Timing Belt HELP

[zigzag]

i took my car to a mechanic to get my spark plugs chaced out cause the first and third holes were cross threaded.... he screwed up the second hole and it kept spitting out my plug.... as with some dick head mechanics refuses to fix his mistake and tries to blame me..... so in short i had to go out buy a new head then pay a friend of mine to swap it out.... i was furious.... it is all done now except the timing belt..... and what do you know the damn bolt wont come off the crankshaft pulley....

now my question is what is the best way of getting this bolt off.... and is this bolt reversed threaded by any chance? i am considering a high torque impact with a decent air compressor.... will this work well?

any help would be appreciated greatly. ive been almost 3 weeks without a car and i am tired of bumming rides off of everyone. thank you ^_^;;

-zigzag

[DBMaster]

You should do a search because this topic gets covered a lot. When I have done my TB I have gone to a local shop and slipped one of the mechanics $5 to take their high-powered pneumatic wrench to it. I then ask them to hand tighten it and drive right home. Then, once the car cools down it's easy to loosen the thing. Various methods I have seen on here include long breaker bars, wedging breaker bars against the floor and cranking the engine (I personally don't recommend that one), and of course impact wrenches. I did mine twice the way I have described and it was well worth the $5. The bolt is NOT reverse threaded, by the way. It has very fine threads and gets tightened to, I think, 106 ft-lbs so it's locked in there pretty good after 90-100K miles. Since the engine rotates counterclockwise you end up turning the engine rather than the bolt when you try to loosen it by hand.

[russiankid]

The A20 does not have a harmonic balancers, it is actually a belt tensioner. To get the bolt loose, I used a regular 12mm point wrench, but a 6 point is better. I put a cheater bar on the wrench and had someone push on the bolt up top so it doesn't snap as the bolt is fairly long. After you get it loose, replace it if possible. When tightening the bolt down, make sure its nice and tight but don't go ape shit on it.

Replace the belt with a quality belt and tensioner, such as Honda or Gates. You don't want to have a tensioner break or a belt snapping after all of this work.

The head could have been repaired without replacing it. The mechanic should know that a Heli coil kit is a simple fix that works.

[russiankid]

You should do a search because this topic gets covered a lot. When I have done my TB I have gone to a local shop and slipped one of the mechanics $5 to take their high-powered pneumatic wrench to it. I then ask them to hand tighten it and drive right home. Then, once the car cools down it's easy to loosen the thing. Various methods I have seen on here include long breaker bars, wedging breaker bars against the floor and cranking the engine (I personally don't recommend that one), and of course impact wrenches. I did mine twice the way I have described and it was well worth the $5. The bolt is NOT reverse threaded, by the way. It has very fine threads and gets tightened to, I think, 106 ft-lbs so it's locked in there pretty good after 90-100K miles. Since the engine rotates counterclockwise you end up turning the engine rather than the bolt when you try to loosen it by hand.

For some reason I thought he was referring to the timing belt tensioner. I slipped a mechanic $20 to undo my pulley bolt. He used his gas torch to heat it up and his impact gun.

[zigzag]

heli coil as i recall is only a temporary fix and over time will result in the same spitting out of the plug.

i edited my post cause i realized it was the pulley not the balancer.... i do have i think a 500 ft/lbs air hammer and i tend to get the damn thing off tonight ^_^;; as far as getting new replacement parts that is a no go considering i have no money at this point in time and wont have any in a few days if i dont get my car running soon so i can get my ass to work. would you think that is enough torque to get the bolt off faster than the engine will turn?

[Dr_Snooz]

Harbor Freight has a red impact gun called "Earthquake" that is lord and master of all crankshaft pulley bolts.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=2623

I can't recommend it enough. My brother liked mine so well he bought one of his own.

[cygnus x-1]

If you have an impact gun use it. That's the easiest way.

C|

[zigzag]

if i had $100 to spare i would but the one i borrowed might have enough torque to do what i need.... hopefully anyways.... if not then ill be walking to work verry soon....

[nswst8]

Heat the bolt spray some penetrating lube (PB Blaster) on it. Spin it off.

Remember this any impact gun is only as good as its air supply.

A 1.5 hp 3gal tank will not provide enough air.

[zigzag]

i bought a 380 ft/lbs air hammer and it wouldn't take it off.... i don't have any heat supply and i think i have some wd40 but that shit eats metal over time.... i have a mechanic and someone knowledgeable working on it tonight so hopefully them two can get it to work. its been a battle and the sun had burnt me to hell and back even with a canopy lol.... but at least it gave me a chance to replace the trans axle mounts (the last of my motor mounts) and the stabilizer bar bushings.

[lostforawhile]

heli coil as i recall is only a temporary fix and over time will result in the same spitting out of the plug.

i edited my post cause i realized it was the pulley not the balancer.... i do have i think a 500 ft/lbs air hammer and i tend to get the damn thing off tonight ^_^;; as far as getting new replacement parts that is a no go considering i have no money at this point in time and wont have any in a few days if i dont get my car running soon so i can get my ass to work. would you think that is enough torque to get the bolt off faster than the engine will turn? a helicoil is not a temporary fix,i's an accepted permanent way to repair threads. if your mechanic was so stupid that he couldn't even chase a thread, a helicoil was probably way beyond his mental capacity anyway.

[Dr_Snooz]

Heat the bolt spray some penetrating lube (PB Blaster) on it. Spin it off.

Remember this any impact gun is only as good as its air supply.

A 1.5 hp 3gal tank will not provide enough air.


To the contrary, I run it with a tiny pancake compressor. The beauty of the gun is that you only need a split second to get the bolt off.


if i had $100 to spare i would

Sorry. It sounded from your first post like this was an option. Most of the time, I just slip an impact socket extension into the timing hole to keep the drive plate from moving while I use a breaker bar on the bolt. That always works real well, unless a gorilla at the shop put it on with a bazooka. Then I get the Eathquake gun.

[zigzag]

a helicoil is not a temporary fix,i's an accepted permanent way to repair threads. if your mechanic was so stupid that he couldn't even chase a thread, a helicoil was probably way beyond his mental capacity anyway.

yes a heli coil is a good fix for THREADS but the heli coil was mostly meant for early jets to fix the problem of bolts vibrating loose.... the heli coil provided a solution.... there is no compression involved in fixing threads for a good fixed lock on bolts.... over time the compression in the cylinder will push the coil out.... do some research.. i did thats why i bought a used head from a junk yard. for $150 i couldnt beat it considering other places wanted $300-$500.

[greentee76]

yes a heli coil is a good fix for THREADS but the heli coil was mostly meant for early jets to fix the problem of bolts vibrating loose.... the heli coil provided a solution.... there is no compression involved in fixing threads for a good fixed lock on bolts.... over time the compression in the cylinder will push the coil out.... do some research.. i did thats why i bought a used head from a junk yard. for $150 i couldnt beat it considering other places wanted $300-$500.


Not wanting to start a fight here but a properly installed helicoil will likely outlast the life of the car(even for those of us here that intend to keep them forever.)
It would at very least have gotten more life out odf the head.

As to the pulley bolt I believe I used a 1/2" drivve impact gun to remove mine.

[russiankid]

heli coil as i recall is only a temporary fix and over time will result in the same spitting out of the plug.

i edited my post cause i realized it was the pulley not the balancer.... i do have i think a 500 ft/lbs air hammer and i tend to get the damn thing off tonight ^_^;; as far as getting new replacement parts that is a no go considering i have no money at this point in time and wont have any in a few days if i dont get my car running soon so i can get my ass to work. would you think that is enough torque to get the bolt off faster than the engine will turn?

