anyone cut up an innovative crx/civic crossmember for the 3g?

[Accordtheory]

As the title says..just wondering. I don't like rod ends, and I need a lot more clearance if I want to run an actual exhaust, so this would fit the bill.
http://www.innovativemounts.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=59111
http://www.innovativemounts.com/v/vspfiles/photos/59111-2.jpg

[Accordtheory]

I might just say fuck it and do it myself..

[Ichiban]

Seriously, look at what's gone into that. Build your own.

[Accordtheory]

It might be easier and cheaper to buy that and cut it up. A lot of times the price of a finished product is lower than I can get the materials for..due to economies of scale, different countries of origin, etc. (the welding cart I made for instance, cost me more in materials than one I could have bought from harbor freight, etc) Esp if you can buy the product used.
When making motor mounts, I'd always buy a cheap set off of ebay and cut them up instead of trying to entirely fab my own. Way more work to do that.

Anyway, I don't have a crx/civic in front of me, I was more wondering about the dimensional differences between them and the 3g.

[evil88accordLX]

It might be easier and cheaper to buy that and cut it up. A lot of times the price of a finished product is lower than I can get the materials for..due to economies of scale, different countries of origin, etc. (the welding cart I made for instance, cost me more in materials than one I could have bought from harbor freight, etc) Esp if you can buy the product used.
When making motor mounts, I'd always buy a cheap set off of ebay and cut them up instead of trying to entirely fab my own. Way more work to do that.

Anyway, I don't have a crx/civic in front of me, I was more wondering about the dimensional differences between them and the 3g.

i have a gutted crx at home and will check the dimensional differences as best i can without actually having to remove the member from the 3gee this evening if weather permits.

[MessyHonda]

some one here with the h22 has a custom front brace...and it looks easy to make

[thegreatdane]

I like this kit: http://www.k-tuned.com/9093k.html

I'm thinking about contacting them to see if they will sell the radius arm setup seperately so I can make my own traction bar.
I just need to measure the length of the 3rd gen radius arms first.

[Accordtheory]

i have a gutted crx at home and will check the dimensional differences as best i can without actually having to remove the member from the 3gee this evening if weather permits.

Definitely appreciate that...

[Accordtheory]

I like this kit: http://www.k-tuned.com/9093k.html

I'm thinking about contacting them to see if they will sell the radius arm setup seperately so I can make my own traction bar.
I just need to measure the length of the 3rd gen radius arms first.


I don't like rod ends

[Accordtheory]

I don't like rod ends because since they aren't sealed and pressurized with grease like any other ball joint on a car, they don't last, and they also connect more vibration/harshness into the chassis. I would prefer the poly bushing with the stock style arm.

[Oldblueaccord]

http://www.explicitspeedperformance.net/TBS.html

I saw a bunch on pictures on here the other day to give you some ideas.


wp

[Ichiban]

I don't like rod ends because since they aren't sealed and pressurized with grease like any other ball joint on a car, they don't last, and they also connect more vibration/harshness into the chassis. I would prefer the poly bushing with the stock style arm.

A lot of rod ends are used on heavy trucks, 4x4's and in aircraft applications. So in terms of them not lasting, I call bullshit. Most modern airbag equipped semi tractor trucks use a five link system with airbags, and rod ends at the end of each link, which are sealed and greasable. Insulated rod ends are available that are intended to decrease the transmission of vibration, and you can also mount your crossmember to the car with rubber insulators, like the factory did to reduce vibration. Look up the Currie Johnny Joint for only one example of the above, Currie being a highly respected driveline/suspension manufacturer.

In my opinion, the factory radius rod system allows an unacceptable amount of deflection and potential for failure.

Edit: Again, look at some of these designs. A 3 foot section of mild HSS square tube with a plate welded at each end. You want to pay how much to chop that up?

[Accordtheory]

Well, I was Hoping to get it for cheap on ebay, but it went for $196 + shipping. Bullshit.

[Accordtheory]

Here's a good link, listen to what he says about heim joints. Call bullshit on him..the designer of the johnnie joint. We both agree, heim joints suck.
http://www.currieenterprises.com/cestore/johnnyjoints.aspx
I do like the johnnie joint. But I still like the oem honda design better for this application. Why? More surface area for the load.

My mind is made up, that is the only way I'll do it. No engineering compromise, the oem design with poly bushings is the best way, period. That innovative 88-91 civic crossmember is the only thing I've found so far that is even close. If you think it's just a 3 foot section with a plate on each end, scroll back up and take another look. It would take hours to build that thing.

[evil88accordLX]

My mind is made up, that is the only way I'll do it. No engineering compromise, the oem design with poly bushings is the best way, period. That innovative 88-91 civic crossmember is the only thing I've found so far that is even close. If you think it's just a 3 foot section with a plate on each end, scroll back up and take another look. It would take hours to build that thing.

okay so i looked at and measured the crossmembers on the crx and the 3gee, and they are absolutely nothing alike. the 3gee crossmember has an almost rectangular bolt pattern with approximately 40" ( all measurements are center of bolt to center of bolt) from the left side to right side, and 2.75" from front bolt to back bolt. the crx/civic crossmember has a trapezoidal bolt pattern, the fronts being approximately 39", the backs 36", and the distance between the two bolts front and rear is 3.25". as cool as that innovative bar is, i dont think it could be modified to work without a major amount of work.

[Accordtheory]

Thanks for the measurements.
What I really need to know though to decide if this is worth doing is if the innovative crossmember's radius arm bushing locations can be made to fit in the right location at the right angle on the 3g chassis. Basically, that would entail measuring the distance inbetween the radius arm bushing centers and then the distance between the radius arm bushing centers to the approximate center of the part that would bolt onto the chassis, or where ever you would drill the mounting holes to bolt it to the chassis. In other words, is the distance between the radius arm bushings and the chassis mounting holes on that innovative piece within the range of modification to work? You wrote that the inner holes on the innovative piece are 4" closer together than on the 3g piece, but is that due more to a decrease in distance on the crossbeam, or a decrease between the mounting holes on the end brackets and the radius bushings? Obviously, it would be very easy to alter the length of the crossbeam. Although it would be easy to cut off the "ears" and drill new holes, it would be difficult to alter the width of the mounting brackets overall.
Anyway, I don't expect you to go out and measure this, but I would definitely be thankful if you did..

[evil88accordLX]

it for sure will take me a while to measure all that stuff, but if i run out of stuff to do this weekend ill see what i can do.

[Accordtheory]

I wish I had this shit in front of me, I could tell if it would work right away..

[88LXi68]

I think a DA crossmember would be a better match.

[Accordtheory]

If I can find one that accepts the oem style bushings..innovative has a crossmember for the 90-93 teg that uses rod ends.

[spiceisler]

Anyone sucessfully make one of their own? I'm faced with doing one for a customer and I don't know if there is an existing one that would work.

[Oldblueaccord]

spice

look thru those picturs I linked too. I think you could get some round or square tube and utilize the honda ends and make your own.

http://explicitspeedperformance.net/myPictures/IMG_2232.jpg


http://explicitspeedperformance.net/myPictures/IMG_2232.jpg

[spiceisler]

Thanks Oldblu. WeirTech (http://http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2073179) actually has a kit that I may purchase and supply the chromoly tubing to complete it. Let's see what the customer wants to do.

http://<a href="http://s83.photobucket.com/albums/j295/strfabwerkes/?action=view&current=tractionbarkit.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j295/strfabwerkes/tractionbarkit.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[Accordtheory]

I think I'm just going to make my own from scratch. I finally thought of a design I like, it's simpler than the innovative one. I'll post pics when it's done, sometime next week hopefully.

[EricW]

I'm interested in seeing what you create. I've thought about making one myself but haven't had a reason serous enough to yet. It would be nice to have the extra space though.

[spiceisler]

I'm actually also curious to see what it will look like.

In for pics!;)