oil leaking into airbox, cant go over 75mph

[thinkagain]

hi everyone, great forum. i just picked up an 87 LXi, auto, 165,000 with the intentions of using it as a DD. it had a few issues when i bought it (dead battery, valve gasket leak) and fixed those issues immediately.

i have a few issues with this otherwise reliable car and i dont want to blow it up neglecting it. i am not a gearhead by any means, but im pretty good with a wrench (or a hammer)

made sure the engine stated normally. oil levels, tank of good gas and lucas FI cleaner... and took it for a test drive.

drove great in the neighborhood. when i took it to the highway it seemed like it was hesitating at about 3-4000 rpm and there was smoke spewing in the car as well as a cloud of smoke down the highway.

when i got home i pulled the air filter and the bottom half is soaked in oil/gas.

also have ecu code 12 flashing (egr?) checked egr electrical connections and they are covered in oil from valve cover leak .

got oil/gas in the air ducts near the throttle body connecting to the air filter

lost 2 quarts of oil driving it about 60 miles cleaning out the fuel system and the hose coming out of the valve cover seems to be the culprit.

not sure where to start..... any suggestions, and thanks for your time.

[thinkagain]

i also have pictures/ can take more pictures of things. but i dont have enough posts

[greentee76]

Sounds like a pretty significant amount of blowby. I would do a compression test and see where you stand.

[thinkagain]

ill check it out and post results/ clean out engine and see where that takes me

(i hope i dont have blown head gasket or bad piston rings but its starting to look like it)

edit: oil pan is covered in oil too, signs of an bad oil pan gasket or bad oil change... gonna change oil, replace the gasket and put in some ring sealer for good measure.

guess i got a weekend project to do for memorial day :/

[Bluntman]

It could also be something as simple as a bad PCV valve making oil get to your air filter. Easy and cheap job. But on these cars we all have our PCV valve nightmare stories. Do a search. Here is my nightmare, but all worked out well in the end. http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=71286

[Dr_Snooz]

x2 on the PCV, but it sounds like you have a bunch of leaky seals as well. There are about a half dozen seals that like to get old and hard and spring leaks. Do all of them as time and money allow.

- Distributor seal
- Oil filter base seal
- PCV breather box seal and all hoses
- Valve cover seal
- Front Crank seal
- Cam seal
- Oil Pump seals

Do the last three at your next timing belt change. Especially do the oil pump as if the seal fails, you'll lose oil pressure and burn up the engine. :(

[lostforawhile]

yea if your pcv valve is stuck closed, or the hose coming out the back of the oil pan is collapsed or blocked, all the crankcase blowby will have nowhere to go except out the breather hose. also if the oil is overfilled, it will literally suck up through the oil seperator box on the back of the block and into the pcv valve, where it will be sucked into the intake.

[thinkagain]

Wow, thanks for the help, ill check the breather tubes and the pvc valve. Its $4 at the auto zone so ill check it out and hope for the best.:nervous:

[thinkagain]

alright, i found the pcv valve. i tried pulling it out but it wont budge.

is it supposed to pop right out? or do i have to get underneath and remove "tube A" from the valve and then its free?

the valve is metal so im not afraid to yank it out but after reading bluntman's nightmare im not so sure i want to do that.

thanks again for the help :o

[ecogabriel]

I wanted to replace the PCV valve (86 LXi); as with yours no matter how hard I pulled it would not budge.... until it did. Put a new valve, reassembled everything... and then I noticed that the rubber hose coming from the separator box behind the engine had broken.
I would suggest ordering at once that pipe in bluntman's thread.
Notice that our separator box (the square thing below that hose) is different; it is exactly as the one below so the hose would be different.

(I did a ghetto repair because I needed the car ASAP threading a hose adaptor inside the box' neck and then running 1/2" hose up to the intake manifold. I needed to get the box out and so you would need the oring where it sits in the engine block, and most likely the hose that goes to the crankcase.
The ghetto repair works OK, but I would have liked more to get the right part... I'm too lazy to work on that again)

At the very least order the hose that goes from the top of the box to the PCV valve but make sure you get a source for the orings (NAPA) and the hose that goes to the crankshaft.

[Bluntman]

alright, i found the pcv valve. i tried pulling it out but it wont budge.

is it supposed to pop right out? or do i have to get underneath and remove "tube A" from the valve and then its free?

the valve is metal so im not afraid to yank it out but after reading bluntman's nightmare im not so sure i want to do that.

thanks again for the help :o

On good side, you have a metal one so you can grip it a bit better. It has to come out regardless. So maybe spray some penetrating oil and see if you can try working it out without the tube it sits in breaking. Some have got lucky. But it has to come out so you have nothing to lose. If the tube breaks it breaks. The tube it sits in has probably hardened, so it may break.

[lostforawhile]

the separator box is the same on all models , I have an lxi one on my dx, I think one has the foam cover and possibly one doesn't. most of the box is attached to the block,which is the same across all model lines. the box is bolted to the block itself with two 10mm bolts, then there's a hose to the oil pan, and a hose out the top going to the pcv valve. there is also a connection with an O ring, this is pushed straight into the block, you can't see it unless you unbolt th ebox and pill it off,

[Dr_Snooz]

^^^ Actually, the 86-87 boxes have a steel neck on top. The 88-89s have a rubber insert that gets hard and crumbles. I put an 86-87 box on mine.

[lostforawhile]

^^^ Actually, the 86-87 boxes have a steel neck on top. The 88-89s have a rubber insert that gets hard and crumbles. I put an 86-87 box on mine.

somewhere in this house I have an insert if someone needs it, I have welded on pieces on mine

[thinkagain]

so i had a nice duel with it, but i won! it was pretty easy to tell it was shot by shaking it around

took it out for a spin and i still get blowby and smoke :(

i noticed something was fishy with the tube leading to the intake:
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/4826/wtfintake.jpg
^^ theres also a hole in the hose i circled not sure if its fuel or coolant

and the hose below the pcv valve has a tear:
http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/8127/leakyhose.jpg


if i want to replace them, what are they called? i looked at hondapartsdeals.com its pretty comprehensive, but i cant find the exact hose

thanks for all the help and input!

[Civic Accord Honda]

get a catch can, the blow by oil will go in to the can and then the air will go in to the engine, best ones are the kind made out of a water separators that go on air compressers.
http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=11009&highlight=catch

and that leaking hose is coolant not sure the name just pop them off go to napa and they should be able to get you one close

[thinkagain]

Found the air intake tube and an extra air filter at my local u pull it for $5. Yard has an egr valve for me too but ill waiit on that. Post results in the next day

[Dr_Snooz]

Looking at those pictures, you are on the verge of spending a lot of money on cooling system repairs in addition to all the other problems. What is your exit strategy for this car?

[thinkagain]

Uhhh I dunno, junk it? The top picture looks horrible but its fixed.

I spent like 300 incl. Purchase and repairs, and its more of a learning experiance for me, and its not my primary ride so ikinda don't care if it blows up on me.

So what do you see that's so incredibly wrong doc? (Except introducing oil into my engine)

[caliass]

I have the same problem too! I replaced all the hoses and the pcv valve. The car ran great for a couple of months and then this smokingand oil in the air filter box thing started over again. I think the oil is coming from the valve cover tube into that elbow that goes from the air filter box to the TB. Any body know what to do next?

[Dr_Snooz]

I have the same problem too! I replaced all the hoses and the pcv valve. The car ran great for a couple of months and then this smokingand oil in the air filter box thing started over again. I think the oil is coming from the valve cover tube into that elbow that goes from the air filter box to the TB. Any body know what to do next?

Catch can.

[caliass]

got any pictures of what that would look like?

[Harrison_Bergeron]

I have the same problem too! I replaced all the hoses and the pcv valve. The car ran great for a couple of months and then this smokingand oil in the air filter box thing started over again. I think the oil is coming from the valve cover tube into that elbow that goes from the air filter box to the TB. Any body know what to do next?

I plan to do the water separator type of catch can like CAH linked to.

[caliass]

I hit that link but it won't connect

[AZZORD]

I'm having the same problem with oil getting sucked into the air box from the hose that goes to the valve cover. I could add a catch can but I guess that my thinking is that it should not be doing this and I would like to fix the problem that is causing it. Could the oil separator box on the back of the block be plugged?

[Oldblueaccord]

Most of the time it is bad (worn) piston rings. You can try some of the other stuff for sure but a compression check will tell you.


wp

[Dr_Snooz]

Uhhh I dunno, junk it? The top picture looks horrible but its fixed.

I spent like 300 incl. Purchase and repairs, and its more of a learning experiance for me, and its not my primary ride so ikinda don't care if it blows up on me.

So what do you see that's so incredibly wrong doc? (Except introducing oil into my engine)

You have a lot of little coolant bypass hoses that are seeping. My experience was that when they get like that, they start blowing out. That leaves you stranded on the side of the road, calling for tows, etc. They all need to be replaced to the tune of $150. If the cooling system hasn't been properly maintained up to this time, then once you start on it, it will pretty much disintegrate on you. By the time I was done, I had replaced all the hoses, the radiator, thermostat, coolant inlet, a freeze plug or two and a whole lot of coolant. I also had trouble getting the water pipe that runs along the back of the block to seal properly. It took me about 8 go arounds with the car before I finally got it to stop breaking down all the time. About the only part of the system I haven't replaced is the heater core.

It it's just a car you putter on, then it's probably fine. Just be prepared for some cooling system issues before much longer. I suspect you're going to have a lot of other issues, but the cooling system will be a big headache for sure.

[dr.jon007]

Hey,
I joined this forum for this thread. I am in your EXACT same boat.

I bought an 87 Accord hatch about a week ago. It has 156k on the clock and has been poorly maintained. (part of the $400 price)

It ran poorly when I drove it to my shop. I pulled the worst looking spark plugs I've ever seen from it and replaced them. Along with those I did wires, cap, rotor, air filter, fuel filter, PCV valve, filled the tank then put in injector cleaner and put a cheap oil filter and cheap oil in with the engine cleaner/ detergent in it and went for a quick drive... This is when it started doing the smoking trick you described.

Once back at the shop, the airbox was pouring oil out of it and I discovered this thread shortly after.

I replaced the hoses on the separator box, double checked the PCV and then I did what I should have done first and did a compression check to discover the #3 cylinder had 70 lbs/ ccm #4 was at 130 and both 1 and 2 were sitting up at 200.

Heads off, pistons out, the issue was extreme blow by from the portions of the piston that separate the top two rings being sheared off and floating around between the top rings. (on the low compression cylinders)

New pistons are in the mail. I'll let you guys know what happens