Roodoo2 LX Sedan B20 IN!

It is in, but the front mount has a dowel in it that I do not think there is a hole for. I am not positive yet so I left the nuts off the mount until I can get under there. It seems to sit pretty strieght otherwise, knowing it is a little high on the front mount.
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7190196.jpg[/IMG]
Nice and clean engine compartment , thanks to citrus orange degreaser, and followed up with gunk engine cleaner.
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7190194.jpg[/IMG]
Old A20A1, it runs great, going to put it back in something soon
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7190188.jpg[/IMG]
A pay off for a long hot days work, it's in but still a long way to go
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7190195.jpg[/IMG]

cool beans :)

Word. i want a b20

That was quick. Good work man. I want a ride in it when you get it running.

Nice work man! Do I assume correctly that that A20 intake manifold is going to go on the B20?

nice!!!!!

I'm Jealous....
Great Work Roodoo :cheers:

i wish i had time to do a b20 swap...yours looks great

thanks for the cheers !
This has been a scary project for me, not the work really but not knowing how this power plant is going to work out. I took out a good running motor and tranny. Good thing is this motor fits in just like oem so I won't have to cut anything so I can always put it back like it was and be ok.
Ive had it since March 08 so, naw it wasn't so quick to go in..lol
There is a long way to go yet, getting the mounts right, figuring out how to use this kind of auto tx, replace the selector cable, getting a trans cooler, plugging off a dozen coolant hoses I wont use, setting up the 38/38 intake and carb, putting in the d16 teg dizzy, making the left side cv axle, arghhhh too much to list.

One cool thing is this motor looks huge sitting next to the A20, and it fills up the engine compartment.. looks totally different. Seems like the power steering pump will be a lot tighter fit too.

:):) cool! hope it runs fine

Looking Good!

It will interesting to see a Weber B20

Good progress! I think you will be the first auto B20A in a while. I remember when I was at that stage as well. This has got to be the year of the B20's!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bullard123

Good progress! I think you will be the first auto B20A in a while. I remember when I was at that stage as well. This has got to be the year of the B20's!

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yeah the writing was on the wall Exile, you, mykwikcoupe, tooloud, ( who else? )got motors in this year.
I started another thread about these automatics, if anybody knows where I can get info on jdm autos please post it. This one has shift or lockup solenoids on top of the tranny, with fluiid passages under them. I am not using ECU or TCM with my plans. Wohdog says he just wired his hot with the key on, constant on and his ran ok, he said as long as the throttle valve cable was adjusted right. That is what has me baffled, why would it need solenoids. I can't find anything on these, most info is 90 and up where the solenoids absolutley were needed to control shifts

Congratulations.....Yeah there seems to be a lot more swaps popping up here lately. I noticed the last two B20A's i have seen lean pretty bad to one side. I looked at mine and it sits level side to side so im curious to why that is perhaps a wrong mount?

Had to use the A20 front mount. At first I just flipped the rubber frame part around so the dowel pin would fit, then the stud on the rubber mount was too short so the other one worked perfect. No lean that I can tell but then the car is in close quarters so it is hard to look at.
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270216.jpg[/IMG]
The belt looks and feels kinda loose to me, I pulled the cover off to line up TDC to install the D16zc teggy distributor.
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270215.jpg[/IMG]
need to plug off a LOT of coolant ports, & EGR gone !
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270214.jpg[/IMG]
As you can see I have a lot of loose ends and thing to deal with yet. I spent extra time getting around wrung off bolt on the trans mount. Finally just took an 11mm socket and hammered it on the wrung out 12, worked like a charm after digging up five other 12 sockets to get a tighter one.

that belt duz look a touch loose eh
wouldnt be starting her up til you do a belt/tensioner etc
my b20 leans toward the left a bit
duno why

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hauntd ca3

that belt duz look a touch loose eh
wouldnt be starting her up til you do a belt/tensioner etc
my b20 leans toward the left a bit
duno why

---

yeah, alot of them seem to lean a bit..

the belts on mine are like that too, i think its just something to do with the valve springs turning the exhaust cam backwards when the engine stops. I wouldn't worry about it

I'm Jealous.
Wish I had the time and $$ to get a B20 for my ride.
Looking good Roodoo

Im guessing the lean is coming from using different mounts since there is a few different ones floating around. I was using the steel front mount on mine but i do have a brand new cast one that i ordered from Japan. I thought i read that there was a slight difference with the front mounts JDM to USDM but don't quote me on that.

