EGR problems

[Low Tek]

ok.. heres the deal. I have done alot of searching, and searching. and I know I saw it somewhere bout an extra EGR in the black box. I keep throwing an EGR code, I checked the EGR, double checked the lines goin to it, and I even cleaned it. reset the ECU and the ran it, it was great for about an hour, and the damn thing lit up again, and the idle crept up, and sits at 1200.. does anyone know what I should replace now?? I opened it up and found the map sensor, but there are 3 other relays, and I have no clue what they are.. :mad:

any help would be cool :sad2:

[Oldblueaccord]

Ok lets get on this EGR deal.

Page 12-75 of the manual says

The ECU CONTAINS MEMEORIES FOR IDEAL EGR valve lifts for varying operating conditions. The EGR valve lift sensor detects the amt. Of EGR valve lift and send the info to the ECU. The ECU the determines the best EGR lift which is determined by signals sent from other sensors. If there are any differences between the two the ECU cuts the current to the EGR control solenoid valve to reduce vacuum applied to the EGR.

Pretty complicated.

Trouble shooting

1. Verify that all connectors are connected
2. Warm the car up to normal temp
3. Disconnect vacuum hose #16 from the EGR valve
4. Connect a vacuum pump and apply vacuum ,doesn’t say how much,
5. Does EGR HOLD VACUUM AND DID THE ENGINE STALL? No then replace the EGR yes then 6
6. Restart the engine check hose #24 for vacuum no ..its blocked yes 7
7. Disconnect #16 form the EGR and connect a vacuum gauge to #16 if there vacuum inspect hose routing if OK replace the EGR control solenoid or if NO vacuum disconnect the 2p connector on the control box ( not sure what box at this point)
8. Ok says to connect battery voltage to the blk/yel and negative to the red vacuum should be 8 inches at this point. No 8a yes goto step 9

8a Remove the control box cover and disconnect hose between CVC valve and the air chamber and connect vacuum gauge to air chamber. Is vacuum app 8” yes replace egr sol. NO inspect line #24 or replace the CVC valve.

9.

[Oldblueaccord]

Ok lets get on this EGR deal.

Page 12-75 of the manual says

The ECU CONTAINS MEMEORIES FOR IDEAL EGR valve lifts for varying operating conditions. The EGR valve lift sensor detects the amt. Of EGR valve lift and send the info to the ECU. The ECU the determines the best EGR lift which is determined by signals sent from other sensors. If there are any differences between the two the ECU cuts the current to the EGR control solenoid valve to reduce vacuum applied to the EGR.

Pretty complicated.

Trouble shooting

1. Verify that all connectors are connected
2. Warm the car up to normal temp
3. Disconnect vacuum hose #16 from the EGR valve
4. Connect a vacuum pump and apply vacuum ,doesn’t say how much,
5. Does EGR HOLD VACUUM AND DID THE ENGINE STALL? No then replace the EGR yes then 6
6. Restart the engine check hose #24 for vacuum no ..its blocked yes 7
7. Disconnect #16 form the EGR and connect a vacuum gauge to #16 if there vacuum inspect hose routing if OK replace the EGR control solenoid or if NO vacuum disconnect the 2p connector on the control box ( not sure what box at this point)
8. Ok says to connect battery voltage to the blk/yel and negative to the red vacuum should be 8 inches at this point. No 8a yes goto step 9

8a Remove the control box cover and disconnect hose between CVC valve and the air chamber and connect vacuum gauge to air chamber. Is vacuum app 8” yes replace egr sol. NO inspect line #24 or replace the CVC valve.

9.


9. Measure the blk/yel for battery voltage no repair wires yes 10

10. Turn ignition off and connect a test harness between the EGR lift sensor and the engine wire harness ,this we don’t have but the pic shows a harness which taps into the wires but keeps them connected to the EGR valve an the same time sorta think a Y connector. so what they’re looking for 5 volts at the red terminal with the ignition ON grn is ground in this case. The wht should have 1 volt I think coming out of the EGR valve or it says its bad. I’m pretty sure this is the feed back to the ECU. 5 volts is sent to it and then 1 volt out without the motor running sounds correct to me.

The rest is about making sure the ECU is sending out the 5 volt signal and that the signal is getting to the ECU


SO lets try this and see whatwe get from there.

Also as and added tip maybe you can just swap out MAP sensors that might be easier than all that bullshit i just typed.


wp

[Strugglebucket]

yeah, the egr is pretty complicated with that variable solenoid and all. they should of used some of that technology on the vac advance on the distributor, IMO.

i'm kind of lost on this one because all i have is paul's shop manual and it doesn't have any emissions diagrams for the KA or KL models. but anyway, are you getting any other codes, or just the code 12?

[Low Tek]

Just the 12.. I think it might be something in the black box, the local honda shop said it might be the 'EGR vacuume canister' or the 'siliniod B' *not sure if that is spelled right*

I went the junk yard and snaged the EGR canister, but I have not put it in. I will let you guys know the out come.. and thanks for the help/info

[Oldblueaccord]

Just the 12.. I think it might be something in the black box, the local honda shop said it might be the 'EGR vacuume canister' or the 'siliniod B' *not sure if that is spelled right*

I went the junk yard and snaged the EGR canister, but I have not put it in. I will let you guys know the out come.. and thanks for the help/info


I think the book called that thing inside the MAP sensor CVC solenoid that has the vacuum line from the EGR to it.
I'm at work I'll look at it when I get home.


wp

[Low Tek]

well.. I replaced the two inside pieces, and still same damn thing. I am goin to go to the u-pull-it and get a nice looking ERG and clean it up. hope this does it

[Oldblueaccord]

well.. I replaced the two inside pieces, and still same damn thing. I am goin to go to the u-pull-it and get a nice looking ERG and clean it up. hope this does it

Dang really.....

