Stezie's - 1988 Accord 2.0i 16v - OEM Restoration

[stezie]

Hi all,

After owning my CA5 2.0i 16v for almost 5 years now i decided to start into the restoration of the car. The reason why it taken me to now is that I only got a garage set up at the house last year and in the past year I was taking my EK4 civic to track days , so that was consuming a lot of the budget.

I will not be modifying any part of the car, I will use genuine Honda parts where available, and at a right price. If a part is needed I will try to source a second hand item on eBay and clean that up before I buy a new part. Ideally I will have the car in the condition it left the factory.

Unfortunately progress will be slow on this as I have limited time and budget to devote to this.. I will never see myself selling the car so I am in no rush to complete it. I just hope I have it done in time for my retirement. 

So here is a few pictures of what it looked like at the end of last year.
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMAG0180.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMAG0184.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMAG0182.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMAG0183.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMG_0087.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMG_0077.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMG_0078.jpg

[stezie]

Job 1 - I thought I would repaint the cam cover a Matt black .

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMG_20110724_153355.jpg

that tidied things up a bit.

[stezie]

I got the spare parts bit parked up outside. Basically I stripped everything and anything i could of that car so that i knew how to take apart my good one. I found out that even though the cars look similar there was a "facelift" from 87 to 88 year models and there is a lot of differences in the engine and gearbox.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMAG0219.jpg

[obdriver6]

oh man that looks so mint!

[Dr_Snooz]

Yes! Factory restoration FTW!!!

[Tomisimo]

Wery nice car, tidy and no rust. good base to begin with.
This is what I plan with my car as well. Alltho I dont mind extra power and better handling, so imo the internals could be made go faster.

[hondalude86]

I really do love these front ends... I'd almost like to have one for my accord so that i didn't hear the confusion between the coupe and the Lude.

[Hazwan]

I really do love these front ends... I'd almost like to have one for my accord so that i didn't hear the confusion between the coupe and the Lude.

But then people would be like, nice Civic!

[87roach]

I really wouldn't say this is a restoration.. at all.

Great looking car though!

[stezie]

Cheers for the comments guys.. in fact there is alot of rust on the rear arches. I took the bumper off and started cleaning up the drivers side arch. With the amount of rust I though the whole car was infected. Ill upload pics from my camera to show the cancer at work.. it doesn't look pretty from here on.

[stezie]

I just picked the stone chip protection off with my hands.. i haven't put any grinders to the rust yet...

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0534.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0535.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0536.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0537.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0538.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0539.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0540.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0541.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0542.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0543.jpg

[stezie]

Some more picking.. its just falling off in my hands.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0544.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0545.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0546.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0547.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0548.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0549.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0550.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0551.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0552.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0553.jpg

[stezie]

I pointed the camera up under the rear wheel arch to show the extent of the rust peaking through.. ill need to completely re build these inner arches.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0554.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0555.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0556.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0557.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0558.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0559.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0561.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0562.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0563.jpg

[stezie]

Passenger side wheel arch isn't as bad , but will still need attention. under the rear bumper looks rust free, thankfully. just a small bit of attention under the rear left taillight. the last picture in this series shows the size of the hole i picked with my hand.. this looked like a solid inner arch before hand. it appears that the stone chip protection done its job over the years, although the metal in behind was rusting away..

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0564.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0565.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0566.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0567.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0568.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0569.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0570.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0571.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0572.jpg

[stezie]

I have two new rear arches to order tomorrow. I just need to find someone willing to change them for me.

this is the first job on the car, and the rust i have found so far is making me dread what i can find later on...

[stezie]

These cars are getting really difficult to find in Ireland now for parts, and when I spotted an accord in the rear of a lorry at a local metal recycling yard last year I asked him if I could take a few things off the car before he crushes the car..

He said that I can take what ever I want off the car and only asked for 50 euro, which was a bargain.

