no break presure... need input

[labeledsk8r]

OK... well i JUST got my car back from getting the new clutch in... so today was the first day truely driveing it.... so im going along.. and i notice the car is haveing trouble stoping.... meh figured it was normal and continued my day.... well im driveing along and i go to stop for a red light... it catches a tiny bit... but i was still doing about 20 by the time i hit the light.... so ebrake was pulled to stop (and yes i tried pumping the breaks aswell) . i have tried driveing it around... and the car stops... but its got almost no pressure at all... almost as if its only useing the pesure of the pedal to stop... to me this sounds like break booster.... BUT im not a break expert... theres no leaks in the system.... the fluid i still full and no signs of a leak or missing fluid.... so does this sound like a break booster?? or what else could go rong to do this... and remember it stoped fine so it seemed last night...

**edit** and yes i just relized i spelled pressure rong rofl

[Vanilla Sky]

Does it feel like you have to stand on your brakes, or does your foot hit the floor?

[labeledsk8r]

Does it feel like you have to stand on your brakes, or does your foot hit the floor?

foot goes to the floor.... feels like theres a leak... but theres no fluid loss

[Vanilla Sky]

I'm going to guess air. It doesn't take much of a leak to give you a really soft pedal. You could also have a rubber hose that's failed, but not ruptured.

[labeledsk8r]

hmmm so how should i test and pin this down...? just jack it up and look for small wet points on the break lines? doesnt seem like its lost any fluid at all

[DBMaster]

Check the spot where the master cylinder is bolted to the vacuum booster. I am on my third master cylinder. They seem to last about 100,000 miles and then develop a slow leak at the piston seals. If you see any fluid at all running down the booster you have a faulty master cylinder. At first your brakes work fine, but when the engine compartment gets hot and the fuild viscosity decreases it will start leaking more and you will lose fluid pressure.

[Vanilla Sky]

Jack it up, grab a brake line, and feel it as someone gently presses the brake pedal. The hose shouldn't expand much, if any. If you find a bad line, replace in pairs.

If that doesn't show anything, bleed your brakes.

[labeledsk8r]

Check the spot where the master cylinder is bolted to the vacuum booster. I am on my third master cylinder. They seem to last about 100,000 miles and then develop a slow leak at the piston seals. If you see any fluid at all running down the booster you have a faulty master cylinder. At first your brakes work fine, but when the engine compartment gets hot and the fuild viscosity decreases it will start leaking more and you will lose fluid pressure.

well it does seem to work fine when the car is cool... ima go look at that right now... shit.. i hate working on breaks... last time i put a master cylinder in it took almost 2 damn days (was on a ford) blah.. kk ima go check

[labeledsk8r]

ok i just looked at it... doesnt seem to be wet.... BUT under the break booster were it conects to the master cyl looks like something has been running dow nit badly... its like rusting in a leak patern.... im really starting to think this guy did a bunch of patch work to sell off this car to me lol.... um does break fluid burn up easy?? becuse mayby its just burned fluid... but it really looks and feels kinda like rust

[forrest89sei]

ok i just looked at it... doesnt seem to be wet.... BUT under the break booster were it conects to the master cyl looks like something has been running dow nit badly... its like rusting in a leak patern.... im really starting to think this guy did a bunch of patch work to sell off this car to me lol.... um does break fluid burn up easy?? becuse mayby its just burned fluid... but it really looks and feels kinda like rust


The Reservoir seals on my dad's Mercedes did that, Wouldn't Look wet but if you moved the reservoir around you would see fluid, overtime it leaked down the break booster and caused it to rust

[labeledsk8r]

Jack it up, grab a brake line, and feel it as someone gently presses the brake pedal. The hose shouldn't expand much, if any. If you find a bad line, replace in pairs.

If that doesn't show anything, bleed your brakes.

crap... well how would air of gotten in there to need a bleed


The Reservoir seals on my dad's Mercedes did that, Wouldn't Look wet but if you moved the reservoir around you would see fluid, overtime it leaked down the break booster and caused it to rust

does this mean i need to replace it?? or could this of been from a past leaking one...?

