Dragstrip pictures. (yes 1/4 mile times too)

[carotman]

Last time I checked, the B16A was less powerful than the B20A, required custom mounts and shift linkage that alore is worth 1k at placeracing. They make the same HP but the B20A has alot more torque... even more torque than a B18C.

I made a quick dollar conversion and the total is around 2300 US for the modded B20A. (depends of the exhange rate)

The B16A here costs around 2k for a 2nd gen. With the engine mounts and other little stuff, It brings the total to over 3K for an unknown B16A thah has an hydraulic transmission. I would need a cable tranny or do a hydro conversion. (more $$$). The 1st gen B16A isn't an option. Most of them need to be rebuild to I prefer to do this with the B20A.

The only advantages the B16A has over the B20A is the VTEC (I don't really need it) and all the parts are available at the dealer. You have to get some parts in Japan forthe B20A but it's really not that much. You can even get them in Europe to the language barrier isn't a trouble.. Alot of B series parts will fit on the B20A like cams, intake manifold, valve covers, camgears, pulleys, LSD, seals, distributors, etc.

Oh, the B20A has 0 miles on it (got it rebuild) while the B16A would kinda be unknown (if it's JDM). I could get a USDM B16A2 but it's a tad more expensive. The B20A cost me $350....

So, for this cost, I got a brand new engine that can match the newer B series.

Of course, the problem is the ECU... no OBD-0 ECU is capable of drivingthis engine at it's full potential.... I'm taking care of this soon.

It all depends on what you want to do with the car. The newer B series are really good engine, I just chose the other option.

[Coroncho80]

alst time I checked, the B16A was less powerful than the B20A

The B16A2 is a better engine than the B20A. If you wanna prove that, we can get a civic hatch with a STOCK B16A2 motor and one with a stock B20A motor and run to see who is stronger. Trust me, B20A will go down. Now, it will be sad to see a STOCK 1.6 beat a stock 2.0 littler.

As far as price goes, you guys are getting robbed because the B16s are not as expensive as they tell you guys.

[accordlxi2.0]

i don't mean to change the subject but i've alway's wondered why acura integra's engine has alot of horses but little torque?
and since you guy's have b series i figured yall could know??

[SteveDX89]

Newer B's have less torque because of the shorter stroke. They make power up top when HP takes over. Carot, I'm running my stock 1st gen B16 w/ I/H/E and unknown miles on Saturday. We'll see how it compares to your built B20A.

[accordlxi2.0]

oh okay, that's cool.

[carotman]

Steve, you should better times than me (I hope so). A stock Civic SI can do low 15's with the B16A2 if the driver knows what he's doing. Your car is obviously lighter than mine (I got power acessories all around) and has something to make the B16A breathe as it should.

My engine needs alot of adjusting and the car too. That was merely a "test" drive so see if everything was ok in the engine and I'm satisfied with the results. There is still alot of adjusting that needs to be done. This is a custom engine so you got the custom work to do that comes with it :P

BTW, I'll post a picture of my distributor soon.... I noticed this morning that my intake cam is set to open LATER than TDC on the camgear....

Coroncho, if you can get a B16A for cheap (a 2nd gen) show me where. I got some friends that would want some. The 1st gen is OK but there are some parts unavailable in America... (like the distributor and vtec solenoid)

[SteveDX89]

Well, I hope you get all your bugs worked out. Saturday will be my first time running at the track so I hope the newbness doesn't hurt me. I can drive the car pretty well so we'll see what happens.

15 sec Accords > 17 sec Accords.

[night]

how about 14 sec preludes

anyway, the modern B swap isnt that hard. im still trying to find some tranny parts and some better pistons otherwise id be about done with mine by now. but 1k in place racing shit is definitly not needed.

and you can get an LS full swap for 600-800, or a 1gen B16 complete for 1000-1200.

my setup so far is looking to be, well, if someone wants a list ill make another thread. either B is a worthy swap, but i think it really depends on your final goals. coming down to ease of swap and power/money desires.

[Gregg86DX]

Can't we all just get along?

Anyway, it's kinda a moot point, since the B20A swap simply is not an option anymore. If B20A's were plentiful for the $500-$1000 that they typically went for, it would be a no-brainer since they drop in with minimal additional work and cost.

Personally I think that, currently, the B16A1 is the best bang-for-buck since they are readily available and retail around $1200 or $1300. If you can fabricate your own motor mounts and can do some wiring, it should be possible to get that swap done for under $2000 and benefit from the great aftermarket support for those engines. A little more money and work can get you an LS/Vtec setup.

Actually, a DIY low-boost turbo A20 setup is also a good option these days.

It's mostly a matter of how much work you can do yourself and how much money you want to spend on a 15 year old economy car.

Gregg

[thegreatdane]

blablabla economy car.

LOL

[Blue Impact]

Yokohama A520 on Integra rims.

They're del Sol rims.

15.6 is not bad, man.

[accordlxi2.0]

just imagine once you get all those bug's worked out, plus getting used to the track luanch.
i belive you'll get into the 14's.

