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so today I had uber gay trouble with the 84, so I took it back into the shop, and he looked a few things over, couldn't find much, but the exhaust was horrid... so he took off everything behind the cat, gutted that out (carefully not to get caught) and then we ordered a new pipe and Resonator... so now its all pretty and doesn't rattle like hell when I turn it off.... weeee
nice felony there.
in just a few short years, in my state anyway, i will be emissions exempt W00T W00T
tee hee :) well, when I get my muffler back on nobody will know anyway, not like its incedibly loud anyways...Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanilla Sky
i odn't care if it sounds like cherry pie, it's still a felony. doesn't matter where state your car is registered, as it's a federal law that states that you can't tamper with your emissions equipment.
thanks for the asthma attack!
hey, so my car is now officially 20 years old. does that mean i'm emissions exempt? i do like that my car doesnt stink of exhaust odor though. my datsun on the other hand has no cat and you smell like exhaust after being around it. lol.
I removed all my emissions stuff, except my cat. I'm sure that thing doesn't work for crap anyways. It's still the original one. Call the cops! ;)
CVCC cars run clean without cats and don't need them to pass the emissions standards that were set in their day. They only had them because the law said that every car produced had to have a cat. I'm pretty sure that's why they stopped using CVCC on the Honda's after 85. Since they had cats, why bother with CVCC?
I wonder what cherry pie would sound like... maybe "mmphphpmpmphpmphphmmmmphpm" ?
you should get a high flow cat installed. you too 2nd gen guy...
Maybe once I put my DC headers in. Oh yeah I'd need an exhaust system to go with the high flow cat. Or a straight pipe to a muffler would work for me.
coolQuote:
Originally Posted by 2ndGenGuy
see, removing most of the emissions crap underhood doesn't bother me. most of it hurts bother performance and fuel economy, not to mention that it doesn't really help emissions.
a cat, however, doesn't hurt performance or economy when working properly, and does help keep the atmosphere clean.
if cars that would have passed emissions without cats would have been allowed to be built without cats, then everyone would have started building cars that didn't require cats. sure, we would eventually have had cats on everything, but we'd be living with a cleaner atmosphere due to the free market effect on engineering at the big 3. everyone would have put engineering money into creating engines that burned cleanly long ago, as opposed to just a couple companies with lean burn engines now. we'd also have a good chance of alternative fuels because fuels like propane and compressed natural gas burn much more cleanly than gasoline.
Many Civics and some early Accords were built without cats. The CVCC engine was the first to pass the pre-emptive emissions standards of 1975. Honda was the only car company to meet those standards before they were abandoned. The laws were abandoned because the other car companies coudln't meet them.
Honda actually licensed some CVCC technology to Ford though. Thier HSC (high swirl combustion) engines were loosely based on the principles of CVCC.
However, I'm sure that a CVCC engine WITH a cat would probably burn cleaner.
I'm also skeptical of high flow cats, and how well they actually do thier job.
high flow cats are constructed differently. they have a larger surface area, and generally a larger hoursing. they pass the fed standards, but i'm not sure about cali.
Canadian market accords never had cats until 86, I'm pretty sure. I disagree that a cat should be installed on everything, and argue against most types of pollution control in favour of tuning and routine maintenance. In fact, if you were to argue for a certain kind of pollution control system, I'd have a properly functioning EGR and EVAP system. Cats dont remove NOx emission, just burn up excess fuel which, if you are tuned properly and have a well designed management system, shouldn't be occuring anyways. EGR actually helps in controlling cylinder temps and detonation in high compression engines, and EVAP just makes sure all the fuel vapor from expansion while the car is sitting there gets burnt. My 83 toy has about 1500 km on its rebuild, a new, in tune carb, 10.75:1 compression, and on a cold morning you can start it and it smells like a new vehicle with a cat. Except the toy never had a cat. Besides, most neglected emissions equipment begins to break down in just a few years and cause such problems that the car is now a worse pollution hazard than a non-emissions car ever would have been.
