Various A-series Cam Grind Specs

[Smeado]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v490/NSXPERT/CamPhases2.jpg

this topic is discussed over at PP.

http://www.preludepower.com/forums/showthread.php?t=319107

I thought you guys might like the link. it applies to you too. and maybe somebody could help us out to make it better.

Cheers

Smeado

[Tomisimo]

ouh nice.. thanks, looks like WebRace is more stable then the others..

[2drSE-i]

Web cams are bisi cams correct?

[MessyHonda]

is the colt the tri flow one?

[Oldblueaccord]

Well colts are ground were as Web does rewelding and grinding. Im just glancing at the chart. SO the web cams you can see they have more built in lift.


wp

[cygnus x-1]

Just wanted to add some notes here.

Web does regrinds and weld ups depending on which grind you choose. The stage 1 and 2 are regrinds and the race cam is a weld up. Web also makes the cams for Bisi but I don't know if they are the same grinds or if Bisi spec'd them differently. Colt also does regrinds or weld ups depending on what you want.

The Colt is a stage 1 triflow that I measured from my own head. There is still some question about the lift numbers of the Colt vs the others since the Colt is the only aftermarket cam with direct measurements. The others are based on published specs which may not match real world results exactly. I'm also going to take some more detailed measurements on the Colt and a stock cam to see if my measurement technique is adding some error.

It would be really great if we could get some actual measurements on the Delta or Web cams.

http://www.coltcams.com/
http://www.webcamshafts.com/


C|

[bobafett]

Thanks for this post, definitely interesting!

[Rendon LX-i]

very instresting...No delta cam graph?

[cygnus x-1]

very instresting...No delta cam graph?


We don't have any specs for Delta. If someone has a spare to send me I would be more than happy to measure it. :)

I've tried searching old posts but haven't found anything yet.

C|

[Tdurr]

Just wanted to add some notes here.

Web does regrinds and weld ups depending on which grind you choose. The stage 1 and 2 are regrinds and the race cam is a weld up. Web also makes the cams for Bisi but I don't know if they are the same grinds or if Bisi spec'd them differently. Colt also does regrinds or weld ups depending on what you want.

The Colt is a stage 1 triflow that I measured from my own head. There is still some question about the lift numbers of the Colt vs the others since the Colt is the only aftermarket cam with direct measurements. The others are based on published specs which may not match real world results exactly. I'm also going to take some more detailed measurements on the Colt and a stock cam to see if my measurement technique is adding some error.

It would be really great if we could get some actual measurements on the Delta or Web cams.

http://www.coltcams.com/
http://www.webcamshafts.com/


C|

if i ever get the extra cash ill be getting a bisi cam so I'll be more then happy to spec my delta if it isnt done by then.

[Smeado]

more info added. bump to see if anybody here want to help contribute to the resource.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v490/NSXPERT/Deltaintake.jpg

take care,

Smeado

[Vanilla Sky]

What's the light blue one?

[Smeado]

delta 270... sorry the legend got cutoff

[JohnBoy]

so which is better the colt stage 2 or the web 2 for a turbo

[lostforawhile]

so colt makes a non triflow? the info was very interesting that the triflow is mostly designed for FI setups VS carb setups. It says they make it but it's not as well advertised. it looks like i would want to look for a stage 2 non triflow for this carb setup. They say the torque loss problem is due to the way fuel injection works with the cam vs carbed

[MessyHonda]

so which is better the colt stage 2 or the web 2 for a turbo

i got a stage 2 colt tri flow to idle at 900 rpm with my set up...fuel injected tho...it was nice...i like the way it would pull to the 6k redline

[AccordEpicenter]

i never really liked the triflow grinds, up top they dont breathe as well as a non triflow grind because they have a little less lift and duration on one intake valve, which gives a little more midrange but doesnt flow as much as a straight grind up top. Huge duration cams with big overlap (usually race type grinds) are bad for turbo, your better off with a milder grind depending on your setup for boost. Im not really sure what this A/T grind is they are talking about though...

