is it worth adapting? ford 2bbl

[HondaBoy]

ok, well my friend bought a nice holley 4bbl off my other friend. its been rejetted and what not. so he got rid of this 2bbl carb off his 390ci and let me take it. worked great and everything. so i know its not a pos. so everyone is telling me to put it on my car, but i know its not that easy to just slap it on and its going to work. it'll take some work. so anyway, i'm not sure how many cfm it is, i dont know the specs right yet. its a little dirty, but heres some pix. the positioning is all wrong on everything so i dont know how i'd get it to work. it may be a little too much for the restrictive intake manifold, that is if i get an adapter plate. i'd rather wait and get the weber i've been wanting or looking around for more carb options.
http://photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/th_d08ecaea.jpghttp://photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/th_137419fd.jpghttp://photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/th_9d732b79.jpg
http://photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/th_d60ce5f3.jpghttp://photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/th_908af538.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/d08ecaea.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/137419fd.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/9d732b79.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/d60ce5f3.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/HondaBoySi87/908af538.jpg

[A20A1]

No the intake manifold being small is good IMO. If the carb is too big I don't think increasing runner diameter will make it less of a problem.

What is that flange from? it looks like a metal version of the EFE plate for the accord.

[A20A1]

I'd really like someone to try out my manifold, a 4bbl would be so f-ing sexy even if it didn't work the best. :)

[A20A1]

Is that carb synchronous?

It may not do so well on the bottom end... our stock carb is progressive, meaning the secondary opens up after primary is already close to WOT. This ensures that all the engine demand is seen by one barrel increasing throttle response since one barrels gets a stronger signal. Then when your RPMS go up and engine demand is at its highest the secondary is open to supply the increase in demand.

Synchronous opens both plates at the same time so your carb splits the demand accross both barrels weakening the signal, which is already low at low rpms... so you get poor throttle response.

If the carb is sized right it's not that big of a problem, if the carb is too big then it's probably better to try a different carb.


Same reasoning for me getting a vacuum secondary 4bbl, the vacuum secondary is better an adjusting to engine demand so there is less of a chance that the secondary will open prematurely. Mechanical secondary, it all depends on the linkage setup. Mechanical may have more stability... it just might not be suited for your needs.

[HondaBoy]

its a synchronous carb then. i noticed that first off that both throttal plates open on one motion because they are actuated by one rod or whatever unlike the kehin that has two. the 4bbl carb would be pretty cool to try out though. maybe a low cfm 4bbl thats matched with the engines flow so it doesnt flood out. i noticed after doing my vacuum removal that it bogs when i stomp the gas from a stop. even when i had it with the vacuum oporated secondary it still boged a bit. its got the manual secondary now. i just got used to it though so its all good. i still have to watch out though because it just needs more air than its getting at lower rpms.

[A20A1]

You think it's too rich? you can fiddle with the the rear Air Jet Controller ports... open one up see if it helps... i think it will add a little more braking to the fuel and help lean out the mixture... if you simply plug the ports air will have to go thru the jets inside and above the float bowl, so you end up with less air and less resistance to the fuel flow and you get a richer mixure. I think the Air jet ports have restrictors in the brass ports on the back of the carb so it's not like you're dumping a ton of ai pressure.

[HondaBoy]

i'm thinking its too rich because from idle or even below 3000 rpm, if the secondary is opened before 3000 rpm it becomes too rich. seems just the secondary is too rich though, not the primary barrel. i'll mess with the air jets though.

[A20A1]

well the port A is for the secondary I think... port B and C are primary and idle or just primary.

[StressSolutions]

Do I understand this? You are talking about putting a carb from a 6.5 litre engine onto a 2 litre engine? And wondering if it'd work right?

Pardon me, but Ford and VW are not Asian...LOL

[87 Acc]

Do you know how much cfm the carbed A20A will need at stock. because I also have a 2bbl Ford carb and it's 325 cfm. I could get an adapter plate made up. And just run every thing manual

[Oldblueaccord]

I think I said something about those carbs in A20's 4bl thread.

It a copy of the Holly 2300 carb. good carb well made.

Might be a 350 cfm or a 500cfm I dunno. Thats a standard holly pattern on the base plate.

And a 390 cubic inch is not 6.6 liters :deal:


wp

[87 Acc]

I just don't wont to over carb it. I live in canada and no one importes the weaber and if I do it my self I'm looking at over $600 for one. But there's lots of Holleys up here so I would like to find somthing in a holley that would work for this, I also plan on running my JDM B20A on a carb (when I put it in, in the spring) My ford carb is from a 1969 Couger with a 351w and it's a 5.9L

[Oldblueaccord]

Well by the formula our cars should need about 190 cfm at 6000rpm. But i think a 350 cfm carb aint gonna hurt you.

Holly 2300 you can get them new thru summitracing.com about $200 or so. thoses ford(motorcraft) ones remaned , less than $100.

wp

[87 Acc]

Thanks, I read that thread about the 4bbl and it help me alot with carb info and also really helped me to know what a Hondas needs for a carb and other avenues I could go. But now I need to decide if I will run a 2bbl or 4bbl do you know if any one way is better then the other? I guess with the 4bbl I can up the CFM if I divide the intake in haft and that would give me more horse power? But also I would need to give the intake alot of custom work. Or will I see power increase with a 2bbl? And I shouldn’t need as much custom work to the intake. I plan on running a B20A on one of these carbs so will the 2bbl be fine? And has any body ran the B20A on a holly 2bbl or 4bbl?

