium, one is almost black... i'm suspecting a bad headgasket)... i can take pics while they are sitting here if you guys want me to...

what's funny is i had a heat range hotter, and they didn't cause the serious dieseling i have now (it was cured when i put in these plugs, but it didn't seem to last)... i think these plugs are a big factor in my badly running engine...

by the way, i've always ran NGK plugs... after oldblue pointed out that the ground prong on these plugs didn't extend all the way across the electrode, i figured i'd ask the community as a whole if i should change plugs...

as for my lean problem, i believe it's an easy fix (according to mike's how-to, the AJC seems to be my problem, leaning me out)... if that doesn't fix my problem, i'll go ahead and swap to DCOE or EFI... i'm getting sick of this carb...

[Oldblueaccord]

wow... i just pulled my plugs, and they are really worn... garbage can for them... they also aren't an even color (one insulator is very pale, two are medium, one is almost black... i'm suspecting a bad headgasket)... i can take pics while they are sitting here if you guys want me to...

what's funny is i had a heat range hotter, and they didn't cause the serious dieseling i have now (it was cured when i put in these plugs, but it didn't seem to last)... i think these plugs are a big factor in my badly running engine...

by the way, i've always ran NGK plugs... after oldblue pointed out that the ground prong on these plugs didn't extend all the way across the electrode, i figured i'd ask the community as a whole if i should change plugs...

as for my lean problem, i believe it's an easy fix (according to mike's how-to, the AJC seems to be my problem, leaning me out)... if that doesn't fix my problem, i'll go ahead and swap to DCOE or EFI... i'm getting sick of this carb...


I just notcied in the picture that the ground strap was not over the elctrode all the way. That just caught my eye. I think it has something to do with the gap being wrong but thats by eye also.

I use NGK's on Honda's althought I am trying a set in my 440 atm and they seem fine. I just pulled set of Bosch plugs outta another old Chrysler product I have and althought it ran OK the plugs were heavy with fuel deposits. I have noticed on platnium plugs and bosch plugs mostly that fuel deposit have a tendacy to build up on them reall bad. On plug was almost bridged over with hard white junk. I put Autolights in it. I wouldnt get Champions anymore there not the plug they used to be


The one thing I didnt mention is your vacuum advance might not be hooked up correctly. Im not sure how Hondas work but I was thinking the distributor is ADVAncED unless it sees a vacuum source. Some of the other carb guys can straighten me out on that one.



wp

[Blkblurr]

The black one may be burning oil and the light one is the one that may have the blown gasket.

[Vanilla Sky]

ok, well, i just got new plugs... i got them one heat range colder (according to my repair manual, the kind of driving i do and my climate lends itself to a colder plug)... i think a lot of my problem is my spark plugs... gooking at them more closey, the are coated pretty thickly with carbon, and are just worn too much to even bother with...

i have a head sitting at the machine shop ready to be picked up for me to rebuild... i had them tear it down and hot tank it...

by the way, can valve lash far out of spec cause any of my problems? i have reason to believe my valve lash is well out of spec... i need to pull my valve cover and check... i'll probably go ahead and set it while i'm at it...

thanks for all the help, guys

[A20A1]

Feel free... i made a pictoral how-to and it needs to get some use. :D

The distributor advances with manifold vacuum. the other advance is centrifugal.

[Vanilla Sky]

i believe it gets more use than you think...

i'll know here in a few hours how much it's helped out... i'll be glad to have my car running again... shouldn't be much more that can go wrong with it... especially after i swap heads...

[Oldblueaccord]

ok, well, i just got new plugs... i got them one heat range colder (according to my repair manual, the kind of driving i do and my climate lends itself to a colder plug)... i think a lot of my problem is my spark plugs... gooking at them more closey, the are coated pretty thickly with carbon, and are just worn too much to even bother with...

i have a head sitting at the machine shop ready to be picked up for me to rebuild... i had them tear it down and hot tank it...

by the way, can valve lash far out of spec cause any of my problems? i have reason to believe my valve lash is well out of spec... i need to pull my valve cover and check... i'll probably go ahead and set it while i'm at it...

thanks for all the help, guys


Cool plugs are cheap.

I dont think the lash would make that much diferance but i dunno. It would rattle really bad at idle if it was way out kinda like a deisel motor.



wp

[Vanilla Sky]

well, not really deiseling, but the carb is trash... i can't even afford a rebuild kit

i'll jsut swap to EFI... i can't afford the DCOE manifold right now, either... the EFI swap won't cost much more than the card rebuild, and i know it's gonna work (came from a well running car)

[smufguy]

Derick, this carb has plagued u too long bro. Efi ............. efi......... efi............... efi....... you know im trying to beat that into your head right? efi........... efi.......... lol

[Vanilla Sky]

praveen, i'm ahead of you...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/6ae359bd.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/a06efb7a.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/653f216f.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/9fec8cc8.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/wannabe_otaku/377b9a61.jpg

at least now i know why it won't run

[Vanilla Sky]

just an update:

i'm starting on the reassembly... i just got the money together to get it all back together...

i should have this thing back on the road in like 6 or 7 months :p