Diagnosis Help

[sfcmikej]

Hey

Not sure what happened. I am somewhat a novice on the diagnosis end. Was driving when the RPM's went kind of crazy. Went real high then low then very eratic. THen engine died. Limped off the road and was lucky enough to park it safely.

Will not start now. Starter will turn the engine but will not start. Doesn't seem to have spark.

I suspect timing belt but am not sure. Any ideas? Any reccomendations on what to look at?

Thanks

Mike Johnston

[lostforawhile]

Hey

Not sure what happened. I am somewhat a novice on the diagnosis end. Was driving when the RPM's went kind of crazy. Went real high then low then very eratic. THen engine died. Limped off the road and was lucky enough to park it safely.

Will not start now. Starter will turn the engine but will not start. Doesn't seem to have spark.

I suspect timing belt but am not sure. Any ideas? Any reccomendations on what to look at?

Thanks

Mike JohnstonI would say the module inside of the dizzy , if you have a meter you can unplu the primary side that feeds power to the coil, then see if it's producing DC pulses when someone is cranking over the engine, the tach reading crazy then the car shutting down is almost always the module. what kind of dizzy is it? the brand? also need to know what model,is it carbed or fuel injected?

[sfcmikej]

It is a 1986 Accord LXi with fuel injection.

[lostforawhile]

It is a 1986 Accord LXi with fuel injection.

trying to remember if the module is inside of the dizzy or not on those, used to carbed engines. eithier way i would test for a bad module, thats what it sounds like.

[sfcmikej]

Gotta love the Maule. Forgive the ignorance but what is the dizzy?

[lostforawhile]

Gotta love the Maule. Forgive the ignorance but what is the dizzy?

the thing sticking out of your engine with all the spark plug wires on it, Dk why they call it that here but they always have.

[sfcmikej]

Ah, then it would be the distributer or the electronic equivilent to it. So the module would be the EFI module?

[lostforawhile]

Ah, then it would be the distributer or the electronic equivilent to it. So the module would be the EFI module?no the ignition module 0

[sfcmikej]

OK, thanks for all the help.

[sfcmikej]

One more question. Is the module the same as the igniter?

[lostforawhile]

One more question. Is the module the same as the igniter?

yep
normally on these cars when it' going the tach will act crazy due to it putting out erratic signals

[w261w261]

What happened with the fuel injected engines is Honda needed a way to tell what the position of the crankshaft was (a so-called crank position sensor). They did a workaround using a sensor inside the distributor to provide this information. When you buy a remanufactured distributor ("dizzy") I think that the rebuilders don't bother with this little extra part, and consequently (like what happened to me) you buy a nice-looking part that, when installed, doesn't work. I ended up with a junkyard piece, which has been working very well for the past 50k, thank you.

I agree, it sounds to me that your distributor cratered. The erratic tach is the main and pretty good clue. If you get a remanufactured one, be sure to keep the receipt and get a good guarantee.

[lostforawhile]

What happened with the fuel injected engines is Honda needed a way to tell what the position of the crankshaft was (a so-called crank position sensor). They did a workaround using a sensor inside the distributor to provide this information. When you buy a remanufactured distributor ("dizzy") I think that the rebuilders don't bother with this little extra part, and consequently (like what happened to me) you buy a nice-looking part that, when installed, doesn't work. I ended up with a junkyard piece, which has been working very well for the past 50k, thank you.

I agree, it sounds to me that your distributor cratered. The erratic tach is the main and pretty good clue. If you get a remanufactured one, be sure to keep the receipt and get a good guarantee.
I think the FI one has two pickups if i remember right, the ignition module can be replaced apart from the dizzy,usually the ignition module is the one that goes the other sensor just tells the computer the crankshaft position, both types of them have seperate ignitors

[Dr_Snooz]

eithier way i would test for a bad module

I would welcome your insight on how exactly to do that?

[lostforawhile]

I would welcome your insight on how exactly to do that?
unplug the primary side going into the coil, and check for pulsed dc going into that side at the plug,while someone is cranking the car, chances are the module has failed.

[sfcmikej]

Hey all

Well I got out the Haynes Manual and it had some tests to see if the module was bad. Ran the tests and they failed. Got a new modue and installed. Still doesn't start. There is at least an even chance that I did the test wrong. What to check next? Entire distributer? Coil? Any suggestions appreciated.

Mike

[Dr_Snooz]

Post those tests! I've been looking forever to find out how to diagnose that stupid ICM. Post the tests!!!!!!

Now that I've got that off my chest, a no spark or no start condition is relatively easy to diagnose and the web abounds with how-tos Like this one (http://www.wikihow.com/Diagnose-a-Loss-of-Spark-in-Your-Car-Engine). Your Chilton's probably has a step-by-step guide too. The shop manual is available here (http://honda.roadpwnage.com/manuals/pages/usdm-accord-1989-full.php) and has all kinds of tests for specific components. Follow the steps and you'll have it figured out before you know it.

[Oldblueaccord]

Check your timing belt is still on. The rotor should turn when the car is cranked over.

Look your distributor over very well for loose shaft or worn parts underneath the flat plastic cap.

When your car cranks the tach should jump a little least my model does.

Get your coil tested or replace it.

wp

[Rendon LX-i]

if your car just turn off...i would check the timing belt mike.......the dizzy on these cars RARELY go out......im not ssaying lost it wrong but check that anyways....but if your belt is old and the teeth are soft then you can firgure out the rest LOL....check the main relay also....

[LX-incredible]

A bad bearing or chipped reluctor teeth (toothed thing directly under the rotor) can cause no spark on 2 or all cylinders. Check for shaft play and air gap between the reluctor and pick up plate (covered in your manual).

[ecogabriel]

I think the FI one has two pickups if i remember right, the ignition module can be replaced apart from the dizzy,usually the ignition module is the one that goes the other sensor just tells the computer the crankshaft position, both types of them have seperate ignitors

Yes, two pickup sensors. One tells when #1 cylinder is on top (forgot the mnemonic for this!!) and another tells when each cylinder is on top.

The module is mounted on the distributor wall outside of it. Whatever the testing procedure is make sure to get silicone grease when mounting it back (or mounting a new one). Silicone grease helps in transferring heat from the module to the distributor body that acts as a heatsink