Car got totaled, one week before repaint...

[89HatchbackLxi]

So... some idiot decided to make a left turn without looking today and turned right in front of me and I couldn't stop in time. My passenger-side front collided with her passengerside front, but the body shop said they were pretty sure my car was going to be considered totaled. Everything behind the hood of my car (interior included) was untouched however, so I'm trying to think of a way I can still save this car, since I've put SO much work into it... Is it even possible to save a car with front end damage? Since it's an older car and all?

Here's a pic of it...
http://i50.tinypic.com/hu0lsz.jpg

[RAZR]

Dang! that sucks. I see a junk yard run in your future

[89HatchbackLxi]

I'm assuming there's frame damage and stuff though. I don't know if I can get what I would need from a junk yard... unless it's like, a new completely new car or something

[Honda Man]

I would take a lot of work but if you can get like the hood bumper fender and headlight bucket replace from jy, and then have someone pull the body back to shape

[Vanilla Sky]

I'd start by pulling the damaged panels so you can get a good look at the structure of the car. Some time on a frame machine paid for by the other person's insurance. You might need a radiator support and such, but they aren't terribly hard to replace.

Claim insurance on it no matter what. You can always buy the car back, repair it, and recertify it. It may not be original anymore, but a good shop can make it as good as new.

[lostforawhile]

before you do anything,talk to the adjuster and see if you can work out something on the frame repair if you do the other repairs, the way these cars are built a lot of stuff unbolts, the headlight bucket, bumper,fender, pretty much everything comes off, even the front cross member unbolts and is simple to replace, once you remove everything you can see how simple the frame is on these cars, look at the rear edge of the door, if it's still lined up properly, you likely don't have frame damage, there is a lot of stuff at the front that can absorb impact damage and crush,without anything behind it being damaged, a crash in these cars looks much worse then it might be

[Stealth]

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[lostforawhile]

What do you mean by "Is it even possible to save a car with front end damage? Since it's an older car and all? ". It isn't that hard to find undamaged panels at a junkyard (depends which one you're visiting). On the bright side, since the car doesn't have paint on it, you don't have to worry about matching paint, just find a good fender, sand it down, and you're all set. One thing that is going to be hard is aligning everything back together, especially the headlight, that thing looks twisted pretty bad. Like Vanilla said, take off the panels, see what you have to work with. If the frame is fine and everything looks like you could just slap new parts on, then keep it. If the whole structure is bent up, then it's really up to you if you want to fix everything.

The parts that "look" (from the picture) like could be replaced include the fender, bumper, and hood. For for the headlight, you're going to have to bend it back to its original position before you drop a new one in. Unless you have some kind of "emotional attachment", you could find a new hatch and just drop all your goodies into the new one, but its all up to you and how much time you have on your hands. Good luck!

the entire headlight bucket including the pivots simply unbolts from the car, no point in trying to straighten it, just get a complete assembly from the yard

[charliekuney]

the entire headlight bucket including the pivots simply unbolts from the car, no point in trying to straighten it, just get a complete assembly from the yard

True, but mounting a new one and getting it line up correctly are two completely different animals.

[Stealth]

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[lostforawhile]

Thing is, I don't know how badly the car his car is bent on the inside. He could get a whole new assembly, but it might be easier (like charlie said) to bend it back into place. A new assemble might not just fit in because of how the whole thing got shifted. Good point though, I completely forgot that the whole assembly comes out!

you'll never get those lights to work right again, just swap it, if it doesn't fit the body has to be adjusted until the bolt holes line up properly, most of the frame on that side can be fixed with a large sledgehammer and a come along and a strong tree, it's pretty straight forward

[lostforawhile]

the heavy bracket part that the light assembly bolts too, isn't in itself adjustable, if it doesn't fit the frame isn't right yet, the headlight bucket assembly itself is where the adjustments are made

[Dr_Snooz]

Bro! So much hard work destroyed! About the only thing I can say is that at least it didn't get hit a week after you painted it. Like everyone else has already said, check out the condition of the car first. That will tell you how to proceed. It's really hard to tell anything from the pic, so I can't say if it's okay or not. If there's frame damage, I would probably find a new, un-wrecked shell to work on from here. If not, then fix it! That's what you're in school to learn anyway right?

[lostforawhile]

the frame there is very easy to straighten, not only does the lower cross member come off, but the upper radiator shell, unlike most other Honda stuff, unbolts,instead of being welded in

[Dr_Snooz]

Just me, but I would never try to straighten a frame. I've heard such bad things about it. If it can be removed and replaced, then I would do that, but I wouldn't try to bend it back.