[cygnus x-1]

i never really liked the triflow grinds, up top they dont breathe as well as a non triflow grind because they have a little less lift and duration on one intake valve, which gives a little more midrange but doesnt flow as much as a straight grind up top. Huge duration cams with big overlap (usually race type grinds) are bad for turbo, your better off with a milder grind depending on your setup for boost. Im not really sure what this A/T grind is they are talking about though...


That's kind of the idea with the triflow grinds. Sacrifice a little up top in order to not loose any down low, and to not affect the idle.

The A/T cam is an older one that Smeado had from some time ago. They aren't made anymore.

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[A20A1]

I forget who has my cam from colt, but it wasn't a triflo. I think Shep79 has it maybe?

[JohnBoy]

hey guy's i have a stage 2 tri-flo but was looking into the web stage 1 and the bisi stage 1.4 turbo grind. i don't know what one to go with a little help please. and i do know bisi gets there cams done through web but there diff. grinds.

[cygnus x-1]

hey guy's i have a stage 2 tri-flo but was looking into the web stage 1 and the bisi stage 1.4 turbo grind. i don't know what one to go with a little help please. and i do know bisi gets there cams done through web but there diff. grinds.


A stage 2 might have a bit much overlap for a turbo, although the triflow stage 2 will have less than everyone else's stage 2. You might as Geoff at Colt and see what he says about using that cam for turbo. If you decide to go with a web/bisi then either the 1.2 or the 2.4 grinds should be good. Actually the Colt stage 2 and the Bisi 2.4 might not be much different.

Since you already have the Colt you could just try it and see what happens. Cams are easy to swap.

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[JohnBoy]

A stage 2 might have a bit much overlap for a turbo, although the triflow stage 2 will have less than everyone else's stage 2. You might as Geoff at Colt and see what he says about using that cam for turbo. If you decide to go with a web/bisi then either the 1.2 or the 2.4 grinds should be good. Actually the Colt stage 2 and the Bisi 2.4 might not be much different.

Since you already have the Colt you could just try it and see what happens. Cams are easy to swap.

C|

sry i meant 1.2 for bisi. but web and bisi are two diff. grinds? i don't know i might just get all of them and hit the dyno to find out whats the best. i'm looking for the one that will give me the most torque since the motors don't really like the high rpm's like the b & k motor

[cygnus x-1]

sry i meant 1.2 for bisi. but web and bisi are two diff. grinds? i don't know i might just get all of them and hit the dyno to find out whats the best. i'm looking for the one that will give me the most torque since the motors don't really like the high rpm's like the b & k motor


Web only lists 3 grinds for us where Bisi lists like 5 or 6 I think? I have no idea if any of them are really the same cams but I would think the straight 1/2/3 stage cams are anyway. I kinda wish Bisi would put up the timing specs for his cams so we could tell what's what.

My thinking (largely opinion) is that the Bisi 1.2 would probably be the best for a reasonably streetable turbo A20. The 2.4 would likely work well too but the RPM range looks high for an A20. I think I would want the lower RPM power band and just turn up the boost.


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[JohnBoy]

see that is kind of what i was thinking since i was running 15 to 30 psi the boost down low would be good RPM's really looking around 7500 but torque is what i'm looking for. i look in to custom gear be cause if i only go 100mph thats fine but to get there in a snap of your fingers is what i what. and your right about bisi everything is a mistory with him lol.

[Smeado]

just a little update.. here is my latest version of the graph.
all cams are graphed form actual measurements except the A/T cam since i wanted that for my own reference and the Web A so i could compare it with the Web A that Cygnus measured to see how the specs and measurement lined up.

if anybody has a cam that they want to measure with a micrometer and put on the graph i will gladly take the data and add it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v490/NSXPERT/CamFEB10.jpg

Cheers,
Smeado
PS thanks to justanothermike for the openloop cam.. it is quite nice

[lostforawhile]

does anyone know where the thread is that lists the companies that do the cams and the different grinds? I've searched and searched and it's somehow gotten buried

[89T]

lazy, http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37583

took like 5 seconds without the search.lol

[lostforawhile]

lazy, http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37583

took like 5 seconds without the search.lol
thanks, i actually searched for 30 minutes, we need a sticky in performance that simply lists the cam grinders, the contact info, and what spec of cams they offer. the Bisimotor valve spring info and contact could also be in there.

[89T]

Its in the faq's!