Heli coil is not temporary. My brother Heli coiled his spark plug in his BMW a year ago and its fine ever since(knock on wood).

Here is an example of a heli coil that will not handle pressure.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1b/Helicoil_14x1.25.jpg/530px-Helicoil_14x1.25.jpg

Here is one that will.
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31yxH2HZR9L._SL500_AA230_.jpg

[lostforawhile]

yes a heli coil is a good fix for THREADS but the heli coil was mostly meant for early jets to fix the problem of bolts vibrating loose.... the heli coil provided a solution.... there is no compression involved in fixing threads for a good fixed lock on bolts.... over time the compression in the cylinder will push the coil out.... do some research.. i did thats why i bought a used head from a junk yard. for $150 i couldnt beat it considering other places wanted $300-$500.I would like you to explain how a helicoil is going to get pushed out? you are drilling and tapping a hole oversize,a helicoil is a threaded insert, it is screwed in. the stainless steel of the coil is much stronger then the original aluminum threads of the original spark plug holes. I would like to know how it's going to get PUSHED OUT? if that was the case every car on the road would have the spark plugs all pushed out. You seem to not know much about machining and threads if you made the statement that you did research and still came up with that . it's also common practice on race engines to helicoil every single thread that is under a lot of load on the engine.

[lostforawhile]

yes a heli coil is a good fix for THREADS what the hell do you think holds the spark plug in? glue? and saying these are just for old jets is crazy, they are used all the time on a lot of things, just get the genuine ones not the chinese made crap ones.

['89AccordLX(Rus)]

Just to add my $.02 to the helicoil debate:

Helicoil has become the accepted reference to a thread repair. As my bro (russiankid) mentioned, there are different thread repair solutions. When I repaired stripped spark plug threads in my BMW, I used a kit manufactured by helicoil. It was not a coil however, it was an insert. Solid metal with internal and external threads. It will not leak and it will not pull out because the contact surface of the threads is actually larger in the head after replacement. FYI, inserts are used not only in spark plugs but also for things like cylinder block repairs where head bolts have pulled out of the block. Inserts are used because the repair is stronger than the original threads. Here's the kit I used over a year ago:
http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductDetail.aspx?MfrCode=HEL&MfrPartNumber=533414&CategoryCode=3482

[cygnus x-1]

i bought a 380 ft/lbs air hammer and it wouldn't take it off.... i don't have any heat supply and i think i have some wd40 but that shit eats metal over time.... i have a mechanic and someone knowledgeable working on it tonight so hopefully them two can get it to work. its been a battle and the sun had burnt me to hell and back even with a canopy lol.... but at least it gave me a chance to replace the trans axle mounts (the last of my motor mounts) and the stabilizer bar bushings.

One thing I found about those crank bolts. Use the shortest extension you can get away with. Even better is a deep well socket. Then when you blast it with the gun, push on the gun like your trying to push the socket farther on to the bolt. This keeps the socket from vibrating around on the bolt and puts more force into breaking it loose. I know this sounds bizarre but I discovered this when I was trying to pull a few junkyard pulleys for a project. The first several I tried just wouldn't come off. Then by accident I found that they would come off if I put some inward force on the gun. I was using a cordless impact with maybe 300lb-ft torque at best.

And WD40 does not eat metal. That's absurd.

C|

[88Accord-DX]

That crank bolt will be hard to get off without 3/4" breaker bar & cheater bar over it, sitting on top of a 4x4 block even with the bolt. Then you need someone to hold the flex-plate/ flywheel, while you torque on that cheater bar. Little bit of heat with a small propane torch on the end of the crank bolt help too. Good luck

With the heli-coil thing, the trick is not to let the shavings get down in the combustion chamber.