So if you as me, tuning/maintenance>emissions crap
just my $.02
that's the basis of the sha-ken law in japan.Quote:
Besides, most neglected emissions equipment begins to break down in just a few years and cause such problems that the car is now a worse pollution hazard than a non-emissions car ever would have been.
while gutting a cat on a perfectly running car isn't that big of a deal, doing the same thing on a car that has even 15,000 miles on it is. since no one ever cares for their cars properly, with the exception of maybe .001% of the population, cats are pretty much needed equipment.
most of us pride ourselves of owning cars that have 200,000 miles on their original engines, without any work being done to them. these cars are more than likely not burning cleanly, and almost certainly burning oil. hell, even my car smokes like a barbeque pit on startup.
personally, if your car passes emissions without a cat, you shouldn't have to have one. since the vast majority of cars wouldn't ever pass without cats, then they need them.
oh, and it's also kind of nice that cats are worth a few bucks at the scrapper. i see at least 2 or 3 exhaust systems laying on the side of the road every week, cat included. ahh, the wonders of platinum as a catalyst.
my cat was coming apart into the resonator and it completely cut off flow which was killing my car... so it needed to be done for my car to actually run correctly.
so your cat was so clogged that it was being blown apart? sometimes that happens. just keep the car in top condition and a sniffer will never be able to know you don't have a cat.
to count as a classic car, it must be 25 years old.
i have to agree with Vanilla. I used to have straight pipe and i thought that by putting cat i would see HP drop. Well when i moved to MD i had to make my car emission legal I bought real aftermarket cat. so far I didn't see any HP drops. i passed emissions with flying colors.
if you are going to take your cat out...at least plant some trees to lower the emitting non cat smog stuff.
Lol, at MH!! Neway, V-Sky is absolutely right. Import tuner confirms it, always use a cat. Not using it won't help you unless the guy at the dyno shop is some sort of psycho killer that will axe you if you don't gain 1hp in an hour!
i might just get a high flow... if i can find one that might work for my baby
if you dont have to smog...i would not worry about it.
rock, there are universal aftermarket cats. you have to have them welded in or have your flanges welded on in the right positions. it's certainly worth it IMO.
and plant the trees anyway. it can't hurt, and if you plant the right kind of tree, you'll have somewhere children can build a treehouse in 20 years.
hmm, I should save up a bit and do that... I just really needed to get mine fixed cuz it was causing way more problems than it was worth... where should I look sir?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanilla Sky
this is what i have on my car right now. i passed immition sniffer pipe with no problem. http://www.car-sound.com/02product/d...irectfit=22623
i think you need this one http://www.car-sound.com/02product/d...irectfit=22633
i got it from this guy http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MAGNA...4891QQtcZphoto
looks like I can order one from schucks! WEEE!!! and I dont have to do emissions at all, so i am not too worried bout passing/failingQuote:
Originally Posted by shepherd79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanilla Sky
I do like your way of thinking. I was always under the impression that a cat would inhibit performance. If I can run a high-flow cat, and it doesn't hurt anything, I'm all for it. You've changed my mind sir.
Man speaking of trees, my neighbors cut down the trees in their yard. Pisses me off. Their property was beautiful, and now I get to see the side of their house. They already bitched about the head in their top floor during the summer, just wait until there is no shade. Idiots. I mean this is the goddamn Evergreen state and people clearcut everything. If you want a flat crappy piece of property, please don't move here.
:werd:Quote:
Originally Posted by 2ndGenGuy
or here
Yeah Oregon too, because I used to live in Portland.
seems like all of the 2gees congregate around southern BC and Washington.
hmmm vanilla sky u seem to have your head up the laws anus but you do have a point and honestly if u run larger pipeing everywhere a stock cat isnt that bad of a restriction... u wont notice the diff without it but the fact your ears started bleeding cuz most the engine sounds is happening right under you...
What?Quote:
Originally Posted by hotdoghogie
Not if it's hooked up to the rest of the system like it should be..:gun:
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyhatesmycar
I think this is the only place where they don't rust down to absolutely nothing.
I think we just have cooler people up here.
^^its too cold up there
