Accord Carb Problems , Should I fix or can I swap motors?

[Holy^ghost]

I have tried to find information on this. I have a 1.6L 12 valve 84 accord. it even says on the hood that its 1598CC. is this rare? oh another question since my carburetor is dead and i need another will the Weber carburetor model K 727 work with my 1.6L. I got told that this engine is rare. also my car has only 99,970K's on it. yes I'm 100% sure its under 100,000K. engine runs awesome. carburetor is the problem.

well I've been searching for about 2 weeks on the web and in books and found nothing on the 1.6L for a 1984 accord. it must be rare. and all i want to know is if the weber K727 carb would fit on my 1.6

I think its electric being as i have no control of it. anyway about the weber carburetor. if i do buy it and add it to my car how much of horse power gain should I expect. maybe you guys should make a full 2Geez site. ill have some pics of my car soon. and you won't believe what it sounds like.

[MessyHonda]

I think its electric being as i have no control of it. anyway about the weber carburetor. if i do buy it and add it to my car how much of horse power gain should I expect. maybe you guys should make a full 2Geez site. ill have some pics of my car soon. and you won't believe what it sounds like.
the carb would just get rid of the emissions crap...so it will give you some hp. maybe like 6-10hp

headers should help

[Holy^ghost]

I'm in Nanaimo on Vancouver island. and yes less emissions crap. already put a strait pipe in with no muffler so I got rid of that stupid catalytic converter and 6 to 10HP is going to be good cause any power i can push will make me happy.. going 0 to 60 in an hour isn't that fun. but then again i do have a crappy carburetor making it slow.

its all stock and has body parts missing. plus its in stock blue. almost no rust though. pics are coming soon.

ugg ill make a vid to so you can hear its awesomeness. and then ill also show you why i think my carburetor has gone to a better place. Ie hard starting and and major stalling in intersections. now to me that sounds like a carburetor. the exhaust timing was adjusted and i have a new ignition system so it has the be the 450,000-Km carb I got from the junkyard.

its called a digital camera. anyway i found out what my engine is its the A16A1 found it on wiki

here are the specs
A16A1
The A16A1 was a carburated 1.6 liter engine used in the 1982-1985 Honda Accords in North America and in some of the 1986-1989 Accords in the non-USDM market.
Specifications
Carbeurated
Displacement: 1596 cm3
Bore: 80 mm
Stroke: 79.5 mm
Power:
88 hp @ 6000 rpm
91 ft/lb torque @ 3500 rpm

ok so heres the deal.
when i first bought the car about 3 months ago it seemed to run almost fine. but then it stated having hard starting issues and it would stall if i tryed to accelerate after stopping. so i got a whole new ignition system from distributor cap to coil and wires. and that fixed it for a while. but now its back to having to flutter the gas pedal to start and stalling IN INTERSECTIONS. thats the part that makes me want to take a gun to it. so i thought for a bit. and came up that it might be the carburetor that i had to get off another car. when i bought the car for $400 in a Vancouver auction it had no carb. dunno why but it didn't. so i had to go to a junk yard to find another. well after being sick and tired of it stalling i went to a mechanic to see what he could tell me. and sure enough it was the carburetor. he said that i should try to buy a new one. well not having the $420 for the weber K 727 i was wondering if a rebuild kit would be worth it.

well some one check my post in the mechanical section and see if they can help me please.

[denhonda]

We got 1598 12v engine here on the 2.5g DX models. Bought one to replace the 1602cc engine on my 82 a few years ago but never got round to doing it cos of all the differences so it got laid to one side & forgotten about sadly. Did run perfectly.
Glad I didn't persue an engine swap thought as the 82 still runs with its old original!

If its the standard Keihen (spelling?) carb, theres a part of it called the accelerator pump which is operated by whats referred to, in the workshop manual, as a 'metal tang' This is adjusted by bending it (honestly!) so it operates the pump sooner and this can cure the initial hesitation you are experiencing when driving off. My 82 is suffering from the same problem & I'll perform this adjustment to cure it as I've done several times before.
The carbs can also get corrosion in the float chamber that blocks up the jets, means new carb is required. If it is okay in there the jets may just need cleaned out (or replaced) - potentially a job for a specialist.
In any event I'd always recommend stripping the carb just to check it before assuming its scrap & replacing it. Rebuild with new gaskets to be on the safe side.

[Holy^ghost]

I had just bought a new accelerator diaphragm for it and a new carb rebuild. the stupid thing has that dumb 2 barrel carb. only on the A161A. had to go to deal for them and have to wait for it to ship from japan. so thank you for your help.

[2ndGenGuy]

Man you're lucky they even still have them in stock or even make them anymore. Everything for these cars is discontinued.

[Holy^ghost]

Yes i inow that the A16a1 Engine was for europe and japan as well as canada but it was optianal and many people didn't put it in. I don't know why the US market didn't get it

[offthahook]

Man you're lucky they even still have them in stock or even make them anymore. Everything for these cars is discontinued.
:bow: :bow: I would love to hear the words "You'll have to wait for transit time from Japan." All I ever hear is "That part is discontinued or on national backorder and will be discontinued." Good luck getting it all squared away. I also hear a lot of "We just crushed that car last week; it had some good parts on it, too." Old Honda parts searches are fun!

[2ndGenGuy]

Yes i inow that the A16a1 Engine was for europe and japan as well as canada but it was optianal and many people didn't put it in. I don't know why the US market didn't get it
Emissions.
The 1.6 has no CVCC. It wont pass emissions standards here. CVCC reduces HP a touch, which is why your 1.6 has as much power as my 1.8.

The accelerator pump is a component of the carburetor. So you'll have to find a diagram of the carb with all it's parts. If you've got the factory service manual, there should be one in there. I've got a UK factory service manual for the 84 Accord, but there's no mention of a 1.6 liter engine.

When you get your new carb, you won't have to worry about that. The accelerator pump will be all new and set up. :)

The thing that makes me curious, and perhaps concerned is that your carb is a 3bbl. I'm scared that you're going to wind up with the US carb and it won't fit. We have 3bbl carbs here, but the third barrel is about 4mm wide. It feeds the auxiliary chamber for the CVCC system in the head. So, I'm really curious as to what you've got, and why it's got the 3rd barrel.

---------

Also, when you get a chance, would you be willing to post some pictures of your intake manifold where the carb bolts on? And do you think you could take detailed photos of the carb when you get it? I'm just curious about compatibility between US and Canadian cars, and the more documentation we have the more modification and preservation we can do to our cars.

[Holy^ghost]

I know. the guy said that theres like only 5 cars in canada with the A16 in them. so im very lucky. umm can someone tell me were the accelerator pump is located. i can't find it in the car manual. but im guessing its near the carborater

one problem its a rebuild for the carb I have. I said that the after market one is a 3bbl carb. when i get home i will take pics of the intake manafold and un- rebuilt carborator. the problem is that i think the carb is from a 1.8 and not the origanal and if thats true the rebuild for it will be useless. and that could expalin why there is a huge gas leak at the gasket were it leads from the carb to the intake. still i will take pics of it with out the air intake on and you guys can compare what the carb is.
im pretty sure it does you will see your self once i take pics of my engine. with the air intake on and with it off showing the carb. and when i get the rebuild kit i will take the carb out and take pics of it as I take it apart

the one on my car now is a two bbl one choke carb. is that the same as the stock one in your car

hmm so it is different. when i get the damn carb rebuild and accelerator pump diaphragm ill take some pics of the intake manifold and carb.

I need a description of what the accelerator pump looks like and were abouts on the carb it is. because even though my car sounds like a rallied out rice rocket it accelerates from 0 to 60 in an hour.

[2ndGenGuy]

Oh ok, so the new one from Japan isn't a 3bbl? Hopefully not, I do think that the 3bbl carb would leak all over the place just as you described.

No, the stock one for my car is a 3bbl.

Which carb do you mean? The 3bbl? Didn't you order a new carb from Japan? It will be all set up right in the new carb...

If you do mean the 3bbl, I can post a diagram of the carb or what I've got from the factory service manual. But I'll have to do it tomorrow night.

[denhonda]

Do you guys ever see copies of the "haynes Manual' for cars?

Haynes do a wide range of car manuals for loads of cars including 1g - 2.5g Accords. They are well written, pretty accurate & have diagrams & photos in them of every procedure. They detail UK, US & Canadian market models. Look on ebay, heres a 2.5g one... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-Haynes-Manual-Honda-Accord-84-85_W0QQitemZ270068009868QQihZ017QQcategoryZ100940Q QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Until you know the car you're working on inside out, they are really handy to refer to. It is probably along the same lines as Chiltons manuals but never seen this manual to know its in's & out's.

[Holy^ghost]

dude i have a Haynes for my car. and it doesn't mention the accelerator pump at all in my book. and i mean in the 2 barrel for my A16A. also is there a way i could adjust it to work better. and its not a new carb im getting its a rebuild. and a new accelerator diaphragm for it

[2ndGenGuy]

Factory service manual is the only thing to get. It tells EVERYTHING and its from the source who built the car. And it's year-specific. So it's not do one thing for the 82, another thing for the 83, this part is here on the 84, blah blah. Chiltons kinda had to reverse engineer the cars, if not just copy thier info from the factory service manual.

[Ichiban]

the accelerator pump is located at the bottom of the float bowl, that's the square side of the carb opposite of the primary and secondary barrels. Find the round metal plate on the bottom that's held on by 3 screws, the pump diaphragm is within. You'll know if you have the right spot because directly above, on the top of the carb, is a rubber boot covering a rod with the linkage that moves with the throttle. To check your accelerator pump, with the air filter removed look down inside the primary barrel (might have to hold the choke plate open with your other finger, it just pushes out of the way) and with your other hand, grab the throttle linkage and open and shut the throttle quickly a couple of times. You should see and hear a jet of fuel being pushed into the primary each time the throttle is opened. If it is, it's working fine.

