More Air Conditioning Related Questions...

[mcs32jr1968]

hey all, I apologize for being such a noob but here goes nothing...

Have an '89 Accord with 77k original miles on it (bought it for $1500)and it runs great...

Only problem is that the A/C no longer blows cold.

I checked the compressor and relays, etc, and everything seems ok...

My brother, a certified Honda Tech says that I must have a leak in the A/C system. He says that the refrigerant used for my year (the now defunct R12)does not evaporate and the only way I could run out of it (causing non-cold air to be produced)is for it to leak out.

Is this true? Logic tells me that everything eventually gets used up and needs to be replaced, even R12 refrigerant. If it does not evaporate or get used up is R12 supposed to last forever??

I don't think my car's A/C has any leaks, it just ran out of R12 and needs to be recharged (either with R12 or a good substitute, don't want to mess with the R134a conversion, right now too costly.....)

Anybody out there with a similar situation with their 3G Accord??

PS..he also mentioned some type of "door" that might not be opening thus not allowing refrigerant to cool the air...

PSS..anybody have any luck with recharge kits you can buy on Ebay or other similar sites???

any and all help would be kindly appreciated...

peace all,

mike from socal

[Hauntd ca3]

any A/C will eventually run out of gas.
if you dont use it, you will lose it, the seals dry out and the gas will sneak past them over time.
if your brother knew anything bout A/C systems he should have been able to tell you that
can you hear or see the compressor kick in?
if the compressor cuts in you should get cold air.
if not, the systems low pressure switch will stop the compressor from cutting in.
go to someone who knows about A/C, preferably someplace that duz A/C repairs and get the system pressures checked.
i dont thin our old honda's have blend doors for temp control.
if it has a heater tap, it wont have a blend door

[mcs32jr1968]

any A/C will eventually run out of gas.
if you dont use it, you will lose it, the seals dry out and the gas will sneak past them over time.
if your brother knew anything bout A/C systems he should have been able to tell you that
can you hear or see the compressor kick in?
if the compressor cuts in you should get cold air.
if not, the systems low pressure switch will stop the compressor from cutting in.
go to someone who knows about A/C, preferably someplace that duz A/C repairs and get the system pressures checked.
i dont thin our old honda's have blend doors for temp control.
if it has a heater tap, it wont have a blend door

thanks for the wise advice...I figured my ride was out of refrigerant but I will still have it checked...the compressor does kick right in and everything seems up to spec, just doesn't blow cold...will follow your advice and get the pressure and overall system checked out...thanks again...

[Vanilla Sky]

Umm, it's an evaporative AC unit. If the R12 didn't evaporate, the system wouldn't work.

While the car only has 77,000 miles on it, it's 22 years old with seals and gaskets that were probably leaky 10 years ago. You're going to have to go through the whole system and replace all of them. If your car has a Nippon-Denso compressor, you can seal it up, vacuum it down, and fill it with R134A. If it's a Keihin compressor, you'll have to either find someone that can fill with R12 or replace your compressor with a Nippon-Denso unit. The Keihin compressor isn't compatible with R134A without a rebuild.

For compressor identification: http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17247

For other AC information: http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35679

A lot of information like this is already in the FAQ and is very easy to find.

[Pnem3]

The R12 will last virtually forever as long as it doesn't leak out. You cannot use it enough to wear it out. If your car really does have R12 in it (it could have miss-labeled R134A, or even hydro-carbons) then it probably has a very small leak. It could just be the schrader valves which would be a simple fix for a qualified technician. If it is a small leak and has R12 then it would be worth keeping it R12. If not then it could be converted to another type of refrigerant.

[Dr_Snooz]

R12 will evaporate out if the system is not properly sealed. Like others have said, there are probably all kinds of leaks in your system. A refill of R12 is going to cost about as much as an R134 conversion. Of course, you will probably not find all the leaks on the first fill, so expect that you'll have to refill more than once. When you put the cost of a 134 conversion up against the expense of two or more R12 fills, the math becomes pretty compelling. You're not going to save any money by sticking with R12.

[Vanilla Sky]

The only advantage to R12 is speed. Old R12 systems were sized with R12 in mind, so they don't have the cooling area that R134A has. There's really no big reason to stay with R12 when any proper cooling system will chill down pretty quickly with R134A. It 30 seconds worth the added cost of R12?

[Pnem3]

When was the last time your AC was serviced and filled? That will give some indication as to how bad it leaks. If you tell me that it was filled a year or two ago and no longer blows cold then that is one thing. If you tell me that it was filled 5 or 6 years ago and it still has enough refrigerant in it that the compressor still comes on then that tells me that it either has a new leak or it doesn't leak much at all. If it had massive leaks then why isn't the refrigerant gone by now? Take it someplace where they can put a sniffer on it and you will probably find that the leaks are minimal. I'm not saying that they won't become bigger in the future but for now they are most likely small. Most of the seals in my AC unit are from 1987 and my unit does not leak.

As for R134A, if you are going to have a conversion done right, the receiver - dryer needs to be replaced with one compatible with R134A and the mineral oil needs to be removed from the system as it is not compatible with R134A and will not circulate. Can you get away with not doing this, YES, but you take the risk of destroying your compressor. In the end, R134A will never cool as well in our vehicles as R12. Depending on where you live and how hot it gets, take that into consideration.

Good luck with your AC.