Let's fix up the suspension - 3G love

[w261w261]

Well, with 217k on the SE-i, and probably 75k on the Bilsteins, I've lately been hearing some noises in the rear when I hit a sharp bump. Also, squeaking in the front when I turn the wheel. Time for some fresh parts. I already have a camber adjustment kit and some bushings (rear swing arm and rear shock lower) ready to go in, so I decided to get all new bushings, save the front sway bar and radius arm bushings, and the rear upper arm stuff, which is virtually new. It took me two hours of plowing through Majestic's pages to order, ultimately, 22 lines of parts (57 total pieces). Along the way, I called Bilstein to see if the shock mounting bushings were different than Honda's (they aren't, but I also was told that the Bilstein "lifetime" warranty doesn't apply if they've been revalved, even by them (bummer)).

I told my mechanic to reserve me a couple of days of his time, cause the whole front and rear suspension is going to have to be torn apart. Apparently, the big bushings in the front of the rear trailing arms aren't too easy to get out, and the rear shock lower bushing has to be pressed into the knuckle.

The only thing I skipped over was the steering tie rod ends. Do they wear appreciably? I have no leaks there, so for now decided to leave the steering alone.

I'm pumped to have everything be new-tight. Cost of all those little bushings, plus upper and lower front arms/ball joints: $852.00. Better than the $1,200 my local dealer would have charged.

[markmdz89hatch]

Hal, I admire you for your dedication to your 3G. If you need any help at all, please don't hesitate to ask and I'll be ready and willing to help in any way I can. After all, I feel weird that I've met your car, yet never met you.

Anyway, so what are you going to end up doing for shocks? Are you going to have Billstein rebuild your current shocks, or do you intend to explore alternatives?

As for the tie-rod ends, I personally would treat those as a part for replacement not just by way of a 'preventative maintenance' item, but rather as a 'wait until there's some indication of excessive wear'. That's if you're talking about your inner tie-rods. The outers are a different story. They have a considerably range of motion during normal driving, and see a fair amount of use. More-so with aftermarket suspension, than with stock. That said, I would have them inspected for boot tearing, or grease seepage of any type. ...and do the shake test to determine if there's any play in the joint. If all pass, then save yourself some $$ and wait on them.

[Joay]

Hal, I admire you for your dedication to your 3G.
:werd:

I can't imagine how good that's going to feel; I think my car handles great with destroyed balljoints and disintegrated bushings all over the place. Would you mind posting the list of stuff you ordered? I have a spreadsheet full of suspension stuff for when I eventually overhaul my own but it sounds like you found a whole lot of stuff I missed.

[w261w261]

:Would you mind posting the list of stuff you ordered? I have a spreadsheet full of suspension stuff for when I eventually overhaul my own but it sounds like you found a whole lot of stuff I missed.

OK, here it is. But there's more bushings than are on this order: the 4 strut rod bushings (very important), those for the front sway bar, and the front of the rear trailing arms. The rear UCA is new already, so nothing there. Also, as I was contemplating what I might have missed, I noticed that it's been 68k since my last timing belt/water pump/hoses/belts/fuel filter/thermostat etc., so I'm going to have all those done. I'll let my mechanic - who is quite willing to let me give him all the parts I want to with no hard feelings - get the belts. I replaced all the coolant hoses about 3 years ago, so I'm only going to redo the upper and lower radiator hoses - I think they get harder service.

The big word(s) on the bushings is SILICONE GREASE. I jump up and down each time on this. It seems elementary that a mechanic would do it, but I've had problems before. Particularly with our suspensions, prone to the dreaded creaking.

Sorry for the large size. I don't know how to make it smaller.

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/2883/majesticorderi409.jpg (http://img524.imageshack.us/my.php?image=majesticorderi409.jpg)

[phillie]

That's a lot of cash.

