engine build b18c

[levon2008]

hey guys its been a very long long time, but on a good note i save alot of money 20k
and now im ready to blow it.

I was looking to build a engine b18c and im not sure where to start i know its going to be a N/A build. I wanted to buy a spoon engine but its for long endurance racing from what i have read. I want a 1/4 mile engine, plus some good top end speed so i can take a 1/4 with nice numbers and go fast on the freeway too.

I need some info on spoon valvetrains and cams good for 1/4 or not. I wanted to get some spoon pistons too but im not sure this is a good idea. I was looking at toda valve springs and retainers. Pretty much i want to go fast and have some rare stuff under the hood like a good little rice head. For sure im getting the mugen valve cover would be nice if i could put more mugen stuff in the engine but i dont know where to look for it. Mugen cams would be pretty awsome.

Please let me know a good set up im looking for high compression and high revs i have been told thats always good for 1/4 mile. I want a beast of a engine im also doing tranny work maybe close ratio i dont know spoon sells a set of close ratio gears. I will also be upgrading my master cylinder i saw some that you press the clutch in half the distance and its ready to go.

Let me know if im going on the right track or not..

Levon

[levon2008]

Oh i forgot i was wondering about omni power intake and exhast valves theyre flat on the tops.

Basically ill do a list of things i was thinking of getting

Toda vtec billet series camshafts Or the spoon racing camshafts
Toda cam gears Or Spoon cam gears
Spoon Sports Balanced JDM Type-R pistons
IL4 bronze valve guides
Toda or Spoon Titanium Valve Retainers
Toda or Spoon Vtec valve spring set or Mugen Valve Spring Set
omni power intake and exhast valves Flat tops
Crower 4340 Steel Billet Connecting Rods
Spoon B-Series Baffle Oil Pan
DC Stainless 2pc. 4-2-1 Header or DC Brushed Stainless 1pc. 4-2-1 Header
or Mugen Power Exhaust Manifold 4-1 Maybe the toda Toda B-series Competition Exhaust Manifold 4-2-1+ Tapper design
I want to swap the manifold also i Was looking at the skunk2 manifold but im sure theres something better
ARP studs

I dont know what else lol

[levon2008]

no body knows anything about this topic?? Oh if someone does reply i forgot to mention i would like this car to be a daily driver. So i dont want to go over board just enough p0wer to smoke some cars around the city..

[Hauntd ca3]

i wouldnt put in a really big set of cams if shes a dd
the spoon motor sounds good to me
you can get 55mm quad throttle set ups for the b motors but they are not cheap
$2000 last time i saw some
that with a set of fast road occasional racer type cam and a decent ecu
like a motec or autronic ecu.
the 4/1 headers are the way to go for hp
2.5 inch piping with straight thru muffler,resonator and hi flow cat if need be
you really need to talk to an engine builder about what you want and need as most of the time they are competely diff things
is easy to build a big hp motor, but if you only gunna drag race it a few times a month
you have to live the rest of the time with a complete pig of a motor that needs 5000 rpm to work right
for a dd, i'd build a turbo motor
but if you have another car for a dd, go fuckin nuts with an na motor for a fun car

[Vector]

20k....

build the a20 for boost.... eos

with that kinda money you can make that motor in there hella fast, and reliable, without having to worry about mounts or converting anything.

[levon2008]

aright i am serious about a swap i saw this site that sells a few motors but i know that its over priced if i can figure out how they did it ill build it my self.... heres the site maybe someone can help me get more or close to the power this site is putting out. I didnt like the fact that they use the stock rods and they didnt say anything about the valves. Oh and look at the retainers they are steel lol. heres the site the motor is at the very bottom B16 http://www.kingmotorsports.com/category.aspx?cat=17

Here is what i am thinking that will get almost the same power:

B16 build list:

B16 Block $99 --- Pick Your Part
Gsr Head $40 --- Pick Your Part

Takes existing 77.4mm stroke to 87.2mm stroke
1.8 Spoon Stroker kit (11.3:1 cr) theres no bore stock bore 81mm $1180
(i could bore and get 84mm safely making the 1.8L to 2.0L) then resleeve

Omni Power Valves flat tops $249.99
Toda Platinum Valve Retainers $249.99
Toda Valve Spring Set $360
IL4 Bronze Valve Guides $45
Skunk2 Pro2+ Cams $703

Total Like 3k then i have 17k for other mods

Tranny:

ATS Carbonetic Close Gear Ratio 1+3+4 $1200
Toda B-Series Lightweight Flywheel $450
Spoon LSD Kit $1200
Exedy Street/Race Twin Plate Clutch Stage 4 $1700

Total like 4k still 12k

Misc:

Omni Power Quickclutch Master Cylinder $197
iL4 Performance Clutch Lines $49.83
MSD Pro-Billet Distributor Kit $250
NGK Power Cables (Spark Plug Wires) $119

Total like $600

Ill use the rest for paintjob bucket seats and body kit..

[Hauntd ca3]

not what id be doin but not my car
you'd get better power from a b20a for similar money
and you did you allow for machining as well
prob as much there as the cost of parts if not more

[levon2008]

yea im just looking for something to keep me intrested this is the engine in here in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiFISY-VMKA this has to be the one off the site below

[A18A]

20 grand damn. loan me $300 lol. seriously though if you do decide to dump it all on the 3g, i'm keen on seeing the finished project

[Accordtheory]

B16 Block $99 --- Pick Your Part
Gsr Head $40 --- Pick Your Part




I call bs on this whole thread.

Go to the all motor section on honda-tech.com, and get flamed there. :werd:

[levon2008]

I call bs on this whole thread.

Go to the all motor section on honda-tech.com, and get flamed there. :werd:

How do you call BS?? heres the site dont believe me i live in cali http://www.pickyourpart.com/pricing/ call BS again buddy type in head and type in Block then come back to my post and call BS if any thing maybe you should type my name into the search button and see what i have done with my car so far. Give me a Break, I joined the military the United States Army and got a sign on bonus of 20k. I am trying to build a DD that has some balls. Goto http://www.inlinefour.com/spoonbserena.html and price that shit out above you wont find the skunk2+ Cams but google those too. Keep your mouth shut if you dont know what your talking about..

Thanks Levon :gun: BS

[forrest89sei]

Theres also that one pick a part yard off of hwy 99 just out of madera

while I wish you luck your chances of finding a b16 head and a GSR block at a pick a part or any do it yourself yard is pretty low.. those yards tend to have stock cars not your swapped cars, but good luck

also rethink things like the clutch, stage 4 is gonna suck ass as a daily driver your in Fresno your going light to light, I'd hate Shaw Ave or Blackstone with a stage 4 lol

[Civic Accord Honda]

i reckon a stage 4 clutch would really suck ass in fresno haha i would go with stage 1 or 2

[Civic Accord Honda]

"link Removed"

[levon2008]

I was going to sell it but theres no buyers, And as the days went by i kept looking at it like I really dont want to sell it and well i cant go through with it. The only problem is i deleted the email allowing me to remove or edit the post lol. Oh i put them in up side down it sounds nice and clear out side of the car and inside the car. I can have the windows rolled up and blast the shit out of the system and it sounds like your inside the car its pretty clear... But yea just to clear that up i cant remove the post. I also have to ship out to my base in virginia i will have to drive my car out there. Now i have people on here hitting me up about buying it Dark Accord could you remove that post?? thanks


Levon

[Civic Accord Honda]

I was going to sell it but theres no buyers, And as the days went by i kept looking at it like I really dont want to sell it and well i cant go through with it. The only problem is i deleted the email allowing me to remove or edit the post lol. Oh i put them in up side down it sounds nice and clear out side of the car and inside the car. I can have the windows rolled up and blast the shit out of the system and it sounds like your inside the car its pretty clear... But yea just to clear that up i cant remove the post. I also have to ship out to my base in virginia i will have to drive my car out there. Now i have people on here hitting me up about buying it Dark Accord could you remove that post?? thanks