Well good luck!

The reason the cast one would not work was just the stud on the car's front mount was too short to give any threads.
Well I had a chance to work on it some today, hard though it was extremely thick and hot out today so every hour feels like three.
I hung the tranny on the hoist and removed the cross brace, two mounts, and dust sheild to install the shift selector cable. It went relatively quick since I used a step down to 3/8 adapter on my el cheapo pep boys 1/2 inch cordless impact.
I pulled the plugs out so I could turn it over by hand, I might have turned it backwards some, not sure which way to turn the crank with the rachet. Shot some marvel mystery oil in the holes to let it work I need to spin it over soon to put up some oil pressure.
Do importers put something in the starter bolt holes? there was this white petrified dog doo stuff plugging both holes. I shot some pb blaster to loosen it up so I can clean the threads.

Speed sensor question: does the fact that the transmission is JDM affect the ability for the speed sensor pulser on the tranny to signal the speedometer in MPH and not KPH. IN other words should I change out the one off my old transmission so the speedmeter reads right ?

should be jdm tyte and use a 180kph speedo (Y)

awesome man! enjoy it.

I think i had to use my USDM speed sensor because the JDM one was not calibrated the same.

Nice work, its looking good.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RobT5580

I think i had to use my USDM speed sensor because the JDM one was not calibrated the same.

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would that be the thing on the transmission or the electronic thing behind the speeodmeter?
I have been searching , I guess I will just run the JDM one and see what it reads.

The speed sensor is on the transmission.

I know where it is ^^ I was asking which part needs to be changed to read mph.

I went to the JY today and picked up a prelude axle. The intermediate shaft was already loose so the whole thing came on to me. $25.00 ( I have an extra shaft if anybody needs one)
I also picked up a Nippo AC compressor, bracket and lines $23.00
A nice multifunction switch from a low mileage car $4.00
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P8030235.jpg[/IMG]

I pryed on this thing some more this afternoon and I can't get the axle shaft away from the intermediate.. I will break out the heavy tackle later on it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

I know where it is ^^ I was asking which part needs to be changed to read mph.

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The way I read his post he was talking about the speed sensor on the transmission. Ive taken apart the speedo in the dash before and there's not really anything you can change in there, just a lot that is easy to screw up.

I thought the speedo was cable driven, and the speed sensor just sent pulses to the ECU/Cruise?

It gets confusing when Im dealing with old school cars and working with new cars and then all those in between years. I know you have to change the drive gear for the speedometer when you change rear ends so the speedo reads correct old school. I know you have to reprogram new cars when you change diff or get oversize tires. I think some cars have electronic speedometer heads but then get a reading signal from a transducer that uses a cable to the transmission. I am not totally sure how these work since it is an area I have not had to mess with.. yet. so my question was being that the trans. was built for land afar and they use kilometers per hour, what exactly do I need to change if anything for my mile-o-meter to read correctly.
This is not a big hold up on my swap progress cuz I can still run it like it is, but while I am in there with the intake manifold off I would like to get it resolved.

i woulda thought the only difference would of been in the gauge cluster itself, anyway for that half shaft, just bolt it onto the block and then pry it out, would make it way easier :D

Man you suck, this is the first ive heard of this. good work...:( I want an engine swap haha.

Hey Roodo did you check your waterpump out? I checked the ones out on both of the B20A's and they were rusted out really bad....... If you need one I have a spare that I can sell you

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

Had to use the A20 front mount. At first I just flipped the rubber frame part around so the dowel pin would fit, then the stud on the rubber mount was too short so the other one worked perfect. No lean that I can tell but then the car is in close quarters so it is hard to look at.
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270216.jpg[/IMG]
The belt looks and feels kinda loose to me, I pulled the cover off to line up TDC to install the D16zc teggy distributor.
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270215.jpg[/IMG]
need to plug off a LOT of coolant ports, & EGR gone !
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270214.jpg[/IMG]
As you can see I have a lot of loose ends and thing to deal with yet. I spent extra time getting around wrung off bolt on the trans mount. Finally just took an 11mm socket and hammered it on the wrung out 12, worked like a charm after digging up five other 12 sockets to get a tighter one.

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allways reset the timing when u get a used motor. mechanics are useless and dont set the timing correctly, every car i have got has been off a tooth/loose and when the belts loose it will hit on the top of the cam cover. i dont think mine ever gets loose its allways tight. i would remove it and reset/retension it

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bullard123

Hey Roodo did you check your waterpump out? I checked the ones out on both of the B20A's and they were rusted out really bad....... If you need one I have a spare that I can sell you

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good idea. b20 water pumps like to fuck out if you leave them for a while unused. the bearing seals allways go on them

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bullard123

Hey Roodo did you check your waterpump out? I checked the ones out on both of the B20A's and they were rusted out really bad....... If you need one I have a spare that I can sell you

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I figured, from what I have seen like when I changed the thermostat this weekend WTF do they use aquarium salt for antifreeze over there ??
Doesn't the prelude B20A5 waterpump work on these? PM ya Bullard

Yeah I think I will check out that belt real good, a comment by Haunted got me thinking.... something about a crate B20A for sale in NZ, brand new but not warrentied unless the timing belt was changed. thanks for the heads up AccordB20A.

Damn Guy, how have I missed this thread for so long? ...anyway, huge props to you for making this swap a reality.

So far it's looking great. One thing that would lead me to believe that the front mount is different on the B is that the crossmember is has two additional holes tapped under the existing "A" mount, that don't appear to be used in an A setup. (I just noticed this last weekend after removing the front mount. I can take a pic of it if you need. Hey AccordB20A and A18A, can you snap a pic of your front mounts on your B20's and post it up for Guy?

I did not see any extra holes on mine, BUT there is this thing bolted next to the front insulator mount that looks like some sort of counterweight, any body have a clue? I took mine off to clean up the crossmemeber and was wondering what would happen if I left it off.
If you look to the left of the mount in this pic you can see some of it, it is covered up by the hose in the pic though
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/P7270216.jpg

yeah, I know exactly that mystery mount you speak of. Beats the hell out of me just what it's for. my first thought was vibration dampener, but then I asked myself how the hell that would do anything meaningful, and the answer seems to be nope.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by markmdz89hatch

yeah, I know exactly that mystery mount you speak of. Beats the hell out of me just what it's for. my first thought was vibration dampener, but then I asked myself how the hell that would do anything meaningful, and the answer seems to be nope.

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it is a vibration dampener i took mine off and there no difference with out it being there.

Slow progress but it's coming
After having roadblocks in just about every stage, I am pressing on... got the new water pump (thanks bullard!) on and the new timing belt (still has Honda belt and looked almost new but meh)
I found a common belt to replace these B20A oem-tooloudnproud had one posted in a thread that fits a peugeot 90 model and nobody had it, they said it was factory direct order from gates. I found an upgraded belt from gates that fits a ...NissanMaxima/Pathfinder/Quest/Mercury Villager/Infinity 3.3L/and get this ... a Lotus (man that has to be good for 90 more HP)
Part #T259 gates, some prefix then ending with 259 Dayco.
Also today I got the timing covers prepped and painted the color I am doing the valve cover. Top Secret until it is unveiled ahhhh hhahaaaa I have to wait till the TV show airs so I can tell you..snicker
Had a wierd thing trying to time up the cam, the intake cam kept trying to spring back when I had it up TOP, so I pryed on it when I slid the belt on. I have the crank on the T scribe, I hope that is right for these.? wohdog?
Got the alternator bolted up, there was no difference in the carb vs FI alt, both had four blades. So I kept the newer looking one that came on the b20 since it has the right pulley.
I put the new plugs in, squared away some coolant hoses and the wiring harness. I need to trace the colors on those three sensor wires.. not sure which one is which. NBD
I spent about three hours sanding and shaping on the custom intake. (see Egrodomy thread) I never set out to make that thing any thing really fancy but I kept cutting and shaping, and smoothing out grinder marks and gouges till why not go for it. It is going to look cool and I have not seen anybody else do one like this. Ive heard of it though.

sorry for the long story, but I am bookmarking where I am for my own benefit.. lol
I still need to take the downpipe off, arrrrggghhh so I can line it up with the DC header downpipe that is on the car from the A20. I can use the same exhaust but just have to butt it. Too bad I cant find a DC header for this then I could just bolt it right up to my A20 downpipe. If the bolts break on this, I will just get a prelude manifold I guess since headers are so hard to find.
This is alot more work than I planned, I keep adding little things, Still not ready for a sound check... onward

I wanted to get it to just run a few minutes, so I completed the fuel and transmission fluid parts. i am running the little carb on it for now just to get it driving again.
The "A20 starter is locked up, it worked fine before, so I cant get it to turn over. Yes it is the starter , I have it out and it still kicks out the drive but doesnt turn the starter motor. Egrodomy manifold on, down to 800 grit on the surface, still not polished. I need to fabricate some Intake manifold support brackets. May be able to use the A20 ones with some mods. The oem b20a FI brackets are not even close btw.
I discoverd the vacuum dizzy has a broke inner nipple, so I may be doing some changes there. I think the guts of the A20 dizzy will fit this D16zc unit.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PA050267.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TWOLOUDNPROUD

it is a vibration dampener i took mine off and there no difference with out it being there.

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maybe thats why you've broken 700 front mounts lol jk

man that manifold there looks really nice!!!

i took my one off on my old car and broke my b18 gearbox a few weeks after (N)

crap, that useless piece of steel is going back on the car then.

looks good! my old starter did that to

Nah leave it off its probably coincidence mate

I would keep the dog bone in I was making more power than twoloudnproud and never broke a stock mount yet with a turboed stock A20. The dog bone is a torque mount that limits the engine movement from the motor twisting, I believe that needs to be kept unless some other provision is made to keep the motor from moving(twisting).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EricW

I would keep the dog bone in I was making more power than twoloudnproud and never broke a stock mount yet with a turboed stock A20. The dog bone is a torque mount that limits the engine movement from the motor twisting, I believe that needs to be kept unless some other provision is made to keep the motor from moving(twisting).

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second that, i be keeping it too

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AccordB20A

i took my one off on my old car and broke my b18 gearbox a few weeks after (N)

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prob just the way you drive
i took that vibe damper thingee off when i converted to manual and 50,000km later still no probs

i took mine off and now my boot lid dont even close anymore :(

dogbone is staying on, I was even considering finding an aftermarket type made for USDM models years ago. Hi performance looking one. I just have it off now as I situate the plumbing, manifold supports and stuff back there. :o)

Mines staying on as the b16 intake manifold is higher than the b20 one and with a alloy intake pipe you cant really see how ugly it is anymore cause its sort of hidden.

and with the way i drive i would break mounts left right and center without a dogbone, My front mount is allready broken i must rememeber to fix that

Looks really good. Definitely put the dogbone back in, you'll need it.

no pics but I took the starter apart, wow this is the easiest starter Ive ever worked on!
Remove the power wire from the solenoid on the assembly. Then the two 10mm long bolts thru the motor part. Remove the two phillips screws on the end plate.
The whole armature comes out intact with the brush plate. I cleaned the armature contact ring with some fine emory cloth, the brushes still had plenty of length so I cleaned it up and shot a little teflon grease to the bearings on both ends. Work the brushes over the slip ring and carefully slide it all back in the housing. Put the bolts , screws and wire back. Ta daaa. good as new! zero $$$