From watching your video, I think your accel pump is probably working. If it's not, the engine will sputter and stall when the throttle is opened. The pump is designed to provide fuel during the momentary drop in manifold vacuum when the throttle is opened (where fuel isn't being sucked out of the main jets) until engine RPM and vacuum increaces, which again draws fuel out of the main jets as it should.

How are your plugs, filters, wires, cap/rotor and timing?

[Holy^ghost]

every ignition part is brand new and works fine the only reason why it is working fine is because i just drove the car at that time and i have the idle at 1,500 so the vacuum stays up. trust me it sputters and lags allot. 0 to 60 in about 5 mins not kidding.

Hey my rebuild kit for my carburetor is in (all the way from japan). all i need to do is pick it up hopefully tomorrow. once I get it ill take pics off it and of the un-built carb. and take pics while I take the thing apart. show off my A16A.

[Ichiban]

once the vacuum is up the engine should accelerate as normal. I drove from BC to New Brunswick (and back) with my accelerator pump circuits completely plugged. Once the car was warm and if you feathered the throttle, it was fine.

John can verify (2ndgenguy) He has that carb now.

[Holy^ghost]

yes but i just got the parts like 3 hours ago so il rebuild the carb and add the new pump diaphram and what not to it in the morning. of course ill post pics

thanks guys for helping me find the accelerator pump. anyway I was pumping it and noticed that it was spewing gas onto my head cover and not into my carb. now could that be the reason for my slow acceleration and stalling.

yeah about that i can't figure out how to get the damn throttle cabe off and its the only thing thats left on the carb. its stoping me from taking it off and into my house so i can rebuild it. can someone tell me how to take it off

after pulling the stupid Carburetor off I will put it on the table and take pics after i rebuild it. it was 34 hoses and a bitch of a throttle cable to get it off

I need some sort of instructions on how to take apart my carburetor. can you give me a website were it tells me how to take apart my keichen (spelling) carburetor for my 1.6L engine

i think ill get my dad to help me on this. it just that there are like a billion o rings and i have no clue were they all go. could you give me a hint as to what or were they go

[A18A]

i learned from experience :) i dunno how much different your carb is to 3geez carbs, but i just unscrew every screw in place (except the float bowl screw) or something along the lines to take it apart, it's quite simple really.

i dunno about 2gee carbs but i read on this forum that you shouldnt flip the carb either, although i did and it didnt do no harm

i would usually just take it all to pieces (taking pics just incase you forget were parts go etc..) and usually when re-assembling it, just what ever part fits goes there.... but thats just the way i do things, might not be recommended though

[MessyHonda]

after pulling the stupid Carburetor off I will put it on the table and take pics after i rebuild it. it was 34 hoses and a bitch of a throttle cable to get it off


next time you will be able to take if off in 1/2 the time...trust me...my uncle and me can swap out the carb in like a hour and 30 mins.

[Holy^ghost]

HAVE THE MANUAL well the haynes. were do i get the car manual that comes with it

what manual do you guys suggest for it

[carotman]

The OEM shop manual. That's the best thing you can use IMO.

[2ndGenGuy]

I would say if you can't find one on eBay, the Honda dealer can order you the original. It's not cheap, but it's the best you can get. Hmm... though you probably want to be careful on eBay, as they will probably have mostly the US version of the manual, which doesn't have your engine or carb.

[Ichiban]

The carb kit should have come with a diagram of EVERY piece of the carb, as well as idle air adjustments and float heights, as well as a little tool to set the float height with.

[Holy^ghost]

well all it came with was a gay gasket and some o rings i thought it would come with instructions as well but it didn't

because there gay. oh well i got it back together but now my gay car won't start. heck i even primed the float bowl.

ok ive had it with the stock carb bring gay and having to do crap to it. where can i get a weber carb for my 1.6L engine. or will the K727 work. my origanal carb is a keihin 2 barrel. does anyone think the weber will work.?

[2ndGenGuy]

Man if you were a little closer to Chiliwack, I'd drive out and help ya tomorrow on my way back to Washington. Its a long ferry ride to where you are it looks like though.
And please, the 2nd gen Accord is anything but gay. ;)

A Weber will work my friend, but like I was saying, you'll have to have a custom adapter plate made. I'm sure you can draw one out and have it made for dirt cheap. The easiest thing to do, but maybe expensive would be to remove your intake manifold, and take it and the Weber to a fabricator and have one made, then the rest you just follow the guides on the site.
Who knows though, if your car is only a 2bbl, it may have the same flange for the carb as another Accord or Civic, and there may be an adapter plate that is undocumented that will work jsut fine.

[Ichiban]

I'm sure there is an adapter plate that will work. Those carbs are similar to other 2 and 1gen accord carburetors.

[Holy^ghost]

why not just use the adapter plate that comes with it. just take all the crap off the intake manifold and leave the big square there. the only thing i'm wondering is if the weber uses the same 4 bolt set up. if it does ill be fine.

2 hour ferry actually. it would be fun if you brought your car

MY CAR MAGICALLY WORKS NOW. i have no idea why it wouldn't start yesterday but now it runs better then ever i mean no lag when going from a stop and no stalling. i guess i fixed it.

ok now it works for some weird reason. and not as in it starts but runs crappy i mean like runs. like new theres no more lag in when i accel from a stop and no stalling. i did have the gay ass choke stick on me cause my dad bent the arm on it but i fixed that and now it runs better then ever.

[lostforawhile]

piercemanifolds.com they should have a complete kit for your car with the webber,the manifold adaptor plate,etc.

[2ndGenGuy]

w00t! Nice work man. Sounds like maybe you didn't give the fuel pump enough time to get gas to the engine or something. It can seem to take a long ass time and not start up. Good work. You are now one of the few A16 masters. I think there's only 2 of you. guyhatesmycar being the other.

Pierce manifolds doens't have it for the Canadian models specifically. But that doesn't matter now. Nice work on the fix! Now we need to get you rebuilding the ES2 carbs... ;)

[Holy^ghost]

pffft its time for that A20 swap i wanna do. going to need 600 for the engine and a few more for the ecu and fuel tank

[88Accord-DX]

If you going to do a swap with A20 engine, get a fuel injected one (A20A3) The carbs on the A20A1 are just as much of a Pain In The Ass!

[2ndGenGuy]

Fuel tank? What for?

[Ichiban]

use the external EFI fuel pump from the preludes, like I'm doing.

[2ndGenGuy]

Yeah I was gonna say the EFI pump from an 85 SEi. I know you don't have those up there, but a quick trip across the border should score you one.

[lostforawhile]

If you going to do a swap with A20 engine, get a fuel injected one (A20A3) The carbs on the A20A1 are just as much of a Pain In The Ass!why don't you get the carb engine and get the webber kit for it from pierce? that way you can just strip everything off of it and start with webbers from scratch. I would still change tanks though,then you can get a decent inline carb pump like a mallory. the pump on the carbs sucks.if you want to go fuel injection and want to upgrade pumps just buy a high performance pump from a different honda. summit racing actually carries a number of high performance fuel injection pumps for honda. I was really suprised to see that venom remans honda pumps to operate better then stock also.

[2ndGenGuy]

2nd Gens already have an inline pump. It's not in the tank, it's mounted in the driver's side, rear wheel well.

[Holy^ghost]

i know thats why if i got an JDM A20A3 i would need a tank from a 86 becuse of the different pumps

ok so after I loosened the throttle cable and gave it some slack. all my car issues disappeared. no stalling and i actually get it to idle at 750RPM without stalling and i have good acceleration now. haha I'm only pulling off idle 750RPM because i have 99,962KM's on it or about 78,000 miles. I am an A16 Master

[Ichiban]

why don't you get the carb engine and get the webber kit for it from pierce? that way you can just strip everything off of it and start with webbers from scratch. I would still change tanks though,then you can get a decent inline carb pump like a mallory. the pump on the carbs sucks.if you want to go fuel injection and want to upgrade pumps just buy a high performance pump from a different honda. summit racing actually carries a number of high performance fuel injection pumps for honda. I was really suprised to see that venom remans honda pumps to operate better then stock also.
You shouldn't have to change tanks to go efi, just add the return line plumbing and you're set.
Also, the canadian A20A4 has slightly more power and less emissions than the USDM counterpart. If you get an A20A1 and go with webber or stock carbs you don't have to change the tank, pump or anything.
BTW the spring/solenoid Mitsubishi fuel pumps on the 2g are a marvel of ingenuity, simplicity and effectiveness.

Glad the rebuild worked out for you.
I see the Messy/Cheese whoring has spread to the 2g section!

[Holy^ghost]

what do you mean. will my car blow up err i hate when that happens, happened to my mustang

[Holy^ghost]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onujMwkBLr0

yes this is a video of my car accelerating from 100 to 180K going uphill and with 3 people to boot. I love my car. the video was done on a cell phone so its kinda crappy but look at the fence and the other cars on the other side whipping by.

before I rebuilt the carb it could only do 140KPH up this highway and with only 2 people in the car. but thats how much of a difference it can make. no real performance parts just a fairly new A16A engine a strait pipe with no cat (legal in my city) and a K and N air filter.
when i mean fairly new I mean 110,000K on the engine.

[Ichiban]

180 KPH? My 82 was screaming at 150, you must have some pretty tall gears.

[Holy^ghost]

it was screaming at the begging but then it shifted to fourth. and yes the tranny was rebuilt it has some hard kick when it shifts. there fairly tall it accels pretty slow and takes up to 140 before it shifts to 3rd/4th

[2ndGenGuy]

Man my 1.8 just about tops out there. Haven't tried a top speed run since rejetting though. That auto box gearing must be pretty good. Is that as fast as it can go?

And do you have a black steering wheel? I forgot what those wheels looked like, since I put the 3gee wheel in my car... :lol:

[Holy^ghost]

well the steering wheel is blue but i guess its worn out cause the outer part wear your hands go is greenish

I dunno what it tops out at but it was only at 4000RPM going that fast. plus i couldn't accelerate anymore cause of some dumb truck in my way but it might push to 200K if i have no one in the car with me and going on flat road maybe downhill i can push 220

[smufguy]

Dont get me wrong, but why is 111mph that fascinating?

[Holy^ghost]

hey when i do the A2A4 swap i bet my 2g will own your 3g

[MessyHonda]

lol a20a4 does not have emissions stuff...but it wont make it mindblowing fast.

[Boltgunner]

3 BBL carb is on CVCC...You may have just the 2 BBL carb...

After trying to learn all about the eight or so emissions subsystems on the 84 Accord CVCC, as soon as Texas quits sniffing the car I wanna go to the Weber and toss all the hoses, solenoids, relays, etc. Plus the Colt Cam treatment. But, the 2 liter hop to the A20 calls to me, IF I could get a handle on what kind of HP it could make BEFORE I start collecting money and parts...

[Holy^ghost]

hey guys I'm back since I'm taking auto shop i have time to fix my ride. and i was wondering were the hell i could find a carburetor for my gay car being that it has the 1.6L engine that was available in Canada. there are none at the dealer ship and the ones in the junk yard are all 1.8 and for some odd reason 2.0. so someone help me find a place to find a carburetor for this car please.

[2ndGenGuy]

I thought you got a rebuild kit for your carb and everything was running great...

[Holy^ghost]

was till the thing started having vacuum issues dont do 200KPH in your accord it might wreck stuff

where do i get those nice rounder headlights and could i swap em for my sealed beam ones

hey guys I've phoned the Honda dealer and went to the junk yard and i cant find a carburetor that will work for my A16A. will the weber carb fit on it without doing something major. or is it time to send it to the great beyond or for parts cause without a new one my car is useless.

don't get mad. ill try to find a carburetor if i cant ill buy the weber and make an adaptor plate. but why do i need one its a two barrel carb isn't it and i have the same manifold as you guys. so i don't think ill need one and that bottem black thing is the same ill try to get a pic of what im talking about.

can't we just ask one of the Malaysian guys to order a set for us it looks like they have a ton of accords with them.

ok since your guys ar all PMSing ill give a list of all the questions i want answered.

question 1
first the carburetor I know the weber might not fit directly. but since i have a 2 barrel carb already and mount flange is the exact same as yours wouldn't it just drop right in. it looks like this one http://oem.thepartsbin.com/parts/thepartsbin/wizard.jsp?year=1984&make=HO&model=ACC--004&category=All&part=Carbur

question two
were do i get JDM headlights. i know you can't just order them but what if someone with a jdm car orders them then ships them too you. or at least finds one and strips it of all its JDM stuff.

question 3
is the A20A motor pretty much a direct swap or do i have to make custom mounts and drive shafts and a custom fuel system.

i found the pick of what i was talking about it was the mount flange

http://oem.thepartsbin.com/parts/thepartsbin/wizard.jsp?year=1984&make=HO&model=ACC--004&category=All&part=Carbur

it looks very close if not the same as that

[2ndGenGuy]

Actually, our cars here in the US have a different intake manifold. We have 3bbl carbs because the heads on our engines are CVCC. I do believe though that your car will have the same mounting flange as some other Accords up there and probably many older Civics as well. What you kinda should do is take your carb off of your motor and measure up the shape of the mounting flange, or get a good idea what it looks like. Then you can compare it to pics online, or even hit up the wrecking yard and check out some other Hondas to see what theirs look like. If they have the same mounting plates, then you know that you can buy a Weber adapter kit for those cars and use them on yours.

Yes the Weber is a 2bbl carb, but the bolt holes are in different locations. That's why you can't just bolt it on to your car. And I know that the CVCC engines like mine have an almost completely different flange from yours...

That part you linked, that star shaped pattern on the very bottom of that flange is what our Weber adapter plates are shaped like. You need something more like the top of that flange.

Yeah, that's all you had to do in the first place. See now we can answer all your questions in one place.

Question 1) I'll refer you back to this thread, cos I don't wanna type it again: http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58194

Question 2) You're right, the only way to get them is to contact somebody in a country where they have them. Just PM somebody who you see with a set of them. Or someone who is from one of those countries. That's what I'd recommend.

Question 3) Since you have the A16, any of the A-series engines should swap in just fine. You should be able to use all your existing motor mounts, and bolt your transmission right up to the A20. Easy as pie.


Nobody was PMSing. It just makes it impossible to answer your questions when you posted "HOW DO I DO A20 ENGINE SWAP" in a thread that had nothing to do with that. You posted in a whole ton of threads with the same questions, so how do you expect us to answer?

[Hash_man_Se_i]

You could try asking one of the malaysian members.... although I think the biggest issue dealing with them is still the language barrier. GL though, cuz those headlights look great on the 2g's

[Holy^ghost]

what car do you think has close to the mount i have? i'm guessing a no cvcc civic.

[MessyHonda]

what car do you think has close to the mount i have? i'm guessing a no cvcc civic.



just put in a a20a1

[Holy^ghost]

if i had 600 bucks for the engine and a place to do it i would. but any way i got pics of my mount flange and ill put them up ASAP

http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/9596/1001451pv8.th.jpg (http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1001451pv8.jpg)
(http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1001451pv8.jpg)
[IMG]http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/1927/1001451ro9.th.jpg (http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1001451ro9.jpg)
[img=http://img131.imageshack.us/img131/1927/1001451ro9.th.jpg] (http://img131.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1001451ro9.jpg)
heres a pic of my mount flange what other cars does it look like?

[2ndGenGuy]

Hmm, sweet pictures. I'm not 100% sure which cars have those, but theres lots. It looks like the same as the 1g Accord. Just look online at Weber adapter kits... www.piercemanifolds.com

http://www.piercemanifolds.com/Catalogpages/honda.htm

http://www.piercemanifolds.com/Images/Catalog/99004.100.htm

That looks right to me.

[Holy^ghost]

so i should order the weber K624 kit. that adapter looks about right but will the carburetor fit right in or will have have to make linkage changes. and will my cruise control still work?

i cant find a pic of a 1st gen mount flange can you please take a pic of the one off your accord or someones i want to compare it. because my flange looks like the one off the older crx's

[2ndGenGuy]

Man, I dunno. Either way the carb is going to work on those adapter plates. It's a little tricky to set up the carb linkage, but the question is will the adapter plate work on your intake manifold. I can go take a picture of my intake manifold, but I don't know how close it's going to be. The CRX manifolds have a REALLY unusual shape, so I don't know what to tell ya about that.

I think your best bet is to print off that list of carb adapters, and go to the wrecking yard and measure which intake manifolds on that list have the same adapter plate. I'm going to guess the old Non CVCC Civics.

[Holy^ghost]

i think this adapter plate will fit it looks almost exact to mine.
http://www.carburetion.com/weber/Dataresults3.asp?Kit_Nbr=K624&Model=ACCORD

ok ive looked at the adapter plates i have it down to 3 please tell me which one would be best for my flange
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/gaskets/99005.490.htm
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/gaskets/99005.333.htm
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/gaskets/99005.551.htm

take a look and tell me which one you think is best

I have some better pic of my mount flange and gasket maybe this will help you help me find an adapter plate for it.
http://im
[URL=http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1001457au7.jpg][IMG]http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/2499/1001457au7.th.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1001458qh5.jpg)

[Hazwan]

It looks different from my 1st gen. But then my engine is 1602cc EL1 non cvcc. I don't know how different is it with EK1. I'll see if I can find the pics later.

[Holy^ghost]

thanks could I just make one out of glue and cardboard my dad did it with his 1968 sport fury so that might work

[2ndGenGuy]

I don't have any better idea than you might on which one will fit. It's going to be trial and error from here on out unless you do some research. You may be the first person to fit a Weber on an A16. But you know, the Weber isn't easy to tune if you have never worked on carbs. You have to be very patient, change jets, test drive the car, etc. You could spend the whole day tweaking the car to make it run right. It's far from plug and play. The linkage can be tough to set up right, and theres a good chance that the Weber you buy won't even run in your car out of the box... The whole reason I went to Weber was because of the complete hell that the ES2 emissions control systems are. Your factory carbs are CAKE compared to the ES2...

[Hazwan]

Sorry for the crappy pics. This is the only pics that I have in my computer:

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v197/ullyeus/case/IMG001.jpg

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v197/ullyeus/case/IMG002.jpg

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v197/ullyeus/case/IMG003.jpg

They look a bit different than yours from what I can see

[2ndGenGuy]

Well the good news is that the A16 and the EL are going to be the closest of any different engines. They're both Non-CVCC, non US, Accord engines with the same displacement.

[Holy^ghost]

looks close enough ill see what i can do. i would get a stock carb the problem is i cant find another 1.6 in the junk yard and the dealer doesn't have them. im pretty sure i can get the car to start but i might have to fumble with jets so it doesn't idle all weird. does the weber come with different jets or do i have to buy other ones. and what year is that accord of yours.

man i need to figure out something if i dont find a carb in a junkyard somewhere the car is useless. unless there is some way for me to fit on a weber carb. what if i just get some un-made gasket material and make an adapter out of that. cause i'm screwed other wise.

ok well since i'm pretty much out of options besides an engine swap. could i swap the manifold from an es2 and put it into my A16. or is the block actually different. because I think the block is the same size its just that the bore and stroke are different.

[89T]

ok! as someone pointed out to you, you dont need to open a new thread every time you have a question. theres 11 or so you can ask this same question on.

[Ichiban]

Go to the parts store and order a manifold gasket for every a-series engine you can think of, including your own. Go to the store, compare them to the A16 gasket and any that match exactly indicates a manifold that you can swap. Now go to a different parts store because this one will hate you now.

