whipped by hyundai

[countryson]

so i have an 89 lxi 4dr 5spd, bone stock 260,000miles. My buddy has a 05 hyundai elantra 4dr 5spd, he has a short ram and a mufller tip and round 130,000miles. We were goofin round earlier and he pretty much whipped me. On the bottom end I can pull ahead, when hit the higher revs he pulls on me bot a car length and holds it. I guess all thing considered thats not all that bad, but i will not stand for this :chainsaw: SO, do yall think a short ram and full exhaust would level the playin field? Im dunno how well these little guys respond to mods

[vteckiller]

so i have an 89 lxi 4dr 5spd, bone stock 260,000miles. My buddy has a 05 hyundai elantra 4dr 5spd, he has a short ram and a mufller tip and round 130,000miles. We were goofin round earlier and he pretty much whipped me. On the bottom end I can pull ahead, when hit the higher revs he pulls on me bot a car length and holds it. I guess all thing considered thats not all that bad, but i will not stand for this :chainsaw: SO, do yall think a short ram and full exhaust would level the playin field? Im dunno how well these little guys respond to mods

if you want the most easiest cheapest performance, get a short ram or full cold air intake, exhaust no bigger than 2.5''-3.'' high flow cat, paceshitter headers. all that should be like, 100$ for the cai setup, 100-200$ for exhaust setup, 100-160$ for headers, so a total of around 300-460$ if you get deep go b16 intake mani, obd1 conversion, portmatch the intake to the head, port match the headers to the block.. get it cleaned up and run 83mm pistons i think stock oem are 83mm? or its 82.7mm cant remember. anywho many ways.. gotta keep in mind the key is flow, in, and out. the right amount..

[2oodoor]

excellant answer


the elantra has around 138 hp, If I had to guess, you would wind up around 145 with ALL those listed mods. Weight reduction helps tremendously, every lb counts in a car this size.

[rjudgey]

Lol can't be having that! hehe!
What the others said really but concentrate on weight, light weight 15" wheels with some nice tyres too.
Exhaust if on the cheap get a later model Cast 4-2 section then a custom downpipe with 2" downpipes, and a 2.25" system with mandrel bends, if you can run without a CAT do it loses you 5-10bhp otherwise. CAI with nice long tubing large size with big air filter on the end of it, fuel pressure regulator and up it a tiny bit. With that kind of mileage it's really worth thinking about a engine rebuild. oversize 83mm pistons new rings and bearings and skim the head and block down a bit to boost CR ratio. Also I'd seriously consider a camshaft regrind Bisi stage 2 would give you a nice boost with all the other mild mods without wrecking your idle and driveabillity. Also I take it this is a manual? Please don't tell me it's auto! lol!

[Dr_Snooz]

What kind of gas mileage does he get with that Hyundai?

[vteckiller]

uhg bisi products.. overrated!! Buy a delta cam and be just as happy if not happier.

[countryson]

Of course its a manual, thats the only way to have a vehicle. i think he gets around 25ish, i pulled down 27 on the last tank, driving like a maniac everywhere.

I was planning on the full exhaust, what muffler would yall recomend? i want throat not buzz, would a glasspack as a resonator help get rid of said buzz? I will admit his hyundai does not have (thank god) is buzz. And a cam was in the plans too. How much does a delta run?

on the bright side i have more room in my car than he does :kekeke:
And i hold over his head my truck is faster than his car :flip: \

[RAZR]

You will be surprised how much just a cat back exhaust will do for these cars when i got my 2.5 cat back with a 40 series flowmaster it revved much smoother and accelerated like nothing else.
I would go with that and a short ram.

[hondalude86]

To be honest i woukd recommend a 2 1/4 inch eshaust. All mandrel bends of course. Im not sure if vteckiller is joking or serious, but youll end up spending more than he said on a few mods. I welded the exhaust together my self on my coupe, with a really nice dual tip muffler and cheap 32" glasspak and my exhaust sounds great but set me back 250 bucks. Do NOT get a 3" ricer exhaust. If you did all the above mods, youd still be heavily restricted by the header collector size, which is 2" on most of what you can get. Im running a vibrant muffler btw. Cam with some advanced timing and a header as well as an exhaust and pretty much any intake will wake that car up! Or break it!

[2oodoor]

i want throat not buzz, would a glasspack as a resonator help get rid of said buzz? \

there is already a glasspack resonator up by the cat oem...
also on my dohc I have a 32 inch (2.5 id) glass pack in place of the oem resonator and cat, 2.25 pipes plus a 2.5 in and out standard muffler at the rear and it has a raspy sound when you gas it, a very quiet raspy sound.
Im not sure if there is some spot welds loose inside the rear muffler making that sound or if it is the glasspack doing that. Typically glasspack tube style mufflers to create that bubbly effect on V8 cars though. I had a crimped style glasspack on it before with the sohc and it just had a low burp on a loop sound lol.
Inside the car I cant hear it at all though, I have to be up next to a wall or bridge to hear that.

A little more ignition advance would probably get that sprint down low for ya like hondalude said.

[Dr_Snooz]

I would recommend that you get your mileage back up to the 30+ it should be and then laugh at your friend for his inefficient car.

[vteckiller]

To be honest i woukd recommend a 2 1/4 inch eshaust. All mandrel bends of course. Im not sure if vteckiller is joking or serious, but youll end up spending more than he said on a few mods. I welded the exhaust together my self on my coupe, with a really nice dual tip muffler and cheap 32" glasspak and my exhaust sounds great but set me back 250 bucks. car up! Or break it!

go to the muffler shop and ask for scraps, or if they have mess ups, super cheap and a test pipe instead of the cat, and the muffler running around 50-75$

[vteckiller]

How much does a delta run? \

deltacam.com ?

[RAZR]

deltacam.com ?

Theres no info on the site about price.

[Tdurr]

When i got my 272 cam it was like 86+shipping. Pretty cheap imo.

[RAZR]

When i got my 272 cam it was like 86+shipping. Pretty cheap imo.

How long ago was that?

[vteckiller]

im sure if they where that cheap there only like $150 usd now max.

[DBMaster]

89 Honda Accord + 300ft cliff = 200mph.

I don't know of any cheaper way to make these cars fast. Of course, the way people drive around here I don't need a fast car. I need a Terex Titan.

[MessyHonda]

lets not forget about OBD1 swap. a good tune can help any motor

[vteckiller]

lets not forget about OBD1 swap. a good tune can help any motor

oh yes obd1 setup then a dyno after you do all those after market parts, lets not forget the stage 3 clutch with the light fly wheel, lsd conversion, get that valve a 5 angle grind, might as well get the 4g accord distributor cause your obd1. get bigger injections... maybe some more..

[RAZR]

This seems like alot of stuff just to beat an elantra.
i think if you get and 2.5 mandrel bent cat back exhaust with a good muffler and a short-ram intake you will beat him.

[2ndGenGuy]

there is already a glasspack resonator up by the cat oem...
also on my dohc I have a 32 inch (2.5 id) glass pack in place of the oem resonator and cat, 2.25 pipes plus a 2.5 in and out standard muffler at the rear and it has a raspy sound when you gas it, a very quiet raspy sound.
Im not sure if there is some spot welds loose inside the rear muffler making that sound or if it is the glasspack doing that. Typically glasspack tube style mufflers to create that bubbly effect on V8 cars though. I had a crimped style glasspack on it before with the sohc and it just had a low burp on a loop sound lol.
Inside the car I cant hear it at all though, I have to be up next to a wall or bridge to hear that.

A little more ignition advance would probably get that sprint down low for ya like hondalude said.

I heard from someone that that sound is commonly heard on Hondas because of the flame traveling out the exhaust valve and colliding with the header at the bend. Because the headers curve sharply around the engine, it's a more fierce collision than on a lot of cars. But that's just what someone told me. Kinda makes sense, but a lot of cars, even V8s seem to have a tight bend right off the cylinder head. They don't have that noise either, so I dunno... I just know it's obnoxious, and sounds like a damn rattling exhaust system, but mine did that since I had it built new.

[cygnus x-1]

I heard from someone that that sound is commonly heard on Hondas because of the flame traveling out the exhaust valve and colliding with the header at the bend. Because the headers curve sharply around the engine, it's a more fierce collision than on a lot of cars. But that's just what someone told me. Kinda makes sense, but a lot of cars, even V8s seem to have a tight bend right off the cylinder head. They don't have that noise either, so I dunno... I just know it's obnoxious, and sounds like a damn rattling exhaust system, but mine did that since I had it built new.


I think that "someone" is making stuff up. :tongue: The Honda sound is likely due to the fact that most Hondas tend to have small displacement 4-cyl engines (that rev really high), and people like to put large exhaust tips on them that sort of amplify the raspy sound. 4-cyls also sound different from 6 and 8 cyls because the exhaust pulses are farther apart in the engine cycle. And the way the cylinders are combined in the exhaust changes the sound too. For example, most 4-cyl engines that use 4-2-1 headers will combine cyls 1/4 and 2/3. Some headers will combine 1/3 and 2/4 (something to do with exhaust tuning), and they have a different sound. Not hugely different but enough to notice.


C|

[stat1K]

i like that "vtechkiller" is in here talking jazz like he knows his business on these cars... please see his other threads and then read his advice...

bisi being overrated statement after suggesting a 2.5"-3" exhaust... lawl.

[RAZR]

i like that "vtechkiller" is in here talking jazz like he knows his business on these cars... please see his other threads and then read his advice...

bisi being overrated statement after suggesting a 2.5"-3" exhaust... lawl.

X2 He needs some more experience with these cars

[stat1K]

or vtech

[RAZR]

or vtech

lol Yeah i dont quiet understand why its like that. Unless he really doesnt kno how to spell it

[gfrg88]

why not just do like a 75 wet shot? Cheap, easy, fast :D

[gfrg88]

http://www.intternetti.net/~jiri/motivation/v-tec.jpg

http://honda-tech.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=126953&stc=1&d=1272891212

[countryson]

I would recommend that you get your mileage back up to the 30+ it should be and then laugh at your friend for his inefficient car.

yeah 30mpg aint gonna happen with how i drive and where i live.

Nitrous has been a thought, like a 50hp shot tho. I have a heavy foot that doesnt need the incentive of nitrous :burn:

I wouldnt run exhuast bigger than 2 1/4 on this car, anything bigger would be pointless and take away what little bottom end it has. cat will be goin bye bye tho.

I have considered a glass pack as a muffler, ive ran em many a times, had one an 18in on my 4cyl jeep, sounded pretty good, not real raspy or loud. My k10 has 2 24in glass packs on it and it purrs like a kitten, then you mash it ans roars like a tiger :rockon:

Im not gonna do an obd1 conversion, small torque cam is probably as deep as ill go.

I sure as hell aint rolling it off a cliff, set it on fire maybe. Better vengeful satisfaction. :deadhorse:

i drove a 98 prelude with v-tec in it once, Its a neat feeling when it kicks in and after words i understood why so many people think its "soo omg fast" Not knocking it or anything, just made me understand more.

Does any one make a header and back kit? Thanks for everyones input thus far :cheers:

[RAZR]

yeah 30mpg aint gonna happen with how i drive and where i live.

Nitrous has been a thought, like a 50hp shot tho. I have a heavy foot that doesnt need the incentive of nitrous :burn:

I wouldnt run exhuast bigger than 2 1/4 on this car, anything bigger would be pointless and take away what little bottom end it has. cat will be goin bye bye tho.

I have considered a glass pack as a muffler, ive ran em many a times, had one an 18in on my 4cyl jeep, sounded pretty good, not real raspy or loud. My k10 has 2 24in glass packs on it and it purrs like a kitten, then you mash it ans roars like a tiger :rockon:

Im not gonna do an obd1 conversion, small torque cam is probably as deep as ill go.

I sure as hell aint rolling it off a cliff, set it on fire maybe. Better vengeful satisfaction. :deadhorse:

i drove a 98 prelude with v-tec in it once, Its a neat feeling when it kicks in and after words i understood why so many people think its "soo omg fast" Not knocking it or anything, just made me understand more.

Does any one make a header and back kit? Thanks for everyones input thus far :cheers:

You have two options when going with headers. You can get a pacesetter header or a obx header. Both available on eBay.
The obx header is also available here if you don't like eBay

http://www.erzperformance.com/mobile/default.aspx#Home

[2oodoor]

89 model? speaking of v tech, assure your bypass valve is functioning properly ...you know the one that opens up the intake runner for WOT

[gfrg88]

obx header off ebay. cheap.

90 accord test will bolt right up-ebay

Pacesetter is the only cat-back that will work(crappy though)-ebay?

3" CAI-ebay tube and k&n filter should be more than good.

272 cam- Delta

if you can find an LS(b18a/b) intake mani, or better yet an SI(b16) intake mani and throttle body do it. Easy to mod. and cheap. Might even consider getting a knock off mani off ebay too :)

[countryson]

whats the advantage to the other intakes? just better air flow? any real difference tween the obx or pacesetter header?

[gfrg88]

what you mean?? an intake tube is just that, a tube. filter is what really makes the difference, imo. if you're looking for every bit of power I'd look into a velocity stack with filter. OBX seems better, 4-1 "race" style. IIRC, it's an S&S replica. pacesetter is pretty crappy. For how close they are in price, I would get the OBX any day over the paceshitter..

[RAZR]

what you mean?? an intake tube is just that, a tube. filter is what really makes the difference, imo. if you're looking for every bit of power I'd look into a velocity stack with filter. OBX seems better, 4-1 "race" style. IIRC, it's an S&S replica. pacesetter is pretty crappy. For how close they are in price, I would get the OBX any day over the paceshitter..

I think by intake hes talking about the intake manifold.

[CzEcHy]

90 accord test pipe actually bolts to our exhaust? Wish somone would of told me this when I asked..

[obdriver6]

The OBX are 4-1 and are design for high end power. The pacesetters are 4-2-1 and are used for low end torque. Both manifols (B18/B16) flow better but the B18 is more for low end torque since the runners are longer and the B16 is for high end power since the runners are shorter.

[stat1K]

^ truth, however the 4-1 is still my favorite, but mostly the just because pace setter is janky.

[gfrg88]

b16 is better. iirc, didn't loose tq, just gained a little throughout the powerband. I'd go with some kind of knock off from ebay, like obx.

Yes, iirc, 90 accord test pipe bolts right up. I'm 99% sure, I did it like 8 years ago...

[hondalude86]

I think it would also be a good idea to look into the jet performance chip too. I never really thought to much about them until I read an old thread where a mildly modded a20 made 140whp on the jet chip in an obd0 compy. Would be a cheaper/easier alternative to going obd1 setup with basic bolt ons. Rustlude87 dyno'd 122whp on a high mileage a20 with just a cam, basic exhaust, shaved head, and cai. Just to give you any idea...

[countryson]

sooo in my little world (correct me if im thinking wrong) the pacesetter header and the b18 intake are what id go for, torque makes the world go round. And the way ive understood it is the a2o is a torquery engine of the bunch right? Stupid question here, what cars had b18s? And jet has a chip for the little guy huh? i may look into that as well. EFI can only adjust for so much ya know

[gfrg88]

for price of jet chip, I'd honestly look into an SAFC, play with cam gear and timing a bit..

B18A/B came in integras. civics might have them if they're swapped. always look at stamps. any b series will work, except for GSRs (b18c1).

[countryson]

SAFC? How much advance do these cars like for a DD? a tooth or 2? Or would a adjustble gear be wiser? Where are said stamps on the engines?

[obdriver6]

An SAFC is devise that hacks your computer to "tune" your engine. DO NOT!!! skip a tooth on the cam gear, if you want to advance the cam timing buy an adjustable cam gear either used (from member or ebay) or new from bisimoto! The stamp is in the same place where the "A20XX" is stamped in our engines

[countryson]

i have n idea where its stamped on these engines either. I know nothing bout these cars, Im a v8 guy. I understand all the same principles apply, more as much air in and out as effcient as possible. But all every engine has different quirks. So ill assume skipping a tooth is not a fine enough adjustment. Where does an individual acquire a SAFC?

[obdriver6]

I know this isn't the A20 but its in the same place. You can get an SAFC (not the same as VAFC) online, on ebay, other forums, and sometime here.
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/4991/c93c1wh5.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/505/c93c1wh5.jpg/)

[countryson]

aha! Good place for it.Thatll make life easier for me thank ya. So in theory with a cam, exhaust intake manifold and tune ill be sittin round 130-ish whp? or that on the optimistic side.

[RAZR]

aha! Good place for it.Thatll make life easier for me thank ya. So in theory with a cam, exhaust intake manifold and tune ill be sittin round 130-ish whp? or that on the optimistic side.

That's about right maybe a little more in my opinion

[vteckiller]

i like that "vtechkiller" is in here talking jazz like he knows his business on these cars... please see his other threads and then read his advice...

bisi being overrated statement after suggesting a 2.5"-3" exhaust... lawl.

sorry static ill change my name to vteckiller if it will make you happy, and i am sorry for talking like i know about " these cars " wont happen again static.

[vteckiller]

X2 He needs some more experience with these cars

so experience me more on whats so worth trolling a forum about on a 2.5-3'' full exhaust tube size?

[gfrg88]

so experience me more on whats so worth trolling a forum about on a 2.5-3'' full exhaust tube size?

that's way too big for a stock n/a engine. Ideal would be 2.25". with a pretty built n/a engine 2.5" would be best. 2.5" turbo, stock. 3" turbo, built.

that discussion can go on forever and ever though.. :deadhorse:

[vteckiller]

so pretty much if you're running cam(with a grind) port polish, maybe run 83mm pistons since you're port and polishing, just bore it out then. with headers, intake, exhaust set up. just rock 2.25"?

[gfrg88]

if you do all that, might as well get higher CR pistons. I'd do some oem ITR pistons; then I would do 2.5"


btw, just cause your P&P the head, doesn't mean you have to bore anything out.. My head is mildly built and block is stock ;)

[countryson]

would it be in bad taste to a hood stack with a turbo? 2.75 in?

[Hauntd ca3]

just in my experiance with my ca3 Si, standard B20a with a short ram and K&N.
completely standard exhaust the car ran out of puff @ 5500rpm
stock system with free flowing rear muffler, no real differance just sounded cool.
new mandrel bent 2.25 pipe from cat back, cat removed and replaced with straight through cherry bomb in its place and above mentioned rear muffler.
much more mid range and top end but still tapered off above 6000rpm.
4/1 mandrel bent headers with above system, pulled all the way to the redline with no let off, and sounded just fucking awesome.
2.25 just seems to be the best compromise for these honda motors and still allows scope for future mods. eg my itb set up and mild cams.

[stat1K]

sorry static ill change my name to vteckiller if it will make you happy, and i am sorry for talking like i know about " these cars " wont happen again static.

haha smart ass troll is smart huh? my name is actually stat 1k ... as in stat one kay... as in statistics one thousand. so your insinuation is lost.

[countryson]

do we have a place to descride all these acronyms? Cause im lost on all of em

[RAZR]

do we have a place to descride all these acronyms? Cause im lost on all of em

What acronyms? If you tell me which ones I can help you.
You can also google them.

[gfrg88]

Urban dictionary ;)

[CzEcHy]

haha smart ass troll is smart huh? my name is actually stat 1k ... as in stat one kay... as in statistics one thousand. so your insinuation is lost.

I always thought it sounded like static also.. especially with your signature saying "statik" x2.. Meh.

[stat1K]

I always thought it sounded like static also.. especially with your signature saying "statik" x2.. Meh.

that's because the guy who did their site said the yahoo shopping cart wouldn't recognize the 1 so they used an i... and bbn isn't MY shop :)

[russiankid]

How's the rest of your car? I.E. suspension, brakes, exterior, interior? If any of those are "eh could use work", take the performance mod money and use it for something useful. If you want to go fast, start with a platform that doesn't take much to make fast.

[gfrg88]

my vote still goes for nitrous. 200-300 bucks for a wet kit. cheap, easy, reliable if you know what you're doing :)

[russiankid]

I'll stick to my 5.3L V8...:flip:

[gfrg88]

5.3 v8?! What happened to your 3rd gen??? I came back, you were gone...

[russiankid]

I sold it last year. I moved away to college, got a truck (need 4x4) and had to get rid of the 3gee. Now I got a Chevy truck.

[countryson]

I'll stick to my 5.3L V8...:flip:

Im gonna have to agree, 76 chevy 4x4 already pulls on my honda and my buds hyundai :thumbup:


How's the rest of your car? I.E. suspension, brakes, exterior, interior? If any of those are "eh could use work", take the performance mod money and use it for something useful. If you want to go fast, start with a platform that doesn't take much to make fast.

and policy has always been "go before show" By no means am i trying to make it fast, I just want a better daily driver

[Nicktorius]

and policy has always been "go before show" By no means am i trying to make it fast, I just want a better daily driver

This completely contradicts the OP. I'm still confused as to why you care that your 23 yr old POS got beat by a '05 Hyundai. To each their own I guess. But my advice is... save your money, buy a faster car.

[gfrg88]

Nitrous damnit!!! :rant:

[countryson]

This completely contradicts the OP. I'm still confused as to why you care that your 23 yr old POS got beat by a '05 Hyundai. To each their own I guess. But my advice is... save your money, buy a faster car.

If you dont understand why i care then explaining it would be a waste of time. And why would i save my money to buy a faster car when this one was given to me? Making it faster than my friends aint making it "fast" and my daily driving involves a very heavy foot, noy to mention the 6-7% grades i climb. So adding power makes it faster and a better DD. i may have not put enough thought when i oput up my first post and i apologize


Nitrous damnit!!!

fine ill put nitrous on it

[gfrg88]

Yay for nitrous!! :D

[AccordEpicenter]

Nitrous damnit!!! :rant:

Nitrous works but a 10lb bottle these days is getting expensive to fill. Figure on spending $40-$60 to get it filled these days, and then its only gonna last around 10 runs max on a 50 shot. So it gets expensive when you just wanna have fun. I wouldnt reccomend the jet chip, Id take an SAFC over the jet chip but thats really not saying much either, OBD1 is really the way to go