[forrest89sei]

crap... well how would air of gotten in there to need a bleed



does this mean i need to replace it?? or could this of been from a past leaking one...?

I ended up having to replace his, I noticed the pressure Improved when I did also

[labeledsk8r]

well i just went out and checked the lines by touch without jacking it up.... front left expanded a bit but nothing to bad.y.. the rest stayed about the same... the rear right seems to be starting to crack meaning its probably the orignal.. but no fluid there... i also shook around the booster... didnt seem to see fresh fluid... but the pedal can still go to the floor with no real resistence to the foot... i cant seem to find wet fluid at all... i think i might just replace the lines AND the brake booster... looseing breaks at that light scared the shit outa me and i dont feel like chanceing that again...

[forrest89sei]

I'd Pickup this Master Cylinder http://www.napaonline.com/masterpages/NOLMaster.aspx?PageId=470&LineCode=UP&PartNumber=39779&Description=Brake+Master+Cylinder+-+New
And if you need lines, i got 4 BRAND NEW Stainless Steel ones I'd sell for $40 shipped if your interested, Good luck man

[Hauntd ca3]

if it were the booster packing up
the pedal would feel like a brick at all times and you would hear a hissing noise when you press the pedal
if you got the rust thing happening on the booster under the master cylinder the seals are tired and it would prob suck in a wee bit of air each time you let off te brakes which would prob explain the shit pedal feel
what the pedal feel like with out the motor running?
replace the master cylinder first and get a shop to do a pressure bleed on the system and see how that feels

[AccordB20A]

does ur engine idle higher or run like shit when u pump teh brakes??

[Vanilla Sky]

That's a master cylinder issue. Replace the master cylinder AND the booster. The booster itself probably isn't bad, but I'm more than willing to bet that it's had brake fluid leak into it.

It's not bad replacing the master cylinder and booster on these cars. I did my first booster in about 2 hours with minimal tools.

[labeledsk8r]

does ur engine idle higher or run like shit when u pump teh brakes??

yes the idel jumps up when releaseing the brae.. and the car looses about 100 rpms when pressing in the break... so i know its trying to boost...

forrest i thin i might take you up on that deal for those break lines...... i iwll be looking into a booster and even anew cylinder im not looseing breaks again....

um can a caliper go out and give this same result???

[DBMaster]

The first time mine went bad it was still under the extended warranty. The second time I replaced it with a new one very similar to what forrest posted. Mine was about $60 also. I bench-bled it and then bled each wheel after installing it - no problem at all. Mine has the rusted area on the booster, too, but yours may have been caused by a previous master cylinder. You really don't have any way of knowing if it has been replaced before, do you? Is the rusted area wet with fluid? If it is I can say with 100% certainty that you need to replace the M/C. If you are even thinking about a rebuilt unit you are far better off getting a kit and doing it yourself, but it is much better to go with a new one for this part.

The rebuild kit is $32.79 at Rock Auto.
If it cost that much to rebuild it the new one sounds even better.

[lostforawhile]

yes the idel jumps up when releaseing the brae.. and the car looses about 100 rpms when pressing in the break... so i know its trying to boost...

forrest i thin i might take you up on that deal for those break lines...... i iwll be looking into a booster and even anew cylinder im not looseing breaks again....

um can a caliper go out and give this same result???master cyl also check your rear brake cylinders if they go bad you will get air in the system,and they go bad all the time. they are cheap.if your booster is bad you will still have brakes, you probably have an internal leak in the master cyl. if the rear brake lines are cracked replace them now!! i had sudden failures in old brake lines like that. you don't know how far into the hose the crack is extending.

[Vanilla Sky]

Yeah, I'd go ahead and replace the brake lines along with everything else.