[MessyHonda]

if not...get an a20 head on your motor...and use the a20 intake

[2ndGenGuy]

The ES2 probably won't work. Again due to the CVCC system. It has a seperate passage, I believe, due to the 3rd barrel in the carb.

Gasket material won't make an adapter plate. I guess I don't understand what the problem is with your car. I think you need to figure out whats wrong before you just go throwing new carbs at it. What if the carb isn't your problem?

[Holy^ghost]

ohh the carb is the problem see the cast for the accel pump fell off and theres a crack in the float bowl. SO I NEED A NEW CARB. now would the manifold from an es2 work. if not what about an A18 and is the A
18 close enough to the es2.

FUCK im fucked. ok what about an A18 and is there a weber for the A18 that i could put on. if not what about an engine swap to the A18. what parts do i need cause i don't have allot of money. could i do it for under 500. better yet wtf can i do for under 500?.

[ghettogeddy]

how about this eather buy a new car or deal with the motor u have now lol its just gona cost to much money to do a swap

[Ichiban]

how about this eathe rbuy a new car or deal with the motor u have now lol its just gona caost to much money to do a swap

Did you just type that with your face?

Seriously if you are tired with the A16, pick up any used A-series complete with carbs. Try and get a common engine, so you won't have this parts problem again, and maybe get a little more power out of it. As for the manifold/carb/webber bs you're on your own, but I'm sure the solution isn't that difficult.

[Holy^ghost]

ok im typing this with my old ass 2gee im about to kill. so anyway what is the most common engine i can swap into this with out having to do a major over haul. let me guess A20A1 or A18A1.. which has the most horse power i wan it to actually go somewhat faster and have over 100hp

[2ndGenGuy]

Dude if you can't figure out how to swap a carb, or fix the current one, what makes you think you'll be able to tackle an entire engine swap from a different car? You know that if you try a Weber swap, you'll be looking at at least $300.

First off the adapter plate will run you about $100.
A USED Weber will be about $100.
If you buy a used Weber for $100, a rebuild may be in order. Who knows how that will run.
A jet kit for the Weber will NOT be cheap.
Hours and hours of tuning...

Your only hope at this point is to rebuild the carb you have, IF that is your problem. I'd hate to find out why you think you need to swap to a Weber.

You're not trying to fix your problem, just trying to get around it. Your solutions are getting worse and worse. First it's carb swap, then manifold swap, then engine swap. Since none of those can be done in a day with $20, you might as well go all out and just get another car or something... I mean really dude. It doesn't sound like you wanna actually work on the car.

[seancornelis]

Hahah jesus christ...

How about just looking in a junkyard for a replacement carb? I'm sure you could find one in a yard near you if you looked, but since you probably won't I went on car-part.com and found this place for you, they've got one listed as "good condition" in stock for $35CDN

http://www.caughillauto.com/

Also just FYI, the A20A1 makes a whole 10hp more than you've got....so it's not like all that work is going to make some huge difference. From reading posts on here it seems like the 3g guys with that motor have carb problems fairly regularly too.

[Ichiban]

If you want the easiest 100 hp, swap in the twin carb ET2 from the 2nd gen prelude. You won't have to modify the fuel system, and it will bolt right up to your tranny with the original clutch and motor mounts. Be warned that the twin carbs are a tuning and maintenance nightmare, so given your current situation...well, there you go.

[Holy^ghost]

i would rebuild my carb IF THE FUCKING ACCEL PUMP DIDN'T FALL OFF and they had a rebuilt kit that actually fixed that for it. god you guys don't know how fucking hard it is to find parts for a carb thats company died. and its discontinued. so don't fucking diss me. the only way to fix this is to get a weber or modify one from another car. and or maybe a different manifold from another car. unless you know a way to re cast a fucking accelerator pump handle then be my guest. but until then the only way to get my fucking car to start is to find another carb that will work.

you know what fuck you guys your no help, wtf would you do huh . if there were no rebuild kits out there that fixed the accel pump and bowl because Honda is a cheap piece of shit company that uses no name brand carburetors. and the weber wasn't a direct fit and you had to tune it for 506834-4534 hours trying to get it to start not knowing if it will ever start. or having to find a manifold that will work with a fag ass engine that doesn't exist anywhere in the known world. wtf would you do.

[Ichiban]

Find another carb! How hard can it be!! I bought/stole 6 or 7 for my car and its an 82-83, with the EL 1602 engine that isn't rare, it's unheard of. And I was going to school and drunk all the time. I could go find a carb for your car tomorrow. It's not that hard.

Edit: I read through this thread, and all these people just tried to help you, and you gave them shit and abuse. What the hell was that all about?

[seancornelis]

If I was you I would just try to find a replacement carb in a junkyard. You probably know where a couple of these are in your town, if not you can look in the phone book or online...they're very common. Used carbs (especially for a 25 year old japanese car) are typically dirt cheap....in fact if you read two posts above this you'll see where I referred you to a junkyard I found online in about 5 minutes of searching that has a factory replacement in stock for your car. It's $35 + shipping which MIGHT be twenty bucks. If you check http://car-part.com there's a few others as well. You also might want to check craigslist for anyone parting an Accord with your motor out. Even though it's an uncommon motor, there's NO REASON you shouldn't be able to find more than a few of these with a weeks worth of searching. Just clean it up and slap it on your car and you're good.