Levon
ah ok and no problem

[levon2008]

I thought of a crazy idea taking the b20a crankshaft and stuffing it into the b16 block will this work. I read that any crank from a b series motor will fit any b series block. If this is true what would i need to do to get this crank inside the b16 block

B20a crank is 95mm stroke

If i can fit this inside the block it will raise the following

LS CRANK
12.24:1 cr5
1793 cc

B20A CRANK
13:1 cr
1958 cc

If this works i will have the sickest b16 motor its almost a 2L engine just 50 more cc. All this is done without any boring of the cylinders ha, and they say get a b18 if i bore the cylinders to 83mm my math figures ill get 2054cc thats a 2 liter engine. Think it would run like shit for a daily though. If i dont bore will the thing run like crap for a dd?

[MessyHonda]

the only thing i liked about going b-series is that even if you wreck your car some one is willing to buy a b-series engine cuz they can fit any civic or integera...if you build an A series no one will buy it cuz only the 2nd gen lude and accord ppl could use it...most of us just need a daily driver not a sports car.

[rustlude87]

Why would you want to put a B20 crank in a B16 that would ruin its great r/s ratio?

And the engines that you posted aren't even the correct ones your thinking about the B20a came in the 88-91 honda prelude Si's which is a completely different B series engine. Thats why it's called the bastard B engine because of it's horrible r/s ratio (tend to throw rods).

Also the LS is a 1.8 liter engine which is not even close to a B16. If you want to make a B series engine with a 1.9 liter engine don't waste your time.

You can make a Cr/vtec which is a B20b and B16 head.

If this is a DD and needs to be reliable just do some bolt ons to the old A20 there not that slow.
Final note: I think your a big dreamer but you want to be like everyone else that owns a civic and swaps a b series. These cars are different from those and you can't do most things others can. If swaps and aftermarket is what you want these older accords aren't for you.

[Accordtheory]

Keep your mouth shut if you dont know what your talking about..

You have a lot to learn.
For one, you will Never find a vtec block or head at a junkyard for $99 or $40.

Your b series info is incorrect.
B16, 77mm stroke, gsr, 87.2, ls/b20, 89. Not 95mm. The B20 (CRV, Not old prelude) is a bigger bore with the 89 stroke, I believe 84mm, vs 81 in the 1.6/1.8s. 1st and 2nd gen b16s have the same deck height, shorter than the gsr/ls/b20. The b16a3 (99-00 si) supposedly is a p72 block. (gsr) I got schooled on this on honda-tech. Don't ask me why honda built it that way. I would have built it as a b17 (something like 84mm stroke) with a good r/s ratio. Instead they chose to relocate the wristpin in the piston down, and keep the same 1.74:1 ratio.
The gsr and b16 heads are also different. The gsr has a smaller chamber with more quench, which is better. The b16 and the type r heads are the same casting. Why honda elected to use the b16 casting for the type r, I don't know.
I suggest you get a gsr. The b16 has too little torque for any non featherweight car, and the type r is too expensive. The gsr has the vtec head with the nice quench, oil squirters, and the bottom end girdle.
Stroking a b16 with the lower deck height block is really stupid. Your rod/stroke ratio goes to shit. The gsr is already kind of lousy, at 1.58: r/s. The ls/b20 is worse, at 1.54:1. The gsr is the best tradeoff between displacement and r/s ratio, and not nearly as expensive as the type r.

If you Really want to piss away that money, get a k20. K20s are the best motors honda has built so far. Plus, you get a 6spd tranny.

[Accordtheory]

Then again, a junkyard turbosystem could easily and cheaply be put on the a20 that would embarrass the k series. Holset hy/hx35 off a dodge cummins diesel, homemade manifold (or the manifold I have for sale, lol) precision front mount, walbro, 1000cc injectors, obd1 conversion, hondata s300/etc, a good clutch, and you've got enough power to kick some serious ass..provided the tranny holds up.

[mykwikcoupe]

Then again, a junkyard turbosystem could easily and cheaply be put on the a20 that would embarrass the k series. Holset hy/hx35 off a dodge cummins diesel, homemade manifold (or the manifold I have for sale, lol) precision front mount, walbro, 1000cc injectors, obd1 conversion, hondata s300/etc, a good clutch, and you've got enough power to kick some serious ass..provided the tranny holds up.

I will say you know more technical info about this than me but just clarify a few things. The B18c is a jdm GSR engine. The JDM B20a does have a 95mm crank. Im not saying these are what hes reffering to or that anyone is more right than wrong.

I would also prefer to go turbo a20a. Its proven theres more accords with easliy had cheap parts than something newer and the only thing you really get with the newer B series is higher revving. Id go with accordtheory's suggestion. best of luck to you either way

[Civic Accord Honda]

Then again, a junkyard turbosystem could easily and cheaply be put on the a20 that would embarrass the k series. Holset hy/hx35 off a dodge cummins diesel, homemade manifold (or the manifold I have for sale, lol) precision front mount, walbro, 1000cc injectors, obd1 conversion, hondata s300/etc, a good clutch, and you've got enough power to kick some serious ass..provided the tranny holds up.
he should do that ^ A20 FTMFW!

[Hauntd ca3]

i still think that the b20a with a low pressure( 6-7 psi) turbo system would be just the thing for a quick accord dd
nice long stroke lends to good torque and aslong as you dont rev them like a b16 or b18c i'd say it would last for years and wouldnt have to much trouble with 200 whp or more.
listen to dark and accord theory and the other long time accord modders levon
they've been at it long enuff to know what will work

[Accordtheory]

just clarify a few things. The B18c is a jdm GSR engine. The JDM B20a does have a 95mm crank.

The accord/prelude motor jdm b20a, yeah. The b20b/z CRV motor, which is completely different and compatible with the vtec head, is 89mm. When talking about the b18s, I just call them by their car, ls, gsr, or type r, usually. So if the b18c is the jdm type r, I'm guessing that replaces the b18c5 in japan, and they still have the b18c1 in the gsr? (Or are they all type r's in japan..lol. The one and only car that I know of that is actually tuned up from the jdm spec for the u.s. market is the supra, 320hp u.s. vs like 280 jdm. Just about everything else there is better.)

[codyJDM]

You're forgetting the SiR and SiR-II. It isn't called a GSR in japan.

[Accordtheory]

So what motors do they have, then?

[Hauntd ca3]

The accord/prelude motor jdm b20a, yeah. The b20b/z CRV motor, which is completely different and compatible with the vtec head, is 89mm. When talking about the b18s, I just call them by their car, ls, gsr, or type r, usually. So if the b18c is the jdm type r, I'm guessing that replaces the b18c5 in japan, and they still have the b18c1 in the gsr? (Or are they all type r's in japan..lol. The one and only car that I know of that is actually tuned up from the jdm spec for the u.s. market is the supra, 320hp u.s. vs like 280 jdm. Just about everything else there is better.)

the jdm tegs are the vtir and type r for the vtec motors
and i think the b18c3? is the plain dohc vtec vtir motor and the c5 is the type r motor. not sure of the proper designation
the gsr has a b18 non vtec motor
think that is still a diff block casting to the b series accord motors tho

[codyJDM]

the jdm tegs are the vtir and type r for the vtec motors
and i think the b18c3? is the plain dohc vtec vtir motor and the c5 is the type r motor. not sure of the proper designation
the gsr has a b18 non vtec motor
think that is still a diff block casting to the b series accord motors tho

Pretty much anything with a C in the name has vtec if I'm not mistaken

[Accordtheory]

Well, whatever. Who cares anyway. Not hard to find out what you're getting when you buy it.

[levon2008]

This is exactly what i needed thank you guys for the great info....



Levon