[labeledsk8r]

The first time mine went bad it was still under the extended warranty. The second time I replaced it with a new one very similar to what forrest posted. Mine was about $60 also. I bench-bled it and then bled each wheel after installing it - no problem at all. Mine has the rusted area on the booster, too, but yours may have been caused by a previous master cylinder. You really don't have any way of knowing if it has been replaced before, do you? Is the rusted area wet with fluid? If it is I can say with 100% certainty that you need to replace the M/C. If you are even thinking about a rebuilt unit you are far better off getting a kit and doing it yourself, but it is much better to go with a new one for this part.

The rebuild kit is $32.79 at Rock Auto.
If it cost that much to rebuild it the new one sounds even better.

true.. well theres rust and im not sure....its not wet anyware... but it had leaked at some point in its life... so your saying rebuild the break booster?? and get a new master cylinder.... ?? im looking at just doing the entire damn thing so i dont have to think about it and will be fine when i se-i rear brake swap later.... im not really good at bleeding brakes... so im not sure if i want to takle this on my own.... any tools to make this easyer?? most likely will be working alone

[labeledsk8r]

master cyl also check your rear brake cylinders if they go bad you will get air in the system,and they go bad all the time. they are cheap.if your booster is bad you will still have brakes, you probably have an internal leak in the master cyl. if the rear brake lines are cracked replace them now!! i had sudden failures in old brake lines like that. you don't know how far into the hose the crack is extending.

i need to figure out were the problem is... how can i tell if the rear cylinders are bad..... leaking?? i cant start blindly ordering parts....

[labeledsk8r]

i need to buy this stuff tonight so any last ideas of exactly what i should buy?? or anything else to check??

[Ichiban]

Here is how I diagnose brakes:

Problem: Soft pedal.

1. Check master cylinder brake fluid level

Solution: Obvious. Bleed brakes afterwards.

2. Check for leaks, broken/bulging lines or wet areas. Remove wheels/drums and check wheel cylinders for leaks.

Solution: Replace affected part. Bleed your brakes.

3. Pump brake pedal rapidly. Check to see if it builds pressure.

Solution:

If pumping the pedal builds brake pressure (the pedal gets hard), the most likely situation is air. Bleed your brakes. If this doesn't solve the problem, another issue may be poorly adjusted drum brakes. In this case, pumping the pedal is necessary to take up the drum/shoe clearance before the brakes apply. After the brakes are released, return springs force the shoes back to their original position, creating excessive clearance again. Since your E-brake works, this is probably not your problem.

If pumping the pedal DOES NOT build brake pressure, you either; have an external leak (see number 2 above), or you have an internal leak in the master cylinder, or a faulty rear seal on the master cylinder allowing brake fluid into the booster. Remove/replace the master cylinder and bleed your brakes. If a failed rear seal has filled the booster with brake fluid, you "should" replace the booster. At least suction the fluid out. Also, black fluid and chunks of seal material in the reservoir indicate piston cups are in bad shape. Even if brake fluid isn't leaking out of the master cylinder, pressure can bypass the seals and return to the reservoir, instead of going to your brakes like it should.

4. Perform a brake function test. Road test the vehicle in a safe area.

I can also give you detailed instructions on how to properly and easily bleed your brakes if you want. It's simple, but if you do it wrong it'll become a major headache.

Good luck.

[labeledsk8r]

yeah thanks man, took th rear dums off after haveing a bit of a fail moment. and the driver side ruber cap was off and it was pissing fluid out of it... also desided to shoot my in that face so i have a mouth and eye full of the tasty fluid lol.... i will be picking up new rear cylinders.... wish i could just go se-i now but damnit... oh well

[Oldblueaccord]

Prolly need new brake shoes as well I bet there paper thin and the cups popped out of the cylinders.


wp

[labeledsk8r]

pads are thin.... but there just not in my budget... just moved... so ima just use up whats left... i know that sounds bad but i have allready put to much into this car... and still jobless after my move

[Soopitup]

ya... strange... did they do a mechanical inspection on your car while it was in the shop? You never know whats going on when people pull apart your ride to check stuff out.. haha

[labeledsk8r]

ya... strange... did they do a mechanical inspection on your car while it was in the shop? You never know whats going on when people pull apart your ride to check stuff out.. haha

naa i doubt it... my mech is one of the best... and i trust him fully with my cars

[AccordB20A]

i have a simular problem with my brake pedal going right to the floor slowly if you hold it there. brakes work fine tho. my brakes have been bled correctly.
im not much of a brake expert so i cant help ya on this one

[Ichiban]

I should add that if your brake pedal fades slowly, then the same set of rules apply as if you can't build pressure at all. As your master cylinder continues to fail, it will bypass more and more pressure until you get no brake pressure at all.

