Project, 4g Distributor / Ecu ( Obd-1 )

[A20A1]

This guy is awesome. While all of us here at 3geez wonder how to make a powerful setup, this guy has it down to a science. If I had the money, I would buy that 3gee off him. Or have him build me an engine.

even better ask if he's hiring.

[SteveDX89]

The best question ever is when can this thread get back on topic.

[SteveDX89]

A20 dizzys don't have points.

[ICEMAN707]

has anyone ever tried chipping the a20 ECU that way you dont need to have OBD1 to have tunability?

[NXRacer]

has anyone ever tried chipping the a20 ECU that way you dont need to have OBD1 to have tunability?

thats not the point. the A20 dizzys are vacuum advance which severly limits your tunablilty. With the OBD1 dizzy's, they are electronically controlled so you have far more control over timing.

[A20A1]

Ahyone with experience with these guys?

http://www.gems.co.uk/

.
.
So we are OBD 0 ? cause pgmfi has a small forum there on obd0
http://forum.pgmfi.org/
http://www.superhonda.com/forum/index.php

[NXRacer]

we are pre-OBD which = OBD0.

[SteveDX89]

Yes, we're OBD 0 however A20 dizzys are vac advance. You have no way to control the timing using ECU tuning on an A20 ECU/dizzy. Why go through that trouble when an AFC will do the same thing. They tune the air/fuel ratio only and not timing.

[NXRacer]

didnt i just say that like 2 posts up?

[Justin86]

ok the swap is pretty easy with the exception of the dizzy and tuning. You need a SOHC OBD-1 dizzy, the conversion harness, and the ECU(F22 or B18 ECU is your easiest option, the civic P06 requires the fuel/timing tables to be changed for it to run proper)
For the carb I have seen a B18 switched to dual Webers, but I'm not sure what he did with the dizzy and ECU. I guess if you set it up right you could run it with carbs, maybe talk to the guys at PGMFI.org to see if it could be possible with like uberdata or an aftermarket standalone.

Now with the B20 and H24 I'm supprised the guy didn't design a better exhaust manifold esp with the B20 and to run the stock radiator on top on it, crazy. Dropping in an aluminum civic rad would leave more room for the turbo and a better flowing manifold I bet he could get out another 50hp at full boost. He made a custom intake mani but went with the cheapest log manifold design? Exxept for the manifold I give him props esp with the methanol injection, a very good idea esp for on the steets. Just read about an EVO8 with methonal injection, put out 450whp at 23PSI on pump gas, the methonal helps alot!

[ICEMAN707]

He says he is willing to sell the 3gee for about $10k-$12k to fund his H24 800hp dyno queen. He is still on the research and experimenting phase on that engine. But the b20a 3gee is just one nasty beast. If I had the money, I would get it ASAP. Nothing like having a 500hp 3gee that could kill most tuned cars on the street, and for a fraction of the price.

To put all that power to the ground, he is using a helical LSD from a ITR and a Clutchmasters twin disc solid hub clutch & aluminum flywheel combo rated for 600hp. He's not using NO2 on the b20a actually. It's putting out about 400-500hp as it is depending on the boost he's running. The methanol injection is his secret to keeping that engine cool and happy at 24psi.

[SteveDX89]

didnt i just say that like 2 posts up?

Yes but some people don't get it. Plus I added another point.

[ICEMAN707]

didnt i just say that like 2 posts up?

Yeah sorry guys, I disregarded the dizzy being vac advanced again and not timing tunable. My bad.

[NXRacer]

a little FYI - i've been talking to these guys http://www.jkobd.com/ who are currently working on an OBD1 conversion harness for the 3g's. I'll let you know if/when i hear they have the kit made and ready to ship.

[ICEMAN707]

that's great NXracer. 3geez have really come a long way. thanks to this site and all its 3gee enthusiasts. thanks mostly to all the moderators! watch, 2 or 3 yrs from now, there will be more parts made for this car if the interest keeps rising. so everybody keep pimpin those geez!

[NXRacer]

i've been emailing one of the guys at that site and he said they're working on an 87 with a GSR swap. He didnt say if it was a GSR motor swap or just using the GSR dizzy. I'm trying to get as much info as possible. i'll relay it as i get it.

[NXRacer]

OBDII started in 96

[ICEMAN707]

well there was an integra GSR for the 90-93 model year too. it used the rare b17a VTEC motor. that one used OBD1. or it could be a 94-95 early model 3rd gen teg GSR.

[bobafett]

caleb any word on the 3g specific conversion harness?

[Slipknotcraig133]

Yea heard anything on that harness.

[Immeraufdemhund]

I have an extra 4g with a good pt3 ecu dizzy, head, and all the wiring if anyone is interested. I have a friend who has an a20a1 that i'd like to convert over to this f22a1. But i'm thinking that i'd like to just fit other things on. I'm looking at the intake manifold but it looks like the size of the runners are significantly larger on the f22a1 than on the a20. I'm thinking that I could just port it to match, but the egr runs through the head on the f22a motor were as there is a pipe on the a20's. That would be an issue. There is also a water jacket that goes through the intake and head on the f22. I'm fixing to go get the runners measured... guess i could do that now.

ok...hmm looking at the intake manifold with the timing belt on the left and tranny on the right.
_/ \_
/ \
|5.1cm| 4.3cm | 5.1 |
\____/

the height is 3.6 cm for just the oval and an extra 1.1cm with the fuel injector hole.

the bottom bolts i think are going to be the problem, but i dont have an extra a20a head or gasket. the bottom bolts on the f22 are 8.7cm apart and 8.6cm on top. the distance on height between the bolts c/c is 6cm.

[Immeraufdemhund]

I remember taking out the wires for the 3g and it is way different for the 4g. the 4g disconnects mainly on the tranny side of the engine bay and then also disconnects the fuel injector resistor box on the timing belt side. the 3g i believe disconects on the timing belt side and just wraps all the way around and just has a few wires the connect to the tranny side.... so that might be out of the question. The pin out on the ecu is kinda long and isn't very specific on the haynes manuel, but i could figure it out if anyone wants it. seems like the b connector is the big one cause it connects nearly the entire dizzy. but the igniter goes to a22, the coil, ground, dash, and power... hmm i didn't know the f22 had a crank, cylinder, and TDC sensors

[w00tw00t111]

I have a p75 teg 5speed ecu but, have yet to buy a dizzy. The distributor I was looking at was a 92 Accord. Trying to remember what I read about it but, I believe there is 3 connectors on the dizzy. For that to connect to the a20 what all would be involved. On the other thread about obd conversion it sounded as if this dizzy would be our best bet.

[Immeraufdemhund]

does anyone have the wires and what they go to for the 3g? i can only find the 4g cause i have it in front of me. It seems that with the 3g accord it is missing the crank sensor, but it has the cyl sensor and the tdc sensor. so looks like a minimum of 2 wires having to be run, then also finding out what connector on the ecu to put them on. On the FAQ sheet it doesn't list it for either the 87 3g, or the 89 3g. but what's interesting that the TDC sensor and the cyl sensor are swaped on the 2 ecu's.

[thegreatdane]

interesting that the TDC sensor and the cyl sensor are swaped on the 2 ecu's.

I think that's a typo, although I cant say for sure since we dont have the 88-89 type ecu here. As for the wires for the ignition you would need to run two shielded wires for the crank sensor and 1 wire for the igniter. And since you're converting to obd-1 you need to take care of some other stuff as well like swap out ecu harness plugs and putting all wires at the correct pin locations for obd-1.