[A20A1]

I divided the plenum so I could use a 4bbl which usually has more cfm to begin with. Not to get a larger 4bbl with more cfm.

Yes there are a few carbed B20As one had a stock carb and I think it was converted to a 38 weber 2bbl.
The other is dual weber dcoe's

You should think about valve, cam, porting, and exhaust mods not just a bigger carb.

[StressSolutions]

And a 390 cubic inch is not 6.6 liters :deal:
wpNo one said it was a 6.6l.

[Oldblueaccord]

No one said it was a 6.6l.


Yeah you said 6.5 sorry still wrong try again. :birthday:



wp

[StressSolutions]

Oh gosh, whether it is 6.5 or 6.6 or 6.4, who really cares, the carb is still 3X to big for the engine.

[87 Acc]

Thanks again A20A1. I have just bin more concerned about getting this B20A in my 87 Hach and having run right with what ever carb I end up using, because I still don’t have a trany for it(mine never came with on) . But by the sounds of it I should run a 4bbl with 500cfm (right?) and if I port and rebuild a year later with performance cams I should be safe with that kind of a set up RIGHT? Or would putting on one of those injection carburetors be to much? I plan on doing a full performance rebuild on the B20A in about a year so I would rather buy one carb that will work in the stock application now, but also still work when the rebuild is done. Any thoughts about that or what would be the best carb to use. Thanks again for your time and knowledge

[A20A1]

You can run with a 32/36 or 38 weber 2bbl or even a stock carb
You want to get your B20A running right before you start adding bigger carbs... or else you'll never know if it's the carb giving your trouble or something else.

[87 Acc]

Ok so I will run with a stock carb for now, and when I do the performance rebuild I will pick a carb that will suite the needs of the upgraded motor. Will I need to do the fuel pump if I run the stock carb? I don’t think I would but you would know better then me.
Thanks

[Cant Stop]

damn having owned a 390 motor it usually required a minimum of 725cfm in the 4 barrel configuration to give it any balls so the 2 barrel might be too much carb but then you can always rejet it to smaller to lean it out.
ideally a 2 barrel off a small block ford would prolly work out better.
i also stripped my car down to a mechanical secondary and yes it bogs if i just floor it but i noticed if you dump it half down and get it in the 2000-2500 rpm range when you floor it , it really picks up speed i believe the bogging is just too much air at once with little gas cuz when you floor it the vacuum drops off a little too fast and it needs to catch up or it dies altogether so i am going to play with a manual choke set to different degrees of openness to see if this can help the bog
i have a automatic so the bog is probably severely worse on this rathe rthan the stick where you can maintain rpms with the gas floored a bit before letting out the clutch.

[A20A1]

If there was a way to add another accel pump to give the secondary a little fuel squirt it might help. I used to have to double tap the throttle to get the car to get over the bog quickly. If you keep the revs up though the mechanical secondary really flies.

[A20A1]

These are examples of other single plenum 4bbl manifolds ... one which I assume is blow thru turbo.

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_01.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_06.jpg
.

This guy mounted the carb using the same spacer I'm using... however he put the primaries closer to the head instead of further away.
I was under the impression that the longer runner would be best for low end so you'd put the primaries further away.

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_04.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_02.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_05.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_03.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b351/Wendy_girl/4bbl_carbed_07.jpg

[Cant Stop]

it sux that you live in hawaii because i would be game for trying your 4 barrel manifold. check with ups to send it to 32809,
i would put a stock 4 barrel from a 289 ford since i dont think i could find one for the early 60's 221 or 260 v8 now if you were going to give it away for the price of shipping i would do it in a heartbeat otherwise i would say 3-6 month loan you pay one way i pay the other way.
oh and according to a hot rod shop the split plenum makes the car more streetable and i believe helps the bottom end speed where the open plenum is more common for full race even though you can choose either for the street.

[Cant Stop]

a20a1 do you still have that intake from the picture that you cut off and had ready for dual carbs or did you finish it and use it on something?
because i would definitely like to get the one that you cut for dual carb usage unless you already welded plates on it for a weber setup then i dont want because i still want to do the dual lude carb setup i just havent gotten around to finding a car locally to strip the intake off of for the 3 gee part.

[A20A1]

It was for dual 45mm bike carbs instead of 4 carbs, 1 per cylinder.

Like the prelude had it... 2 carbs.

You can hook it up fairly easily you just need 2 carbs, some metal pipe behind the carbs and 2 rubber connectors to connect the carbs to the manifold.

http://www.3geez.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3879
.

[Cant Stop]

so do you still have it like in the pic? i have the prelude manifold i would cut it where needed and weld it on the one shown.

[A20A1]

I should still have it... hopefully I didn't toss it. :(

[Cant Stop]

lemme know what you want for it if you still have. as it will save some time and did you grind any of the egr stuff away or left it as pictured.
thanx man.

[A20A1]

I still have the manifold, not sure what I was selling it for, i posted that in a different thread.