[labeledsk8r]

the way it sounds... is that my master cylinder is going out still... i have a feeling the leaking rear cylinder was just kinda a small part of the bigger problem.... time to read my hynes manual on master cylinder changes lol

[stat1K]

i like how you edited your first post to say you spelled "pressure rong" lol... and then continued to spell everything wrong including "hynes" manual... while the two names are related (haynes and hynes) they aren't the same. Trust me i know i've been called haynes my whole life. However, it seems to me that judging from the picture of the engine bay you posted when you got the car the mc looked pretty shitty. like rust on the bottom could just be the picture though. Also you'd be surprised how one leak can cause a whole brake system to not work properly. It's like when you bleed the brakes and you have one of the bleeder nuts unscrewed and the pedal has no effort whatsoever. if you have that say x2 or x4 it's obviously not going to stop very well at all. I'd change the mc and booster to be safe... but also look to see if it's not leaking excessively from the prop valve which can fail as well.

[labeledsk8r]

i like how you edited your first post to say you spelled "pressure rong" lol... and then continued to spell everything wrong including "hynes" manual... while the two names are related (haynes and hynes) they aren't the same. Trust me i know i've been called haynes my whole life. However, it seems to me that judging from the picture of the engine bay you posted when you got the car the mc looked pretty shitty. like rust on the bottom could just be the picture though. Also you'd be surprised how one leak can cause a whole brake system to not work properly. It's like when you bleed the brakes and you have one of the bleeder nuts unscrewed and the pedal has no effort whatsoever. if you have that say x2 or x4 it's obviously not going to stop very well at all. I'd change the mc and booster to be safe... but also look to see if it's not leaking excessively from the prop valve which can fail as well.

man i really dont care about spelling... i truely dont... and everyone else seems to have understood what i said... so w/e man...

i know how one leak can fuck the entire system... but i think i blew the rear cylinder from me and my buddy screwing around.. it just poped the seal out now that i looked at it more... i will replace them anyways or atleast rebuild them... my only problem is right now is that i have spent almost 5 grand in like 3 weeks on a move and shit... and i kinda expected this car to atleast run allright till i had my job going.. but i cant even get my job back till i know i have a working car.... so my funds are running out fast... i plan to change everytihng... becuse your right it looks shity... but if i can get it to work for say a month without it i might have to do that just so i can get income again in this new city

[MessyHonda]

time to upgrade to some technafit lines...i bought mine for 143 shipped...and they are real nice.

[labeledsk8r]

time to upgrade to some technafit lines...i bought mine for 143 shipped...and they are real nice.

um did you read my post above about kinda straped on cash atm rofl... i wish i could afford to upgrade rigt now... but i cant...

[gp02a0083]

That's a master cylinder issue. Replace the master cylinder AND the booster. The booster itself probably isn't bad, but I'm more than willing to bet that it's had brake fluid leak into it.

It's not bad replacing the master cylinder and booster on these cars. I did my first booster in about 2 hours with minimal tools.

i agree its easy to replace the Mc's on our cars, just remember to bench bleed it and your good to go

[A18A]

whats bench bleeding?

[Hazwan]

whats bench bleeding?

Bleed the MC while on the bench..? lol

The idea is to have air free MC before installing into the car, and making further bleeding easier since there is less air in the system to begin with.

[Ichiban]

Okay, I try to avoid telling people exactly what to do, because I'm not there and every situation differs. I try to give people the general process and let them figure it out from there.