Just me...

[lostforawhile]

Just me, but I would never try to straighten a frame. I've heard such bad things about it. If it can be removed and replaced, then I would do that, but I wouldn't try to bend it back.

Just me...

it can be done with no damage, remember I recently graduated from Auto collision, it's just steel, it can be fixed and put back in shape, hammered,welded etc, from what I can see in the picture, I dont even think the gap between the fender and front of the door is damaged, in a bad hit in the front,normally the fender ends up jammed in the door, I dont think it's that bad

[lostforawhile]

I can see the fender is pushed up, but thats just a tab on the end of the fender that holds it, it's not even contacting the door, if it was hit so bad as to damage the frame the gap would be gone

[Vanilla Sky]

I'm with Lost. It doesn't look like it's pushed in far enough that the frame will have serious damage. I've fixed 3 of these radiator supports with a come-a-long and a BFH. If it's bad and you're anal about it, you can always drill out the spot welds, burn out the seam sealer, and weld in a new piece. If done properly, it's as accurate as automated assembly, and it's stronger because you use plug welds instead of spot welds. You also have the opportunity to do some seam welding while you're in there, but you'll want to match that on the other side if you're going through the trouble.

After working on enough race cars, I know that it's just metal and it can be bent back into place, cut apart, and welded back together.

[gp02a0083]

Looking at that one picture , i would say from my body-shop experience that the front section of the apron is tweaked as well as the front corner of the radiator support. The uni-bodies on these 3rd gens are not that strong at all. A good 15mph tap to the front section can separate the inner apron from the core support under the battery tray ( i can prove this with my 1st black hatchback that was rust free). The bum per support also may be pushed in a little bit as well. depending on the damage i would say this has a good chance of being put on a good frame machine. I've seen far worse repaired at the body-shops I've worked in. Vanilla has a point with the repair, that side will end up being stronger than the other once the repair is made and is properly done.

[89HatchbackLxi]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I'm still waiting on the body shop to tell me what they are going to do with it, and whether or not they think its "totaled" (which I'm positive it will be).

Additional info on it: I slowed from about 50 to 20 before the impact occurred. The Coolant leaked out upon impact, along with some other liquid that may have been oil? I didn't check what it was.

I hope you guys are right at saying there isn't much frame damage. I'm really hoping to keep this car. I've put so much bodywork into it, and I don't want it to be wasted. The rest of the car looks perfect still. I don't see any visible secondary damage anywhere. The car stayed running for about 2 minutes after the crash occured and then the engine started making a really loud noise that didnt sound good (not sure how to describe it) so I turned the car off at that point. Car still worked in accessory 1 (maybe it was 2, I don't know) but it was beeping that the key was still in it when I put it into neutral to put get it up on the tow truck. Guess the battery still worked.

Also: The Passenger door does not open out more than about 30 degrees. The fender was pushed back into the gap.

[Ayeobe]

The car looks pretty bad to me, man. The bumper is all up in the wheel-well, and yeah, the fender gap is big because the fender is ferther into the body. The bumper and headlights are almost flush, so the radiator support and headlight bucket area was pushed back about 4-5 inches? If you have AC, i imagine it was refrigerant and coolant from the radiator/condenser that was leaking. When you said coolant leaked, its no big deal, the freakin resevoir is right in the front bumper basically, but from the looks of the rest of the bumper, i doubt the rad got out with out a scratch.

As everyone else has said, its just metal. It can be repaired. It just depends on how much work you're willing to put into it, and/or how much money.

[Dr_Snooz]

Okay, I'm not trying to have the last word here, but I think dissenting opinions are good (if they are informed, of course). I'll just add this one last bit and then let it go. Throughout high school, I worked in a car dealership that had a body shop. We sent plenty of cars to the frame straighteners and they could often put the car back together and on the road. However, the whispers amongst the staff when no one else was around were that the car was never quite the same again. They couldn't tell you what exactly was different, but it was. And we're talking about GM cars in the '80s here. They were such sloppy garbage that they were falling apart in the showroom, yet people noticed the frame repair. During that time, they had a batch of cars that would blow through tie rod ends in very short time. When GM got tired of replacing them on warranty, they simply increased the allowable tolerances to nearly 1/4" of slop. Imagine driving a car with 1/4" of slop in the tie rod ends. God bless Roger Smith. Yet even on these piles of trash, people noticed the frame repair. Obviously, a lot depends on what's damaged and the type of damage. A radiator frame isn't as important as a subframe, of course. Anyway, for big frame members, I wouldn't, myself, attempt a frame repair on something as precisely engineered as a 3g.

I'm done now. Thanks.

[2oodoor]

So I. Guess you are ok?
Good luck with the car, that sucks. Assess the mechanical damages thoroughly.

[lostforawhile]

Okay, I'm not trying to have the last word here, but I think dissenting opinions are good (if they are informed, of course). I'll just add this one last bit and then let it go. Throughout high school, I worked in a car dealership that had a body shop. We sent plenty of cars to the frame straighteners and they could often put the car back together and on the road. However, the whispers amongst the staff when no one else was around were that the car was never quite the same again. They couldn't tell you what exactly was different, but it was. And we're talking about GM cars in the '80s here. They were such sloppy garbage that they were falling apart in the showroom, yet people noticed the frame repair. During that time, they had a batch of cars that would blow through tie rod ends in very short time. When GM got tired of replacing them on warranty, they simply increased the allowable tolerances to nearly 1/4" of slop. Imagine driving a car with 1/4" of slop in the tie rod ends. God bless Roger Smith. Yet even on these piles of trash, people noticed the frame repair. Obviously, a lot depends on what's damaged and the type of damage. A radiator frame isn't as important as a subframe, of course. Anyway, for big frame members, I wouldn't, myself, attempt a frame repair on something as precisely engineered as a 3g.

I'm done now. Thanks.

you are talking about Gm here and their standards of frame repair lol, A lot of those cars from them couldn't stay in alignment when they were new I've seen plenty of Honda stuff repaired properly and it's just fine, knowing how this car is put together I dont think it will be any issue

[Buzo]

I would buy another 3gee and start over.

With this kind of damage, there will be always something, a little detail, an uneven gap between the door and the fender, something misaligned that would remember you of the event.

Also you mentioned something wrong with your engine. So besides the need to hire the best shop in the word, you need to address the engine noise which is already a huge project itself.

[MessyHonda]

once the frame is bent it will never drive straight. i had to replace my rear crossmember after i hit a curb around 40mph....i replaced all parts and the alignment shop had to tweak it because on stock setting it would not go straight.

[89HatchbackLxi]

I haven't heard back from the insurance company yet, so I don't know what they'll give me for it, but it's pretty obvious the thing is totaled. Now I'm really just hoping I can get enough cash from their insurance company to get another car for now but also to buy my 3Gee back with a salvage title, store it, and then at somepoint, I can get another 89 LXi Hatch and swap my basically spotless interior, louvers, etc, to the new hatch.... I honestly would have been fine just driving my hatch around for the rest of my life, as it was pretty much a perfect car by my standards...

My autobody class instructor happens to be an estimator at the bodyshop I had the car towed to, and I had autoshop class last night so I got to talk to him a bit about my car. He said he already reached about $5,500 worth of damage, and that wasn't even a complete/thorough inspection of the car since he has to wait for an insurance adjuster from the other person's insurance to inspect the vehicle since I only had liability on the car. He told me it appeared to be transmission fluid that was leaking from the car in addition to the coolant leak from the radiator getting destroyed, and also the frame damage was pretty bad, basically saying I really shouldn't try to repair the car but rather just start over with another car.

The good news is, I have all the receipts from everything I've had done to the car since I got it, (4 struts, 2 springs, 2 tires, 4 fuel injectors, patch panel + labor on everything) which was easily over $2500 on just that stuff in the last year, so I'm hoping to be able to use that to my advantage regarding how much I get for the car.

[import racer]

Mann that really sucks,But like they said if the frame isn't to bad it is fixable.Good luck man,hope u get it fixed.

[Dr_Snooz]

I can get another 89 LXi Hatch and swap my basically spotless interior, louvers, etc, to the new hatch....

You're in Cali, so finding a good, straight, rust-free donor car won't be as difficult as finding one in, say, Pennsylvania. Good luck with the new project. :ugh2:

[Vanilla Sky]

Do you have a manual or automatic? I can't remember.

[lostforawhile]

I haven't heard back from the insurance company yet, so I don't know what they'll give me for it, but it's pretty obvious the thing is totaled. Now I'm really just hoping I can get enough cash from their insurance company to get another car for now but also to buy my 3Gee back with a salvage title, store it, and then at somepoint, I can get another 89 LXi Hatch and swap my basically spotless interior, louvers, etc, to the new hatch.... I honestly would have been fine just driving my hatch around for the rest of my life, as it was pretty much a perfect car by my standards...

