For those of you with AC that don't work...

[CoAsTeR]

My AC system runs fine... it was just a little low pressure so the pressure switch prevented the compressor from kickin' in. Of course from what I understand we have the old R12 (?) system which is like $100/lb (canadian) and it costs $$$ to change our system over to r134a stuff.......

anyways, I didn't care too much about my AC system since I didn't wanna spend alot of $$ so I just shoved 134a up its ass and VOILA, AC runs purrrfect. I mighta had about 3/4lb of r12 still in it but I put a little over a pound or so of 134 in.

anywas, can this potentially damage my system? I'm loving the AC, especially with all this massively hot humid weather up here in toronto, ontario. Its soooooooooooooo awesome havin' AC again!!!!

My mechanic did it to his 4th gen accord... he said that he tops his system back up every few months, even though his is still R12. so for like 20 bucks a year I have AC

[DBMaster]

Short term it will work. Long term, it will die.

[TeKKnoTeKK]

That will ruin your seals and o-rings over time, the two are not compatible. You are supposed to change the o-rings along with taking the R-12 out before converting to R134

[Einstein]

$20 first year, $200 second year, $2000 third year... :p

[DBMaster]

That's the thing with A/C. Many different refrigerants can be thrown in there and give you cool air. The issues include, moisture absorption by the refrigerant and oil, system pressures, corrosive subatances being produced, etc.

There is plenty of information out there about why refrigerants should not be mixed. It is illegal, of course, but nobody here seem to be too concerned about that.

I would convert my system to one of the R12 replacements before I would go with R134a for the reasons you can read about. Hell, I would put propane in my system before I would put in R134a. Of course, I was able to afford the new system components and R12 when my system went bad three years ago. I have four cans of R12 at home.

[accordlx]

They are right, R12 and R134a do not mix and are not compatible. Sorta like oil and water, they are both liquids but do not mix at all. They also use two totally different lubricants. I would never put propane in my system either. The flash point of propane is WAY TOO LOW. Should you have a leak or o ring failure, you would possibly blow up your car. I wish I could drive my car around the country and let everyone see how well a properly vaccuumed and charged 134a system works. The conversion kit is only $35-40. It is well worth it if you live where you need A/C. It seems that here in Ohio, A/C is a necessity, not a luxury this year.

[DBMaster]

LX, I was not really seriously considering using propane. I was just making sure I got my point across that I would not use R134a. I use the A/C WAY too much here to do anything to compromise the life of the system. After spending $1,000 to replace the system three years ago, putting $15 worth of R12 into it every couple of years is not big deal. When it's 100 degrees outside I want to maximum temperature drop out of my system and R134a's not going to cut it.

If I lost all of the refrigerant I might consider one of the drop in replacements for R12, but only one that runs similar, or lower, pressures and is compatible with mineral oil. It is nearly impossible to get all of the old oil out of your system and it is not carried by R134a. The oil that comes with the $35 kit is, but your sysem will be stuck with mineral oil sitting stagnant wherever it was before you lost the R12.

[DarkkManX]

where i say where in tarnation can i get info on convertin to 134 and info on r12 and whether or not i need it, how to tell....you know, the whole shabang

[DBMaster]

This is one of my favorite sources...

http://www.aircondition.com/

[Einstein]

Originally posted by DBMaster
LX, I was not really seriously considering using propane.

I'm suprised you even mentioned it. This is VERY BAD. It's dangerous for you and for anybody who works on the A/C after you. I've heard of critical injuries to mechanics who worked on a car without knowing somebody tried using propane in the system.

[tyne89]

lol ah man propane sounds like fun i think i goin to try it














.....jk

[Einstein]

http://www.state.co.us/gov_dir/cdps/...p/pr020494.pdf

http://www3.gov.ab.ca/hre/whs/public.../pdf/ch058.pdf

[Jerren]

lol, i just went to the honda dealer. they told me that it would cost like $1000 to get my ac fixed. I just laughed and drove away.. i guess i'll never get my AC fixed.

[1988starter]

I saw a r12 to a r134 kit for 35

[accordlx]

Just my point Einstein. Propane is dangerous. A shop in the area got busted a couple of years ago for using propane instead of R12. They found out because a lady turned on her air for 2 minutes and her car exploded. 2.5 lbs of propane is enough to heat an average sized well insulated home for half a day.

[1988starter]

well I just used a r-12 to r134 conv kit and it worked wonderfully.

[POS carb]

Mixing R12 and R134? Didn't anyone read my damn post? For christ's sake it even said the serial # of the compressors incompatible with r134!

[CoAsTeR]

Where can I find the R12-R134 conversion kit? what store has it? I don't think they sell em' in canada, you have to change the wh0le system from what I understand. So I'd have to goto niagara falls/buffalo to pick a conversion kit up......

I think there is a pep boys and a napa auto parts store just on the other side of the border... would they have em'?

[1988starter]

I got it from K-Mart their is a web adress on the box.
www.id-usa.com
But I have not looked at it yet it is called the
2 Way R-134a Retrofit & Charging kit

[DBMaster]

Geez, you can't even make an offhand remark. Don't forget that there is another highly flammable substance that runs under pressure in your engine compartment already....GASOLINE.

DO NOT USE PROPANE IN YOUR A/C SYSTEM.

How's that, happy now!

Personally, I promise no to post to another thread about A/C. People are gonna do what they want. They are going to sentence their systems to a slow death with cheap R134a "conversion kits" (Hey, it blows cold air NOW, right?), or they are going to do it right. It's all a question of $$. Thanks to our lovely government that makes a point to discourage us from owning old cars cold air costs money!

Sorry I started anything.

[CoAsTeR]

honestly, you're right.... I mean... my AC runs great right now. Just the other day I had NO AC at all, and it sucked but I am used to just rolling down the windows..... by slappin' some 134 in a r12 system, my AC works great and I'm loving it!! Sure it may kill my system in time... not to sure how much time though... but I was never planning on spending ANY money on my system, I was just gonna roll down the window. So if I can get a little use outta it before it completely dies (dies=i'm killing it with wrong freon) then why not? My buddy ran his with mixed freon for 2 years now and it still works great... dunno if I'll have that kinda luck but hey... if my car lasts me another 2 years... I'd be impressed. So after my original post on this subject I'm actually going to go out and buy the conversion kit and ONLY fill it with 134 so that MAYBE I can prolong the life of the system and do it halfass right.

I was NEVER going to put propane in my system... I took that suggestion just as sarcasm cuz I would like to think that it'd be flippin' stupid to do such a thing hahahahah....

Thanks for the help guys, I'll be makin' a trip to the states sometime in the next week or so to get mah stuff....... plus I need a radar detector... are they legal in Niagara falls or buffalo NY? I'll post this in another section.... Thanks

[DBMaster]

All right, just one more comment. If you have questions about your A/C I have noticed that this board has some real experts who answer questions. Maybe try to ask them here...

http://vintagecars.about.com/gi/dyna...ndition.com%2F

I read the stuff at the Interdynamics site and it all seemed logical, though I did read just about everywhere that you need a new drier with R134a compatible dessicant and that they make a R134a calibrated expansion valve that will give you similar performance to R12.

I looked on eBay at the prices people were paying for R12. Wow! A friend of mine at church gave me fours cans for free!

Happy cooling!