alternator bad again.........

[Nio]

Okay so I bought a new battery. put it in, ran it for a day, then it dies, and now the alternator seems to be dead again. Even though its less then 2 weeks old. WTF...

you guys have any ideas. *can't stay I have to catch a ride to work now.*

[-DWM-]

Are you sure it's the alternator? Make sure all your connections in the charging system are clean and tight.

[Nio]

yeah im sure, i disconnected the plugs from the battery while she was running. she died right there on the spot.

[joebeets]

Battery icon illuminated on dash?

[Nio]

when she was running with the new battery yes. with old battery the light would flash when i would accelerate.

[lostforawhile]

have you thought about replacing the brushes? someone on here recently posted a link where you could buy them. they are pretty cheap, an alternator light coming on under acceleration normally indicates the brushes are failing. they are spring loaded, but if they are worn too short, the centrifugal force can force them away from the commutator

[Nio]

well some good news, oriellys said they would replace it if it tests bad. so i should have a new one by the end of the day.

[lostforawhile]

well some good news, oriellys said they would replace it if it tests bad. so i should have a new one by the end of the day.

bad news it's from Oreilies and probably rebuilt by the same people who rebuild the junk from autozoned and advanced. before I put the new one in my car i'm going to try and find a better regulator and quality brushes, the few minutes I spend on it may save me a lot of trouble in the future.

[headbanger]

have you thought about replacing the brushes? someone on here recently posted a link where you could buy them. they are pretty cheap, an alternator light coming on under acceleration normally indicates the brushes are failing. they are spring loaded, but if they are worn too short, the centrifugal force can force them away from the commutator

i bought brushes for my alternator at advance auto parts.

[Nio]

while i would love to get better parts i cant right now. i would rather use crappy parts since i dont even know if i have a cylinder issue as well.

[Hauntd ca3]

yeah im sure, i disconnected the plugs from the battery while she was running. she died right there on the spot.

thats not a good idea eh.
doing that blows up regulators.
and when you had the old battery in it, did you have to jump start the car when you put the new alternator on?
trying to charge a flat as battery is another good way to hurt an alternator.
it will try and charge its arse off which creates alot of heat in the rectifier and can end up blowing a diode. altenators are not designed to charge a completely flat battery and they need something to charge into unlike a generator which dosnt care
go buy a cheap 10 or 20 dollar digital multimeter from autoparts or what ever you have where you are.

[Nio]

thats not a good idea eh.
doing that blows up regulators.
and when you had the old battery in it, did you have to jump start the car when you put the new alternator on?
trying to charge a flat as battery is another good way to hurt an alternator.
it will try and charge its arse off which creates alot of heat in the rectifier and can end up blowing a diode. altenators are not designed to charge a completely flat battery and they need something to charge into unlike a generator which dosnt care
go buy a cheap 10 or 20 dollar digital multimeter from autoparts or what ever you have where you are.

Okay, first I didn't have to charge it when I put the new battery on, She ran right there, but her battery light had been on all the time once I put the new battery on.

I know about the battery issue if its dead and tries to start charge it, But This didn't happen until I put the new battery on, it was like once I put the brand new battery on it blew the alternator. Once I get the fuse, How would I test the alternator? which would I connect it to.

and I have a multimeter I just need to replace the fuse, it was a gift. >.< even though it was a broken gift its easy to fix.

[Nio]

BTW thanks guys, You all a big help. If it wasn't for you guys I would probably be screwed. :P

[ecogabriel]

NAPA sells brushes too -I got mine from there.

Also, I am allergic to "remanufactured" stuff as quite often what fails may be replaceable by a conscious DIY -brushes, voltage regulator. Check the service manual for testing procedures; also, get a digital multimeter as it has been suggested here -it'll pay itself in no time. Chances are you may narrow down what may possible be failing.

