I think I'm going to throw a rod.

[Nio]

I have a really bad knocking noise coming from the engine, At first I think my exhaust valve was really really loose.

*which it is almost twice as far out as it needs to be. can't fix that though, the adjusting screw won't work*

but the car has now died on my on the highway and won't get above 60MPH..


I really hope its not going to throw a rod, I just bought a new oil pan, gasket, and oil filter.

T_T

any help would be nice.

also if it is my valves needing adjusting, how would I do it, I followed the repair book, however they won't loosen or tighter.

[Ju_S12_Turbo]

did you loosen the nut to adjust the valves? I know it see,s simple but I gotta ask.

also http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39319

[Nio]

I followed all of that in my book.

but the nut and the screw wont turn. they wont turn at all.

I even tried my power tools.

[Ju_S12_Turbo]

dont mess with the screw until you break the nut free. if it is jammed idk. I don't know how good your power tools are. if you think your engine is toast or about to be, you could put a breaker bar on the nut and break it free. Other then a impact gun I don't have any other ideas (maybe heat and pb blaster but I don't know if it is ok to do that in the oil)

[nswst8]

Check for a dead spark plug first for lack of power, you don't have push rods in this engine..

Break loose the jam nut first then adjust the valve screw.

[ecogabriel]

Check for a dead spark plug first for lack of power, you don't have push rods in this engine..

Break loose the jam nut first then adjust the valve screw.

x2

[Dr_Snooz]

I would avoid using leverage on a valve adjuster locknut. I would use hillbilly impact, ala #2 in this thread: http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64355&highlight=hillbilly+impact

If you got knocking noises coming from the block, then it's probably all moot anyway.

[Nio]

I got the nut loose.


:3 after driving home I let her sit for 45 minutes, then while she was still hotish, I got the bolt loose.

but I didn't adjust it cause it says do it while its cold.


Also I hope this is the problem, but now she won't get above 45mph, and she dies alot when I get to stops or let off the throttle in neutral.

and its not just a slight tapping noise. its a really loud knocking noise now.

But it doesn't happen while shes cold, it gets louder the hotter the engine gets.

[lostforawhile]

video, but sounds like a rod, what is your oil pressure?

[Nio]

video, but sounds like a rod, what is your oil pressure?

the pressure goes up and down badly.


If it turns out to be a Rod, I'll just get a new engine.

>.> or maybe I'll install a B16. :D lol

but I really hope its just bad valves.

I'll get a video up soon.

[lostforawhile]

the pressure goes up and down badly.


If it turns out to be a Rod, I'll just get a new engine.

>.> or maybe I'll install a B16. :D lol

but I really hope its just bad valves.

I'll get a video up soon.
if the pressure is going up and down badly, it's definitely a rod bearing. a bearing always gets louder when the engine heats up. bearing probably spun on the crank, which means the rod bore and crank journal are most likely screwed. your oil pressure is shot because the clearances between that bearing and the crank journal are way too much, so all the oil goes out the gap, and pressure can't build. valves won't affect your oil pressure that much, if you had a badly worn cam it could, but the valve stems are lubricated by splash lubrication, not pressure. a main bearing would normally indicate oil pressure always low, and would be more of a rumble type noise, rod bearings knock, because every time a cyl fires under ignition, the rod hammers into the crank, due to a loose clearance. if you disconnect the plug wires one at a time, when you get to the bad one, it should knock less.

[Nio]

if the pressure is going up and down badly, it's definitely a rod bearing. a bearing always gets louder when the engine heats up. bearing probably spun on the crank, which means the rod bore and crank journal are most likely screwed. your oil pressure is shot because the clearances between that bearing and the crank journal are way too much, so all the oil goes out the gap, and pressure can't build. valves won't affect your oil pressure that much, if you had a badly worn cam it could, but the valve stems are lubricated by splash lubrication, not pressure. a main bearing would normally indicate oil pressure always low, and would be more of a rumble type noise, rod bearings knock, because every time a cyl fires under ignition, the rod hammers into the crank, due to a loose clearance. if you disconnect the plug wires one at a time, when you get to the bad one, it should knock less.


well I just remember that I'm low on oil at the moment so that might be why my pressure is screwed up to.

*just got a new oilpan, filter, and stuff which I was going to install this weekend until this happened*

Also sometimes when I accelerate, or let off the gas the knocking will skip, and when I let off the gas it sounds way faster then when I accelerate.


Also I disconnected the plug wire for cylinder 1, the one I thought the valve was in, *since its way looser then the others.* the sound was the exact same.

[lostforawhile]

well I just remember that I'm low on oil at the moment so that might be why my pressure is screwed up to.

*just got a new oilpan, filter, and stuff which I was going to install this weekend until this happened*

Also sometimes when I accelerate, or let off the gas the knocking will skip, and when I let off the gas it sounds way faster then when I accelerate.


Also I disconnected the plug wire for cylinder 1, the one I thought the valve was in, *since its way looser then the others.* the sound was the exact same.
valves don't knock, they tap, rod bearings knock, if it's knocking your engine is toast, adding oil isn't going to help with a spun bearing. and when you accelerate yes the knocking can slow down, mainly because the bad rod bearing is under constant pressure, and isn't hammering as much, it stays in contact with the rod under higher rpm

[2drSE-i]

PLEASE don't get rid of this car.

[lostforawhile]

PLEASE don't get rid of this car.

yea, I'm sure someone has a long block they can sell you, if the rod is knocking, don't even bother to put on the new filter, or pan. save them for a fresh block. Put up a video so we can hear this noise.

[Nio]

PLEASE don't get rid of this car.


okay don't take this personal.


but are you f-ing crazy.

I would swap the engine,tranny, and even front end just to keep this car.

I've not just put hours into this car...I love it to much to get rid of it. she means alot to me, I've learned how to fix alot of stuff.

Plus I leave for boot in 16 days, after I get done I might get 7 days to a month off depending on when my A-school starts.

and I will use my boot money either for a new engine, or the B-16 Install.

2 grand will help alot for my car. :D


if its a rod so be it, just tells me how badly the last owners took care of the car.


>.> not like all of the work I did didn't show that either.

BTW thanks for the help guys.

I was hoping for the best but I knew what could be the worse.

New engine it is.

>.> gonna be fun though, I'll completely rebuild one. instead of putting a stock one in.

[LX-incredible]

if the pressure is going up and down badly, it's definitely a rod bearing. a bearing always gets louder when the engine heats up. bearing probably spun on the crank, which means the rod bore and crank journal are most likely screwed. your oil pressure is shot because the clearances between that bearing and the crank journal are way too much, so all the oil goes out the gap, and pressure can't build. valves won't affect your oil pressure that much, if you had a badly worn cam it could, but the valve stems are lubricated by splash lubrication, not pressure. a main bearing would normally indicate oil pressure always low, and would be more of a rumble type noise, rod bearings knock, because every time a cyl fires under ignition, the rod hammers into the crank, due to a loose clearance. if you disconnect the plug wires one at a time, when you get to the bad one, it should knock less.

Camshaft, rocker arms, and valves will not affect oil pressure at all. There is an oil control jet in the block that only lets a certain amount through. Excess oil flows out through notches at the top of the cam caps.

[lostforawhile]

Camshaft, rocker arms, and valves will not affect oil pressure at all. There is an oil control jet in the block that only lets a certain amount through. Excess oil flows out through notches at the top.
when did they start adding that? there is still quite a bit of pressure at the top, Honda doesn't use cam bearings, it's steel on aluminum, the oil pressure is the actual bearing. I know on several older ones I worked on with oil pressure problems, replacing a worn cam made quite a difference in the oil pressure. It's a great system as long as you have enough pressure, if it drops , it eats up the journals the cam rides in.

[Dr_Snooz]

I was hoping for the best but I knew what could be the worse.

New engine it is.

>.> gonna be fun though, I'll completely rebuild one. instead of putting a stock one in.

If you haven't done it before, building an engine is awesome! You learn so much and when it's done, you KNOW the car like you never could have before. It doesn't matter what happens after that, you know exactly what's wrong and how to fix it.

[Civic Accord Honda]

yeah build a new engine your self!

[Nio]

well I found several options.

Cherry Ave. downtown has blocks for 100$ if I pull it myself, and engines for 150$. but I know they don't run.

a place closer to me on the east side of the city has a fully running engine for 300$ if I give them mine.

I found a option online for a complete rebuilt engine, for 750$. but I don't know if it would be a good Idea.

I might go ahead and get the 300$ one, and go ahead with my boring for 200$, the B18 forged rod's for 75$, and the tegi Type R used pistons for 100$ and replace everything else myself. which seems like the best Idea right now.

of course this will be in a little over 2 months since I have boot in 2 weeks. ^o^ yea!.

So everything seems to turn out alright.

And I'm not all that bumbed about the engine, since I now get my own. :D


and thanks for the support guys.

[lostforawhile]

well I found several options.

Cherry Ave. downtown has blocks for 100$ if I pull it myself, and engines for 150$. but I know they don't run.

a place closer to me on the east side of the city has a fully running engine for 300$ if I give them mine.

I found a option online for a complete rebuilt engine, for 750$. but I don't know if it would be a good Idea.

