Idling/stalling problem in Warm Temp HELP!

[keruhas184]

I apologize if this has already been discussed to death, but I think that I have a unique problem. I have a honda accord 87 lx manual.
here is the deal:

First thing, the idle is almost always too high (or shows too high, as I can't hear it well when it shows 4500rpm - it sonds much lower. ) Sometimes it gets back to normal after a long time driving - for like 30 mins

Then the car is jerky sometimes when I press/hold the accelerator evenly. Then, it smokes too much most of the time at cold start, but I think that's just 'cause its too old (220,000mi)

But the real problem is that sometimes it takes 15mins to start the beast And the idle can't hold itself - and the car dies.

But here is that unique part: ALMOST ALWAYS the starting/idling/ stalling problems are in warm temp weather! When it's cold - starts/works fine.

During the spring/summer time (now), can't start it. When I do start her up, she doesn't hold the idle! So there I am- sitting like an idiot revving her up for 10mins so she doesn't die. And that doesn't always work - you driving, pop in the clutch, and she stalls at the worst moment

And the next time I start it (after 15-30mins being off), I have to do the same thing to hold the idle. Sometimes works ok and she doesn't die on me, but always jerky during the summer.

I tried to look for bad vaccum hoses, but I don't know how to, and there are so many! I tried to adjust the O2 sensor for high altitude (the one on the left of air filter - little box thing with a screw-like adjuster) and it didn't seem to help either way. I used the carb/engine cleaner a few times, but I think that all it did is eat out the joints of my muffler

I tried to see if I could adjust the carb somehow, so I took off the air filter, fooled around with the valves - didnt help. Sorry, but I'm not too mechanically savvy.

I took it to a "mechanic" all they did was rider her for 30miles, run some "tests" and say that they don't know-that junk is not for them! Their "test" said something like (don't have it with me) 3rd cylinder isn't getting enough fuel or some sort, but I think it was just so I don't feel bad paying the $50.

I replaced the spark plugs a year ago, they seem fine. Just replaced the air filter/oil.

Now, I read through a few posts, and the solutions seem: replace bad vaccum hoses, the ERG, PVC valves, coolant??, fuel filter(s) (changed both), or do some carb tinkering.

I think that I need to change some stupind temp sensor or some rather - I hope so.

Please guys, help! I've struggled with this problem for 2 years now, and don't know what to do next (well, I don't want to spend the $200 by going to dealership). I've changed almost everything there is to change in her, and plan (need) to squeeze out 50,000mi more, but this carb problem is really annoying.

Thanks in advance

Keruha

[shepherd79]

ok, i think your problem is your carb. my car did that for a while till i got a new carb. it was making jerking problem when it was cold or hot. i got a new carb, and boom problem when away.
idle, your idle should be around 2500 and not 4500. there is a screw that you can turn to lower it.
hard start in hot weather, well it can be a few things. again it can be your carb, or there is vacuum leak somewhere in the system.
check all your vacuum lines for any unusual sound. one time i had vacuum line broken and my car wouldn't idle at all.
oh and make sure you have Chilton or hanyes manual handy.

[ACCORD EX]

well my bet is on teh carb too !
but the mechanic said to you that something is wrong with the cylinders ! so that what i would do ! run the engine > pull each plug wire and see if there is a lot of difference without this wire ! and the install it back in and go the next one and so on !
if one of the wires don't really make a difference so this cylinder is not firing properly ! although this not making the high idle , but it can cause smockig , bad starts !

MIKE

[keruhas184]

Well, how much would a new carb cost? And if its cheap, wouldn't replacing one require a specialist in tweaking it to work right? I'll replace the distributor, as I saw a bad gasket in there.

How can you hear vaccum lines when the engine is running? All my lines don't look too new...is there an easy way in diagnosing those tubes? And if(when) I find the bad lines, do they still sell replacements for them?

Thank for the help

[ACCORD EX]

i buy vacuum lines per meter !

MIKE

[keruhas184]

Well: replaced the distributor cap, replaced a bunch of vacuum lines. Tried to adjust the idle stop screw (black one), tried to adjust the idle control screw (left of carb), fooled around w/ the right thingy (i think A/C idle). Put the altitude adjustment screw in the middle (left of engine little black box, near the vacuum control box)

First off, no change at all. Then idled tooo high (4000), wouldn't drop the fast idle no matter what... Fooled around more... wouldn't hold the idle... did some more adjustments...gave up.

Now it either doesn't hold the idle, barely holds it at 500 (but is dying), or after some driving the idle is 4000 and wouldn't drop till turn off the car.

So, the car starts fine now, I think the cap did it. Doesn't smoke too much. In going over how2, discovered the existance of idle mixture screw and fast idle screw... Will try adjusting them. But don't u have to take off the carb to do that?

Maybe it's still the vacuum hoses, haven't them all yelt..will do. I think its one of the valves or a diaphragm that's bad. Will probly go to dealer in few weeks . Oh well... guess I better practice not pressing the clutch while braking...

Further advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks

[DanG86LX]

It might be that throttle is stuck open on highest idle cam.. How is the choke flap let say after 5min? It should be fully opened.
Is the choke opener working?
Check the choke heater too, there are some old threads about it!

[keruhas184]

the choke flap was about half-way open when I turned the engine on while adjusting all that stuff. Where is the choke opener, and how do you deal with it? I'll look up choke heater...
But, i'll probly just might as well let honda guys adjust the carb right / fix it. Cause after looking through the manual jpegs I can clearly say that I'm not that competent in adjusting/troubleshooting all those components.
There is a problem somewhere, be it the hoses or something mechanical, as this idling/carb issue has been alive for at least 3 yrs. Might as well let the dealer find it. But if I can fix something w/o paying $$$, i'll do it.

[keruhas184]

just drove 100mi. Now it just can't hold the idle in any conditions, or holds it very low and dies.

So in the city I'm getting to know my best friend again: the handbrake.

Teh overall idle is 1000 more than before tinkering. When adjusting the idle stop screw according to directions there seemed to be no change, no matter which way it was turned...

THanks

[DanG86LX]

"When adjusting the idle stop screw according to directions there seemed to be no change, no matter which way it was turned..."

..so the throttle doesn't sit on idle-stop-screw! figure out what is holding the throttle slightly open. https://www.3geez.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17812
Open the choke flap manually by pulling its lever till is vertical, then give the throttle a kick, the high idle cam should release. If not, look from the left/right side of carb and see what is stopping the throttle lever.. (diaphragm lever ?).

[keruhas184]

Maybe that's what it is. Thanks for the advice, will try...

[keruhas184]

Oh, it idles fine now, or good enough. I ended up taking it to honda and having them tune the carb to spec settings. Then I replaced the whole distributor, adjusted timing, got NGK wires, plugs, MSD blaster coil ss, flipped the lid, put K&N in there, replaced EGR, fuel pump, cut AC belt, adjusted jets per advice of fellow 3g member (all the way inside, and 3/4 turn out), replaced O2 sensor and changed the trans fluid.

And what do you know, im starting to like riding in her. Next, Im thinking a short ram, and maybe a high-flow cat.

BTW thanks for all your help again