[joebeets]

If your warning light is on and you do not have 14 volts at the battery terminals when idling, you need an alternator. You may also have a parasitic drain. Measure the amperage with a VOM between a battery terminal and its disconnected cable, all lights off. I would think less than an ampere is OK. In the meantime, charge the battery and disconnect it when not in use. Avoid night driving, and you can go a few days before recharging.

[Nio]

NAPA sells brushes too -I got mine from there.

Also, I am allergic to "remanufactured" stuff as quite often what fails may be replaceable by a conscious DIY -brushes, voltage regulator. Check the service manual for testing procedures; also, get a digital multimeter as it has been suggested here -it'll pay itself in no time. Chances are you may narrow down what may possible be failing.

While I would love to check a manual, They only gave me the alternator *I usually don't buy parts from stores I usually buy from junkyards.*

so I guess I should ask for the box this time huh. :3

[lostforawhile]

If your warning light is on and you do not have 14 volts at the battery terminals when idling, you need an alternator. You may also have a parasitic drain. Measure the amperage with a VOM between a battery terminal and its disconnected cable, all lights off. I would think less than an ampere is OK. In the meantime, charge the battery and disconnect it when not in use. Avoid night driving, and you can go a few days before recharging.

normally on these cars it's the brushes, the regulator or one of the diodes. you can get universal alternator diodes, all they have to do is be rated for the current of the old ones.

[ecogabriel]

While I would love to check a manual, They only gave me the alternator *I usually don't buy parts from stores I usually buy from junkyards.*

so I guess I should ask for the box this time huh. :3

Sorry; I should have said get the service manual for 86-89 accords and look for testing procedures.
Service manuals are available on this site; they will give you a structure on how to check for problems and the testing procedure itself together with what to expect.

I do some shopping in the junkyard too; yesterday I went there and got (among other things) a set of power window switches (driver's door) for the toyota.
I have that car's service manual and took with me the pages on how to test the switch. After checking that it worked, I paid $7. As expected it works flawlessly. I also pulled out a radiator (virtually brand new) for the 3g for $25 as mine has a tiny leak and there were a few fresh 3gs in the yard; they won't be there when I'll need them

Back to business, search for the service manual on this site and check the alternator section. If your problem turns out to be either brushes or voltage regulator you can replace either of them (I believe voltage regulator comes with its own brushes attached). EVen if it is an internal problem, the manual will give you a way to crack the alternator open and test it. It depends on how far you want to go...

[ecogabriel]

normally on these cars it's the brushes, the regulator or one of the diodes. you can get universal alternator diodes, all they have to do is be rated for the current of the old ones.

Do you know where one can get those diodes?

[Hauntd ca3]

just read thru an earlier post an you said the light came on when you revd it.
def check the charge voltage. am thinking over charging.
denso altenators will turn the charge light on and on hondas the cat convertor light aswell if they over charge

[lostforawhile]

Do you know where one can get those diodes?

you should be able to find online alternator parts places

[Civic Accord Honda]

yep autozone and kragen orileys etc all like to sale you bad alternators(and dizzys and ac compressors etc etc etc etc) ... just keep taking em back until you get a good one...

[Nio]

yep autozone and kragen orileys etc all like to sale you bad alternators(and dizzys and ac compressors etc etc etc etc) ... just keep taking em back until you get a good one...

sounds good to me, Anyone have a good online place that gives you decent parts?

[cubert]

sounds good to me, Anyone have a good online place that gives you decent parts?


You can check Rockauto.com...ive gotten some stuff from them before, but never anything electrical so im not sure how prices/reliability are


Then again, ive bought many electrical-related things from the chain stores, and the only time I ever had a problem was with the alternator in my civic...after a couple of months the bearing went bad. Brought it back, got a new one...

[Nio]

Okay so I took the alternator off today to go swap it and guess what I found.

TT_TT My ground wire and some of the cable leading to it had been melted.

Here are some pictures for you, I was also wondering if I could just go get some *insert number here* gauge wire and replace it myself and fix this issue. Could the alternator itself cause this, maybe the last battery, or just some old wiring that needs replaced.
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0062-1.jpg

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0063.jpg

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0064-1.jpg

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0065-1.jpg

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0066-1.jpg

It even melted the bolt.
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0067-1.jpg

and then the damn cap came off.
http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0068.jpg

[Nio]

Okay, i went and got it tested, Its working, So its just the bad connection there. I guess It would be okay for me to rewire it myself, with I'm assuming 10 gauge.

[joebeets]

You need to check for a short, using the parasitic drain test in my last post. This would explain your overheating.

[Hauntd ca3]

i'd do it with some 8 gauge and use some good quality heavy duty crimp terminals from the alt to the fuse box.
thats the main + output to the fuse box that lead by the way.
the alt earths through its case and bracketing etc.
run the new cable along where the old stuff ran or if you cant be stuffed, put some split conduit around it and cable tie it to the loom that the old cable is in.
with the alt end of that cable looking like that, its suggests to me that it was either a loose connection or corrosion which causes arcing in case of a loose connection or high resistance in case of the corrosion.
clean up the nut or get a new onw and put a nice shiney spring washer under it when you put it back together

[Nio]

i'd do it with some 8 gauge and use some good quality heavy duty crimp terminals from the alt to the fuse box.
thats the main + output to the fuse box that lead by the way.
the alt earths through its case and bracketing etc.
run the new cable along where the old stuff ran or if you cant be stuffed, put some split conduit around it and cable tie it to the loom that the old cable is in.
with the alt end of that cable looking like that, its suggests to me that it was either a loose connection or corrosion which causes arcing in case of a loose connection or high resistance in case of the corrosion.
clean up the nut or get a new onw and put a nice shiney spring washer under it when you put it back together

Okay, So I guess the Ground that connected the fuse box, *the one with the L-shape connection on it is the same wire?

Plus I have to go back to the store, Since I 10 is to small. which really sucks.

But Okay, I guess I'll be back, if theres anything else let me know.

Thanks a bunch guys.

[Nio]

this?

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0072.jpg

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/My%2089%20Honda%20Accord/SSPX0073.jpg

Cause I followed the line and it seems to be the right one.

:P don't want to cross any wires now...

[Hauntd ca3]

if you can follow that one back to the altenator thats the one
nothing in the fuse box of a modern cars fuse box is connected to earth.
its all live. and the chassis is ground.
if you have another means of transport, pull that whole cable out of the loom and take it to an auto electrician and get them to make you a nice new 8 gauge one. they'l have the nice heavy utilux type crimp connectors and the big arse crimping tool to do it right.
those light wee crimp terminals you can get are not the best in the world.
if it cost you an extra few dollars for the better job, its worth it

[Nio]

if you can follow that one back to the altenator thats the one
nothing in the fuse box of a modern cars fuse box is connected to earth.
its all live. and the chassis is ground.
if you have another means of transport, pull that whole cable out of the loom and take it to an auto electrician and get them to make you a nice new 8 gauge one. they'l have the nice heavy utilux type crimp connectors and the big arse crimping tool to do it right.
those light wee crimp terminals you can get are not the best in the world.
if it cost you an extra few dollars for the better job, its worth it

Yea it would be worth it, :P but I had to jump threw a few hoops just to get the money for what I have now. so I'll have to make due untill my next check.

But I believe that is the one coming out, because the only other lines that where in the same bundle went to the check system on the exhaust manifold.

[Hauntd ca3]

would be a good idea,if you have the $$ t replace the batt to starter cable and the batt to fuse box cables as well.

[Nio]

Well I replaced the clip on the positive on the battery cable as well.

But after doing the mad scientist cable work to the alternator she is up and running, all the lights on the whole dash are brighter then ever. As well The battery light is no longer on. I also replaced the ground cable to the valve cover with the extra parts I had.