I might go ahead and get the 300$ one, and go ahead with my boring for 200$, the B18 forged rod's for 75$, and the tegi Type R used pistons for 100$ and replace everything else myself. which seems like the best Idea right now.

of course this will be in a little over 2 months since I have boot in 2 weeks. ^o^ yea!.

So everything seems to turn out alright.

And I'm not all that bumbed about the engine, since I now get my own. :D


and thanks for the support guys.the 300 doesn't sound bad, let them have your boat anchor for a running one.

[Nio]

the 300 doesn't sound bad, let them have your boat anchor for a running one.

When I called em they said they don't care if my runs or not, they just want it.

Guess they would rebuild it and then sell it.

[Dr_Snooz]

Rebuild the one you have. You know it's hosed (admittedly quite badly), but at least you know HOW it's hosed. Any other engine you buy will also be hosed. You just won't know how until you've spent a bundle buying it, putting it in, trying to figure out why it's hosed, etc. etc. etc. Rebuild the one you have.

Oh, and always, always, always rebuild your own. It's way too much work and expense to entrust to someone else. They don't know more than you do. And they care less.

[lostforawhile]

Rebuild the one you have. You know it's hosed (admittedly quite badly), but at least you know HOW it's hosed. Any other engine you buy will also be hosed. You just won't know how until you've spent a bundle buying it, putting it in, trying to figure out why it's hosed, etc. etc. etc. Rebuild the one you have.

Oh, and always, always, always rebuild your own. It's way too much work and expense to entrust to someone else. They don't know more than you do. And they care less.

I think he's going to also rebuild the one he's getting, better to buy one that runs with no rod knock, then one with rod knock. with that knock he's probably got a ruined bottom end on a rod, plus possible crankshaft damage.

[Dr_Snooz]

He should price it out. When I was rebuilding mine, a kit with a crankshaft was only about $100 more than a regular kit. We assume here that the $300 engine does not have rod knock but that is by no means assured. He won't know unless he A.) pulls the thing apart and measures the bearings or B.) puts it in and gets surprised. Even if there is no knock, there's bound to be other issues. I'll never put another engine in my car that I haven't rebuilt with my own two hands. I've already pulled one supposedly "rebuilt" engine that was garbage. Cost me nearly as much as a full rebuild to put it in, then I got to do a full rebuild anyway. I'll rebuild my old broken stuff before I go through that again.

[lostforawhile]

He should price it out. When I was rebuilding mine, a kit with a crankshaft was only about $100 more than a regular kit. We assume here that the $300 engine does not have rod knock but that is by no means assured. He won't know unless he A.) pulls the thing apart and measures the bearings or B.) puts it in and gets surprised. Even if there is no knock, there's bound to be other issues. I'll never put another engine in my car that I haven't rebuilt with my own two hands. I've already pulled one supposedly "rebuilt" engine that was garbage. Cost me nearly as much as a full rebuild to put it in, then I got to do a full rebuild anyway. I'll rebuild my old broken stuff before I go through that again.

yea I see your point, I would prefer to rebuild my own stuff too, but if I have to, I would rather start with the engine that is in better shape for a base

[LX-incredible]

when did they start adding that? there is still quite a bit of pressure at the top, Honda doesn't use cam bearings, it's steel on aluminum, the oil pressure is the actual bearing. I know on several older ones I worked on with oil pressure problems, replacing a worn cam made quite a difference in the oil pressure. It's a great system as long as you have enough pressure, if it drops , it eats up the journals the cam rides in.

84 for the Accords. Pretty much every non-vtec Honda motor after 83 had an oil control orifice between the block and the head.

[Nio]

He should price it out. When I was rebuilding mine, a kit with a crankshaft was only about $100 more than a regular kit. We assume here that the $300 engine does not have rod knock but that is by no means assured. He won't know unless he A.) pulls the thing apart and measures the bearings or B.) puts it in and gets surprised. Even if there is no knock, there's bound to be other issues. I'll never put another engine in my car that I haven't rebuilt with my own two hands. I've already pulled one supposedly "rebuilt" engine that was garbage. Cost me nearly as much as a full rebuild to put it in, then I got to do a full rebuild anyway. I'll rebuild my old broken stuff before I go through that again.

well I'm buying a engine that runs yes.

Since this engine has had alot of problems with it all together.

anyways I'm going to be getting the engine bored out before I install it in the car. getting new pistons rods bearings, everything inside, then I'll be installing quite a good bit of other parts brand new so I don't think it will be all that bad.

I plan to put about 1500 into the engine when I get back. so it should run just fine.

[Ju_S12_Turbo]

sounds like it's time to start running gear oil to make the noises go away lol