If you want to put a Weber on your car then by all means DO IT!!! I don't understand exactly what magic answer you're looking for here, though. Everyone has helped you out and pointed you in the right direction but you have to personally take the steps to make it happen.

Can't find an adapter plate? You can have a machine shop modify one for you, or even MAKE one. It's just a piece of metal, there's nothing fancy to it. If you really want to go as far as swapping an entire intake manifold from an A20A1 (I don't see what the point in this is at all) that might be possible too. You can look at diagrams from shop manuals for a comparison, if you can't find the shop manuals go to a Honda dealership and see if the service department would be nice enough to let you check theirs out. Even BETTER THAN THAT (and probably easier) would be to take yours off, go get an A20A1 manifold from a junkyard and compare them side by side. It's entirely possible and very likely they will match up, but again I don't know why you would even do this when you can just have an adapter made.

It's just boggling my mind exactly what you want from any of us on here that you haven't already been provided with. Everyone was very helpful and took their time with you, but bitching about how crappy your car is and how you can't get it to run isn't going to fix it.

Lastly, you gotta remember there aren't really so many people out there with 1st and 2nd generation Accords, so NO ONE on here is gonna be down on you just for the hell of it. The more folks we can get on here and the more info we can all take from each other the better. If you were to carry on like this on pretty much any other automotive forum (hell even the 3g side of this site) you would have been told to go fuck yourself a long time ago...so just appreciate that you have a pretty devoted, albeit small, community here to help you out.

[2ndGenGuy]

you know what fuck you guys your no help, wtf would you do huh . if there were no rebuild kits out there that fixed the accel pump and bowl because Honda is a cheap piece of shit company that uses no name brand carburetors. and the weber wasn't a direct fit and you had to tune it for 506834-4534 hours trying to get it to start not knowing if it will ever start. or having to find a manifold that will work with a fag ass engine that doesn't exist anywhere in the known world. wtf would you do.


Well lets see. You summed up my engine. The Weber was far from a direct fit from my engine. I told you how to get a fucking adapter plate made so the Weber would bolt right on. Once you get the adapter plate, you're in the exact same boat as I am. I can't get parts for my shit either. The A16 isn't that rare, considering EVERY 2.5g up there came with them. Did you even try finding a parts store that deals Weber parts? Vancouver is a HUGE city, I'm sure there's at least one.

You're obviously not a dumbass, because you rebuilt a Honda carb, so I don't see what the problem is getting an adapter plate made. Can't be any more expensive than buying a pre-made one.

Or like guyhatesmycar said, get another carb and scavenge parts.

[Ichiban]

Lastly, you gotta remember there aren't really so many people out there with 1st and 2nd generation Accords, so NO ONE on here is gonna be down on you just for the hell of it. The more folks we can get on here and the more info we can all take from each other the better. If you were to carry on like this on pretty much any other automotive forum (hell even the 3g side of this site) you would have been told to go fuck yourself a long time ago...so just appreciate that you have a pretty devoted, albeit small, community here to help you out.

:werd:

Consider yourself lucky.

[A20A1]

If its the standard Keihen (spelling?) carb, theres a part of it called the accelerator pump which is operated by whats referred to, in the workshop manual, as a 'metal tang' This is adjusted by bending it (honestly!) so it operates the pump sooner and this can cure the initial hesitation you are experiencing when driving off. My 82 is suffering from the same problem & I'll perform this adjustment to cure it as I've done several times before.
The carbs can also get corrosion in the float chamber that blocks up the jets, means new carb is required. If it is okay in there the jets may just need cleaned out (or replaced) - potentially a job for a specialist.
In any event I'd always recommend stripping the carb just to check it before assuming its scrap & replacing it. Rebuild with new gaskets to be on the safe side.
"Keihin"
Also that Spring on the arm connected to the metal pusher should be replaced as well, mine was saggy so response to the pump was very slow even with the tab bent.



you know what fuck you guys your no help, wtf would you do huh . if there were no rebuild kits out there that fixed the accel pump and bowl because Honda is a cheap piece of shit company that uses no name brand carburetors...
Keihin is a name brand, just not an American one... but they do sell a lot of Motorcycle and WaterCraft Carburetors.


... and the weber wasn't a direct fit and you had to tune it for 506834-4534 hours trying to get it to start not knowing if it will ever start. or having to find a manifold that will work with a fag ass engine that doesn't exist anywhere in the known world. wtf would you do.
Depends where you buy the weber from... I got a weber on ebay for $70 and an adapet plate for $50. The jets needed changing but the carb still ran.
I would see if you can do a head swap or at the least an intake manifold swap from an A20 or ES or ET engine, whichever matches your ports, then you can grab their intake manifold and use the weber adapter plate for that manifold.