Have you had a chance to run thur the wiring. Get yourself a small multi-meter there real handy. probe those wires and see what voltage your getting.

Could be that magnet thing on top is just not working. Thats what pulls it up and down.


wp

[Low Tek]

Dang really.....


Could be that magnet thing on top is just not working. Thats what pulls it up and down.


wp

can that be seperated? or is one piece, I think I might try to pop off the top - there are small screws... sigh...

[Oldblueaccord]

can that be seperated? or is one piece, I think I might try to pop off the top - there are small screws... sigh...


Mine has a shinny metal think held on by clips on both sides. On the top of the EGR. It also says JAPAN on top of it. The wire plug is underneath that.

I always assumed it used a magnet to pull the EGR plunger up and down but I am not so sure about it.


wp

[Low Tek]

hmm

I went to the honda dealer, an they said that it is all one piece.. and Auto Zone said $88 new.. I am just not sure if I want to get a new one, or just look else wise.. damn old cars anyway.. lol

[Oldblueaccord]

hmm

I went to the honda dealer, an they said that it is all one piece.. and Auto Zone said $88 new.. I am just not sure if I want to get a new one, or just look else wise.. damn old cars anyway.. lol


Can you take a picture of your EGR for me?

Reason why I want you to check the voltage at the plug is so maybe I can think of a way to bypass it. Im thinking as long as it sees a certain voltage the computer wont know the differance.



wp

[Low Tek]

ok... I will get a pic of it tonight..

[Low Tek]

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid163/pf33c89e27d15a2a1332b57d1ddd14ae4/f4934221.jpg

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid163/p9634a76e073ffd9d41d6870ca785e989/f4933ff1.jpg

I think this this is what you wanted

[Oldblueaccord]

Welp thats it. I wanted to make sure you had that silver clip thing on it. Looks just like mine.

Next step is to get a multimeter and poke those two wires coming out of it and lets see what the reading is. I will do the same to mine and maybe we can come up with a solution.

I have a Sears brand multi meter i paid 32$ for. Its pocket sized like 3"x4" I love it goes anywhere be a good one.


wp

[Low Tek]

well.. this is the deal.. I got another u-pull-it EGR and cleaned it, hooked it up but it not bolt it down to the intake, so it is free 'floating'. I have not had a check engine light at all.. my question is, if I plate off the EGR spot, will this effect anything?

[Oldblueaccord]

well.. this is the deal.. I got another u-pull-it EGR and cleaned it, hooked it up but it not bolt it down to the intake, so it is free 'floating'. I have not had a check engine light at all.. my question is, if I plate off the EGR spot, will this effect anything?

Naw I have had bolts plugging both ends on mine no differance in the way it runs. But it have the sensor bolted on. It may effect your Nox emmsions as in higher.


Glad it is working!!


wp

[Low Tek]

ok.. I ran it through DEQ for the 100 thousndth time, and last run I unpluged the vacuume advance on the distributer. and it maybe everything run low and it almost passed.. could the vacuume advance go bad? can this be replaced?

[Oldblueaccord]

ok.. I ran it through DEQ for the 100 thousndth time, and last run I unpluged the vacuume advance on the distributer. and it maybe everything run low and it almost passed.. could the vacuume advance go bad? can this be replaced?


DEQ is this emisions?


The vacuum advance can go bad I think when mine did I had to much advance all the time but it was a long time ago. You can just change that part out of the distributor. My car would ping alot under load and this fixed it.


Do a search for acetone in your gas. There been several acticles and alot of chat sites are on it. For one its gives you about 3 mpg more and I have heard your emission is squeky clean. There calling for about 2 oz per 10 gallons. Make sure also run the car really hard before you take it in so the cat is nice and hot.

The EGR would help mostly lower NoX by cooling the combustion chamber a little so if your is plugged of its not helping.



wp

[Low Tek]

DEQ is this emisions?


The vacuum advance can go bad I think when mine did I had to much advance all the time but it was a long time ago. You can just change that part out of the distributor. My car would ping alot under load and this fixed it.


Do a search for acetone in your gas. There been several acticles and alot of chat sites are on it. For one its gives you about 3 mpg more and I have heard your emission is squeky clean. There calling for about 2 oz per 10 gallons. Make sure also run the car really hard before you take it in so the cat is nice and hot.

The EGR would help mostly lower NoX by cooling the combustion chamber a little so if your is plugged of its not helping.



wp

DEQ is emmisions, and they suck ass... lol... acetone?? like the shit you buy in the store? hmm.. I will have to look into that.. I replaced the EGR but did not attach it to the intake.. maybe I will do that and connect the new vacuume advance..

[Oldblueaccord]

DEQ is emmisions, and they suck ass... lol... acetone?? like the shit you buy in the store? hmm.. I will have to look into that.. I replaced the EGR but did not attach it to the intake.. maybe I will do that and connect the new vacuume advance..

http://pesn.com/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/

I have not tried it yet but everything i have read has been positive on it.


wp