How Racers Convert From P/S to Man/S

[bushbean]

The following discussion talks about how racing folks convert
power steering on Acura Integra's to manual steering:

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=184202

I'd be very interested to know if similar conversion can be
done sucessfully on our beloved 3geez.

[A18A]

i know another way you can convert to manual steering, just pull the p/s belt off :D

[bushbean]

i know another way you can convert to manual steering, just pull the p/s belt off :D

That's not enough, according to the discussion. You also need to let the system breath.

[Blizzard]

Yes, it can. We got rid of all the power steering crap.

[lx-i coupe]

i know another way you can convert to manual steering, just pull the p/s belt off :D

that's all i did:omg: i need to put my a/c belt on though, it's been fraking hot and humid as hell the past couple days. i haven't decided about the p/s yet

[teck]

hmm my 95 civic dx has no p/s....

[Vanilla Sky]

Unless you're racing the car, keep the power steering. It's speed sensitive, and only creates a minor parasitic loss when up to speed.

If you're willing to lose power steering, That looks like a better alternative to the Flying Miata way of depowering.

[teck]

hey man my ride came stock no p/s

[bobafett]

oh god i am so glad i got rid of the PS and lame heavy brackets that go along with it!

[86AccordLxi]

Ur c4r is s000 much f4st3r n0w!!! Zomg!!

Hahaha.

For a daily driven car, you should just keep ps imo.

Alex

[russiankid]

Ur c4r is s000 much f4st3r n0w!!! Zomg!!

Hahaha.

For a daily driven car, you you just keep ps imo.

Alex
Agreed.

[bushbean]

Unless you're racing the car, keep the power steering. It's speed sensitive, and only creates a minor parasitic loss when up to speed.
If you're willing to lose power steering, That looks like a better alternative to the Flying Miata way of depowering.

I agree P/S is better for the average Joe driver. However, my rack is leaking, and I hate having a puddle of grease on my drive way all the time.

Here is the link to the Flying Miata way:

http://flyinmiata.com/tech/depower.php?x=2

I think I'll try the F-miata way on a rack from the junkyard as practice.

[Blkblurr]

If your rack is leaking it will still leak after you do this conversion because it will still have enough oil in it to keep it lubed. If it's leaking from the shaft seals it will continue. If it's leaking from the hose or tubes going into the rack just fix them. A breather is fine but not needed. All you need to do is remove most of the oil in the rack by moving the wheel back and forth and then connect the two steel tubes together with some fuel line hose and clamps. The rack itself becomes the reservoir. also jumper the input lines to the rack in the same way.

[TWOLOUDNPROUD]

I would give up my left nut before i give up my power steering.:Owned:

[bobafett]

For a daily driven car, you should just keep ps imo.

Alex

also agreed

[Secondaries]

I would give up my left nut before i give up my power steering.:Owned:

You're obviously a woman. :Owned:

[coope]

i don't have ps and it's pretty good but took some gettin use to at first but it's only bad when ur trying to park and back up its like turning a semi or something but i don't want i back was to much hassle

[cygnus x-1]

On my Prelude I removed the guts from the valve body and plugged all the ports. Then I disassembled the rack and greased the gear and shafts. Road feel is infinitely better now and it's not that hard to deal with when parking. I like it.

C|

[TWOLOUDNPROUD]

You're obviously a woman. :Owned:
I think not there Newbie . taking out your P/S just to gain 3 to 5 hp to me is just Stupid. Here something to think about when you are going staight on the road the p/s dont even take a 1/2hp from your motor only when you go in to a turn then it takes the 3 to 5 hp from your motor.Most of us race a staight road no turns so there no real benefit to remove the p/s to me. So if you want to take out a prfectly good p/s be my guest.

[Blizzard]

On a race only car most of the benefit is weight reduction. On a daily driver, comfort aside, its not worth the trouble imo.

[Civic Accord Honda]

my pump died so i riped out the pump and brakets and cut the lines also took out everything to do with A/C
helped a lil but the main thing was it got rid of the smokeing PS pump

[Civic Accord Honda]

oh and do i need a man rack or is mine just asking?

[bushbean]

Civic Accord Honda88LXi,
Man racks are almost impossible to find, unless you're lucky enough to be Canadian or live near the border.

cygnus x-1,
The Flying-miata webpage makes the process of disassembling the rack to be so easy. They didn't even need any special tools. Was it so easy on your 'Lude?

TWOLOUDNPROUD and other anti-Man/S-tite,
I also prefer P/S, but not one that is half working, leaks, and dirty my driveway. The main motivation for me is cost of fixing the half working P/S system on my car. Replacing the rack and the pump would cost hundreds of dollars. Doing the Flying Miata conversion costs me zero dollars. A lot of us are driving 3Geez because we are poor and can't afford dropping a couple benjamins willy nilly. Man/S conversion is a good alternative for poor people.

Then, there is the issue of heavy steering. Personally, I am used to heavy steering because I learned to drive on a car with Man steering. I think Man steering is a lot like stick shift; if you learned with it, it's easy. Most of my friend were unfortunately enough to have been taught auto-tranny only when they were in drivers-ed. They've not been programmed to use the left foot and the right hand to shift, so they think it's too difficult to learn stick shift now. I learned on stick shift, so I think it's so easy. I don't even think about shifting; I've programmed it into my DNA. I think when a person learned to drive with man steering, the person knows the technique of not turning the steering wheel until the car moves forward/backward. People without much experience with man steering simply have trouble with this technique because they have not programmed it into their DNA.

However, I would submit that if I was living in NYC, I would probably get my P/S fix instead.

[coope]

x2

[A20A1]

This isn't converting to manual, it's just PS removal
We already have members who did the removal by looping the lines on the rack and removing the pump, cooling pipe, and belt.

I didn't add in a breather, and actually topped off the fluid before closing up the loop. I didn't have any problems with it.

I didn't do it to gain HP

Just to lose some weight and free up some room in the engine bay :)

[Legend_master]

This isn't converting to manual, it's just PS removal
We already have members who did the removal by looping the lines on the rack and removing the pump, cooling pipe, and belt.
I didn't add in a breather, and actually topped off the fluid before closing up the loop. I didn't have any problems with it.
I didn't do it to gain HP
Just to lose some weight and free up some room in the engine bay :)


Yep that is exactly what I did when I did my swap.

[AccordEpicenter]

not sure if im gonna fix my ps yet, but i most likely will

[bobafett]

We already have members who did the removal by looping the lines on the rack and removing the pump, cooling pipe, and belt.


Yep this is the method that I used. Just looped the lines and that was that. Feels good, no complaints. If you know what to expect with MS its not that bad. :D

[AccordEpicenter]

yo boba, was the steering much better after you looped the lines etc? My pump is taken out and the lines are looped right at the pump... Its pretty heavy right now...

[cygnus x-1]

I don't remember any serious difficulty with the power-steering-ectomy, but it was unbelievably messy. Every time I thought I had the rack completely drained I would move it and fluid would shoot accross the garage. It was disgusting.

One thing I want to mention. I disassembled and greased the rack because I was worried that having fluid in it would make it feel heavy, since you have to push that fluid back and forth. I don't know if it really matters but I'm glad I did it. I also never have to worry about leaks and the engine bay is much less cluttered. I like simple. Simple is good.

C|

[bobafett]

yo boba, was the steering much better after you looped the lines etc? My pump is taken out and the lines are looped right at the pump... Its pretty heavy right now...

I never drove the car in the in-between phases. It either had normally functioning PS or totally removed and looped. But I would still consider it 'pretty heavy' for sure. Its definitely harder than my dads manual steering civic, and the manual steering truck that I drive around. Next time I am feeling motivated I might actually take the rack apart, drain it and relubricate it, like cygnus did. It just seems like the 'best' way... our method is pretty easy and doesnt require that much work lol...

[AccordEpicenter]

adding a breather will help prolly

[Secondaries]

I think not there Newbie . taking out your P/S just to gain 3 to 5 hp to me is just Stupid. Here something to think about when you are going staight on the road the p/s dont even take a 1/2hp from your motor only when you go in to a turn then it takes the 3 to 5 hp from your motor.Most of us race a staight road no turns so there no real benefit to remove the p/s to me. So if you want to take out a prfectly good p/s be my guest.


Red88Si
Preludepower Member

Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Houston TX
Posts: 1,582

Tell it to them. Power steering removal is done for more than just gaining horsepower. Without all that fluid moving around to get in the way you get a much better feel of the road. Plus, with a P/S rack converted to non-P/S, you usually have a shorter ratio than with a manual steering rack. Power steering doesn't do much of anything over 10mph anyway, so even if it isn't sapping power it's added weight that doesn't need to be there. And don't say the weight won't make a difference. People don't go through all the trouble to relocated their batteries to the trunk for nothing. Newbie.

['A20A3']

:Owned:

[MessyHonda]

i got to try out racetek82 b16 swap hatch.....and he does not have PS. im not sure but that engine is light because i could turn the wheel with almost one hand standing still....i tired it on my car and it was harder....maybe cuz i was pushing the fluid back or something.

[Legend_master]

i got to try out racetek82 b16 swap hatch.....and he does not have PS. im not sure but that engine is light because i could turn the wheel with almost one hand standing still....i tired it on my car and it was harder....maybe cuz i was pushing the fluid back or something.


The suspension has alot to do with it aswell. Also if the ground is wet or not.

[MessyHonda]

The suspension has alot to do with it aswell. Also if the ground is wet or not.



well it was not wet...i did notice he still runs his stock 13 inch rims tho...i have fat fives with falken tires.

[mike10562004]

.

[2ndGenGuy]

Sorry to bump an old thread, but what did you guys do with the speed sensor on the transmission? Did you just cap the power steering lines that go into it? Does the PS fluid lubricate anything in there? It won't overheat and blowup without PS fluid in it will it?

[AccordB20A]

when we did it to the prelude racecar we pulled the guts out of it so there was noything to wear in there. Working good so far at 200 km/h haha

[AccordEpicenter]

i was just gonna loop the lines to the ps sensor but maybe thats a better idea. I actually took the valvebody off of the rack and dumped all the valving out, then drilled a hole into the aluminum valvebody end and threaded a brass barbed fitting into it. Plus, i filled all the holes in the valvebody in with JB weld. Extreme but it should do the trick. If this is gonna be shitty then i have a good ps rack i can install in the car but i want to be rid of ps