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omni89LX-i
04-30-2007, 07:41 PM
This guy boosted a 94 cavalier by replaceing the muffler with the turbo setup. aside from that the car is stock, injectors and all. im thinking about tryin it for my 89 LX-i cuz my muffler is litterly rusted half off.
http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/power-adder/238864-another-remote-mount-turbo.html
Has any1 ever tryd this?

2ndGenGuy
04-30-2007, 07:52 PM
Sounds like the Squire's Turbo Systems setup. There's lots of cars out there with this setup. It's proven reliable, so I don't see why it woudln't work. They sell a kit for about $2500 or so. I'd rather do this than a complicated setup with the turbo in the engine bay. You can ditch the intercooler, less heat in your engine bay, plus you can run long tube headers for more efficent flow back to the turbo.

ZackieDarko
04-30-2007, 10:21 PM
you need lots of displacement to do a remote mount setup

this has already been coverd some where on the board

cubert
05-01-2007, 03:05 AM
Id just do a real turbo setup.

'A20A3'
05-01-2007, 03:24 AM
Id just do a real turbo setup.

Word.:bong:

omni89LX-i
05-01-2007, 08:57 PM
i did a search of the site and found the thread that was already discussing this but around page 3 i got tired of reading and decide to just ask again.
my 3g is my daily driver, i love it, but a little more power (say 6lbs of boost) would b awsome!

i dont want to do a traditional setup because $$$ is something i dont have alot of. intercoolers, injectors, custom manifolds blah blah blah tend to add up!

cubert
05-02-2007, 02:42 AM
Im looking at it like this...


A turbo is a turbo, either way more air is going into the engine, so regardless its gonna need more fuel etc. With low boost like you wanna do im sure the car would run etc, but i wouldnt really wanna take the chance of the car leaning out and melting a hole in a piston, ya know?

omni89LX-i
05-02-2007, 04:34 AM
true
but if it does lean out and explode or something ill just do like Easy-E said and
"Throw it in tha gutta, then go buy anotha"
thank god for that salvage lincense!

mikes87lude
05-24-2007, 02:55 PM
I always wondered; How do they lubricate that setup? And what about the long piping you would need to run for the intake and pressure side of the turbo? dont hit a speed bump too fast.

2ndGenGuy
05-24-2007, 03:05 PM
I always wondered; How do they lubricate that setup? And what about the long piping you would need to run for the intake and pressure side of the turbo? dont hit a speed bump too fast.

Solution is easy: Longer oil lines. And why would the intake piping be any more at risk than your existing exhaust system? Make sure you don't have it hanging down, and you're good to go.

HondaBoy
05-24-2007, 03:19 PM
i had seen a guy here in town do that on a firebird. turned out pretty cool, but i think he killed the engine with a bad nitrous oxide setup. i think the remote turbo setup is a good one. keeps a lot less heat from transfering into the intake air and probably longer turbo life along with less internal engine damage from heat.

mikes87lude
05-25-2007, 05:24 AM
Solution is easy: Longer oil lines....

How would you run a return line to the oil pan when it is gravity fed, and the turbo sits lower than the pan.

LX-incredible
05-25-2007, 10:21 AM
How would you run a return line to the oil pan when it is gravity fed, and the turbo sits lower than the pan.
Oil pressure.

2ndGenGuy
05-25-2007, 11:32 AM
Oil pressure.

That's what I was going to say... a pump. People do rear turbos all the time, the STS systems aren't magic.

mikes87lude
05-25-2007, 02:31 PM
That's what I was going to say... a pump. People do rear turbos all the time, the STS systems aren't magic.

So you would use somthing like a dry sump pump for return?

2ndGenGuy
05-29-2007, 10:36 AM
So you would use somthing like a dry sump pump for return?

I don't know exactly, but I'm sure there's gotta be something out there. Or something can be modified to work. Maybe even purchase the oil pump from the STS guys, since they sell individual parts from their kits.

Here's one on a Cobalt, so you don't have to have big displacement for this to work:

http://i.b5z.net/i/u/1473169/i/universal/Cobalt_Turbo_View.JPG

The way I see it, if someone can design and sell a kit, you can build it yourself too.