Although it was a 12v engine with an auto gear box, the suspension is the same so I took all that, along with abs sensors, alternator, and full set of locks, and a working electric aerial, that wasn't broken!!

What annoyed me is that when the guy went to look at the car, he said there wasn't a mark on the car before he picked it up by the grab and threw it in the back of the lorry.. :( I could of helped myself to lights and panels.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/DSC00314.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/DSC00316.jpg

I hope to have the spare suspension cleaned, painted and fitted with new bearing, and bushings where possible to drop into the car.

[Tomisimo]

Holy, from the outside it didnt look as bas as close ut, check out under the gas tank also and radiator support, these are usual places they use to rust where you font see before its to late. The most efficient way to get rid of bublerust is to use rotary brush on the anglegrinder.
http://www.forum.svartkrutt.net/images/uploaded/200908061045424a7a9836bcf09.jpg
just mark the rotation direction and always use it in the same direction or those steel hears will fly out og sitting.

[stezie]

Holy, from the outside it didnt look as bas as close ut, check out under the gas tank also and radiator support, these are usual places they use to rust where you font see before its to late. The most efficient way to get rid of bublerust is to use rotary brush on the anglegrinder.
http://www.forum.svartkrutt.net/images/uploaded/200908061045424a7a9836bcf09.jpg
just mark the rotation direction and always use it in the same direction or those steel hears will fly out og sitting.

Yeah if you stood close to the car the arches did not look healthy.


My plan of action is to remove the complete rear suspension and sub frame, including petrol tank. I will then remove all stone chip protection from underneath and identify any rust spots then I will re coat the under neath of the car in black POR 15, then spray red again.

[87roach]

I think I spoke too soon!

It's not a project without rust repair haha

[Vanilla Sky]

Do you have an air compressor? With a restoration and rust repair like this, you'll absolutely hate not having one.

[obdriver6]

I don't like rust but I do like the stack of parts you have! :)

[stezie]

air compressor?? naaaa i doesnt have one.. should i have one? ha.. na im just a novice mechanic.. all the welding and body work will be completed by a pro for me.

unless for using air tools like an impact gun?



Yeah spare parts are handy, i grab as much as i can where possible.. not many accords about now.

[Vanilla Sky]

Air tools are awesome to have, especially to run big impact guns and sand blasters. As a matter of fact, you would probably REALLY like a soda blaster. It uses baking soda as the abrasive media, and it leaves a protective coating on the metal. You can save a lot of money by taking care of the minor rust yourself. Same with the suspension parts. A few cans of Chassis Black or similar epoxy paint would make your suspension look brand new.

I have to commend you greatly for restoring one of these cars. Most people, myself included, only want to make them go fast. Thanks for keeping one in nice original condition.

[Tomisimo]

Air tool are must on a 20++yr old car. I had to cut damper fork, because the bolt was rusted shut inside LCA, you have some neat impact hammer tools for cars that wil shake anything out, but the bolt willlook like a mushroom tho. plus you can use it with point sand blaster to prepare your car in order to save some cash for a full body repaint. do as much as you can, learn the car.

[stezie]

air compressor is on the shopping list then so.. What size of compressor would you guys recommend? bear in mind I would like to keep as much floor space as possible in my garage and dont want to spend a fortune on a set up that will only have occassional weekend use.

[Tomisimo]

from my personal experience, saving money on tools is not smart, look after Gebe tools, they are good example of quality=price. I believe they sell over whole europe. Gebe tests tools and if quality meets their standard, they will name it an sell it. There is a chart you can look at. it looks like this.
http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/68604888.png
Air tools, dont buy the cheapest, turbines inside tend to wear out quickly. To keep turbines in good shape I would recommend to get a Oil-Fog smearer. Inexpensive, but effective protection.

[stezie]

so a 150 liter compressor is minimum?

[Tomisimo]

This was an example. Different manufacturers have their own charts, mainly because they use different internal pressure. But I dont think you'll ever need one as big as you asked, open sandblaster uses more air, but if you want to keep dust and sand to the minimum, there is a spot-blaster gun with rubber nuzzle.

[stezie]

cheers dude.. ill keep an eye out for a deal on a compressor.. im in no rush..

right now I have a full set of suspension to clean down, paint up and then replace with new rubber bushes and bearings where possible.. this should keep me busy for a few months as i dont have much spare times on my hands..

[stezie]

WOW!! Look at the time.. told you this will be a slow restoration..

Any how, got stuck in there again at the week end tearing down the front end. I suspected that the front cross member was rusty and it was, quite badly.. So a tear down will allow access to that..

While i was at it, i though i would start the car one more time, just to hear it one more time.. it could be a year or two or more before i hear it running again..

I couldn't find my camera so have no pictures of front bumper coming off and the headlights and wipers..

But here is a few pics of how it is now...

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0656.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0665.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0666.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0668.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0670.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0672.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0678.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0680.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0682.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0684.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0685.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0686.jpg

So thats how it is now...

Air con is out, power steering pump and cooler out, cruise control out. radiator out...

I want to lift the engine out, get the suspension and subframes off, have them powder coated and then treat all the rust.

[Dr_Snooz]

Wow. You have your hands full. Seeing all that corrosion in the engine bay hurts. Best of luck with the build. Are you planning a frame up restoration?

[stezie]

In fairness this car isnt too bad for rust.. The front lower cross member and the two back wheel arches need replacing.. there is a patch needed at the front of the sunroof as well, and apart from the surface rust here and there, it shouldnt be too bad..

I plan on getting rid of all the rust and giving the car a full respray. Then build up all the suspension components with new bushings, ball joints, bearings where ever needed. I will also try to get the steel components powder coated black..


Most of the strip down at the front is to access the rust in behind the radiator reserve tank... and from the way its located i might have to dissameble the ABS system to get that out..

I think while i have every thing this stripped i might go ahead and lift out the engine so that i can get the front subframes powder coated aswell.

[obdriver6]

Rust scares me! :(

[Legend_master]

Wow.... I thought I had a large project in front of me. Always glad to see someone dedicated to saving one of these cars! The interior looks fresh tho, and good luck with the project.

[stezie]

Rust scares me! :(

yeah me too.. To be honest for a car thats coming on 25 years on Irish roads its in pretty good nick.. ive see cars here thats 10-15 years old and have been wrote off because of rust.

Only the back wheel arches are scarey looking and the guy i have lined up to do the work says that its not a big job for him and he can rebuild the inner wheel arch.


Wow.... I thought I had a large project in front of me. Always glad to see someone dedicated to saving one of these cars! The interior looks fresh tho, and good luck with the project.

Cheers. Hopefully i will be bringing this car to classic car shows for many decades to come.. :)

[stezie]

So from doing noting for years and months, I am getting carried away with the stripping!
I removed all the wiring loom from engine bay, removed the ALB system and removed the fuse box.

I also removed the Drivers side suspension...


I sometimes get carried away unbolting stuff from the car, i forget to take pictures at each stage... I must remeber to take more pictures...


http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/12June2012051.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/12June2012052.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0749.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0760.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/IMG_0758.jpg

[stezie]

I was going to repaint the engine bay, but there is nothing wrong in there.. I might just take the subframes off, have the subframes powder coated, and then give the engine bay a good degreasing and a polish..

Then when I build the engine bay up again, i will powder coat brackets / zinc plate / or paint them.



With the wheel arches, even though they look in good condition i wight take the wire knot wheel to them to remove the stone chip guard and repaint those and reapply stone chip protection.

all suspension conponents will be powder coated black where possible.

[stezie]

a few more bits removed at the weekend there.. im still not in the habit of taking pictures as i take bits out of the car.. i will get it off then take a picture.

i started at the back and worked my way forward. i removed all the rear lights, removed exhaust right the way up to the exhaust manifold, i removed the exhaust heat shields, the rear suspension and brakes are off, the fuel tank removed and .... shoot..... im sure i for got something.. a few more pics below..

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1153_zps89ac290b.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1154_zpsd33a7a34.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1157_zpsf1660bd9.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1169_zps63909d9d.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1155_zps283fc751.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1181_zps37489275.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1175_zpsf1f62ad0.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1171_zpsc814b117.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1184_zps74842fad.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1190_zps1d5a3fbf.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1199_zps985ab39b.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1201_zpsb885bea9.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1203_zpsdfbfd833.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1220.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1219.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1217.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1204_zpse453191e.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1216.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1215.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1214.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1213.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1212.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1211.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1210.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1209.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1208.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1207.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-16/IMG_1205.jpg

[A18A]

nice update! you have some fun ahead of you lol

[stezie]

Oh I know! One job I am not looking forward to is removing the old stone chip protection..

Anyone have any suggestions on removing that stuff as easily as possible?

[Xaisk]

Ill be ghosting this project. The car looked so fresh until you removed all the parts.

[stezie]

Ill be ghosting this project. The car looked so fresh until you removed all the parts.

the car was kept well most of its life, i bought the car 6 years ago and didnt have a garage to keep it in until 2 years ago. Having a car sitting idle out in the weather will let the rust get out of control..

Thankfully, apart from the rear wheel arches there is no major rust on any components or on the chassis. Most of the rust you see in the pictures is surface rust. so it time to get on top of it and clean it up..

[stezie]

I got the engine out at the weekend..

It will need a good de greasing and a few oil seals...

You tube Video of engine coming out. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL2jztO90Fc&feature=share&list=UUsK5inUQMqFALMfV40DfPlw)

[MessyHonda]

cool vid

[stezie]

an update, ill let the pictures speak.. still pulling the car apart to get it ready for a full respray..

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1255.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1254.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1253.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1251.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1246.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1244.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-9-22/IMG_1245.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1263.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1262.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1261.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1260.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1259.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1264.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1265.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1266.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1269.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1271.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1272.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1273.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1274.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-29/IMG_1275.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1277.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1278.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1279.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1280.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1281.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1286.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1285.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1290.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1291.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1289.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1288.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1287.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-09-30/IMG_1282.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-17/IMG_1398.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-17/IMG_1397.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-17/IMG_1395.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-17/IMG_1385.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-17/IMG_1383.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-17/IMG_1378.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-21/IMG_1421.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-21/IMG_1415.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-21/IMG_1414.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1476.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1479.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1482.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1483.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1484.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1485.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1486.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1487.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1488.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1489.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1490.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1491.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1492.jpg

[stezie]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1496.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1497.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1503.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1498.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1500.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1501.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1510.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1511.jpg
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-10-31/IMG_1512.jpg

till next time...

[stezie]

small update.. windscreens and boot lid off..

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-11-05/IMG_1522.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-11-05/IMG_1524.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-11-05/IMG_1523.jpg

till next time..

[eduardo i.]

more steering wheel pics please;)

[stezie]

more steering wheel pics please;)

A few special request pictures just for you eduardo..

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/IMG_0076.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-11-05/IMG_1533.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-11-05/IMG_1535.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2012-11-05/IMG_1536.jpg

[Dr_Snooz]

There's a lot of love in this build. For the rust repair, are you going to be harvesting pieces from donor vehicles or fabbing your own sheet metal?

[stezie]

There's a lot of love in this build. For the rust repair, are you going to be harvesting pieces from donor vehicles or fabbing your own sheet metal?

the donor vehicle was completly shot with rust.. not one panel was reusable. i could only unbolt parts from it then send it to scrapper.

I sourced replacement wheel arches, they not a perfect replica but they are better that the rusty void thats there..

I would not be doing the body work myself, as i have zero welding experience but I do have a guy lined up to do the work for me. He will be rebuilding the inner wheel arches with sheet steel. and for the bit at the sunroof, he said he could craft a piece of steel cut from an old civic at the door pillar. he said its got a similar crease for the sunroof glass, so will need a small bit of whacking to make it line up the best... fingers crossed as they say.

[eduardo i.]

Thanls :), the car looks amazing.Was that stering wheel recovered at some point? thinking about doing that to my firts gen acord:rockon:

[Vanilla Sky]

For all of that light rust, I'd really want a sandblaster. It's really the only thing that will get your metal really clean without really attacking it.

Looks like you've come a long way, though. Good job!

[stezie]

Thanls :), the car looks amazing.Was that stering wheel recovered at some point? thinking about doing that to my firts gen acord:rockon:

I dont think it has been eduardo. Its the original leather..

[stezie]

For all of that light rust, I'd really want a sandblaster. It's really the only thing that will get your metal really clean without really attacking it.

Looks like you've come a long way, though. Good job!

Yeah im trying to see what my options are to bring the car to someone thats within reason, driving wise to sand blast the whole car.

But yeah, I reckon taking it apart is the easy bit.. Cleaning , restoring, sourcing replacement parts and reassembly will be very time consuming though..

[Vanilla Sky]

If you come across anything you want from USDM land, I don't mind shipping overseas.

[stezie]

If you come across anything you want from USDM land, I don't mind shipping overseas.

Thanks for the offer! I very well might take you up on that offer.. some part number in honda europe show discontinued, but there still seems to be some stock in various odd parts in honda usa that i might need to get.. and any of those dealers refuse to send international..

[obdriver6]

Hope you remember how to put it all back together! lol but all kidding aside you are a brave and thorough man :bow:

[stezie]

Hope you remember how to put it all back together! lol but all kidding aside you are a brave and thorough man :bow:

thanks... i hope i remember aswell.. I think the hardest part to remember where I put all the different boxes of stuff.. I havent done much in a month now. I really must get underneath and start stripping all the stone chip protection... im guessing it will be a messy job. but once thats done its ready to be sent to the body shop for new wheel arches and a respray..


any one got any tips on removing that stuff from underneath???

[bscanlan]

Really wondering if you intend to remove the doors for the respray. I am close to painting and I want to remove the doors, but cannot find the connection (under the dash presumably) to disconnect the door wiring harness. Any thoughts?

[stezie]

Sorry i have no recent updates on this , its been a busy year.

Yeah the wire loom is easy disconnected. If you peal the wire grommet away from the car frame the connector is just inside the pillar. You can use a flat head screw driver to release the connector lock. If need be i can post a picture of the connector location during the week.

[stezie]

I got side tracked with another project.. Instead of selling the S2000, I went and bought a Civic Type R Shell in black and went about a building it for a track day.

5253

video of me racing it on track: Camera car is a civic with integra type r engine, my car is the one with the white number plate.

http://youtu.be/xCQX1x-PtYM


More pics here: @ Stezie's Black EK9 Pictures - EK9.org JDM EK9 Honda Civic Type R Forum (http://www.ek9.org/forum/photos-videos/58458-stezies-black-ek9-pictures.html)

[stezie]

So update on the accord. Car is basically a bare shell now.. so started into the rust.. i didnt realise how thick the wheel arch protection was on and its gonna take a very very long time to get it all off and resprayed..


http://youtu.be/BPQk7TqOU50

[Dr_Snooz]

I'm always happy to see updates to this thread. Keep up the good work!

[stezie]

So I got the accord completly stripped. All thats left is metal! so I took the car down off the axle stands for the first time in a year and placed it on a trolley. i didnt even use a jack as the car was that light i could lift it myself. i then took the car outside and gave it a power washing inside and out to get rid of crud


http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2242_zpsde1c5132.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2240_zpsf5bb5ba5.jpg (http://s67.photobucket.com/user/stezie1/media/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2240_zpsf5bb5ba5.jpg.html)

[stezie]

After leaving the car outside over night to dry off, i took it back in and lifted the car onto its side so that i can start cleaning the underbody back to bare metal.


http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2276_zps303ef294.jpg (http://s67.photobucket.com/user/stezie1/media/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2276_zps303ef294.jpg.html)

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2280_zps55deed35.jpg (http://s67.photobucket.com/user/stezie1/media/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2280_zps55deed35.jpg.html)

and after a few hours i cleaned one section

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2286_zps7f4e6116.jpg (http://s67.photobucket.com/user/stezie1/media/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-07-13/IMG_2286_zps7f4e6116.jpg.html)

[niles]

Wow! You inspire me - too bad mine is a daily driver. I would love to do this!

[stezie]

i just hope its worth all the effort! ill need to buy another grinder and a couple more wire knot wheels by the end of the week..


does any one have an easier method to remove this junk from underneath?

[Dr_Snooz]

does any one have an easier method to remove this junk from underneath?

Send it out to have it media blasted? LOL

[Legend_master]

i just hope its worth all the effort! ill need to buy another grinder and a couple more wire knot wheels by the end of the week..


does any one have an easier method to remove this junk from underneath?

I wonder if spraying it with carb cleaner and letting it soak will make it come off easier?

[stezie]

Send it out to have it media blasted? LOL


I have considered sand blasting , but i dont know if that will even lift this stuff . It must be a european thing but there is two layers of protection underneath. it looks like the car was coated with white seam sealer, then painted then and layer of rubberised tar type coating is on top of that again. The grinder bogs down and nearly stops if i put the wire knot wheel flat on the stuff. I have to attack the stuff with the wheel on its edge.

The protection actually held up very well over time, its just the bit that were missed at the factory that are rusty and letting the rest of the car down. put it like this, in the rear arch wells, i can tear sheets of the stuff off and there is barely any metal left behind. The metal rusted through from the rear, inside out. Its strange.

[stezie]

I wonder if spraying it with carb cleaner and letting it soak will make it come off easier?

Its worth a try. thanks for the tip

[Dr_Snooz]

I would try heating it with a heat gun and scraping it off with a stiff putty knife or scraper. If you hit it with a blow torch, it might just catch fire and you won't have to do anything more.


...anything more than rebuild your garage that burns down. :(

[bullard123]

Wow this is a fantastic project! This car will be very special to you for a long time once its finished.

[stezie]

Wow this is a fantastic project! This car will be very special to you for a long time once its finished.

thanks. will be kept for a long time

[zedries]

Just read through this... It was my intention to do this to my poolude but way too much rust.

I am impressed you are this committed. Well done. I may do this with my BA1 in the future.

Zaahir

[Mortem]

This project reminds alot of my project too, i got also B20A2 Ca5 Euro version. I never did go it so trought as you have, nice job! Thought my one had hell of welding, like 2 months in row just welding + other things, been doing it like year and half now. But i got my one back from paint and its painted with metallic/pearl white. When i get to i will post my project on 3geez.com aswell. Anyway just keep doing it!

[stezie]

This project reminds alot of my project too, i got also B20A2 Ca5 Euro version. I never did go it so trought as you have, nice job! Thought my one had hell of welding, like 2 months in row just welding + other things, been doing it like year and half now. But i got my one back from paint and its painted with metallic/pearl white. When i get to i will post my project on 3geez.com aswell. Anyway just keep doing it!



thanks. i almost have the under body completly clean. I limit myself to 60 minutes of working the grinder, so that I keep my interest up and return to it.

Im interested in seeing your car, pics please! :)

[Mortem]

thanks. i almost have the under body completly clean. I limit myself to 60 minutes of working the grinder, so that I keep my interest up and return to it.

Im interested in seeing your car, pics please! :)

Sure, i uploaded these pics already. Sorry for bad quality of pics, cell phone's camera wont give right to pictures. But from date you can see which one are latest. First picture is before and with name of "maal" are after, everything else is taken between. Will get better pics up when i got time to.

im a bit newb with forum, so i dont know how to paste picture directly, but heres the link to folder where you can all see em: Index of /ca5 (http://prepula.fi/ca5/)

[Mortem]

i also wanted to use OEM parts but found that alot of parts are discontinued from Honda europe so i had to hit to aftermarket stuff, been buying some of from ebay. 2 weeks ago got EBC GreenStuff brakepads + Blackdiamond brake discs.

[stezie]

i also wanted to use OEM parts but found that alot of parts are discontinued from Honda europe so i had to hit to aftermarket stuff, been buying some of from ebay. 2 weeks ago got EBC GreenStuff brakepads + Blackdiamond brake discs.


your car looks good. keep up the good work

[stezie]

Ok I'm at the point where i cant get this rubberized coating out from the corners and tight areas. a high speed wire knot wheel seems to be the only device to shift the stuff.. the coating is actually very effective for the most part, the metal is clean under neath. But it is let down by the coating process at the factory not covering the underneath 100% and making sure it was sprayed into the hard to reach areas. it is also affected by rust coming through from behind so it all has to come off and start over again..

I need suggestions on how i can get a wire knot wheel into the tight to reach areas.. the small wire wheel on the drill isn't rough enough to take it off.

For example the space between the spare wheel well and the rear chassis leg i cant get the head of the grinder in there. Pictures below.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-09/20130908_165459_zps25e38d4b.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-09/20130908_165447_zps9ef55e97.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-09/20130908_165419_zps780b6b7b.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-09/20130908_165400_zpsf8b4e238.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/stezie1/1988%20Accord/Restoration/2013-09/20130908_165350_zpsc5bd0048.jpg

[derolph]

i just hope its worth all the effort! ill need to buy another grinder and a couple more wire knot wheels by the end of the week..

does any one have an easier method to remove this junk from underneath?I have found that mineral spirits/paint remover will soften the undercoating, allowing it to be scraped or rubbed off.

[stezie]

I have found that mineral spirits/paint remover will soften the undercoating, allowing it to be scraped or rubbed off.


I didnt think of making a concoction like that. Did you mix it 50/50 then leave it on for a while? Was your car covered in the same way as mines?

[derolph]

I didnt think of making a concoction like that. Did you mix it 50/50 then leave it on for a while? Was your car covered in the same way as mines?No, I did not mix them. What I meant to say was user either mineral spirits or paint thinner; they are very similar products. Where I did this was in the wheel well area. I would guess the same type of coating was used on all Honda cars but I could be wrong. You could try it in a small area. If it works, I think you will find that the undercoating begins to soften within minutes. If it does not seem to work, then perhaps we do, indeed, have some different types of coatings that we're dealing with.

[stezie]

No, I did not mix them. What I meant to say was user either mineral spirits or paint thinner; they are very similar products. Where I did this was in the wheel well area. I would guess the same type of coating was used on all Honda cars but I could be wrong. You could try it in a small area. If it works, I think you will find that the undercoating begins to soften within minutes. If it does not seem to work, then perhaps we do, indeed, have some different types of coatings that we're dealing with.

ah ok i get you. I used petrol to try and soften it a bit, but didnt do a thing. only thing petrol was able to do was remove the residue that was left behind from the grinder.. Ill try some of that paint stripper. thats a gel so should sit on the surface and soak in a bit.

[Ayeobe]

I have to say man, this looks awesome. There's a reason my thread isnt named "restoration".. The care you are putting into this is awesome. I can not wait to see it on the road..But in the mean time, updates are aweesome.

[stezie]

I have to say man, this looks awesome. There's a reason my thread isnt named "restoration".. The care you are putting into this is awesome. I can not wait to see it on the road..But in the mean time, updates are aweesome.

Thanks. I cant wait to get driving it again either. I just hope i don't make any shortcuts..


Thoughts please guys.. I was thinking... I know the under body of the car was sprayed in a black coating.. but i was thinking on spraying the underbody with POR15, top coating that with the same red as the body, so underneath looks really clean. Then have all the suspension parts gloss black, and paint the exhaust and heatshields silver so it all stands out against the red... how to you guys think it would look?

[mint89]

544354425441

My 1989 LXi. purchased two months ago, only 115k miles, one owner and clean...clean...clean only needs dings and scrapes from body finished. redoing sound system and them off to body shop for paint and clearcoat. it rides like new, feels like new a rare find on craiges list. now I have two LXi 89. both green and in tip-top shape!!

[Dr_Snooz]

544354425441

My 1989 LXi. purchased two months ago, only 115k miles, one owner and clean...clean...clean only needs dings and scrapes from body finished. redoing sound system and them off to body shop for paint and clearcoat. it rides like new, feels like new a rare find on craiges list. now I have two LXi 89. both green and in tip-top shape!!

Dude, why are you post-whoring?

[usj101]

No more updates?

[Dr_Snooz]

So this is just my take, and people can take it or leave it, but you should NEVER reduce your car to a non-running condition for some mega-duper, holy grail build. Most of the time, you get busy, get poor, get married, get a kid and the build turns into a giant pile of crap in your garage. It bums you out, at makes the wife cranky, the kids throw rocks at it and you end up shoveling it into a dumpster after hanging onto it for way too long. If you REALLY love your car and want to keep it forever, keep it running above all else. Do piecemeal improvements and keep driving it. The only time you should do a frame off restore is if you're going to take the car to a shop and write them a 6-figure check to have it done by a certain date.

[Oldblueaccord]

So this is just my take, and people can take it or leave it, but you should NEVER reduce your car to a non-running condition for some mega-duper, holy grail build. Most of the time, you get busy, get poor, get married, get a kid and the build turns into a giant pile of crap in your garage. It bums you out, at makes the wife cranky, the kids throw rocks at it and you end up shoveling it into a dumpster after hanging onto it for way too long. If you REALLY love your car and want to keep it forever, keep it running above all else. Do piecemeal improvements and keep driving it. The only time you should do a frame off restore is if you're going to take the car to a shop and write them a 6-figure check to have it done by a certain date.


I am right there with you on this!

[Dr_Snooz]

As long as I'm on my soapbox, don't ever start a remodel until you have all the stuff you need to complete it. So many guys buy a house and tear out the bathroom without any thought of how to replace it. Then they get to live without a bathroom for years and end up with a house they can't sell because banks won't lend on a house that's torn apart. Then you get to spend thousands of dollars for the privilege of selling what you already own. Don't do it! And don't leave your remodels slightly undone. Replace every last piece of trim, every knob, every missing patch of carpet, etc. BEFORE starting on a new project. Leaving bits and pieces go will also result in a house you can't sell. The little bits seem insignificant, but they pile up slowly over time until they're a giant problem and the banks won't lend. Finish what you start!

[Dr_Snooz]

Okay, now that I got that off my chest, I think I'm done now.

[stezie]

Okay, now that I got that off my chest, I think I'm done now.

Good!

This is my take, MYOB!!! Dont presume that people are more interested in keeping forums updated, just for keyboard warriors to have the odd anonymous opinionated rant against what ever is posted.

This is the perfect example of why I no longer participate in online forums any more.

[Dr_Snooz]

My "opinionated rants" are based on my personal experience and I offer them in the hope that others will heed the lessons I've learned and not make similar mistakes. If that touches a nerve or causes offense, you're welcome to respond with "opinionated rants" of your own. If you choose to resort to personal attacks instead, that's your prerogative, but it says a lot. I wish you all the best with your build and will help in any way I can. But I will continue to speak my mind freely and respectfully and I encourage you to do the same.

[stezie]

Sharing your experience is welcome.

You SHOULD not presume every ones life experience is the exact same as yours, thus justifying how YOU dictate how people should go about their build.