Wont start...during day

OK wtf....so the last two days, my car refuses to start. I have spark, battery is fine, all ignition components are fine. i tryed to spray some WD-40 (the flammable shit) to get some ignition, that didnt even work....it has before. Yesterday, 4pm it was 105 with humidity, it made me late to work...damnit....today it was 100ish at 1...made me late again....ive been driving a buick so u must imagine how frustrating it is to get home at 11 30 at night....

whats wierd is when i get home it fires up like nothing happened......help please???

bump

thats a tough one bro. good luck

yeah i heard the same about a car on preludepower doing that during hot weather, ill see and it may or may not help

http://preludepower.com/forums/showthread.php?t=243334
sorta might help dont know but i triedlol

If you sure you have spark then spraying some TB or carb cleaner in the TB should have made it at least grunt. sometimes WD40 doesnt cut it, too many other ingrediants. I am wondering if the ambient temp really has something to do with it, this is interesting.

i think it is a vampire

...doesnt wana go out in the day time so it refuses to start until night :-D

its the fuel pump main relay.

Can be had for like 40 dollars at the dealer

Do a search on the fuel pump main relay and you will see the same symptoms in other threads.

deff main realy. I had the same problem. all i did was take it apart and resolder it it works fine now. Have a look at this http://techauto.tripod.com/mainrelaysolder.htm it will help a lot


The relays are known for bad solder points, but they only act up in the heat

I've had very similar problems with my '87 LX-i

Normally (like 80% of the time) it'll start right up FIRST TRY with a crank or two at most. Then, every once in a while if I get in and drive for like < 5 minutes, shut the car off, run into the store or whatever, and try to start it back up shortly thereafter, it'll crank once or twice, start up and rev to like 1.5k for a second, and drop out completely. Then if I try to start it, it'll just crank away and never fire up.

I can usually (after like 10-20 tries) get it to catch by turning the key for a split second so it cranks once or twice, and if it doesn't catch, turn it back off and repeat. I never let it crank away b/c I've noticed that if it is going to start up, it will do so with just a few cranks. I have NO clue why this works or what is causing it to act so inconsistently...

Another interesting story is from this past 4th of July. It was like ~2:00PM I'd say (pretty hot outside) and I was about to leave to go to my aunt's for a little family get-together. Went to turned the car on - it cranked once or twice, fired up, and died out almost instantly. Turned the key again, and it sounded as if it caught (the tach jumped a little) and then it went back to cranking. Then every subsequent try (probably like 20-30 times) lead to just cranking. Next I tried to kickstart it by rolling down the hill next to my house and dropping the clutch, but every time I dropped the clutch, the tach would match the gear (2nd or 3rd - tried both) as if the engine was turning, but it WOULD NOT FIRE. :wtf: If I engaged the clutch, the rev's would drop to zero again as if the car was turned off, sitting still, in neutral. Then my dad tried towing me around the development and I tried repeatedly dropping the clutch and getting it to turn over, but NOTHING. :huh: We gave up and went to my aunts and stayed there until like 8:00PM. During this time I went to the parts store and grabbed a new fuel filter - we figured this was a good place to start and it hadn't been replaced for probably about 1 year.

When I got back, I turned the key and she started up FIRST TRY. I drove it around the block a few times - no symptoms. We changed out the fuel filter, she started up again first try.

Since then, I've encountered the starting problem a few times, mostly after the car has been sitting overnight and to mid afternoon (maybe like 16-18 hours?) but eventually I've gotten it to start up, sometimes after walking away from it for a while and coming back an hour or two later. My gut feeling (after doing some reading) is that it's the thermostat or some sort of faulty temp-sensor causing the ECU to flood the cylinders b/c it thinks the ambient temp is super cold. Any thoughts?

Looks like people have nailed the problem. But it might also be vapor lock, caused by a weak fuel pump or moisture in the gas. when it gets really hot out the gasoline vaporizes in the fuel line and the car won't start.

you can hear if the relay is working or not,it makes a click kind of noise. If you dont hear it, your not going to start. With mine the engine light will stay on, and the car won't start intill i hear the click, the light flashes, goes out, and then it starts. Its really bad when its hot, and if i go for like a 5 min drive and shut it of. Have a look at the solder on the pins of the relay and iif they look like the ones in the pic (on the link i posted) clean them up and resolder them. It worked for me

sounds like the main relay as well.....my dad thought it was vapor lock in the tank, as my car wouldnt have been running for 10 hours or so...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EX-ileAccord

you can hear if the relay is working or not,it makes a click kind of noise. If you dont hear it, your not going to start. With mine the engine light will stay on, and the car won't start intill i hear the click, the light flashes, goes out, and then it starts. Its really bad when its hot, and if i go for like a 5 min drive and shut it of. Have a look at the solder on the pins of the relay and iif they look like the ones in the pic (on the link i posted) clean them up and resolder them. It worked for me

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So... you think my problem sounds like a relay problem as well? Main relay or fuel pump relay?

its the main relay up under the dash on the drivers side, and its a bugger to get out. Once you get it out take the cover off and look at the solder on the pins, if they look like the ones in the link i posted you are going to have to resolder them or get a new relay. I priced one for my EX-i and it was $75, so I just resoldered it, and it works fine now


if you want I'll take a pic and post it up for you

()_O my 87 exi has the same problem too... if i turn it off for a couple mins n try to start it again it will rev to 1000 then die out then i cracnk it again n it wont start... now i hav an idea what the problem is >_<

