Let's talk about distributors!

[88acordDX]

So this is the first thread I'm starting here that will hopefully have some sort of use or purpose!! I am in the market for a performance variant for the rebuild I'm in the middle of. I tore a stock distributor down the other day and was wondering if theirs any internal upgraded springs or lighter/stronger materials that anyone has ever purchased on this site. And further more are their any after market suppliers of performance distributors matching the A20's? Here are some pictures I took during the tear down if anyone is interested in rebuilding or cleaning their distributor.
http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs416.snc3/25066_105311739505869_100000811315071_55460_483724 8_n.jpg

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311742839202_100000811315071_55461_724225 4_n.jpg

http://hphotos-snc3.fbcdn.net/hs436.snc3/25066_105311746172535_100000811315071_55462_706019 0_n.jpg

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs416.snc3/25066_105311752839201_100000811315071_55464_509593 6_n.jpg

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311756172534_100000811315071_55465_662839 9_n.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs416.snc3/25066_105311769505866_100000811315071_55468_558807 5_n.jpg

http://hphotos-snc3.fbcdn.net/hs416.snc3/25066_105311772839199_100000811315071_55469_184098 5_n.jpg

http://hphotos-snc3.fbcdn.net/hs436.snc3/25066_105311776172532_100000811315071_55470_29203_ n.jpg

[88acordDX]

Some more pictures

http://photos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311786172531_100000811315071_55472_136529 4_n.jpg

http://photos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs456.ash1/25066_105311789505864_100000811315071_55473_205524 8_n.jpg

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs456.ash1/25066_105311792839197_100000811315071_55474_746577 0_n.jpg

DON'T TAKE THIS PART OFF... you don't really need to and you wont have to re align it later if you don't.

http://hphotos-snc3.fbcdn.net/hs436.snc3/25066_105311802839196_100000811315071_55476_332638 7_n.jpg

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311839505859_100000811315071_55484_253348 1_n.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311806172529_100000811315071_55477_143463 0_n.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311832839193_100000811315071_55482_748472 5_n.jpg

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs436.snc3/25066_105311822839194_100000811315071_55480_974236 _n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs456.ash1/25066_105311829505860_100000811315071_55481_567403 3_n.jpg

http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs456.ash1/25066_105311842839192_100000811315071_55485_230615 8_n.jpg

[stephensimmons]

I know I havent found anything to up grade it. And to be honest with you you really cant find parts for it except for the electrical stuff it it unless you go to the junk yard. As for a performance distributer thats a no no to. What most people are boing that do use them that ive talked to say the best thing to do is lock in out and use a msd digital 6 ignition box for timing or a msd btm 6 if your going to boost it. other than that jus get you a parts store replacement and ride!

[88acordDX]

After a little more searching I found this company called Rpm Partz. They list a distributor for the 1986-89 accords but they don't really state that it will out perform a stock one, plus when I called they quoted me $225.

[2ndGenGuy]

Or you could just dump the distributor all together and just go with a MegaJolt Lite Jr / EDIS coilpack setup. Fully programmable, and cheap to build. Cygnus sells all the parts to make the A20 MJLJ setup a piece of cake! All you have to do is a little wiring.

[2oodoor]

yeah distributors are just so eighties huh ....

the best you can do is make sure the dist is functioning the best it can as it is , and as designed. YOU can try a hotter coil or MSD 6al or varience of that system made by Summit or otherwise.

Just like chevys or fords or vw bugs, for dist you can use dual points, or magneto type ign but what would be the point.. ha ha points

:thumbup:

[88acordDX]

lol Points... Can you run those type of coil/ignition set ups on the dx and lx models?

[stephensimmons]

lol Points... Can you run those type of coil/ignition set ups on the dx and lx models?

Do you mean the distributorless ones?

[stat1K]

or you could switch to obd1 and not have to worry about a vacuum advance anything.

[88acordDX]

Do you mean the distributorless ones?

Yea, I'm using a weber on the rebuild I'm doing i just don't want any complications with the wire harness or connections since it's not Fuel Injected

[stephensimmons]

Yea, I'm using a weber on the rebuild I'm doing i just don't want any complications with the wire harness or connections since it's not Fuel Injected

You could run a msd ignition

[88acordDX]

I was reading about the MSD ignitions, and I know this sounds stupid but I have no idea what it actually replaces on the car. I mean I can remove, tear down, rebuild, and reinstall an engine. But a lot of after market "stuff" I have no real Idea on how it works. Even their videos will compare products but I didn't find anything on installation, other than a distributor and coil.

[stephensimmons]

I was reading about the MSD ignitions, and I know this sounds stupid but I have no idea what it actually replaces on the car. I mean I can remove, tear down, rebuild, and reinstall an engine. But a lot of after market "stuff" I have no real Idea on how it works. Even their videos will compare products but I didn't find anything on installation, other than a distributor and coil.

It hooks between the dizzy and the coil to amplify spark. Also you can set your rev limit

[cygnus x-1]

A properly functioning stock distributor is going to work just fine in terms of spark energy. Adding an MSD box won't gain you anything except for the rev limiter. The real advantage to fully electronic ignition is that it (A) doesn't have any mechanical parts to wear out, and (B) it allows for tuning the timing for different areas engine operation (load/RPM). With a mechanical distributor you would do this by changing springs and weights, or the vacuum advance diaphragm. But there are no such parts available for these old distributors.


And technically OBD1 does have vacuum advance. It's just built in to the ECU programming and not an external mechanical device. Hooray for electronics!


C|

[88acordDX]

So really with a stock distributor and a carburetor theirs nothing to improve other than a rev limiter? Will a hotter coil do anything for spark or are the limits of the distributor not worth it?

[cygnus x-1]

So really with a stock distributor and a carburetor theirs nothing to improve other than a rev limiter? Will a hotter coil do anything for spark or are the limits of the distributor not worth it?


The carb has nothing to do with it. A hotter coil won't really do much; not because of the distributor, but because a hotter spark won't really do anything for the fuel combustion. A hotter coil is useful in cases where you are trying to run really lean (for economy) or really rich mixtures (turbo applications) that are difficult to ignite. But on a stock type engine the stock ignition is just fine. At least in terms of spark energy. Adjustable timing is a different story.


C|

[88acordDX]

Well thanks for the good knowledge you guys! Sometimes I forget how old these cars really are, around here they are pretty rare.
Stock Ignition it is.

[AccordEpicenter]

you guys should look into going obd1. All the spark strength in the world isnt going to help you if you cant accuratly control the timing.

[A20A1]

I should add your pics here
http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53918

i was looking at the differences between the tec and hitachi.

[firefighterwhite89]

Has Anyone Noticed On The Vacuum Advance Piece On The Dizzy...It's Long Metal Shaft That Goes Inside The Dizzy Can Screw In And Out, And Upon Looking At Two Of The Same Ones For An 86' Lxi New, Both Measured Out Different Lengths, And I've Found Nothing On How They Need To Be Measured And Set Right.:help:

[lostforawhile]

I was reading about the MSD ignitions, and I know this sounds stupid but I have no idea what it actually replaces on the car. I mean I can remove, tear down, rebuild, and reinstall an engine. But a lot of after market "stuff" I have no real Idea on how it works. Even their videos will compare products but I didn't find anything on installation, other than a distributor and coil.A lot of people on here have said they have gotten better spark with an MSD box, better idle and sometimes better fuel economy, the main thing is on those boxes, is you get multiple sparks at lower RPM this will help make sure you get complete combustion. another advantage would seem to be, the dizzys with the internal ignitor, they seem to overheat and the ignitor fails. with an ignition box, the load is taken off of that ignitor, and it just serves as a signal. On older Honda's they have the same ignitor, but it's sitting directly on a metal plate with heat sink grease, on these cars, it's an identical ignitor, but it's on spacers with no way to dissipate heat. You can take an ignitor out of an 81-83 civic, drop it in this car, and it will function perfectly. I ran one for years. I'm still thinking of making an aluminum spacer to go between the ignitor and the base. with it acting just as a signal, it's not directly loaded by the coil, and it will run much cooler. the other advantage, is if you are running boost, the more advanced boxes have a vacuum hookup, that will automatically retard timing as boost increases.


Has Anyone Noticed On The Vacuum Advance Piece On The Dizzy...It's Long Metal Shaft That Goes Inside The Dizzy Can Screw In And Out, And Upon Looking At Two Of The Same Ones For An 86' Lxi New, Both Measured Out Different Lengths, And I've Found Nothing On How They Need To Be Measured And Set Right.:help:
you need to use a timing light with an advance dial, there are advance marks on the flywheel, you dial in the specified amount of advance on the timing light, and make sure the advance mark is lined up when checking timing while the advance diaphragm is hooked up. you adjust the diaphragm until it's advanced correctly

[lostforawhile]

something else to note, if you hook up the retard diaphram, even if you have removed all the vacuum stuff, it will make the car easier to start. that's what it's for, it retards the timing on startup, if you use one of the solenoids out of the vacuum box, that bleeds off vacuum when it's unpowered, you can connect this to manifold vacuum with a check valve, and to the start circuit. when you are cranking the car, the timing is retarded, when you stop cranking, the vacuum is released

[Dr_Snooz]

Disconnect and plug both advance diaphragm vacuum lines. Set the base timing to 4* BTDC. Then reconnect them and check the timing again. It should be 15* BTDC with full advance. If not, then adjust the arm and try again.

Those are the timing settings for an '89 LX-i with California emissions specs. Yours might be different. The full timing inspection is detailed in the factory service manual in the Engine Electrical section. The '89 manual is available here (http://honda.roadpwnage.com/manuals/pages/usdm-accord-1989-full.php) for download if you want to get an idea what the full timing inspection looks like. It starts on pp. 24-4 -> 24-8. And yes, the timing inspection is 4 pages long...

[lostforawhile]

Disconnect and plug both advance diaphragm vacuum lines. Set the base timing to 4* BTDC. Then reconnect them and check the timing again. It should be 15* BTDC with full advance. If not, then adjust the arm and try again.

Those are the timing settings for an '89 LX-i with California emissions specs. Yours might be different. The full timing inspection is detailed in the factory service manual in the Engine Electrical section. The '89 manual is available here (http://honda.roadpwnage.com/manuals/pages/usdm-accord-1989-full.php) for download if you want to get an idea what the full timing inspection looks like. It starts on pp. 24-4 -> 24-8. And yes, the timing inspection is 4 pages long...

what the timing lights with the advance dial do, is change the timing of the light flashes, if everything is lined up, the mark indicating the advanced point, will line up instead of the main timing mark. I need to get another one, mine was stolen years ago, you can exactly dial in your advance, not just your main timing marks

[firefighterwhite89]

Ok. Thanks Guys.

[lostforawhile]

Ok. Thanks Guys.

if you ever get a good timing light with the advance function, you'll never want a basic one again, you set your base timing with the advance plugged and the dial on 0, then you hook up the advance, set the car at the specified rpm, and dial the advance on the timing light, it will show you exactly where the advance mark is

[Dr_Snooz]

There are a couple different marks on the AT drive plate. There's the 15* mark indicated by the "15", but there is also a green dot. I assume that is the 4* mark. Can anyone confirm that?

[DBMaster]

Unfortunately, I cannot. Mine has a white hash mark at Zero, which is the setting to go for when both vacuum lines are disconnected and plugged. It also has a red mark at 15 degrees which is where it is supposed to be when the lines are reconnected. Of course, mine is not a California car and it was built in Ohio.