Whats the status on the swap Roodoo?

wow the house project has taken over....but I bought a header that will be here Monday! hope to have it driveable by the weekend. It has turned winter here and cold so I have to see what the weather does, I hate working with frozen hands.. lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

wow the house project has taken over....but I bought a header that will be here Monday! hope to have it driveable by the weekend. It has turned winter here and cold so I have to see what the weather does, I hate working with frozen hands.. lol

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Oh hell yeah frozen hands FTL, It was cold and raining when I was swapping my trans and the car was out side and I could not get it in to the garage( trans locked the tires up when i tried to move it so it was stuck lol) So i know how you feel XD

lol you pussys if you work hard your hands dont freez haha

nah i think your winters might be colder than ours...

Anyways im looking forward to seeing this car working, even better when its have a five speed gear bocks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by markmdz89hatch

yeah, I know exactly that mystery mount you speak of. Beats the hell out of me just what it's for. my first thought was vibration dampener, but then I asked myself how the hell that would do anything meaningful, and the answer seems to be nope.

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it absorbs harmonics from the a20 engine, it vibrates and cancels out a specific harmonic like a tuning fork. it's probably useless on the b20 motor since it wouldn't have the same harmonics.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AccordB20A

second that, i be keeping it too

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I kept mine, i replaced the large end with a solid aluminum mount and kept the small end rubber.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AccordB20A

lol you pussys if you work hard your hands dont freez haha

nah i think your winters might be colder than ours...

Anyways im looking forward to seeing this car working, even better when its have a five speed gear bocks

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Me tooz


it is too cold considering it has been 70's F the past few weeks

I need some nipple cream for my hands.. lol
handling fiberglass insulation and them dang roof shingles will take it's toll. When it is this cold your skin busts open easier it seem like, I just barely nicked my finger with some pliers and it made a big hole in my finger..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lostforawhile

it absorbs harmonics from the a20 engine, it vibrates and cancels out a specific harmonic like a tuning fork. it's probably useless on the b20 motor since it wouldn't have the same harmonics.

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that is pretty interesting Lost, where did you read that? it makes sense because I have seen similar things on usdm cars, but this thing seems pointless although it cant be. It is lined up with the flywheel sort of.

our b20's have one too maybe you guys better buy some off me, maybe thats why all the b20 turbo peeps fail lots lol. i think my current car has still got its harmonic vibration thingee in tact

turbo is ok, esp for A20.. amazing results and durability.
But this motor is capable of 180+ hp with a very usable torque band in NA form. Just about all I need since this is not a drag car, just a head turner.. lol

heres a good book for you, talks a lot about v8's, but tons of great engine building info for you. it's called engine builders handbook by Tom Monroe, it's HPbooks-1245 if you can find it. great great book.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lostforawhile

heres a good book for you, talks a lot about v8's, but tons of great engine building info for you. it's called engine builders handbook by Tom Monroe, it's HPbooks-1245 if you can find it. great great book.

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saw something similar when I was at the Summit superstore last tuesday.
They have some cool stuff in there, I need an excuse to go back there soon.

since Im getting a header I think I can use a sawzall to cut that oem downpipe (without cutting the oil pan me hopes) instead of removing the whole dam front crossmember like I have set up to do. The bolts are rung off, I was going to remove the manifold with the downpipe attached, which is a snakey undertaking.

I need a quieter muffler system, the smitthys is too loud by itself. I may add another glass pack. I was also looking at dual outlet rig like bullards but not as cool looking, more stealth. The only concern for me on those though is the added weight.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

I need a quieter muffler system, the smitthys is too loud by itself. I may add another glass pack. I was also looking at dual outlet rig like bullards but not as cool looking, more stealth. The only concern for me on those though is the added weight.