Now if you wanna talk impact drivers, one of the best on the market is the Ingersoll-Rand 2351 TI. It has 1,100 of nut busting torque. It'll run around $240 or so, but you need about 100 p.s.i. of air.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/21DGZD4142L._SL500_AA200_.jpg

[zigzag]

then you guys have had success with the heli coil.... ive talked to 3 people and all have popped out.... and i know the spark plus are held by threads my point was.... ah fuck it dont care i bought the fucking head its installed it works the bolt came off the timing belt is on needs a little more adjustment.... sad thing is the radiator cracked and i have to get a new one....

@lostforawhile
try sounding a little less rude next time.... i tend to argue with with people who sound rude to me.... i live with one and if i could i would kick her ass out of this damn house.... and to top it off i live next door to a nosey rude know it all needless to say i avoid her at all costs.... sorry for arguing just been a really rough month and as far as i have heard from others not affiliated with this site they arnt a verry successful tool.... of course then maybe they them selfs didn't install them right.

[QUOTE}....the stainless steel of the coil is much stronger then the original aluminum threads of the original spark plug holes. I would like to know how it's going to get PUSHED OUT?....[/QUOTE]

my guess would be the only thing holding in the stainless steel coil is the aluminum head itself.... just cause you put in a stainless steel thread substitute doesn't make it bullet proof if your complaining about the aluminum threads.... so the new aluminum threads holding in the stainless steel threads doent sound any more successful than aluminum threads holding in the spark plug itself.... if any of what i said makes sense.


one guy said it lasted him 2 years before it finally blew out the plug again along with the coil.... i didnt want to take the chance of going 75 down a highway and the heli coil just blowing out my plug.... then i would have to go out and get a new head regardless. i would rather much just save myself the hassle.

[cygnus x-1]

my guess would be the only thing holding in the stainless steel coil is the aluminum head itself.... just cause you put in a stainless steel thread substitute doesn't make it bullet proof if your complaining about the aluminum threads.... so the new aluminum threads holding in the stainless steel threads doent sound any more successful than aluminum threads holding in the spark plug itself.... if any of what i said makes sense.



A helicoil should be stronger than the original thread because it has a larger outer diameter. Larger diameter threads have more surface area and therefore more holding force.

The thing with spark plugs and aluminum heads though is that they CANNOT BE OVER TORQUED. Even with a helicoil. Over torquing puts shear stress on the threads, and combined with the extra stress from compression can weaken the threads. Aluminum also tends to fatigue over time with repeated stress and release cycles so it may not happen right away. So pay attention to those torque settings and use anti-seize compound.

But beyond that, heads are (relatively) cheap and plentiful so it's not that big a deal.

C|

[Dr_Snooz]

i bought the head its installed it works the bolt came off the timing belt is on needs a little more adjustment....

Glad to hear everything worked out. How did you get the bolt off?

[zigzag]

Glad to hear everything worked out. How did you get the bolt off?

a big air compressor and an air hammer with over 500 ft/lbs.... as far as my dad and the guy working on it, they both said my car sounds 2X better even before the plugs holes were cross threaded dad said. here is a pic of my old head before we took it out to be swapped.

http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/1041/pict0233mj0.th.jpg (http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pict0233mj0.jpg)

the only difference with the new one was that it had plastic sleeves between the rockers where there were no springs.... the old head didnt have them.... we thought it was weird but didnt think much of it.... degrease it and put it in after it dried.... looked like new :P

[zigzag]

well the radiator is on and i got to drive my car tonight :P right now there is a faint tapping sound but he said its a valve and to give it a few days.... if it keeps on he will find it and adjust the valve then adjust the timing belt a little more.... other than that is runs great. thanks for your help guys.

[Dr_Snooz]

Probably a good idea to adjust all the valves after a few days of driving.

Nice work with the impact gun.

[zigzag]

thanks ^_^ though i just found one of my vacuum lines is missing.... ill upload the pic.... trying to find where this one goes >.< i have it capped off right now but i cant seem to find where it goes for the life of me.... would anyone happen to know? what is that piece btw?

[zigzag]

scratch that i found a good diagram here and its supposed to be capped off.... i found the cap it was knocked off and stuck in a good place ^_^;; sorry

[zigzag]

question.... adjusting the valves does the engine have to be stone cold? i looked through posts and found a thread and was wondering if the measurements i got were correct? intake .006 and exhaust .010.... i tried it but it gave a worse tapping noise than before.... and i tried the measurements under the hood but those gaps were huge and still gave an awful tapping noise. i can take it to a honda dealership and they will charge me $100 to adjust all valves and replace the valve cover gasket, but i would rather do it myself since im short on cash and cant afford it.... please any help would be great.

also i started putting my car in 3rd and moving it to over drive when the car reaches 40-45 mph because it felt like it was putting less strain on my car.... but it seems when i start off in over drive after it takes the car up to 4000 rpms before it shifts gears.... but if i dont use 3rd and just use over drive it shifts fine.... would starting off in 3rd then putting the car into over drive at 40-45 mph bad for my trani?

[Dr_Snooz]

Intake = 0.005"-0.007"
Exhaust = 0.010"-0.012

Properly adjusted valves will make a little noise. If they are quiet, you run the risk of burning them up. Adjusting is more art than science, so you might need to re-do a few times before getting it right. The dealer doesn't always do them right either, so save your money.

I shift my AT all the time and no, it shouldn't do what you're describing. When was the last fluid change? It might be time for a flush.

[zigzag]

last year i replaced the trani.... so its probably time for a flush >.< i will get on that soon.... as for running quiet how would that run the risk up burning up the valves? trying to learn all i can about this stuff for later on in life.... better to know than to get ripped off by some mechanic.... im not doing that again.

[nswst8]

Engine does need to be cold for valve adjustment. Let the car sit overnight before you adjust.

[lostforawhile]

last year i replaced the trani.... so its probably time for a flush >.< i will get on that soon.... as for running quiet how would that run the risk up burning up the valves? trying to learn all i can about this stuff for later on in life.... better to know than to get ripped off by some mechanic.... im not doing that again.if the valve is never closed all the way from being too tight hot gasses will always be escaping past them and eroding the valve. if the the clearance is too loose you will loose power because the valve never opens all the way. if you take it to a dealer i can almost guarantee they won't let it get cold by it sitting all day,and adjust the valves wrong. they make money by moving cars in and out and trying to do as many small services as they can. it costs them money to have the car sit. the difference between the valve being even 70 and 100 degrees can affect the clearance you measure by several thousandths of an inch. this is enough to misadjust the valves. the service manual will list a certain temperature the cyl head is to be below before adjusting them for this reason. this temperature they list also takes into account how much the valves and rockers assemblies will expand at normal operating temperatures. theres a lot of engineering in that valve train.

[zigzag]

got ya.... what i did was adjust the valves 30 minutes after driving down the road to the guys house.... i will have to pick a weekend to do this when im not running the car.

what we did was move the gear to top dead center and adjusted the closed valves exhaust first one by one cranking the gear to each cylender then started over doing the intake afterwards.... when we got done adjusting intake at .006 and exhaust .010 we started up the car and the ticking sounded worse....

so far what ive found out here is to move the gear to TDC and adjust all the valves for that cylender.... then move the gear 1/4 the way and adjust the valves for the next cylender.... in order 1-3-4-2....

im still trying to figure this out and get it right but it does seem like i lost a bit of power since the last adjustment.

[Oldblueaccord]

I don't think you are following the valve adjustment procedure correctly.

1. The head has to be cold. The specs listed are for a cold motor. When wamed up those adjustments are differant and unless you know the amount of "growth" it won't be correct.

2. You must mover the engine over 4 times and follow the correct firing order. TDC is on the compression stroke all valves closed not the exhaust stroke where the intakes are closed and the exhaust is open.

