Megasquirt???

[jecu]

I was wondering if I could convert my carb 89 accord to fuel injection by using the manifold, injectors, throttle body, etc. from the LX-i or SE-i and using megasquirt to complete the rest of the conversion, using fuel only control?

[bobafett]

you will need other parts as well, such EFI fuel pump and tank, fuel return line etc... but i don't see why you couldn't run MS. :)

[Swap_File]

Here is a post from the megasquirt forums from a guy who put a MS in his 1986 Accord:

http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?t=771

[BITESIZE]

What is megasquirt?

[shepherd79]

Megasquirt is DIY stand alone that cost under $200-300.
http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html

If you are going to convert to stand alone, you still need to convert vacuum distributor to digital one.

[smufguy]

you can run megasquirt, or u can just run the stock conversion for EFI using ur year compatible fuel injected car. As far as megasquirt, ill just say dont bother.

[PhydeauX]

There is a new website www.megasquirt.info. The bgsoflex site is way out of date. Megasquirt does more then just fuel now, you can use it to control spark as well. Plenty of info on the site. The accord's efi computer is fuel only and you could directly replace it with the ms but ms is able to control spark and it give you more control over it then the stock mechanical distributor. The ms problaby isn't going to be streel legal if you live in a state with emissions controls and if you've got a stock engine its not going to be of that much benefit. If you've got big plans and a tight budget its the best fully programable ecu for the price.

andy

[Swap_File]

If you run megasquirt, you can use Ford EDIS and ignore the problem of fitting a new distributor.

I was originally going to run Megasquirt, but I believe an OBD-1 swap will be cheaper and easier (especially now that I found an easy way to fit a F22 distributor on).

[hondaman1986]

id say that the megasquirt is cheaper than a regular fi swap because you dont have to pay for the hole wireing harness and stuff from a junkyard and you also dont have to worry about the harness being bad or other things. also if you wanted you could keep your egr and stay emisions legal if you tuned it to be. how are they going to know if it isnt stock if you make it look like it is. im gonna do the megasquirt in my 86 dx hatch carb. im just gonna use an 89 fi mani and exhaust to keep the egr... only thing about that is theat i passed oregon deq without an egr or a cat on my car. dont ask me how but i did.

[Estimated Prophet]

I was originally going to run Megasquirt, but I believe an OBD-1 swap will be cheaper and easier (especially now that I found an easy way to fit a F22 distributor on).

And how would that be?

[newaccorddriver]

for all you people who say we need a digital distributor, the answer is WE DONT NEED ANYTHING TO CONTROL SPARK. well, i shouldnt say anything, because we do in fact need MS. what we need is the VR signal coming from the 2 poles in the distributor, along with an HEI module from a GM car, MSnSe or MS2, and voila, we got ignition control.

with my MS project, i plan to start with fuel only, then get into ignition. the only thing thats stopping me right now is the fact that i have no engine yet, and i want to break it in on the stock ECU before i throw in massive amounts of fuel

[hondaman1986]

for all you people who say we need a digital distributor, the answer is WE DONT NEED ANYTHING TO CONTROL SPARK. well, i shouldnt say anything, because we do in fact need MS. what we need is the VR signal coming from the 2 poles in the distributor, along with an HEI module from a GM car, MSnSe or MS2, and voila, we got ignition control.
with my MS project, i plan to start with fuel only, then get into ignition. the only thing thats stopping me right now is the fact that i have no engine yet, and i want to break it in on the stock ECU before i throw in massive amounts of fuel


see thats the great thing with megasquirt is that you can program it to run with less fuel if you know what you are doing (not saying that i do). also my plan is the same as yours. fuel first then spark later but i already have an msd digital 6 plus to control my spark so im not to worryed.

[bobafett]

I am pretty sure your spark is not controlled by your MSD Digital 6 ignition. The spark is enhanced by the ignition, but the spark is 'controlled' by your vacuum advance distributor. Unless you have other stuff going on that I am not realizing.

newaccorddriver - how close are you to getting ms + spark control going? I desperately need something to control my timing electronically, and I am at the point where I either need to switch to a obd1 setup, or something like the MS2 or GM ECM setup.. I would like to know a little more about your plans to integrate ignition control. :)

[coope]

about how much hp does it give u and is it easy to do

[hondaman1986]

I am pretty sure your spark is not controlled by your MSD Digital 6 ignition. The spark is enhanced by the ignition, but the spark is 'controlled' by your vacuum advance distributor. Unless you have other stuff going on that I am not realizing.

newaccorddriver - how close are you to getting ms + spark control going? I desperately need something to control my timing electronically, and I am at the point where I either need to switch to a obd1 setup, or something like the MS2 or GM ECM setup.. I would like to know a little more about your plans to integrate ignition control. :)


yes i know that its running off my dizy but people are saying that you cant run our dizy with megasquirt and im saying that you can if you know how to set it up

also the only stock ignition part on my car is my dizy so im basicly just useing msd

[hondaman1986]

about how much hp does it give u and is it easy to do


it easy if your good with electronics and have good oll fasiond know how. how much power it gives you is up to your mods and tuning skills.

[coope]

oh when u do it take some pics and write an how to

[hondaman1986]

oh when u do it take some pics and write an how to


it will take a while but when my engine is built so will my MS so i will take pics

[newaccorddriver]

newaccorddriver - how close are you to getting ms + spark control going? I desperately need something to control my timing electronically, and I am at the point where I either need to switch to a obd1 setup, or something like the MS2 or GM ECM setup.. I would like to know a little more about your plans to integrate ignition control. :)

when im fully broken in with my motor which i still need to build, im estimating around july-ish for megasquirt to be up and running, and august for spark.

as far as spark goes, we actually have everything we need in our distributors. if you open it up, you will find a reluctor(the square thing with 4 points), and 2 poles that sense those points every 90 degrees. all you need to do is get a signal out of that which is mind numbingly easy. i believe its the cylinder sensor since it shouldnt be the TDC sensor since theres 4 points. but anyways, if you read through the megasquirt stuff, you will see that a GM HEI(high energy ignition) chip is capable of controlling the coil itself and triggering it, something our ignitors were supposed to do. so by replacing the ignitor with the HEI chip, we can effectively, and easily get electronic control. as far as actually going through with megasquirt, i have yet to do it, so this is just theory, but since this setup has worked for many many cars, i dont see how ours is any different. its a big PITA to actually setup the base timing, but well worth it if you ask me

[newaccorddriver]

ignore most of the picture and pay attention to how its wired up. our distributors have everything we need in them to make this setup work

http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/ew7hei.gif

[cygnus x-1]

Hmm... Will be keeping an eye on this thread. Been thinking of an FI conversion for my Prelude.

This is a little off topic but I'll throw this out there anyway. One thing that makes me hesitate with the FI conversion is that I would have to replace the tank and fuel lines. It's not a huge deal but Prelude parts are kinda hard to find around here and having to drop the tank and run lines would be annoying and I would rather not have to do it. So I'm wondering, is there maybe some other way to pressurize the the fuel to the level needed by the injectors? I'm thinking of something like a two stage design where the stock pump gets the fuel to the engine and a second pump creates the high pressure for the injectors.
Thoughts?

C|

[hondaman1986]

ok here are some pics of my megasquirt and stim board not the best pics but oh well. lol

all the bags the squirt came in

http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/2892/1002176qz7.th.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1002176qz7.jpg)



the megasquirt with black case


http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/9644/1002177fu7.th.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1002177fu7.jpg)


the squirts internals

http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/6818/1002178ti1.th.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1002178ti1.jpg)


the wonderfull stim board which realy does help vary vary much lol


http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/3716/1002179bc3.th.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1002179bc3.jpg)

and lastly the tuning cable


http://img133.imageshack.us/img133/1310/1002180hw7.th.jpg (http://img133.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1002180hw7.jpg)


the squirt and stim board where vary easy to put together because every bag has the component location on it. also for testing you need to jumper xg1 and xg2 not x1 or x2 but "XG1 or XG2" if anyone wants to know more pm me

[newaccorddriver]

Hmm... Will be keeping an eye on this thread. Been thinking of an FI conversion for my Prelude.

This is a little off topic but I'll throw this out there anyway. One thing that makes me hesitate with the FI conversion is that I would have to replace the tank and fuel lines. It's not a huge deal but Prelude parts are kinda hard to find around here and having to drop the tank and run lines would be annoying and I would rather not have to do it. So I'm wondering, is there maybe some other way to pressurize the the fuel to the level needed by the injectors? I'm thinking of something like a two stage design where the stock pump gets the fuel to the engine and a second pump creates the high pressure for the injectors.
Thoughts?

C|


it IS possible to do it, but in a very specific way.

you basically need a 'fuel tank' or a 'surge tank' in the engine compartment with the line from the fuel tank in the back going to it(preferably after the filter). from there, you need to hook up a second fuel pump from that, and that would create the high pressure needed by the injectors. as far as return lines and such, they can all be routed back to the tank in the engine compartment for convenience

[cygnus x-1]

it IS possible to do it, but in a very specific way.
you basically need a 'fuel tank' or a 'surge tank' in the engine compartment with the line from the fuel tank in the back going to it(preferably after the filter). from there, you need to hook up a second fuel pump from that, and that would create the high pressure needed by the injectors. as far as return lines and such, they can all be routed back to the tank in the engine compartment for convenience

That is exactly what I was thinking. So next question; has this kind of thing ever been done in a production vehicle? That I could maybe find in a junkyard and scavenge parts from?

I've also been researching newer model cars that use returnless systems where the pump and regulator are together inside the tank. The pump is also speed controlled so that it only runs fast enough to keep the pressure up. This is a benefit because the pump doesn't get nearly as hot and it wouldn't need to be submerged for adequate cooling. I would be worried about a standard electric FI pump overheating in a small volume surge tank.

C|

[newaccorddriver]

That is exactly what I was thinking. So next question; has this kind of thing ever been done in a production vehicle? That I could maybe find in a junkyard and scavenge parts from?
I've also been researching newer model cars that use returnless systems where the pump and regulator are together inside the tank. The pump is also speed controlled so that it only runs fast enough to keep the pressure up. This is a benefit because the pump doesn't get nearly as hot and it wouldn't need to be submerged for adequate cooling. I would be worried about a standard electric FI pump overheating in a small volume surge tank.
C|

if your planning on going this route, i would recommend an external pump for the application. an external pump makes it so much easier since you dont have to make a tank for the pump to fit inside instead, you add a few fittings in it. external pumps are fairly cheap, so i dont see why this would cost alot more then using a junkyard pump.

[carotman]

Yes, an external fuel pump would be the way to go.

[hondaman1986]

Yes, an external fuel pump would be the way to go.


i fully agree it makes everything 10,000 times easyer at least for me

[cygnus x-1]

Yes, an external fuel pump would be the way to go.

Right, except that I don't think there are any for the returnless type systems that I'm talking about. Still looking around though.

C|

[newaccorddriver]

Right, except that I don't think there are any for the returnless type systems that I'm talking about. Still looking around though.
C|

if you cant find a returnless system, you can always feed the return line back into the surge tank in the engine bay anyways

[cygnus x-1]

So like this:

Fuel tank
|
stock LP pump
|
surge tank near engine
|
external HP pump
|
fuel rail
|
bypass regulator
|
Return to surge tank


This seeems ok as long as there aren't any issues with the HP pump overheating. The fuel in the surge tank is going to get pretty warm because of the heat carried back from the fuel rail.

C|

[carotman]

Fuck the returnless system. Just have a custom fuel pickup made. It's fery easy to do. 88turboaccord had one on his car. I can't find the pictures anymore tough :(

The custom fuel pickup includes a return line and a feed line. It's a stock EDI fuel pump clone with just two tubes.

[hondaman1986]

you could also do what i am and just put in a fuel cell an external pump, and a return style system for under $300

::edit::

yea well i thought it would be under $300 and i was wrong... just priced everything and its closer to $500 but its better for me because its easyer

[mikes87lude]

Pics of my MS
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-21-07_1911.jpg
stem
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-24-07_2357.jpg
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-24-07_2359.jpg
testing
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-26-07_0013.jpg
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-26-07_0056.jpg
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-26-07_1548.jpg
remade injector harness
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-26-07_1935.jpg
wiring mess, cleaned up now
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-27-07_1228.jpg
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s242/emarel76/02-27-07_1358.jpg