Adj. cam gear installed, new cam, headers

[paso100]

:) Wow, what a difference. I had a Colt Triflow Stage I reground cam installed and put on the Golden Eagle adj. cam gear, set at 0 deg. I also had the Pacesetter headers put on at the same time. The performance was better, but a little underwhelming. Most gains were felt/seen above 40 mph.
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I adjusted the cam gear to +2 (advanced) last night and acceleration is much better from a stop and continues through the rpm range. I did not adjust my ignition timing so I don't know how that is affecting performance. Next up is advancing another degree or maybe even 2, then retarding it to see how the powerband changes.
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I was a bit skeptical before putting it on, but I think the adj. cam really does make a noticeable improvement.
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The downtubes on the Pacesetter were giving me a little trouble, vibrating against the engine crossmember. My muffler man just knicked off a little bit of the crossmember for better clearance and now there's NO vibration. You can see where the crossmember is notched in the pic. For all the bad-mouthing of the Pacesetter's spring-loaded joint (vs. a flex pipe), I'm having NO problems in that regard, so far.
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Overall, after adjusting the cam gear, I'm very happy w/ this set up.
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http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/paso100/camgear.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/paso100/x.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/paso100/xx.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/paso100/xxx.jpg
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/paso100/xxxx.jpg

[EricW]

I see you had to notch the front beam like I did for my pacesetter.
I think your ball joint bolts are too tight, there should be alittle room for the springs to compress.

there you go
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/2110000-2110999/2110099_64_full.jpg
Looks good but I would have kept the timing belt cover and just cut a circle out of it like others and myself have done.

I have the Gude cam and It did give a noticeable gain. Not sure how it stacks up against the others available though.

[carotman]

Nice stuff!

[sinisterfuzzy]

what kind of 1/4 mile times are you getting with that? i think i might just do this kind of thing.

[mkymonkey]

MAN I SO WANT A FREAKING ADJ. CAM GEAR. is anyone selling one?

that looks fucking awesome....and with all your suspension stuff...this car should do fucking great in autox!

[bobafett]

i think if u advanced your cam timing and didnt touch dizzy, you also advanced your ignition timing, which could also help explain the increase in power. :) would be easy enough to check i suppose... :)

look good though...

[thegreatdane]

looking good with that stainless header, certainly a lot prettier than the black finish ones.

That's a horrid oil leak from your cam cover if it's spraying all over your PS line as well hehe

[paso100]

That's a horrid oil leak from your cam cover if it's spraying all over your PS line as well hehe
Yeah, you should see the potato chips and fries in the back seat. I guess it's time to use some Simple Green on the engine. I have one last oil leak (minor) to fix that I'm sure is coming from the oil pump. Oh the joy.
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As far as 1/4mi. times I just don't know, I was never into straight-line performance. But talk about a rush taking it in the hills or getting on the freeway. I have an automatic transmission and I still get a pretty good kick when it shifts into high gear. Gotta love that little extra torque. It feels like the car lost about 300 lbs. The engine is so much more responsive powering out of turns. Also, it's so much easier to cruise at 85-90mph I REALLY have to watch out for the CHP. I just got a ticket for doing 99 on a two-lane highway. :violin: The officer said he was not going to cite me for reckless driving (in California that would be 100mph), but I'm cringing about the fine. Sometimes it makes me wonder..... (as in buying a new Yaris.) What's the point of having a fast car if you can't drive it????:rant: I'd love to AutoX, but there's no track nearby.
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I'm really curious about what retarding the timing will do, but I'm going to drive it around at +2 deg. for awhile before experimenting.

[Acid X]

I need to finish my exhaust, get a header, and then a cam.

Yes. Those are on my to-do list.

[snoopyloopy]

nice, looks real good. i like your report because i wanna do something similar. i already have dcs headers and full exhaust and getting a cam shouldn't be too hard. just need a cam gear...

[TWOLOUDNPROUD]

MAN I SO WANT A FREAKING ADJ. CAM GEAR. is anyone selling one?

that looks fucking awesome....and with all your suspension stuff...this car should do fucking great in autox!
This is just going to kill you i gave my cam gear and the motor to MessyHonda88dx for free:Owned: http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/11/web/359000-359999/359877_10_full.jpg

[gfrg88]

This is just going to kill you i gave my cam gear and the motor to MessyHonda88dx for free:Owned: http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/11/web/359000-359999/359877_10_full.jpg


:wtf: i wouldve bought that off of you if i wouldve known you didnt want it. :slap:

[MessyHonda]

:wtf: i wouldve bought that off of you if i wouldve known you didnt want it. :slap:

and its mine now....HAHAHA(evil laugh) i have not had time to install it but yeah Tommy is one of the best guys... thats why im going to put that engine to good use...i dont want to say nothing but dont expect 122hp...

[crazykamper]

wow, u lucky messy!!

[mkymonkey]

wait...so why the fuck did you give it to him did he give you a blow or something? lol(no offense messy)

dude i would have paid you what you paid for it! you suck!


*turns head and cries to self*

[87preludeA20A3]

Pk were do you get those cam gears for one... and second if you think about it by changing the cam gear on a SOHC engine you are both changing valve timing and ignition timing(the distributor is on the end of the cam).. I could be wrong but it sounds right to me.. Oh and where do you get those cam gears i want one lol...

[mkymonkey]

it was a group buy a couple years ago

[speedpenguin]

Lookin' good!

[Strugglebucket]

did you notice how much different the engine sounds when you change the valve timing? to me it sounds kinda throatier advanced and raspier retarded.

right now i'm running at 3deg advanced with the ignition timing at the normal 15btdc. it feels fastest there but i honestly won't really know until i can get some sort of quantifiable measurement (dyno, ¼mile time).

[TWOLOUDNPROUD]

wait...so why the fuck did you give it to him did he give you a blow or something? lol(no offense messy)
dude i would have paid you what you paid for it! you suck!
i forgot it was on the motor when he came and got it and im not going to be a Ass and take it back so it his But i did not forget to take the DC Header off :bandance: that my Baby:Owned:

You know what sucks mkymonkey Nuts i can not find a 89 hatch that i want to buy to put my new B20a in (no offense mkymonkey)

[paso100]

did you notice how much different the engine sounds when you change the valve timing? to me it sounds kinda throatier advanced and raspier retarded.
right now i'm running at 3deg advanced with the ignition timing at the normal 15btdc. it feels fastest there but i honestly won't really know until i can get some sort of quantifiable measurement (dyno, ¼mile time).
That's interesting about the sound. I can't compare because I haven't retarded it yet. At WOT (wide-open throttle) it sounds "busier" and when letting off the gas it sounds quieter than stock to my ears. I guess besides flowing more freely, it sounds more free, too. How much did you experiment w/ the ignition and cam timing? Decrease in power at X deg?? And did you notice more torque at lower revs when advanced, and more power at higher revs when retarded, like some say? I like the way the engine responds now w/ my cam at +2 deg w/out compensating my ignition timing, but I want to set the ignition to stock just to see the difference. I'll keep what you said in mind.
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A dyno would be nice—and accurate—but I don't mind adjusting off my butt dyno:) because I like the way the car "feels" according to the way I drive. I don't mind losing fractions of a second if it means trading time for feeling more connected to the car. It's like riding a V-twin motorcycle that has more torque but is not as fast compared to a higher HP bike w/ a narrower power band. Now if I were racing ......:)
BTW, that JetHot coating on the Pacesetter really works. I notice the pipes cool down a lot quicker than w/ the stock exhaust.