3. you want a slight drag on the feeler guage when you tighten the adjustment hold down nut. The part about "slight drag" is subjective but you will get the feel for it. Recheck after the nut is tightened that your original adjustment is the same. You may have to readjust you gap.

One thing you have to remember is the rocker arm is on the base of the cam when you make your adjustment. This can be seen by looking at the cam lobe itself and where the rocker pad is. You may want to push the rocker down onto the cam to make sure it is on the cam when you are using the feeler guage.

That all being said once you get good at it yes you can skip around and do other cylinders on valves that are closed.

EDIT: Pretty good link here
http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/0c/f1/54/0900823d800cf154/repairInfoPages.htm


wp

[2oodoor]

good link! bookmark that one and you can navigate to any car repair procedures
You can take the plugs out to make it easier to turn the engine by hand and shine a light in the spark hole to see the piston TDC
Make sure you have a good light shining on the actual gap, so you can see you are not holding the guage at an angle, and you can feel/ see the .007 and .011 should slightly drag but not pinch.

[Dr_Snooz]

I swore a lot when I did my valves for the first time. That whole "slight drag" business was really hard for me. I got the valves flappy and rattly one time, then silent the next. What a pain. I hate adjusting valves.

[zigzag]

you guys are awesome ^_^ i will be attempting this again soon as soon as i read the link provided a few more times over lol i will let you know how to goes.... wish me luck >.<

i know what you mean.... is it good when its quiet.... what should it sound like when they are properly adjusted?

[Oldblueaccord]

There are some vids on you tube.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqgNRn3ashM


wp

[zigzag]

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e330/mysticshrooms/PICT0406.jpg

what is this sensor? i want to put one of those dome air filters over my carb and get rid of the bulky breather.... is there a thread on this subject?

[greentee76]

Intake air temp sensor. Sends signal to Solenoid control computer under seat which in turn tells the funny little valves in the black box of doom what to do.
It is a little more complex than that but that is the basics.
To get rid of the bulky air cleaner( ain't it a bitch? ) properly is going to require a devac. Look on the carb tech page, I believe the devac how to is stickied there.
(This all depends on what the smog requirements are in your area.)

[zigzag]

so what if i drill a hole in the metal of the filter and screw the sensor there? wouldnt that be an easy bypass? or does it have to be before the air hits the filter?

[tenchimuyo93]

i use this for my impact needs

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00988244000P

works just as good an air powered one.

[zigzag]

2 things i would like to ask now.... im shifting at between 2500 and 3500 (mostly 3000-3200) rpms. is this normal?.... and the first time i kept check of mpg i got 21 the first time and tonight the light came on and i got 15.4 >.< thats a big jump, do you think my valves are getting burnt up? i am having my friend come back by to help me adjust the valves in the morning while the engine is cold.... i hope it isnt too late :(

[zigzag]

FINALLY!!!! the valves have been adjusted and my car no longer shakes at idle.... smoother take off and acceleration....

now im looking at an edelbrock air filter.... the dome shapped on that sits over the carbs intake....

http://www.tias.com/cgi-bin/google.fcgi/itemKey=1922885382

now is it possible to mount the the air temp sensor to the bottom? its still reading the air temp before going into the carb intake.... also what do i do with the excess vacuum hoses going to the black intake box? is there a tutorial on this subject i can read into?

[Civic Accord Honda]

that air cleaner looks bomb man!!
and u just plug the vac lines that go to the old air cleaner lol

[zigzag]

thats what i thought but i just had to make sure.... yea it looks nice and its easy as hell to clean.... foam filter washed with warm water and soap.

now one more question there is a piece going from the black box to the small black box in front of it.... now i know to put a mini filter onto the head cover but im talking about the other one.... what do i do with that? if pics are needed ill post them up as soon as i can....

the increase in air flow will this help my gas mileage?