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try the raptor one it's pretty quiet

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

wow the house project has taken over....but I bought a header that will be here Monday! hope to have it driveable by the weekend. It has turned winter here and cold so I have to see what the weather does, I hate working with frozen hands.. lol

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so this means Ill be expecting a price on the stocker anyday right? No really I need it. Thanks man and good luck on the house. Its been in the low 40's here all week and rainy and Ive been under my car doing an engine swap. i feel your pain on the nipple cream. Iyts not the cold its the scraps that hurt and the slips knuckle bangs really kill.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mykwikcoupe

so this means Ill be expecting a price on the stocker anyday right? No really I need it. Thanks man and good luck on the house. Its been in the low 40's here all week and rainy and Ive been under my car doing an engine swap. i feel your pain on the nipple cream. Iyts not the cold its the scraps that hurt and the slips knuckle bangs really kill.

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yes you can get it I won't need it anymore, and thanks it has been a journey, aches and pains make it interesting..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

Me tooz


it is too cold considering it has been 70's F the past few weeks

I need some nipple cream for my hands.. lol
handling fiberglass insulation and them dang roof shingles will take it's toll. When it is this cold your skin busts open easier it seem like, I just barely nicked my finger with some pliers and it made a big hole in my finger..

---

Reminds me of when I did carpentry. My hands were constantly injured. Winters were the worst. Every little thing just busted my hands wide open. Even if they weren't injured, the cold just made them crack open and bleed. I remember hitting the edge of my finger with a hammer, just a glancing blow really, and it sheared the side of my finger off.

You should try those blue nitrile gloves. I did my swap in February here in Fresno and my hands never got cold never got injured. They didn't get dirty either.

got some blue nitrile, forget to use them unless im using adhesives... they work good though true dat..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

got some blue nitrile, forget to use them unless im using adhesives... they work good though true dat..

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finally convinced them to light the heater at work, it's not rocket science to light the pilot,although they think it is you stick a propane torch up there and push the pilot button in until it lights. wanting to save money by having us freeze. doesn't do much good unless you are standing in front of it though. airplane hanger=air infiltration of cheese grater. blue nitrile gloves ftw. was drilling with coolant all week and freezing my ass off.

OK , update.. and a little lesson in 3rd gen prelude headers!
For sure the Hedman Chikara does not fit (91 lude) I had to open up the stud holes, just as expected. But the angle of the down pipe is wrong as is the length. The headpipe flange comes right even with the bottom of the block at the oil pan. I did happen to try the down pipe backwards and it does mesh flat with the flange so I will cut this one, shorten and turn the downpipe flange to fit the Accord. Pics...
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PB280380.jpg[/IMG]
Look how long these pipes are! they look cool but do not fit the car, Im sure it would scrape the pavement!
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PB280381.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PB280379.jpg[/IMG]
I am a little disappointed in the Hedman Chikara Header as compared to my DC from the A20, the pipe is not a big. I have waited long enough and these are going to be what I use though. If I had known I had to do all this chopping I would have gone with the H22 Header with fat pipes. The stock B20 exhaust is not that bad, just heavy with the cast iron is all!
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PB280378.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PB280382.jpg[/IMG]

bump to be able to veiw the post! it would not scroll.. I will post other pictures here later!

http://i441.photobucket.com/albums/q...axhaust001.jpg
here you can see the 3g lude 4/1 headers i've talked out elsewhere here.
the collector flange is just below sump gasket level and has bout an inch of clearance either side of it.
the pipe off it only required a small section cut out of it and rewelded to the flange to get the angle right and ground clearance.http://i441.photobucket.com/albums/q...axhaust004.jpg
but here you can see the prob with the the a/c line or lack of it due to the number 1 primary wanting to occupy the same space.
but i can live without it

I have the AC off right now, so I could not tell anyhow. I think that a hose could be made to get around it though.
I like the long downpipe on the Hedman, I hate to cut any of it out.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

I have the AC off right now, so I could not tell anyhow. I think that a hose could be made to get around it though.
I like the long downpipe on the Hedman, I hate to cut any of it out.