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EX-ileAccord

its the main relay up under the dash on the drivers side, and its a bugger to get out. Once you get it out take the cover off and look at the solder on the pins, if they look like the ones in the link i posted you are going to have to resolder them or get a new relay. I priced one for my EX-i and it was $75, so I just resoldered it, and it works fine now
if you want I'll take a pic and post it up for you

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Is it behind the fuse box on the driver's side? A pic would be helpful :)

Can anyone explain what EXACTLY the main relay's purpose is and why having poor connections on the relay can cause the problem I'm having? I'm just trying to make sure I understand for my own benefit

well i busted out the voltage detector today and my fuel pump is getting power, pulled one of the fuel lines and sure enough, its got fuel. Its got something to do with the transmission, when i jiggle the gear shifter it starts.....that i can live with for a while.

The transmission? That would be the safety switch, but I thought those would prevent the starter from engaging at all? I have a manual, but that's the usual setup with an automatic. Hmmmm.

man, Im telling you its the main relay moving the shifter is just a quincadence(thats deff spelled wrong). There is nothing in/near the shifter that would cause that problem.As for power to the fuel pump, you get power there, but i bet you theres no power at the injectors

checked the power to the injectors as well, they were getting power....it started all day in the blistering heat. its gotta be the safety switch. btw, its coincidence ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 2drSE-i

btw, its coincidence ;)

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<-- thank you..... hahaha
is your car 5 speed or auto?

its auto

so.. the switch you think may be causing it not to start would be the the one that will not let the car start in gear. That switch will not let the car turn over either. Now the other thing is did you try to test for power when the car was having the problem?

what exactly is the purpose of the main relay and where does it come into play in the starting sequence??????????????????????????????

The main relay powers your fuel injection system and comes on when you turn your igntion on.

It's the main relay, believe those guys! If you want to verify: Turn the key to "On" not start. You should hear a click from the left side of your dash when the yellow engine light comes on. After 2-3 seconds when the light goes off you should hear another click. When the relay is going bad you will usually not hear the second click. The problem occurs when the interior temperature is elevated. That is why it does not happen at night, or when the car is in a garage.

been there done that!
my main relay died a few days ago. ironicly a honda motorbike broke down outside the house we were staying at the occupants dont like hondas. repair man comes. fixes bike. car dosent start. repair man trys to fix our car. fails.All this after i tell the guys at the house that honda motorbikes and cars are the most relibile ones. the relay cost us about £60 i dunno about dollars but hay there you go.
p.s A few days before the car wouldnt start at all it would't start 1st time maybe 2nd or 3rd time but now every thing is ok for now

UPDATE:

Replaced the main relay this past weekend. After pulling my old one out and examining the contacts and the soldering instructions, I bitched out and opted to just buy a brand new one and not have to hastle with soldering (never soldered before and didn't trust myself enough to not screw it up). Also, I really did not have the time to waste attempting to re-solder it...

Advance Auto Parts carries a direct replacement to ours (Mitsuba RZ-0028) and had to order it Saturday night to have it in stock for Sunday morning. Cost me a good $75 solid, but after starting it up repeatedly (AND HEARING THE AUDIBLE CLICK LOUD AND CLEAR WHEN THE KEY'S TURNED TO 'ON' POSITION) I'm pretty damn happy I did so.

So far I've had not a single problem starting even in very hot weather, so we'll see how it goes. Thanks to all who recommended this replacement :)


ON A SIDE NOTE:
My main relay was a B I T C H to get out. It was a very tight space to begin with and the A/C duct made it a very tight squeeze and I could only get a socket around the 10mm bolt holding the relay in place after pulling the plug on the relay and using a universal joint with an extension on the ratchet. Good luck to all who attempt this in the future. I hope others' are easier to get out...

I ordered mine from Majestic for under $40 if I recall, but I'm with you about messing with the soldering. I opened my old one up and doused it pretty good with electronics (tuner) cleaner while I was waiting for the new part to arrive. I actually had no trouble with it for over a week after that. Who knows, maybe that's a possible fix as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dmbshu

UPDATE:
Replaced the main relay this past weekend. After pulling my old one out and examining the contacts and the soldering instructions, I bitched out and opted to just buy a brand new one and not have to hastle with soldering (never soldered before and didn't trust myself enough to not screw it up). Also, I really did not have the time to waste attempting to re-solder it...
Advance Auto Parts carries a direct replacement to ours (Mitsuba RZ-0028) and had to order it Saturday night to have it in stock for Sunday morning. Cost me a good $75 solid, but after starting it up repeatedly (AND HEARING THE AUDIBLE CLICK LOUD AND CLEAR WHEN THE KEY'S TURNED TO 'ON' POSITION) I'm pretty damn happy I did so.
So far I've had not a single problem starting even in very hot weather, so we'll see how it goes. Thanks to all who recommended this replacement :)
ON A SIDE NOTE:
My main relay was a B I T C H to get out. It was a very tight space to begin with and the A/C duct made it a very tight squeeze and I could only get a socket around the 10mm bolt holding the relay in place after pulling the plug on the relay and using a universal joint with an extension on the ratchet. Good luck to all who attempt this in the future. I hope others' are easier to get out...

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told you it was going to be a bitch hahahaha. glad to hear you got it fixed tho man. good job:rockon: