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dmitch31
05-31-2007, 05:56 PM
87 LXI

Some of you may have been following my saga in some of the other threads, and here's (hopefully) the last chapter.

My car stopped running right after I began to proceed through an intersection. I had it towed home. I thought perhaps the timing belt had slipped, so I replaced the timing belt.

Turns out the timing belt was a wild goose chase because my old timing belt was fine (no harm getting a new one though). After that, I realized that my distributor was the problem. One of the spring keepers had busted loose inside and the inside of the distributor trashed itself. Fine, so I go get a rebuilt one and put it on.

Problem is I can't get the car to start, and here's what I've verified this evening.

1. I've verified for the 6th time that the timing belt is on right. I get the flywheel exactly square on the TDC mark, and then I took the valve cover off, and both of the marks on the camshaft gear were PERFECTLY lined up with the top of the head.

2. Then I took the cap off of the distributor to confirm that the rotor was pointing to the wire leading to cylinder 1. Sure enough, it was, so that's all good.

3. Using a timing light, I verified that I am indeed getting spark to each plug.

4. I took all of the plugs out and made sure they were extra clean and put them back in.

5. When I took the plugs out, I could smell fuel.

6. When I turn the key, I can hear the fuel pump.

The thing is, when I crank the starter, it's not JUST cranking. You can hear that the engine is really trying to kick over. It's like it's just almost there, but not quite.

Here's where my inexperience gets the best of me, because at this point, I don't know what else to check. I've made sure that everything that I disconnected is hooked back up. Can I get any advice from anyone who has been in this situation before? What can I try to do to get this baby to go ahead and kick over and run?

Thanks.

P.S. More info. The distributor cap and rotor are brand new. When I changed the cap, I moved one wire over at a time so as to make sure that they were put on right. Also, before taking out the plugs, I labeled the end of each spark plug wire 1, 2, 3, and 4, so those aren't mixed up. Tomorrow morning, I'll double check on the distributor cap end to make sure I didn't get anything mixed up there.

Also, the spark plug wires are about a year old and are in great shape. I've made sure that the wires are attached firmly both at the plugs and the distributor cap.

Additionally, I tested the coil per the manual, and it checks out perfectly.

And yes, there is gas in the car.

A18A
05-31-2007, 06:26 PM
have you done a compression test?

cygnus x-1
05-31-2007, 06:45 PM
What happens if you push down the accelerator pedal some while it's cranking?

C|

88Accord-DX
05-31-2007, 09:00 PM
Make sure your at the compression stroke of TDC#1 cylinder. To be sure, remove the valve cover & make sure both the intake & exhaust rocker arms aren't on the cam lobes. Also, compression test each cylinder. Could be loosing compression from valve not sealing, etc. It'll also rule out some other things such as rings, valve adjustment problem. Personally, I like to use a leak down tester to look at valve seating problems.

Oldblueaccord
05-31-2007, 09:40 PM
WIth the compression test, I'd put new plugs in it to start. Try some ether as well. It should fire on ether otherwise the spark is not correct

I could not remember you original problem but search for the same thing. I think if the intake temp. sensor goes bad the car will go way rich and either not run or just totaly flood out with fuel.


wp

LX-incredible
06-01-2007, 01:21 PM
If you have the tec this is what it should look like at TDC:
[URL=http://imageshack.us]http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/6625/puplposyd2.jpg[/URL
You should have movement in both directions. On some remanufactured cardone dizzys there isn't enough travel to get to 15 degrees BTDC. You may have to remove the E-clip and turn the vacuum advance rod to gain more travel. It also helps to have someone else cranking the car while you slowly rotate the distributor.

dmitch31
06-01-2007, 04:41 PM
On some remanufactured cardone dizzys there isn't enough travel to get to 15 degrees BTDC. You may have to remove the E-clip and turn the vacuum advance rod to gain more travel.

Well, I do have a cardone remanufactured distributor, but I don't know about the whole 15 degrees BTDC thing. Could someone educate me? And if I turn the vacuum advance rod, would I be trying to lengthen it a bit or shorten it a bit?

Thanks.

88accordSF
06-01-2007, 04:50 PM
the ignitor could've failed....

LX-incredible
06-01-2007, 09:50 PM
Well, I do have a cardone remanufactured distributor, but I don't know about the whole 15 degrees BTDC thing. Could someone educate me? And if I turn the vacuum advance rod, would I be trying to lengthen it a bit or shorten it a bit?
Thanks.
Is your dizzy a Tec or a Hitachi? Base timing on these cars is 15 degrees BTDC. After it's started you will need to set it at that. Instructions on checking timing can be found on the hood sticker or in a manual. For the vacuum advance rod, if you are advancing the distributor and hit say 11 BTDC and can't go any further, you will need to make the advance plate rotate in the same direction as you were trying to turn the distributor. Turning the advance rod inward will make the plate turn CCW for advance, outward (CW) to retard. If your distributor is a Tec, when you remove the cap it should look like the picture I posted. With the engine at TDC #1 and the dizzy turned all the way clockwise, the teeth on the reluctor should be lined up with the pickup plate.

LX-incredible
06-01-2007, 09:53 PM
the ignitor could've failed....
Only if he wasn't getting spark.

dmitch31
06-07-2007, 10:44 AM
Is your dizzy a Tec or a Hitachi? Base timing on these cars is 15 degrees BTDC. After it's started you will need to set it at that. Instructions on checking timing can be found on the hood sticker or in a manual. For the vacuum advance rod, if you are advancing the distributor and hit say 11 BTDC and can't go any further, you will need to make the advance plate rotate in the same direction as you were trying to turn the distributor. Turning the advance rod inward will make the plate turn CCW for advance, outward (CW) to retard. If your distributor is a Tec, when you remove the cap it should look like the picture I posted. With the engine at TDC #1 and the dizzy turned all the way clockwise, the teeth on the reluctor should be lined up with the pickup plate.

It's a Tec. Would this be something that would prevent the car from starting?

LX-incredible
06-07-2007, 12:14 PM
Yes.

2oodoor
06-07-2007, 03:08 PM
BTW which mark on the flywheel did you use as TDC? There are like five diff marks, the correct one is stamped and hard to see , it is like -T-

dmitch31
06-08-2007, 05:56 PM
With the engine at TDC #1 and the dizzy turned all the way clockwise, the teeth on the reluctor should be lined up with the pickup plate.

Thank you. I will check that tomorrow!

dmitch31
06-10-2007, 05:52 PM
With the engine at TDC #1 and the dizzy turned all the way clockwise, the teeth on the reluctor should be lined up with the pickup plate.

Well, I was hoping that we were onto something here, but when I checked the distributor with TDC #1 and distributor turned all the way clockwise, the teeth on the reluctor were perfectly lined up with the pickup plate. It's getting towed to the shop tomorrow.

88Accord-DX
06-10-2007, 06:51 PM
I haven't heard any good news on here about Cardone re-manfactured distributors. Wonder if the MAP sensor or ECU is a problem here? Let us know how it turns out, kind of curious myself.

LX-incredible
06-11-2007, 08:14 PM
Well, I was hoping that we were onto something here, but when I checked the distributor with TDC #1 and distributor turned all the way clockwise, the teeth on the reluctor were perfectly lined up with the pickup plate. It's getting towed to the shop tomorrow.
Another member had problems with the one of the inner sensors being bad and not pusing the injectors. It was also a cardone reman.

dmitch31
06-12-2007, 02:08 PM
Another member had problems with the one of the inner sensors being bad and not pusing the injectors. It was also a cardone reman.

OH MY GOD!!! Now I know why your signature line says "Cardone Sucks". I just got off the phone with the shop, and the Cardone distributor that I put on there was defective! They had to get a different distributor! They said the vacuum advance was broken and that the way it was assembled internally was "out of time".

I got this Cardone from O'Reilly's. There was another brand of distributor that I could have gotten from AutoZone, but it was about $100 more. If I would've had any idea!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If I would've gotten the more expensive non-Cardone distributor, I would've been on my way a LOOONG time ago! Now who knows how much I'm going to have to pay the shop for all of their time trying to figure out what the heck was wrong! Can you tell I'm just a bit pissed!!! :rant:

This Cardone piece of shit is going to wind up costing me a whole lot more money, not to mention time and frustration and additional funds for an additional tow to the shop!

After this, I will NEVER buy anything with the name CARDONE on it ever again!!!!!!!!

Thank you to all of you for your attempts to help.

LX-incredible
06-16-2007, 10:43 AM
After this, I will NEVER buy anything with the name CARDONE on it ever again!!!!!!!!
Amen brother.