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you prob can have the a/c line remade without to much hassle if you want a/c.
and cutting bits of the down pipe off with a 4/2/1 header will prob change the tuning of them a bit, but i dont thnk it would be stuff all diff, but unless you dont mind the pipes hitting things and getting bent and dented, you might have to cause that down pipe looks pretty close to the ground eh.
looks lke you might have to cut a few inches out.
the main reason i had to cut my down pipe is to get the angle right more than ground clearance.

You should PM me some details on that Hedman unit, it almost looks like a solution to my problem. I have about 2.8" between my front x-member and the front pan rail on my EL engine, which would seem to be enough to snake exhaust through. My concern is that the pan rails on the B20A are spread wider than mine, and there won't be any room once that engine's in.

If I can tuck the exhaust right up against the engine, I might just get away without other modifications.

Are you altering the angle of the header in relation to the head, or just the downpipe? Looks like you're gonna be close to the pan, might wanna incorporate some sort of heat shield like I'm thinking about.

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Originally Posted by guyhatesmycar

You should PM me some details on that Hedman unit, it almost looks like a solution to my problem. I have about 2.8" between my front x-member and the front pan rail on my EL engine, which would seem to be enough to snake exhaust through. My concern is that the pan rails on the B20A are spread wider than mine, and there won't be any room once that engine's in.

If I can tuck the exhaust right up against the engine, I might just get away without other modifications.

Are you altering the angle of the header in relation to the head, or just the downpipe? Looks like you're gonna be close to the pan, might wanna incorporate some sort of heat shield like I'm thinking about.

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I had not thought about the heat on the pan gasket, dam. yes it is tucked like you say but I held the downpipe up to it backwards with the outlet going towards the front bumper and it mated up flush without contacting anything so that means if I cut it about 8 inches from the flange it would work. I am not changing the head pipe angle just the down pipe needs work. There was a bracket there for the oem downpipe that I removed, maybe could use that to attach a shield. I dunno.
Haunted I was thinking about that, I may try and add some on the other end, this header appears to be tuned with the downpipe judging by the length of the runners.

from the look of the down pipe you have, the collector near the flex looks to be bout the same place as the factory exhaust.
so i'm going to hazard a guess and say that those headers are just a replacement for a factory manifold setup in which case you prob wouldnt shag the tuning up much by removing an inch or so near the flange to get both ground clearance and the right angle,if anything by shortening them you'd gain a touch more in the upper mid range.
as for clearance to the sump/oilpan, aslong as you have an inch or so clearance you'll be fine.
just check how much clearance the factory pipe has and aim at about that.
or set it up so that the bottom of the down pipe runs level or slightly below the level of the crossmember

Here they are together, you can see there is a significant difference in the downpipe. The head pipe lower flange also has an angle to it instead of being ninty degrees from the head side flange.
The oem downpipe is dual walled! pipe inside a pipe. I was wondering how I would cut the Hedman downpipe and NOT use a butt weld, but a fraction size OD sleeve to join them so there is no obstruction inside. I am going to try to keep close to the same length on those 2 to 1 runners.
The oem manifold weighs about 445849403 times as much as the header..
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...1228002208.jpg[/IMG]

the angle of the first half of the headers is going to be an arse to change.
but if you can get the down pipe to meet up and get some bolts in it you shoild be right there. looks like you have the clearance there for it not to be to close to the block.
with the down pipe length, cut the pipe of flush at the flange and grind out the remains of the weld etc so you just left wit a plain clean flange.
cut of what you need to off the down pipe and weld it back onto the flange.
that'll sort that part out.
they look like the bends are mandrels,so you should be able to cuta wedge out of them,bend them so the to edges meet and weld it up.
if you do the cut at the start of the bend, once its done you might be able to get a die grinder in to clean up the inside of the pipe.
and if you want to keep the length you have now,weld what you cut out of the first part of the down pipe back in near he collector.
go to an exhaust shop and get the pipe flared so you dont have to butt weld it

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Originally Posted by Hauntd ca3

with the down pipe length, cut the pipe of flush at the flange and grind out the remains of the weld etc so you just left wit a plain clean flange.
cut of what you need to off the down pipe and weld it back onto the flange.
that'll sort that part out.
they look like the bends are mandrels,so you should be able to cuta wedge out of them,bend them so the to edges meet and weld it up.