First, don't shotgun parts. It's a waste of money and time. Use the procedures to determine the proper course of action. You already determined that the rear cylinders are toast. Change those. If you don't like the way I explained it, read your Haynes manual. It'll tell you the same thing, but in a flow chart.

If in fact you just popped out a piston from the rear wheel cylinder, replace it anyways. If you just stuff it back in it'll never seal properly again. They're cheap.

Second, check stuff. Use your head and understand what's going on in the brake system. If you stomp on the pedal and pressure doesn't go to the brakes, it's going somewhere else. Undo the two bolts on the master cylinder to booster and check the piston rod in behind for fluid leakage. You don't even need to undo brake lines. If fluid pours out as soon as you separate the two, you've found an obvious problem.

If you decide to change out the master cylinder, do yourself a favor. Go to the auto parts store, and buy a cheap 10mm flare nut wrench. They will know what it is. Without it you will destroy your brake line flare nuts (the fittings with the wrench flats). After that, it's simple. I crack the brake lines first, then undo the cylinder from the booster. Then I finger loosen the lines off completely, and swap in the new, bench bled unit. It's a 20 minute job, not including bleeding.

Also, when you bench bleed or otherwise, pump the cylinder smoothly and slowly, if you thrash it around quickly, you will foam the air into the brake fluid, and you'll never get it all out until it sits for a few hours and you do it again.

Good luck.

[Ichiban]

Bleed the MC while on the bench..? lol

The idea is to have air free MC before installing into the car, and making further bleeding easier since there is less air in the system to begin with.


That and at the angle some master cylinders are mounted to the car, proper bleeding is impossible because the air pockets end up higher than the port they are trying to escape from.

[russiankid]

the way it sounds... is that my master cylinder is going out still... i have a feeling the leaking rear cylinder was just kinda a small part of the bigger problem.... time to read my hynes manual on master cylinder changes lol

Change the cylinders first. When i was doing my brakes i forgot to tighten the bleed screw on one of the front calipers. So i was trying to bleed the rear brakes and the pedal would just go straight to the floor. So that one leaking cylinder can cause the pressure to be lost.

[labeledsk8r]

Okay, I try to avoid telling people exactly what to do, because I'm not there and every situation differs. I try to give people the general process and let them figure it out from there.

First, don't shotgun parts. It's a waste of money and time. Use the procedures to determine the proper course of action. You already determined that the rear cylinders are toast. Change those. If you don't like the way I explained it, read your Haynes manual. It'll tell you the same thing, but in a flow chart.

If in fact you just popped out a piston from the rear wheel cylinder, replace it anyways. If you just stuff it back in it'll never seal properly again. They're cheap.

Second, check stuff. Use your head and understand what's going on in the brake system. If you stomp on the pedal and pressure doesn't go to the brakes, it's going somewhere else. Undo the two bolts on the master cylinder to booster and check the piston rod in behind for fluid leakage. You don't even need to undo brake lines. If fluid pours out as soon as you separate the two, you've found an obvious problem.

If you decide to change out the master cylinder, do yourself a favor. Go to the auto parts store, and buy a cheap 10mm flare nut wrench. They will know what it is. Without it you will destroy your brake line flare nuts (the fittings with the wrench flats). After that, it's simple. I crack the brake lines first, then undo the cylinder from the booster. Then I finger loosen the lines off completely, and swap in the new, bench bled unit. It's a 20 minute job, not including bleeding.

Also, when you bench bleed or otherwise, pump the cylinder smoothly and slowly, if you thrash it around quickly, you will foam the air into the brake fluid, and you'll never get it all out until it sits for a few hours and you do it again.

Good luck.

i didnt mean to offend you if i did... i apreiciate the help... \brakes are the only system on a car that scares hthe shit out of me to rip apart...i have no problem doing disks and calipers but when it gets farther into its components it kinda cares me... dunno why....

im on my way over to car quest soon to get 2 rear cylinders (replaceing them in pairs) thanks guys i will let you know if this works

[Ichiban]

i didnt mean to offend you if i did... i apreiciate the help... \brakes are the only system on a car that scares hthe shit out of me to rip apart...i have no problem doing disks and calipers but when it gets farther into its components it kinda cares me... dunno why....

im on my way over to car quest soon to get 2 rear cylinders (replaceing them in pairs) thanks guys i will let you know if this works

No offense taken. It just makes no sense to replace parts until you verify them bad. Which your master cylinder still may be, maybe not. If you take a logical, methodical approach, you can do just about anything. How do you think I felt the first (and only) time I grabbed a grinder and cut the rear framerail out of my car? With a little patience and hard work, I rebuilt it better than new.

Oh and if you need help with bleeding, just ask. I swear, do it wrong and you can lose your mind. There's a simple method (you need a friend to help) and a wrench. It's easy, and you'll end up with great brakes.

[labeledsk8r]

No offense taken. It just makes no sense to replace parts until you verify them bad. Which your master cylinder still may be, maybe not. If you take a logical, methodical approach, you can do just about anything. How do you think I felt the first (and only) time I grabbed a grinder and cut the rear framerail out of my car? With a little patience and hard work, I rebuilt it better than new.

Oh and if you need help with bleeding, just ask. I swear, do it wrong and you can lose your mind. There's a simple method (you need a friend to help) and a wrench. It's easy, and you'll end up with great brakes.

i fully agree... blindly replaceing parts gets expensive and is not needed... thats mostly the reason i made this thread so i know what to check and what normaly goes bad... i could easly go order everything for the brake system and be in the hole 500+ bucks but that wouldnt be to smart

[russiankid]

i fully agree... blindly replaceing parts gets expensive and is not needed... thats mostly the reason i made this thread so i know what to check and what normaly goes bad... i could easly go order everything for the brake system and be in the hole 500+ bucks but that wouldnt be to smart

But then you'd have a brand new brake system:cheers:

[Oldblueaccord]

i fully agree... blindly replaceing parts gets expensive and is not needed... thats mostly the reason i made this thread so i know what to check and what normaly goes bad... i could easly go order everything for the brake system and be in the hole 500+ bucks but that wouldnt be to smart


well since your broke and need the car for the job stuff the cups back in the cylinders bleed it real quick if you can and don't use the E brake at all. If it pops again the pinch that side off until you can get it all fixed up. Thats how life goes sometimes.


wp

[labeledsk8r]

well since your broke and need the car for the job stuff the cups back in the cylinders bleed it real quick if you can and don't use the E brake at all. If it pops again the pinch that side off until you can get it all fixed up. Thats how life goes sometimes.


wp

well i just bought 2 new cylinders... and did that... mostly i was worried about buying like cylinders, master cyl, brake lines, booster... ya know just guessing as i fix things.... it seems to be stoping... the ebrake needs to be adjusted.... and the adjuster spring was broken on one... i put it back together for now without the adjuster clip and no spring... will have to get one from a junk yard when they open or new if you can get them new... it should be fine for a few days without that adjuster spring right?

[russiankid]

well i just bought 2 new cylinders... and did that... mostly i was worried about buying like cylinders, master cyl, brake lines, booster... ya know just guessing as i fix things.... it seems to be stoping... the ebrake needs to be adjusted.... and the adjuster spring was broken on one... i put it back together for now without the adjuster clip and no spring... will have to get one from a junk yard when they open or new if you can get them new... it should be fine for a few days without that adjuster spring right?

Not sure on that but if the junkyard car has better pads than you, take those and use them for the mean time.

[labeledsk8r]

Not sure on that but if the junkyard car has better pads than you, take those and use them for the mean time.

well actukly the pads looked great once i had them off.... so i dunno... but it seems fine without that adjuster screw..... felt like it was looseing presure agian but its stoping fine.... so i dunno

[2oodoor]

I saw a 3g today at JY that had all new wheel cyl and brakes.. you never know what you will find. I thought about you when I saw them. :wave:
sometimes the self adjusters get stuck and with wear that makes the wheel cyl move too far, eventually popping out and otherwise start leaking.
You bench bleed MC to get the little bit of air out of the end of it, some boooster rods /brake pedal never push the MC valve all the way to the tip.
Unless your brake lines are rusted, they should be ok, the flex lines from the frame to caliper can cause problems, so can water/moisture in the bottom of a caliper, water finds it's way to the lowest point of gravity which is in the cavity of the caliper. A good fluid flush is a good idea anyway.

[DBMaster]

I guess the 30,000 maintenance item of replacing the brake fluid was good foresight. I have had the car since new so I have been doing that. I have used Valvoline synthetic DOT 4 fluid since it came out - I don't remember how many years ago that was. I have had the M/C seals fail every 100K miles, but the rest of the system is totally original, except for the pads and shoes, of course.

[Vanilla Sky]

I agree with brake fluid flushes. On the flip side, NOT flushing quickly degrades the seals, and the bit of water trapped can become corrosive enough to erode anything it comes in contact with.

If the fluid isn't a light honey color, flush it. An hour and $10 of fluid now will save you hundereds of bucks and many more hours down the road.

[Soopitup]

Technically the color of the fluid shouldn't matter, I have a break fluid tester, tells the percentage of water in the fluid, 0% is great, 1-2% will need servicing soon, anything 3% or over is a very bad thing and you'll need a brake flush. So get it checked out first, most shops will have one on hand and will do it for free, takes like 5 seconds...

[lostforawhile]

you can get that kit with all new hardware at nappa and it was pretty cheap,talking about the brake springs,clips,etc i have to disagree on not replacing the parts, these cars are 20+ years old,it's not wasting money to overhaul the brakes.

[labeledsk8r]

well ... all last night it stoped fine.... today im driveing around get some taco bell... come home.. then go back out.. and the pedal starts getting spongy again... so it looks like ima need to swap master cylinders... i have one sitting here ... just need to learn how to do it lol

[DBMaster]

That sounds like an M/C to me, too. It comes with a bench bleeder kit. It's two plastic fittings that connect to the brake line holes and they have plastic tubes attached to them. You stick the ends of the tubes into the reservoir and pump the piston with the end of a screwdriver until you see no bubbles in the tubes. This is much easier to do with a bench vise. You keep the bleed tubes connected until you get the M/C bolted in. You will end up having a little fluid drip out when you pull the plastic fittings and connect the metal lines. You get very little air in the system this way. Then, you bleed at each wheel until the fluid runs clear. It should take one bottle of fluid or less to do this. I bleed mine in this order even though the shop manual has it a little different. RR, LR, RF, LF. I start at the farthest point from the M/C and work my way closer.

Just FYI, I have found that routine bleeding is much faster and easier if you replace the fluid in the M/C reservoir first.

[lostforawhile]

That sounds like an M/C to me, too. It comes with a bench bleeder kit. It's two plastic fittings that connect to the brake line holes and they have plastic tubes attached to them. You stick the ends of the tubes into the reservoir and pump the piston with the end of a screwdriver until you see no bubbles in the tubes. This is much easier to do with a bench vise. You keep the bleed tubes connected until you get the M/C bolted in. You will end up having a little fluid drip out when you pull the plastic fittings and connect the metal lines. You get very little air in the system this way. Then, you bleed at each wheel until the fluid runs clear. It should take one bottle of fluid or less to do this. I bleed mine in this order even though the shop manual has it a little different. RR, LR, RF, LF. I start at the farthest point from the M/C and work my way closer.

Just FYI, I have found that routine bleeding is much faster and easier if you replace the fluid in the M/C reservoir first.
also take off the resovoir cup, they usually don't come with the new master cyl. when you take it off,pop out the screen and clean the cup and the screen with brake cleaner. you will be suprised how much garbage is in there.

[labeledsk8r]

ok i just put a NEW MC on and reman booster becuse i had rust roles in mine... ..

now i have a new problem... the fucking brakes are to stiff.... feels and the idel doesnt go back down stays around 2,500 once on the gas... and when i mean stiff... there fucking stiff... i adjust the fitting for the pedal... so i dont know whats up...

[Vanilla Sky]

Defective MC.

[labeledsk8r]

Defective MC.

are you fucking for real.... i have to do that hit all over again !!!! FUCK!@!


**edit** wait MC ?? the car stops fine.... its just super stiff... and i think the front brakes stay on slightly.... wouldnt this be a bad booster not MC... i bled the brakes with a buddy hitting the brakes and there was fluid pumping.....

[A18A]

sounds like teh booster to me :dunno:

[Vanilla Sky]

Yeah, my bad.

Defective BOOSTER.

/relpied when half asleep and in the middle of cleaning house

[labeledsk8r]

Yeah, my bad.

Defective BOOSTER.

/relpied when half asleep and in the middle of cleaning house

gotcha.. damnit i dont want ot do this shit again lol

sigh will have to wait till my next day off.... sigh

[forrest89sei]

That sucks man!

Well I'll get those brake lines out tomorrow for ya, so you can do it all at once

[DBMaster]

also take off the resovoir cup, they usually don't come with the new master cyl. when you take it off,pop out the screen and clean the cup and the screen with brake cleaner. you will be suprised how much garbage is in there.

Actually, mine came complete; reservoir, cap, and all. It has been on there for a good few years now. It was a nice surprise for $65.

[labeledsk8r]

do boosters take time to like brake in?? or no.... becuse i dont know why but it seems ot be getting better... but i dunno... the fronts are still dragging... but i have ot drive the car becuse i need to get to a interview in 3 hours lol

[89T]

no vaccume leaks?
plugged vaccume line....ect.ect.

[A18A]

is the check valve on the hose around the right way??

[2oodoor]

yep vaccum check valve on the boooster at the vac connection.

DBMaster a lot of companys stopped putting in the bleeder hoses in the box with a new MC :thumbdn:

[labeledsk8r]

i will check that line later tonight... dunno how i woulda put it back on backwards....if i did ima feel soo damn dumb

[forrest89sei]

It's not being dumb, it's being under pressure :wave:

[Oldblueaccord]

Theres a rod in there that need to have the correct length or the fronts will start to drag the farther you drive it.


wp

[Oldblueaccord]

Its pages 20-24 20-25 in the 88 Helms book.

Just to parapharse from the book it looks like with the booster under vacuum you want justa small amount of play .016". I never have done it so someone might have something more to add to the process.


I do know this if its wrong the front brakes will slowly compress until there locked up completely.


wp

[labeledsk8r]

sounds like that might be it.. becuse they can seem fine but get worse and worse the more i drive and seem to get better if the car sits for a while... can this be adjusted while installed or disasemble it again? thanks man

[Oldblueaccord]

I have never done it. I was hoping some else would post up. It looks like you would need to remove the MC from the booster to adjust it. If you dont have a helms look online here at the manual and see what I mean.

Just a thought you might be able to plug the booster off and be able to drive it. I dunno if it would work but its worth a shot.

wp

[labeledsk8r]

I have never done it. I was hoping some else would post up. It looks like you would need to remove the MC from the booster to adjust it. If you dont have a helms look online here at the manual and see what I mean.

Just a thought you might be able to plug the booster off and be able to drive it. I dunno if it would work but its worth a shot.

wp


true , i kinda looked at it today... might be able to adjust it without removeing it from under the dash... if not... all i care about it not unhooking the hardlines form the MC becuse i realy dont feel like bleeding all those lines again (and then again when my SS brake lines get here) so meh we will see....

[russiankid]

true , i kinda looked at it today... might be able to adjust it without removeing it from under the dash... if not... all i care about it not unhooking the hardlines form the MC becuse i realy dont feel like bleeding all those lines again (and then again when my SS brake lines get here) so meh we will see....

When you put new lines in you will lose a lot of fluid, so maybe you can adjust it then?