help... car not starting.

[newaccorddriver]

im not sure whats going on, but for some reason my car doesnt want to start. its a freshly rebuilt motor, so i dont know whats wrong.

its oil system has been primed. and im getting fuel pressure. its throwing out code 6 for the ECT which is plugged in, but probably worn out. other then that, im basically alone, and i cant get the car started, so i cant check for spark on my own.

[newaccorddriver]

well, i havent checked for spark yet, but im going out right now to get a push button starter for my car so i can crank it from the outside.

also, ive noticed that when i run my fingers through the exhaust runners, i dont smell fuel. does anyone know what might cause my injectors to not fire? i mean, they were working perfectly fine before when i had my accord running.

[Whiter]

im gonna save u whatever it costs to buy a push button.. all you need to do to get the starter to run, if it actually works that is, is take a wire like 18 gauge or something insignificant and short the positive terminal of the battery with the terminal at the starter that the thin wire is plugged onto.. i had to start my car like this for a week due to my ignition not turning over my engine because of a ground in the black+white wire circuit

[newaccorddriver]

i just bought it, and paid like $5 for it. kinda worth it cause my hands arent in there all the time


as far as my car starting goes, im getting fuel pressure and spark, but still no fuel for some reason. can anyone give me some insight as to works wrong?

[2oodoor]

you coulda saved the five duckies... all you need to do is take the small wire out of the plug on the starer... put in a piece of scrap wire long enough to reach the battery. Turn the ign key to on/run (not start) and just touch the scrap wire to the positve post of the battery to enguage the starter.
can you get it to run by spraying some carb cleaner or something volitile into the throttle body? if it trys to crank then, you are not getting fuel to the rail or the injectors are not being driven by ECU. My guess anyway.

[newaccorddriver]

ill try the carb cleaner thing probably tomorrow.

im not sure what is wrong, but im guessing that its possibly the sensors in the distributor that are bad. TDC/CYL sensor are in there, and if one of those are bad, its quite possible that it wont work. my fuel rail is getting fuel pressure though. at first i thought it got pinched somewhere, and now that i got a new fuel line from an integra, i had modified it to for the accord by adding length from my last fuel line. its getting much less pressure now though(40psi instead of 60psi) which made me think that it got kinked somewhere in the line.

[A18A]

i know this would prolly sound silly, but is the firing order right? (1-3-4-2) i remember when i first put my engine in, spent all day trynna get it going, and it had spark and fuel, but wouldnt run, i had the leads around all wrong

[labeledsk8r]

well as you posted in your other thread about it mayby being the dizzy could be it... the dizzy isnt sending signal to the injectors.... i dont know anything about intake many swaps.... mayby a FPR would be good for that setup??.. i dont think a 20 psi drop would make the car not start though i just think it wouldnt run very well... and be kinda slugish...

P.S. you get your box?

[newaccorddriver]

well as you posted in your other thread about it mayby being the dizzy could be it... the dizzy isnt sending signal to the injectors.... i dont know anything about intake many swaps.... mayby a FPR would be good for that setup??.. i dont think a 20 psi drop would make the car not start though i just think it wouldnt run very well... and be kinda slugish...

P.S. you get your box?

ya, good stuff man, didnt expect it that fast.

[newaccorddriver]

i know this would prolly sound silly, but is the firing order right? (1-3-4-2) i remember when i first put my engine in, spent all day trynna get it going, and it had spark and fuel, but wouldnt run, i had the leads around all wrong

i am quite sure i put them in properly as the distributor cap has numbers on it as well

[newaccorddriver]

just tested the distributor according to the haynes manual, and the resistance between both the sensors checked out fine. anyone else have any ideas?

[newaccorddriver]

just tested the resistor box out and it tests good.

seems like im ruling out everything one at a time here and everything seems to be working well within specs, yet im still not getting fuel in the cylinders.

[russiankid]

Are you getting fuel to the fuel rail at all? If so are the injectors working properly?

[newaccorddriver]

Are you getting fuel to the fuel rail at all? If so are the injectors working properly?

im getting fuel to the rails and in the lines and everything. the injectors are not firing for some reason. the distributor sensors are within specs, along with the resistor box.

[Oldblueaccord]

Main Relay working correctly? Its in the fuel and spark loop.


wp

[newaccorddriver]

Main Relay working correctly? Its in the fuel and spark loop.


wp

where is it and how do i check it out? its getting spark and fuel pressure, but nothing is coming out of the injectors. and the injector fuse isnt blown or anything.

[newaccorddriver]

just changed the ECU out, and still not starting. anyone have any idea what is wrong here? its not getting any fuel for some reason. and for some reason, i keep getting a code 6 even after i changed out the sensor to 2 other ones i had lying around that were working before i took the motor out of service.

[steveko]

Mabey it's a bad ground too the injector circuit.

[newaccorddriver]

Mabey it's a bad ground too the injector circuit.

i thought it was at first, but apparently its not since i grounded it to the valve cover ground, and from there i made a new ground and hooked it up to the chassis. i used a multimeter and i was getting power from the injector fuse in the engine bay.

whats weird is its constantly throwing out a code 6, and when i decided to unplug the MAP sensor, its still throwing out a code 6. so apparently it doesnt want to throw out multiple codes at once?

[steveko]

So, the code 6 is the map sensor or ?

[newaccorddriver]

So, the code 6 is the map sensor or ?

code 6 is the coolant temperature sensor, which i tried 2 others, and it still gave out that code

[forrest89sei]

code 6 is the coolant temperature sensor, which i tried 2 others, and it still gave out that code

Maybe theres a break in the wire somewhere?

Still don't know how it would cause the car not to start

[honda on dirt]

couple quick checks....make sure you have ground at pins #9 and 10 in the 17 pin white connector for the ECM....those are injector grounds...also see if you have reference voltage at the map, baro,intake air temp,and throttle position sensor....they are all on the same circuit coming from the ecm should be about 5 volts....those are pin #34 on the 16 pin black connector at the ecm

[newaccorddriver]

couple quick checks....make sure you have ground at pins #9 and 10 in the 17 pin white connector for the ECM....those are injector grounds...also see if you have reference voltage at the map, baro,intake air temp,and throttle position sensor....they are all on the same circuit coming from the ecm should be about 5 volts....those are pin #34 on the 16 pin black connector at the ecm

first off, why would there only be 3 grounds if theres 4 injectors, and isnt there supposed to be a ground for the injectors on the harness? i mean, doesnt the ECU trigger the injectors with a 12V input?

how would i be able to check for a reference voltage at the said sensors?

[honda on dirt]

on a 3 wire sensor one is a ground,green/white one is reference voltage yellow/white and third is return to ecm.which varies..red/yellow TPS, check with a voltmeter and the ecm pulses the ground for the injectors the 12 volt is continuous which is on pins 1-4 of the 17 pin white connecto at the ecm...or use a noid light to see if you are getting injector pulse

[newaccorddriver]

currently i am not getting an injector pulse otherwise the engine would be starting. anyways, before i start to move onto more drastic solutions, is it wise to wire up the injector grounds to the ECU directly?

[honda on dirt]

just read down furthe in your post about checking the dizzy and all the resistance values were fine....do you have your powers where they need to be....if there is no power going to the the cylinder sensor then there will be no injector pulse because the ecm doent know the engine is spinning....make sure ya got power where power needs to be...as for running a ground directly off the ecm i wouldnt suggest it....with ya throwing a constant code 6 id say somewhere somehow a power wire got broken or forgot to gt hooked up....just make sure ya got power where ya need it... that also goes for the grounds too

[newaccorddriver]

just read down furthe in your post about checking the dizzy and all the resistance values were fine....do you have your powers where they need to be....if there is no power going to the the cylinder sensor then there will be no injector pulse because the ecm doent know the engine is spinning....make sure ya got power where power needs to be...as for running a ground directly off the ecm i wouldnt suggest it....with ya throwing a constant code 6 id say somewhere somehow a power wire got broken or forgot to gt hooked up....just make sure ya got power where ya need it... that also goes for the grounds too


im not sure how i would check for power at the distributor, but its plugged in as far as i know and i believe that it generates its own pulse as well as i tried to use this for megasquirt. and for the code throwing problem, it seems to be a constant code 6 despite me unplugging alot of other sensors as well.

everything is grounded well as far as i know, and to be sure, i connected extra grounds from those grounds to the chassis

[2oodoor]

unplugging a bunch of sensors on this type ECM will not help in diagnosis, it will not let you pass the inital code untill it is addressed.
Can you get access to some noid lights?
NONE of the injectors are pulsing? , if not that rules out a whole lot of other things involving the dizzy.
I have a feeling even if you switch to MS you may still have an issue here. Did the car try to run by spraying carb cleaner in the air plenum?