thanks

[2oodoor]

sounds like you need to adjust the TV cable at the transmission. You can short or lengthen those to tweek your shift points. Makes a HUGE difference in how the car behaves. You should be able to hold OD D4 in at 60 mph. There will be a place in there where it will drift in and out, that is the near end of what you want out of a properely adjusted cable. The far end is where the car shifts in 1 and 2, should'nt hold on too long but yes long enough to take advantage of the engines torque and not bogg.

my 2 cents on the crank bolt, a milwalkee 1/2 inch 115 volt ac electric impact 300 ft lbs, took care of the last one I did. My cordless just whimpered at it because this bolt had never been off before. Yes any air impact should get it, and you dont need a lot of air for an impact gun to work. ive changed a six lug wheel with one portable air tank full of air before, hooked an air chuck to the hose.

Helicoils, I believe both Mitsubishi and Ford approve those repairs on spark plug holes. ( they also recommend removal of the head to install them too but F that..can you say ShopVac... Lol) You have to use the correct one and use the correct torque and spark plug.

On adjusting the valves , my own method is setting them at .007 and .011 and adjust the nut down on the feeler guage, making sure the gauge is being held level with the gap and not at any angle. then let the rocker and valve stem hold the guage pinched just as I let out the nut so it will slide out with slight to very little drag. You should be able to recheck those again at .006 &.010 with gentle drag on the feeler guage. Be sure the nut does not turn the adjustment in when it is tightend.

[zigzag]

i have adjusted the tv cable before but this is recent that this has all happened.... in 3rd all gears shift perfect and right on time.... but in OD D4 it takes the car 4500 rpms to shift out of 1st.... im just going to flush the trani.... its been about if not a little more than a year so it could use it anyways. as far as the filter goes as soon as i find out what to do with the connection between the black box in front of the air intake ill run out and buy one.... pics comming later today to show what im talking about.

[2oodoor]

well the cable can get stuck too. fyi
Also the other end of it, is yours connected to the carb or to the gas pedal, they came both ways.
On the air filter, I always thought the only way to go to another air filter box was to use one from a 3rd gen Civic. There is a thread here about this.
Just completing the info, not saying you didnt already know :wave:

[zigzag]

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e330/mysticshrooms/PICT0469.jpg

well here it is.... i know the one going to the head cover gets a mini filter but the one below it.... what do i do? i cant leave it open.... thats the only thing holding me back i believe.... and i dont even know what its for to be honest i mean half of it splits off and dead ends...

[russiankid]

It's for the air pump system. That hose connects the airbox to the system but also acts as a baffle.

[zigzag]

so is there a way to bypass it? or connect it elsewhere?

[russiankid]

I missed the whole thread, what are you trying to do?

[zigzag]

im trying to put a dome filter over the carb and get rid of the big black breather.... ive explained it a bit with what im going to do with the air temp sensor and gave a link to the edelbrock filter im going to use.... just trying to figure out how im going to make all this work....

[cygnus x-1]

Will that Edelbrock filter fit on the carb? If it does then the rest should be pretty easy. Put a breather on the valve cover and on that black box for the air suction valve. The air temp sensor could go just about anywhere really, but inside the filter would be a good spot.

The air suction valve BTW lets fresh air (from the filter box) into the exhaust stream to help the catalytic convertor do its job. That dead ended tube is just a resonator to help cut the noise down.

C|

[2oodoor]

you can remove the whole air blow thing totally, esp if you get the header, just save the flare nut on that line to make a plug out of it by welding a short bolt in it. Either way you can do away with it, of course it does help keep the cat cleaner if you need that.

[zigzag]

you guys are awesome ^_^.....:flash:*dances*.....

the filter is only 3 inches tall and with the box off it looks to have enough room.... if not then i can always return it :P i will let my dad know about this and will get started on it soon.... btw will this help with MPG i hear it does cause of more air.... but i dont know if itll make my car run too lean or rich.... but i can always mess with the adjustment knobs if needed.