[Lok]

I thing, a nice N/A B20A ( like carotman's) is Ok for CA3 Accord..
15.7sec is a nice time for a 2600lbs car with that power..
Stock B16A2 (160hp) on Civic 4d Eg (2460lbs, same drag coeficient like CA3 Accord, but much shorter gear box) runs 16.1-16.4sec the 0-1/4mile with professional driver
(european magazines results)...
Carotman has performance cams, but stock header-exaust and stock intake manifold-TB..............that is not good, with a b16a1 manifold-65mm TB-and a 60mm internal
diameter(custom) exaust, i thing will pass the 200hp barier easy(don't forget that he run's 11:1 compression, dramatic improvement if compare it with stock 9.5:1), and he will drop the times to high 14sec ( the same as jdm INTEGRA TYPE-R 195hp-2400lbs).

The top-performance N/A engine for our Accord is B18C5 ( like wickedaccord's) or
B20VTEC with aftermarket parts, but since PLACE RACING went out of business,
i thing we must continue with the olds A20-B20..............they are very nice engines
and could make huge amount of power with TURBO-NITRO-and N/A tunning (but more
difficult N/A than newer Honda engines because of no many aftermarket parts)

[Hash_man_Se_i]

I am curious to know what elevation carotman is running at? anyone know, because I know where I would run here, i would take off .7 of a second and that would be my ET at sea level...

I think that this B20 has lots of potential, and can't wait to get mine underway, i think that now with 11:1 compression, improving the air-flow in and out of the engine would durastically improve the performance of the car... best of luck with future track times carotman, and I am getting very anxious to see some dyno results.

[night]

Stock B16A2 (160hp) on Civic 4d Eg (2460lbs, same drag coeficient like CA3 Accord, but much shorter gear box) runs 16.1-16.4sec the 0-1/4mile with professional driver

[Hash_man_Se_i]

BTW, my friend just ran 15.4 at the track with his '03 accord v6 coupe, with injen intake... I would say that the fact that carot's accord is on par with a 250hp car is pretty damn good.

[carotman]

Yeah like you said, the engine sure needs to breathe better and flow better on the exhaust side.

It's all part of the neverending project. It started as a stock Carbed Accord with no options...

[Hash_man_Se_i]

Hahah thats awesome, and how it has evolved is wicked... i know you park the car for the winter, so i can't see what you get around to doing while its sitting there... gonna be quite interesting to see, and exciting too.

I am definately gonna have to meet up with you next year when i'm at georgian college.

[carotman]

The car is definetly parked all winter. So far, I haven't been able to find a place where I can work on the car while it's in storage. This means it just sits there with the car cover on until I take it out of it's winter sleep.

During the winter, I'm basicaly collecting parts for the next season. I won't do much to more the car this year since I'll be storing it in about a month. Maybe fix the leaky oilpan drain bolt but that's all.

That would be great if we had a meet once you're at Georgian college. I saw it's in ontario but where will you be exactly?

[FyreDaug]

Not to bash yoru car man (and please take that seriously because I hate my sunfire) but my sunfire ran 15.6 with just an intake. Then again it is a new car and had <35000km on it. Its was a 2004 with an ecotec. I was proud of the car when I liked the piece of shit (that breaks down all the time) but lets see you push lower 15's!

[AccordEpicenter]

if youre having wheelhop issues, check your motor mounts betcha some are broken or shot, take the tire pressure in the front to 18psi and burnout hardcore thru the water/bleach in the burnout box, that should net you a 2.2 60 ft and maybe a 15.4. What were you shifting at? Yea im sure you could pull better times with some tuning.

[A20A1]

So would solid motor mounts reduce wheel hop... I really got to get mine under control.

I can't see the pics... but there are no red x's either..

[RobT5580]

As i found with my B20A using my stock computer was not good enough and it was running lean on my wideband O2. Carotman is running the prelude ecu which is certainly a better match but i still doubt its running to it full potential. Also he was using the dual stage manifold which i found extremely restrictive. So unless someone does what i wanted to do which is set the B20A up with a stand alone and have it tuned we wont really know its full potential naturally aspirated. I may do it if shit fails with my turbo but at this point im not willing to spend anymore money on it.

[AccordEpicenter]

you cant let the b20a turbo fail, rob... too many trash talkers are expected to go down in flames against that car...

[carotman]

Hehe the pictures might not work anymore.

Anyway this was more a test drive than anything else.

I will see with my A/F meter how the Lude ECU controls the fuel but this is definetly one of the first things to change with the intake manifold. The good thing is.... I got those parts in the basement right now... waiting for my car to get out of storage ..... in 2 weeks


The rear and side mounts ahde eurethane in them while the front mount is the Original mount that came with the car. I'm sure it's owrn out and needs to be replaced. The torque rod bushings are also the Honda Originals (16 years old). Those will need to be replaced to reduce wheel hop.

I don't know if I mentioned it but I had so much wheel hop that the cig lighter poped out on one of the launches.

Anyway, I know I can lower this by at least 1 second.... this is where the fun begins