My autobody class instructor happens to be an estimator at the bodyshop I had the car towed to, and I had autoshop class last night so I got to talk to him a bit about my car. He said he already reached about $5,500 worth of damage, and that wasn't even a complete/thorough inspection of the car since he has to wait for an insurance adjuster from the other person's insurance to inspect the vehicle since I only had liability on the car. He told me it appeared to be transmission fluid that was leaking from the car in addition to the coolant leak from the radiator getting destroyed, and also the frame damage was pretty bad, basically saying I really shouldn't try to repair the car but rather just start over with another car.

The good news is, I have all the receipts from everything I've had done to the car since I got it, (4 struts, 2 springs, 2 tires, 4 fuel injectors, patch panel + labor on everything) which was easily over $2500 on just that stuff in the last year, so I'm hoping to be able to use that to my advantage regarding how much I get for the car.

they are estimating by replacing all the damaged parts etc, find out how much just to make sure the frame is straight, then you can fix it yourself pretty easy by all bolt on salvage parts

[Stealth]

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[gp02a0083]

they are estimating by replacing all the damaged parts etc, find out how much just to make sure the frame is straight, then you can fix it yourself pretty easy by all bolt on salvage parts

It really depends on the insurance company policies. My mom got into an accident back early in February that almost totaled the car if i didn't call bull shit on some of the adjuster's mistakes and shit he clearly should have seen but didn't or ignored. I asked if the shop could check and straightened the car if it needed it being i knew the front rad support was bent. I could have easily went to a pick-n-pull and grabbed the front end sheet metal, bumper, front lenses and other stuff for like a 3rd of the cost. The shop wouldn't release the car in "non-drivable" condition unless it was to another shop. See what you can recover from the car with $5,500 in estimated damage its never gonna drive right at all.

Hey i got a 80's g body cutlass, never had a problem with it for the past 11 years now with 153k on the odo. 1/4" isn't that far off , its only 6.35mm. It wasn't uncommon to see some jobs be about 3cm or more off depending on how extensive the damage and where it was even on a uni-body chassis.

[lostforawhile]

It really depends on the insurance company policies. My mom got into an accident back early in February that almost totaled the car if i didn't call bull shit on some of the adjuster's mistakes and shit he clearly should have seen but didn't or ignored. I asked if the shop could check and straightened the car if it needed it being i knew the front rad support was bent. I could have easily went to a pick-n-pull and grabbed the front end sheet metal, bumper, front lenses and other stuff for like a 3rd of the cost. The shop wouldn't release the car in "non-drivable" condition unless it was to another shop. See what you can recover from the car with $5,500 in estimated damage its never gonna drive right at all.

Hey i got a 80's g body cutlass, never had a problem with it for the past 11 years now with 153k on the odo. 1/4" isn't that far off , its only 6.35mm. It wasn't uncommon to see some jobs be about 3cm or more off depending on how extensive the damage and where it was even on a uni-body chassis.
they were bullshitting you on not releasing the car, it's your property, they have no right to seize your property, bad shops try to do this to scare people they are estimating that much damage because they are calculating the cost with markup of all the parts you can pull yourself and bolt on, they are also figuring in labor costs for work you could easily do yourself. and probably figuring in paint, unless you pull the parts off and look yourself, you'll never know what is actually damaged.

[Dr_Snooz]

Hey i got a 80's g body cutlass, never had a problem with it for the past 11 years now with 153k on the odo. 1/4" isn't that far off , its only 6.35mm. It wasn't uncommon to see some jobs be about 3cm or more off depending on how extensive the damage and where it was even on a uni-body chassis.

The spec was for the amount of play in the tie rod end itself. You could move the tie rod 1/4" before the wheel started to move. Yikes!

[89HatchbackLxi]

You're in Cali, so finding a good, straight, rust-free donor car won't be as difficult as finding one in, say, Pennsylvania. Good luck with the new project. :ugh2:

Yeah... I guess... Hatches are still pretty uncommon though. I've been on craigslist pretty much 24/7 since the accident. Only have found one hatch for sale near my area and its a manual transmission, carbed, dx model with body damage and a not so great looking interior and almost 300k miles on it. Oh, and its listed as $1,500. A total rip off if I ever saw one.

Pretty much the only thing similar between my car and that car is they are both 89s and hatches. The rest is way different. I just can't bring myself to buy a car in worse condition than mine was when I got it. So it might be awhile before I find myself in a 3Gee again...

[Stealth]

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[89HatchbackLxi]

You should squeeze as much money as you can from the insurance company (use your receipts etc.), then put a salvage title on your car. Fix the car up so that it's drivable again for now. Once you find a good hatch, buy it with some of the insurance money, swap the stuff from your hatch to the other, take the other hatch interior and put it in your hatch. After that, sell the old hatch (the one you had an accident in) and keep the new one. If you do this right, you will have gained money and lost nothing because of this accident.

That's what I'm hoping I can do. I'm thinking I will just get a different car in the meantime though, (my parents are looking to get a new car at the moment so I might just be able to drive their Odyssey for now if they do). My hatch probably won't be getting back on the road anytime soon if ever.

I'm also hoping to do a 100% interior swap from my hatch to the next one since I can't imagine I'll find one with a better interior. That, as well as swap a few other parts my car had that are still in perfect condition even after the crash.

[89HatchbackLxi]

Well, my hatch is gone... The first offer from the other people's insurance co. was $3,500 something for my car, plus an additional $350 for the 1qt of chromaclear+act and 1qt of chromabase + basemaker unused paint supplies and the 2nd patch panel I had ordered that I'm now unable to use. I'm going to attempt to get the base price up to $4,000, which I feel is a fair price. I'm not going to buy back my car from them though... I have nowhere to store it long term, and it's just gonna make me depressed knowing it'll never drive the same again. :(

I'm looking into getting a 94-99 3000GT SL as my next car. I'll probably get another hatch someday, but I'm guessing it will be awhile before I find another one that is in as great of condition as mine used to be. Bummer...

[Dr_Snooz]

That's a good price. Sorry to hear the car is going to heaven though. Your project had real potential.

[2drSE-i]

HATE that this happened. A ton of work, time, blood sweat and tears lost. I think that had a major influence on the price you got.

I'll throw this out as far as frame repair goes.

When you bend a piece of metal, it loses its strength (Think about a paper clip). I'll equate this to shade-tree frame repair, and probably a lot of what happens.

Actual, true frame repair costs GOOD money, and includes welding, seam sealing, and MAJOR body work. It can be done right, and the car can be just like new. Problem is, we hear all too often about the friend's girlfriends brother's cousin's car that was straightened out by strapping it to a tree and putting it in reverse with the wheel turned whichever way and it looked fine, but drove like crap. (whew, run-on sentence from hell...)

[Vanilla Sky]

Man, I think if I had that much money to spend after my 3gee got totalled, I'd build a mini truck. That much would buy a decent Nissan, some steel, and all of the airbag parts needed to bag and body drop it.

[HLW]

Well, my hatch is gone... The first offer from the other people's insurance co. was $3,500 something for my car, plus an additional $350 for the 1qt of chromaclear+act and 1qt of chromabase + basemaker unused paint supplies and the 2nd patch panel I had ordered that I'm now unable to use. I'm going to attempt to get the base price up to $4,000, which I feel is a fair price. I'm not going to buy back my car from them though... I have nowhere to store it long term, and it's just gonna make me depressed knowing it'll never drive the same again. :(

I'm looking into getting a 94-99 3000GT SL as my next car. I'll probably get another hatch someday, but I'm guessing it will be awhile before I find another one that is in as great of condition as mine used to be. Bummer...

If you want a 3g hatch, romonharvey listed an 89 SE-i hatch in Pre-90 Accord Related for 850 you might want to look into. The post's title indicates socal only so it should be in socal.

http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78920

[Vanilla Sky]

Except there were never any SEi hatchbacks.

[Honda Man]

Except there were never any SEi hatchbacks.

Ha that was what I was thinking also. Reall y sorry to hear she's gone holmes. But at least Snooz is right. Buy the way if you or I can get em, my offer for the louvers is still on the table for the louvers

[HLW]

Except there were never any SEi hatchbacks.

That's how it was listed. look at the link. the person may be confused about what is it but if it is a hatchback and FI I though 89HathcbackLxi might want to check it out to see if it would be acceptable. Check the link to the post

http://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78920

or the text form the post below.

89se-i hatch socal only
Hey i have a 89 se-i hatch for sell has 249,xxx miles but has a newly rebuilt motor from the what i was told there's no pink slip right now but.im working.on getting it im asking 850 thanks jusr message me for more details thanks

[Civic Accord Honda]

thats sad to hear your getting rid of her :( freaking acidents.... i would of fixed it though wouldn’t of been that hard to... theses old hondas are pretty easy to get back in to shape ...

[MessyHonda]

yeah when i go to the junkyard i get sad when i see a 3gee in a bad wreck. they are not too safe. i saw one that was prob rear ended and the whole truck was in the back seat. if anyone was back there it would of killed them.you got some money coming your way so i wish you good luck with your future car.