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I think that may be the way I go, cut the downpipe at the flange, make it about 45 degree wedge, and reweld it to the flange. That would streighten out the bend and put it about the right length at the same time.
The head pipe is ok as long as I match the angle with the other piece.

the only bitch is, since you got two pipes to cut and get right, you cant really afford to f it up eh
thats where i had it eay with my headers.
only one pipe to mod

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Originally Posted by Hauntd ca3

the only bitch is, since you got two pipes to cut and get right, you cant really afford to f it up eh
thats where i had it eay with my headers.
only one pipe to mod

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gee thanks for the vote of confidence..hahaaa
right on though, I will make sure to sink out the flange and then spot the area first then come back for a good roll of coins.

well i hope you get there in the end and have some good working b20a headers that fit your b20a good. i also hope they actually help the engine out haha

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Originally Posted by AccordB20A

well i hope you get there in the end and have some good working b20a headers that fit your b20a good. i also hope they actually help the engine out haha

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HA heh... yes well the stock one is not a bad design but very heavy so I look at it as weight loss. Not a lot of difference in the head pipe but the down pipe is longer so maybe that is the engine gain right there..
thanks for all the support guys, Im steady getting there.

well today is the first time I have given this project ANY attention in over a month so I will update. We cut the header downpipe and rewelded the downpipe flange at an angle to streighten it out from B20Axx ed ness. Still too long though as you will see it will surely hit the ground. Not a big problem as long as the flange matches a little further down the pipe when it is cut again.
I port matched the crappy Hedman welds , should have taken before after pis of that, it was terrible with obstructions.
You may notice something missing from the header now too. [IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PC300419.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PC300420.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PC300422.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PC300423.jpg[/IMG]

Sweet man looking whoop ass! I might be copying your methods here soon. Missing the O2 bungs and EGR?

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Originally Posted by 2ndGenGuy

Sweet man looking whoop ass! I might be copying your methods here soon. Missing the O2 bungs and EGR?

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what egr?I dont think this one had one now I cant remember LOL missing air pipe thing ?and the O2 bungs are down lower and I need those so they remain.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by roodoo2

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t...2/PC300422.jpg

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I need a brighter pic of this situation to determine oil pan vs x-member clearances.

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Originally Posted by guyhatesmycar

I need a brighter pic of this situation to determine oil pan vs x-member clearances.

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ok no problem, I already edited that one and it looked better than before I put it up, anyway see if you can get any more out of your screen adjustment till I get another pic .

my pipe hit a little when i made my downpipe,but i just took out the center crossmember and did a little hammering with a body hammer,bent the lip over,it's fine now.

It's good to see that you got it in there, hopefully that bend wont see too many bumps. You should see a decent power gain too I'd imagine, keep up the good work!

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Originally Posted by 87roach

It's good to see that you got it in there, hopefully that bend wont see too many bumps. You should see a decent power gain too I'd imagine, keep up the good work!

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Im not leaving it like that, it is way way too vulnerable and visable, I already hit bottom a good bit around this area.

guna say doo
\would take another couple inches out of that down pipe at least

Oh dear that joint is going to kill flow no way you can get it sitting at the same angle and have a new downpipe made up with less sever 90 degree angle to it!! That would flow ten times better, if you could find a way to move the whole header a couple of cm's or half an inch forward would work better, maybe have another flangle made up and get that welded to the header, then have the original holes bored out big enough to fit the spacers on so that your studs are still long enough to fit the nuts on. That would give you bit more clearance between block and pan. What do you think? Need to find someone with a mandrel bender i think and get some piping made up and a new collector for the 2-1 part on the downpipe, nice quality flexi joint too or it will leak and crack eventually. Nice to see the engine in though welcome to some serious power and speed now!! Also if you can have at least 2.25" mandrel bent system or 2.5" is even better but harder to fit, our engines just love bigger exhausts hard to believe they got 160bhp and used 1.75" piping!!