Imagine how that fucker must sound! The turbo spool right at the back of the car, completely unmuffled! Would make some guys have second thoughts about racing for sure... :D

mikes87lude
05-29-2007, 05:56 PM
WOW!!!! That actually looks pretty cool, bet it runs pretty cool too.(temperature wise)

MessyHonda
05-29-2007, 06:05 PM
ewwww solid rear axle FTL

mikes87lude
05-29-2007, 06:30 PM
ewwww solid rear axle FTL

The solid axle is pretty s@$tty. Bet it's pretty quick though, as long as you keep it in a straight line.

MessyHonda
05-29-2007, 06:43 PM
The solid axle is pretty s@$tty. Bet it's pretty quick though, as long as you keep it in a straight line.



yup.....so that means my car could take that POS int the twisties...

mikes87lude
05-30-2007, 08:15 AM
A couple of informative links. These are Chevy setups, but they help to get the idea.
http://www.superchevy.com/technical/engines_drivetrain/induction_poweradders/0411sc_sts/photo_15.html
http://www.ststurbo.com/benefits

EricW
05-30-2007, 08:42 PM
Imagine how that fucker must sound! The turbo spool right at the back of the car, completely unmuffled! Would make some guys have second thoughts about racing for sure... :D

A buddy of mine had one on is Chevy pickup and it sounded like he had a whistle stuck in exhaust when he got on it.

AccordEpicenter
05-31-2007, 02:38 PM
yeah itll work but the way i see it, its alot of added fab work, you gotta run charge piping ALL THE WAY TO THE REAR OF THE CAR as well as OIL LINES and then you need a scavenging pump for the oil drain because it sits lower than the oil level in the oil pan and will backflow into the turbo itself... Plus, ALL the factory exhaust from the engine back is a restriction at that point. I would only use a setup like this if there was absolutely no room to fit a turbo kit in the engine bay itself, other than that, i wouldnt reccomend it.

mikes87lude
06-01-2007, 10:09 AM
Wht about cost comparison?
Under hooh needs custom made manifold $400 to $700, intercooler $200 to $400.
Remote setup needs longer piping, Longer oil feed and return lines, 12 volt oil pump for oil return. (a Moroso dry sump pump like they use on V8 drag motors would probably work)

2ndGenGuy
06-01-2007, 12:29 PM
Wht about cost comparison?
Under hooh needs custom made manifold $400 to $700, intercooler $200 to $400.
Remote setup needs longer piping, Longer oil feed and return lines, 12 volt oil pump for oil return. (a Moroso dry sump pump like they use on V8 drag motors would probably work)


This is what I'm thinking. You're already running piping all over your car, from the turbo to the intercooler, then back up to your intake manifold. I'd bet the piping would be just as long, maybe a bit longer for the rear mount setup, but cheaper I bet than buying an intercooler.

And about the oil draining into the turbo... How is that a bad thing? Do you like the turbo draining oil out when you shut the car off? Seems to me it would be better for the oil to be sitting in the turbo at all times ready to go. Oil would always be in the turbo, and the pump would push the oil from the pan into the turbo, and that same pressure would push it back. I don't see how it matters if your turbo is below or above your oil pan, pressure is needed to circulate it, since it's still a closed system.

Also, who is going to be running a stock exhaust with a turbo anyways? And I don't see the added fabwork when you're talking about running a long ass pipe in a straight line. Sure there will be the initial bends coming out of the turbo, then up to the intake, but from the rear to the front of the car is straight, and may be even less fabwork bending tubes and whatnot. Plus you're spending a lot less time squeezing tubing around inside your engine bay.

And how much LESS fabwork is it than trying to make some crazy turbo manifold and cram your turbo up in front of the engine. Plus, I can keep my longtube header and get better flow to the turbo than I would with a log manifold, and at a much cheaper cost than a custom ramhorn manifold too. Plus you get the ninja-factor. Nobody will see the turbo when the hood is open. :D

2ndGenGuy
06-01-2007, 01:06 PM
Also, from the STS patent on remote turbos:



Referring to FIG. 1A, a turbocharger system, generally indicated at 10, for use with a combustion engine (not shown), is comprised of a turbocharger 12 having an oil inlet 14 configured for being coupled to the pressure side 16 of the oil pump 75 of an oiling system 18; and an oil outlet 20. The turbocharger 12 also includes an exhaust inlet 22 and outlet 24 on the turbine 58 and an ambient air inlet 26 and a charge air outlet 28 on the compressor 59. An oil pump 30 in fluid communication with the oil outlet 20 is configured for being in fluid communication with the oiling system 18. A pressure driven check valve 32 is coupled to the oil inlet 14 of the turbocharger 12 and in fluid communication therewith. The check valve 32 is configured to prevent the flow of oil from the pressure side 16 of the oiling system 18 into the turbocharger when the pressure on the pressure side 16 of the oiling system 18 drops below a predetermined level. For example, a 5-psi check valve will close when the pressure on the pressure side 16 drops below 5-psi, indicating that the engine has been shut off. The outlet 36 of the check valve 32 is positioned above the oil inlet 14 of the turbocharger 12 and the inlet 38 of the oil pump 30 is positioned preferably but not necessarily below the oil outlet 20 of the turbocharger 12. This ensures that oil entering the turbocharger system 10 from the pressure side 16 of the oiling system 18 is allowed to freely flow into and out of the turbocharger 12 during turbocharger operation. This system also prevents gravity from draining any residual oil contained within the engine or oil pressure lines connected to the turbocharger 12 when the system is off. This prevents the possibility of a "dry" start-up condition.

Pretty interesting. Looks like they just use a check-valve to prevent drain back from the oil system. I wonder if using a secondary oil pump, and tapping the oil pan would be another way to keep oil flowing through the turbo. Then the oiling system from the turbo is separate from the oil pressure system in the car...

mikes87lude
06-01-2007, 02:21 PM
And about the oil draining into the turbo... How is that a bad thing?........and the pump would push the oil from the pan into the turbo, and that same pressure would push it back....

Once the oil reaches the bearings/bushings there isn't a lot of pressure coming out, thus the need to pump the oil back to the motor. Most turbos gravity feed the oil back to the pan. I was thinking , maby set up a totally seperate oiling system for the turbo. A container with an electric pump and cooler that is seperate from the engines nasty oil. Thoughts????

AccordEpicenter
06-01-2007, 10:00 PM
i bet unless its at least schedule 10 stainless youll probably crack/melt/warp to shit any NA header you can find due to the added stresses of the high heat under pressure that a turbo operates at. Plus, oil puddling up inside the turbo makes them burn horriffic amounts of oil. And what makes you think you dont have to use an intercooler for a rear mount setup? I bet your charge air temps will still be 190-220 *F, compressing air creates alot of heat nomatter how you compress it.

2ndGenGuy
06-02-2007, 12:37 AM
Just read this page here:

http://www.ststurbo.com/benefits

I read through thier patents, and there's nothing special about their setup. Anybody could build something like this... Thier turbo systems regularly push Corvettes to 900HP, and they've built the worlds fastest Silverado using it. They use whatever headers they put on thier cars and don't seem to have any problems. There are no custom headers for this turbo application.

Remember the turbo is in the back of the vehicle, away from engine heat, and being exposed to cool ambient air rushing under the car. It makes perfect sense for there to not be so much heat. I don't even understand where the skeptisism comes from. It's been done, it's proven and it works.

yaboygotit
02-01-2008, 09:41 AM
well after taxes i think that will be my next move because the track opens in march so i gotta get ready

Accordtheory
02-05-2008, 10:13 PM
I don't even understand where the skeptisism comes from. It's been done, it's proven and it works.

Yeah, but it gets its ass handed to it when compared to a real setup.

Accordtheory
02-05-2008, 10:15 PM
I would only use a setup like this if there was absolutely no room to fit a turbo kit in the engine bay itself, other than that, i wouldnt reccomend it.

X2...

labeledsk8r
02-05-2008, 10:37 PM
im not even going to read threw all this lol... i have seen it done on a new GTO and just like any setup it has its pros and cons... pros it takes no engine bay space and does not need a IC due to the charge pipe has time to cool , the downfalls are its even lagyer with worse responce and power numbers cant get as high as a manifold type... it doesnt loose alot of power but loss is there.....

i dunno i think it would be nic to see a setup like this on an accord... just for fun... even runnig at 5 psi it would make it more "funnable" and it would be something difrent



**edit**:::: and omg may i say that the cobalt in the uper pic has a uter trash rear axel... looks like a toy car

A20A1
02-07-2008, 07:08 PM
I just picked up a book
Motorbooks Workshop
Turbocharging Performance Handbook
Jeff Hartman

It'll be a while though I want to read it all the way through and then bookmark the relevant data and post anything useful I might find for anyone wanting the remote turbo setup.

page 81 mentions rear mount, nothing indepth though :(

bobafett
02-07-2008, 07:23 PM
remote turbo setups, when 7 ft of charge pipes just isn't enough...

A20A1
02-07-2008, 07:28 PM
hehehe :)