[87preludeA20A3]

What manufacturer or company did that group but go through? I would love to get another going both on here and prelude power... I likey alot...lol

[mkymonkey]

there is one already. and i think that the thread was posted on preludepower as well. just search up adj cam gear or something. im too lazy to do it for ya. :D the progress on it now is that the guy (i dont remember who started it) got an eagle cam gear from another member already and has handed it to his buddy that will start the whole deal. but it will be a month before anything is even manufactured or whatever.

[87preludeA20A3]

ok will search like now... thanks

[paso100]

I'm going to put my cover back on after I play w/ the cam timing so I don't get grief when it comes time to smog. I'll also put the stock intake back on for the same reason. So have you played w/ the settings yet? If so, let us know the difference

[Strugglebucket]

That's interesting about the sound. I can't compare because I haven't retarded it yet. At WOT (wide-open throttle) it sounds "busier" and when letting off the gas it sounds quieter than stock to my ears. I guess besides flowing more freely, it sounds more free, too. How much did you experiment w/ the ignition and cam timing? Decrease in power at X deg?? And did you notice more torque at lower revs when advanced, and more power at higher revs when retarded, like some say? I like the way the engine responds now w/ my cam at +2 deg w/out compensating my ignition timing, but I want to set the ignition to stock just to see the difference. I'll keep what you said in mind.
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A dyno would be nice—and accurate—but I don't mind adjusting off my butt dyno:) because I like the way the car "feels" according to the way I drive. I don't mind losing fractions of a second if it means trading time for feeling more connected to the car. It's like riding a V-twin motorcycle that has more torque but is not as fast compared to a higher HP bike w/ a narrower power band. Now if I were racing ......:)
BTW, that JetHot coating on the Pacesetter really works. I notice the pipes cool down a lot quicker than w/ the stock exhaust.
i have the ignition timing at stock just to be on the safe side. you can only advance it so much (especially with a cam, and especially if you're using lower octane gas) until you start getting too much detonation. on a dyno i would probably see how much i could gain from advancing it 2 or 3 degrees to see if it's worth it. gotta remember the timing control on our cars is kind of primordial.

[LiTtLe xOx BitT]

Thats the same cam gear i just got. You should have it dynoed to see how much hp you have.

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2110099/3 Theres a pic of mine installed.

Ill probably end up doing that, i just haven't felt like it, lol.
I havent got to adjust anything yet, i will probably wait til i get it dynoed to mess with it. i get payed again on the 26th so hopefully i will get it done then.
I think my next engine mod is going to be a camshaft, Im trying to get the gude one from johnnyO.PART NO: HACS01
DESCRIPTION: Added power and torque; strong to redline
POWER BAND 3500 RPM To 6500 RPM
IDLE: Good
SPECIFICATIONS: Intake LIFT - .434 DURATION - 252
Exhaust LIFT - .434 DURATION - 252
I was just looking at their head packsge, im waiting for a response on how much it will cost.
I just set it to 3degrees retarded so ill see what improvements that makes.

[89ACCORD2DR]

Man Can Somebody Please Give Me More Info Nd Were I Cn Go Purchase A Reground Tri Flow Cam

[89ACCORD2DR]

Man Can Somebody Please Give Me More Info Nd Were I CAn Go Purchase A Reground Tri Flow Cam

[paso100]

Man Can Somebody Please Give Me More Info Nd Were I Cn Go Purchase A Reground Tri Flow Cam
Go here:
http://www.coltcams.com/
Check out this previous thread:
http://3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51135
And use that Search button in the menu bar:) .

[rjudgey]

Engine will sound louder because the camshaft is letting in more air and fuel, and what happens when you let more air and fuel in it makes a bigger explosion, bigger explosion more exhaust gas to push out, also the header not being cast doesn't absorb the noise as well so is louder anyway.
I actually find that retrading my camshaft works better only couple of degress, go any more than a couple either way is not normally worthwhile, unless you've chopped a lot of the block or head then you have to set it couple of degrees advanced just to get back to 0 degrees again. With mine retarded it's a bit lumpy low end and doesn't pull as well from low revs but boy when you hit 3500rpm takes off like a rocket upto 7.5krpm obviously mines a fully tricked out head but still impressive for a camshaft that only has 272 degree duration not much less revs than a DOHC engine, and more importantly that head only had stock valves inside so would have been even better with my big valve conversion.

[MessyHonda]

Engine will sound louder because the camshaft is letting in more air and fuel, and what happens when you let more air and fuel in it makes a bigger explosion, bigger explosion more exhaust gas to push out, also the header not being cast doesn't absorb the noise as well so is louder anyway.
I actually find that retrading my camshaft works better only couple of degress, go any more than a couple either way is not normally worthwhile, unless you've chopped a lot of the block or head then you have to set it couple of degrees advanced just to get back to 0 degrees again. With mine retarded it's a bit lumpy low end and doesn't pull as well from low revs but boy when you hit 3500rpm takes off like a rocket upto 7.5krpm obviously mines a fully tricked out head but still impressive for a camshaft that only has 272 degree duration not much less revs than a DOHC engine, and more importantly that head only had stock valves inside so would have been even better with my big valve conversion.



yeah i heard -3 degrees is a good seting...i have mine like -1 and it still pulls good.

[Toohardtohandle]

I said it before and I'll say it again...If anyone is interested in getting a "group buy" for adjustable cam gears. I'M IN!!!!!!

[Blk87dx]

will that cam work for any a20? even a 2bbl?

[teck]

OMG! jeaous i wnt a darn cam gear hehe looks good man

[snoopyloopy]

I have the Gude cam and It did give a noticeable gain. Not sure how it stacks up against the others available though.
so wait, now we have gude cams in the mix too? i'm conflicted on what i should do. but which one is best for stock or bolt-ons only setup out of delta 272, gude, and colt tri-flow i and which is better for p&p head + bolt-ons setup out of the delta 282, gude, and colt tri-flow ii? because i don't think i'll get around to bottom end before i go b20a.

[2oodoor]

nice job digging this one up snoopy.
282 may be a bit of overkill without serious head work.
Guys,, every time you move the cam gear a little, it drasticly changes the dist timing, you must move them both. I would advise setting the gear at 2degrees adv, and then go back to dist and set to 15, maybe one more time on the cam gear if everything is cool, then set the dist timing to where it does not ping and gives you power in the range you like to drive without pegging the gas to make it pull strong....but not too much so that it does not pull even as strong at wide open thorttle than at half.. ok hard to explain the butt dyno...
you want it to pull strong with out flooring it, for daily driving and impressive acceleration, but then you do want it to pull even noticably stronger at wide open. Probably start with a fresh oil change and a clear mind and make reference points to measure your progress or lack there of.

[bobafett]

fyi we run a 282 cam on zeph's car that is mechanically stock motor other than some interesting oil leaks. it pulls great, but DEFINITELY has a worse low end than stock. that being said, the 282 is a badass cam and is definitely a lot more fun than the 272. :) we put the 282 in his car it fired right up and idled immediately. now that he has quad carbs his idle is a bit tricky, but with the weber it was easy. :)

also fyi, i HAVE serious headwork and could not get my car to idle below 3000 rpm with a 282 cam even with stock intake manifold and throttle body. but of course i am a glutton for punishment, and i am planning a 272/282 hybrid cam once i get my engine management setup finished. :D

[snoopyloopy]

so....delta 282 might be what i'm looking for? i usually drive in the lower rpm range, but i don't mind a romp to the top either. and no one besides ericw has tried the gude cam? and tri-flow ii vs 282? gogogo

[bobafett]

if you prefer lower rpm grunt dont bother with a 282. it feels like ur half throttle until 3000 rpm, then it just feels like you floored it instantly at that point. its awesome. :)
mainly im saying its totally drivable, and enjoyable. but i don't mind my power up top. hondas weren't meant to make tons of hp down low, so take advantage of that and wrap it out a bit! :) heheh.. of course if you want to push it past 6000 all the time you should probably make sure that ur valvetrain is up for the task. if you just want a fun cam and not have to worry about anything a 272 is perfect.

[MessyHonda]

so....delta 282 might be what i'm looking for? i usually drive in the lower rpm range, but i don't mind a romp to the top either. and no one besides ericw has tried the gude cam? and tri-flow ii vs 282? gogogo



well the cam i have is the Colt stage 2 tri flow


here are the specs

STAGE 2 - PRIM INT 280° .392 LIFT
> SEC INT 268° .383 LIFT
> EX 288° .394 LIFT
>Recommended for carburetor engine. However, it will work on F.I. with a
>noticeable idle
>and possibly a slight surge. Strong mid range. No mods are required
>Power band is 3500 - 7500 R.P.M.

[bobafett]

seems pretty similar although i don't know the lift specs for the delta cams. also don't know the secondary intake duration. :) but from those specs it seems like a fun cam.

[Toohardtohandle]

Ok so does anyone have any suggestions in respect to the adjustment on a 88 auto with:

CAI
Colt Cam Stage I
Pacesetter Header
2.25 exhaust w/out the cat (Hi-Flow Muffler)

I'm thinking -2 adjustment based on the opinion of other members; and I guess I should mention that I'm up-grading my TB as well.

[EricW]

If you want more torque run it advanced, I ran my gude cam at advanced 4 degrees for autocross, it brought the power band down to about 2k (from around 3.5k) and made the car have some nice acceleration.

[DaveTheAve]

$post = new Question($threadId);
$post->noobQuestion('

What are the advantages of installing a new cam gear? Why should one do it?

');
$post->submit();

[bobafett]

lol php post eh?

you can adjust your powerband to make power earlier or later depending on your mods/preference/goals.

[DaveTheAve]

Note my sig, Web Consultant... I manly do PHP5 (w/ OOP... Zend Framework!!) & MySQL.

Anyway, is a new cam gear recommended for performance? Or should I stick with the stock one?

Also, what is the third belt down, on the right of the engine block? I can concave mine with my finger... Just want to know what belt I need to replace when it comes flying off... and HOW do you get at the belts???? They are in there good I think.

[DDRaptor]

Hey wow colt cams are not an arm and a leg like i used to believe.

wait i don't understand how to compare paeco and colt cams profiles

Colt ($180) lift
primary 280 392
sec. 268 383
exh 288 394

paeco ($230)
The best power range is 2500-6800 although it will rev to 7500. INTAKE: 27/59 EXH:63/23 DURATION: 266 LIFT:.382"

just trying to compare apples to apples

[snoopyloopy]

if you prefer lower rpm grunt dont bother with a 282. it feels like ur half throttle until 3000 rpm, then it just feels like you floored it instantly at that point. its awesome. :)
mainly im saying its totally drivable, and enjoyable. but i don't mind my power up top. hondas weren't meant to make tons of hp down low, so take advantage of that and wrap it out a bit! :) heheh.. of course if you want to push it past 6000 all the time you should probably make sure that ur valvetrain is up for the task. if you just want a fun cam and not have to worry about anything a 272 is perfect.
but wait, acg allows me to potentially get 272 rpm range out of the 282 (or tri-flow2) cam with 282 performance, correct? that sounds like something that interests me...


Hey wow colt cams are not an arm and a leg like i used to believe.

wait i don't understand how to compare paeco and colt cams profiles

Colt ($180) lift
primary 280 392
sec. 268 383
exh 288 394

paeco ($230)
The best power range is 2500-6800 although it will rev to 7500. INTAKE: 27/59 EXH:63/23 DURATION: 266 LIFT:.382"

just trying to compare apples to apples
looks to me like the paeco has a lower duration, so it's not as aggressive as the colt. and the lift is lower as well.