The only issue is when I jump above 4500 RPMs her battery light flashes very lightly. But I think that is because the battery is not fully charged. So I'm keeping it very low, and not going to push her for a few days.

[Nio]

http://i776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/th_FILE0003.jpg (http://s776.photobucket.com/albums/yy41/nionai/?action=view&current=FILE0003.flv)

[Civic Accord Honda]

hmm Yeah i had to replace the wire from the alt to fuse box on my civic, Pretty easy to do.. i used 8GA wire with plans to up it to 4GA

[Hauntd ca3]

The only issue is when I jump above 4500 RPMs her battery light flashes very lightly.

grab you dmm. the volt meter should work as its only the ammeter that is fused.
check what the voltage is when the light comes on when you give it a rev.
it shouldnt do that even if the batt isnt fully charged

[Nio]

grab you dmm. the volt meter should work as its only the ammeter that is fused.
check what the voltage is when the light comes on when you give it a rev.
it shouldnt do that even if the batt isnt fully charged

Will do, I'll give it a check tomorrow once its a brighter out, I keep tripping over crap while I'm trying work on her at night.

[griffonks]

I know you said that funds were tight but I believe that I would install new brushes while I had the alternator on the bench- 20 year old brushes got to be worn. Good Luck

[Nio]

I know you said that funds were tight but I believe that I would install new brushes while I had the alternator on the bench- 20 year old brushes got to be worn. Good Luck

Well if they kept the 20 year old brushes in the new alternator I bought 2 weeks ago then somethings wrong. ;)

[kentwat]

I figured I add to this post. I need to check my alternator cables then looking at your picture. Here for about the last month randomly my battery light would come on. I hadn't seen any headlight issues dimming. But now it is happening alot more. So I did as told put the meter on the battery and it said 14+ volts at idle. But the light wasn't on? So I checked it off and battery had 12 volts. I started it back up and checked charge again and it was the same 14. I also put the negative on the valve cover to make sure I had the same amount. I leave and now my light is on all the time. After reading the posts again, I'm thinking brushes? Is there any way to get the alt out without pulling the axle? Thanks and hope this isn't too much of a hijack.

[Tomisimo]

my Alt is also shot, Just ordered new one. I know my Diodes are gone along with brushes I think, so I ordered new one because I cudnt find where to buy Diodes.

[Nio]

I figured I add to this post. I need to check my alternator cables then looking at your picture. Here for about the last month randomly my battery light would come on. I hadn't seen any headlight issues dimming. But now it is happening alot more. So I did as told put the meter on the battery and it said 14+ volts at idle. But the light wasn't on? So I checked it off and battery had 12 volts. I started it back up and checked charge again and it was the same 14. I also put the negative on the valve cover to make sure I had the same amount. I leave and now my light is on all the time. After reading the posts again, I'm thinking brushes? Is there any way to get the alt out without pulling the axle? Thanks and hope this isn't too much of a hijack.

all you have to do is make sure your AIR INTAKE BOX is out, after that's gone *atleast on the FI* you can unbolt it and just pull it straight up and out behind the intake manifold.

its really not all that hard. I check it about once a week now.

[Oldblueaccord]

In the end game running a large guage wire from the pos. side of the battery to the main lug off the alt will fix alotta flaky wire/charging problems on any neg ground car. I do it on all my pre 80's vehicles esp. if they have an ammeter guage in the dash.

It keeps large current flow going thru old wires.


wp

[kentwat]

all you have to do is make sure your AIR INTAKE BOX is out, after that's gone *atleast on the FI* you can unbolt it and just pull it straight up and out behind the intake manifold.

its really not all that hard. I check it about once a week now.

Thanks for the tip. Diving to a customer it was off then on the last minute or so. Then leaving and the drive home it was on full for at least 20 miles. Lights and everything seemed ok. No dimming or fluctuating.??