[newaccorddriver]

unplugging a bunch of sensors on this type ECM will not help in diagnosis, it will not let you pass the inital code untill it is addressed.
Can you get access to some noid lights?
NONE of the injectors are pulsing? , if not that rules out a whole lot of other things involving the dizzy.
I have a feeling even if you switch to MS you may still have an issue here. Did the car try to run by spraying carb cleaner in the air plenum?


ive tried addressing the code 6 by hooking up a working sensor in and it still didnt fix the problem.

are noid lights the lights that you plug into the injector socket? if so, ive already tried those and dont get anything.

i totally forgot about trying to spray carb cleaner in the intake when i tried starting it this weekend.

if i were to switch to MS, i would be eliminating the stock ECU and many of its vacuum lines. on top of that, i would be wiring up everything directly, so there shouldnt be a reason as to why im having no injector pulse. all MS really does is control the injectors, and if it cant do that, then theres probably a hardware problem. and unless all 4 of my injectors are toast(which were working fine when i took them out), then it should fire up

[2oodoor]

well the good noids are inductive I believe, otherwise you could just use a test light. Testlight won't tell you if you are getting the controlled dwell pulses from ECM, or if they are all grounded. In fact you could fry the ECM by giving it direct grounds and 12v backfeed, it has it's own reference voltage.

About the MS, that is what I am saying, if you have a wiring problem on the injector harness, or some wire pulled out of a bulkhead connector, it still won't work right unless your MS comes with all the wire harness for injectors, map sensor, everything on top of the engine.

See if it makes a noise by spraying something, won't take but a minute. That will eliminate some steps.

back step for a second, if you can get the right wire from the coolant sensor (code 6?) back to the ECM you may should try to use a hi ohm meter to check continuity between the input and the reciever (ECM) that would tell you if you have an open circuit there, changing the sensors would be useless be that the case.

[newaccorddriver]

when im changing to MS, i ditch the entire stock harness in the favor of directly hooking up the new wires to the injectors and sensors. in the event there was ever a break in the harness somewhere which is quite possible cause i havent ruled that out yet, i wont have to worry about it since there will be a new harness.

MS is pretty flexible, the only thing i really have to do is just add a few sensors and ditch every old sensor i have. effectively, im starting new again and eliminating all the old sensors which might have problems.

[2oodoor]

ok, I see what you mean then, if you wanted to use it anyway I would say nothing to it but to do it :cheers: senseless to leave the MS system in the box anyway.
You should try the spray thing so you can at least feel good the motor does run. Its primed, and if it is timed.... it should go

[Demon1024]

Don't take this wrong but you did replace the right side sensor on the thermo houseing right? i know they usually spit more gas when failed but i dunno just throwin it out there...

[newaccorddriver]

Don't take this wrong but you did replace the right side sensor on the thermo houseing right? i know they usually spit more gas when failed but i dunno just throwin it out there...


ive replaced both those sensors, and neither seem to be working. id LOVE to see my car spit out more gas, but for now, im trying to get it to spit

[newaccorddriver]

ok, I see what you mean then, if you wanted to use it anyway I would say nothing to it but to do it :cheers: senseless to leave the MS system in the box anyway.
You should try the spray thing so you can at least feel good the motor does run. Its primed, and if it is timed.... it should go

ya, after having MS sit on my table for over a year, i think its finally time i use it. fairly neat little package too. ill try the spray thing this weekend if i have time to make sure it runs somewhat.

[cygnus x-1]

You could even just dribble a little gas into the throttle body and see if it tries to fire. If you have a propane torch you can also use that.

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