[w261w261]

<<Anyway, so what are you going to end up doing for shocks? Are you going to have Billstein rebuild your current shocks, or do you intend to explore alternatives?>>

<<That's a lot of cash>>


I <think> my shocks are ok. Certainly, they don't exhibit any bobbing on hard sweepers with bumps. I'm assuming that the noise I hear from the rear and now from the front a bit is other parts of the suspension. It's hard to tell, even from an inspection when the car is up on a rack, because under most circumstances, everything is fine....it's only on a sharp ridge in the pavement that I hear things. I originally thought it was the rear ball joint, and so I replaced both of the UCA's back there...interestingly it helped, but did not eliminate the problem. Since I've had the car since 86k (8 years now, whew!), I know that the rear bushings have never been replaced, and that noise is aggravating, so I'm just getting rid of everything rubber, including the shock bushings, the big rear trailing arm front bushings, anything I could find that might be worn enough to be ok on small bumps, but not on big ones. I considered whacking the suspension with a sledge to simulate a large deflection, but basically decided to throw money at the problem instead. Since I plan on keeping the car forever, I don't mind. And although putting $1,000 in parts and who knows what in labor -well, I'll know soon enough :) - is a lot of money relative to the value of the car, many of my friends and neighbors have vehicles that are depreciating at thousands -many thousands- of dollars per year. I just got back from dinner, in which we went in a friend's brandy new 528i AWD Bimmer, sticker $56k. Very nice, but I feel like I'm riding in a leather-lined tank. When I sit down in my car, with it's never-to-be-seen-again Formula 1 like view (Euro pedestrian protection regs and no more pop-up lights), I'd rather be in my 3G. The fact that most of the rest of the world (including my wife) does not share my opinion matters not a bit to me. I've hardly spent a dollar on the car in the past year, so if I have to spend $2500 now it's not so bad. The Goddamn Passat ate $3200 with only 72k on it last fall (head gasket, timing belt, etc), and it's not half the car that the 3G is - well, maybe 3/4's the car - the 2004 model Passat is the last year that was an A4 with a different body, so it's pretty nice.

If I do all this, then still have the noise, I guess I'll conclude that I have busted something in the right rear shock. Then I'd just get a couple of new Bilsteins, as those aren't revalved so Bilstein should help me out. But I really don't think they are the problem.

As an aside, I'd also like to say again how happy I am with my Bilstein/Eibach mod. Once I homed in on the right revalve for the fronts (330/115), I really couldn't ask for more from the suspension. It's only dropped 1", and perhaps I'd go for 1 1/2" if I was doing it over, but it's not that big of a deal.

And lastly, I guess I have the sin of pride mixed with sadness, as I watch the 3G generation slowly melt away. The enthusiasts are left of course, and that makes us more special. But it is a little like watching distant relatives die one by one. Maybe you don't cry because you didn't know them that well, but you are connected in some way, and so their passing seems a little sad. But you carry on. Next year, a new paint job, mainly because the rear wheel arches have the usual cancer, and it'll be a good one. So good, that it's going to be worth a lie to my wife.

[nswst8]

Yeah, I'm with you on this one. Just did the timing belt, upper control arms (Advance auto ponied up replacements off 2002 warranty receipt saved $300) strut rod bushing, valve adjustment.

But I did the work myself to save the big bucks. I really don't like other people working on my car. Plus I'm cheap.

[w261w261]

But I did the work myself to save the big bucks. I really don't like other people working on my car. Plus I'm cheap.

A guy named Terry works on my car, in a shop owned by a 20 year ex Honda dealer mechanic. Terry and only Terry works on it, and although I would prefer no one touch it, I have no time, no lift, and candidly, not enough knowledge. Terry has frequently asked me to sell him the car when I get rid of it, and I've told him that IF I would sell it it would be to him, so I guess he's especially motivated to do a good job. He would anyway though, because he's Terry. But I've also told him that I'm never selling the car. Terry thinks I will, eventually. I know I won't. But I'm 20 or 30 years older than him, so maybe he'll get it someday. Hah.

[nswst8]

Good to know you have a good mechanic, I ran into to many bad ones. I know a few great ones and they laugh all the time when I call and ask about something. Their reply is "You know it's something stupid" and 9 out of 10 times it is. But thats why I'm not a professional mechanic.

Its therapy for me.

[Civic Accord Honda]

new suspension is always worth the price! it will feel like a whole new car when its installed

[MessyHonda]

spend the money and buy the k sporks....cah is right....when you put a new suspension on the car it will ride way better....the thing for me is that i need new tires because the tires it has are really bad....cant go fast in corners with out making noises

[LX-incredible]

Ah, I remember my first suspension overhaul with honda parts. Shit was expensive. Trashed half of them in less than a year with my crazy driving and ATF leak. Went with poly the next time around and no problems for over 2 years. But boy did it ride smooth with the new oem bushings.

[2drSE-i]

....cah is right....\

:jaw:

[Civic Accord Honda]

:jaw:

:lol: :lol: