Pacesetter : Intake , Short Shifter , Header , Cat Back Exhaust , High Flow Cat

[jlaccord89lxi]

Originally posted by Jims 86LXI HB

........one of of the mufflers they tested was a Dynomax Super turbo that they had a muffler shop create as a cat-back system, didn't even have mandrel bends btw. It was the 3rd most powerfull, 2nd and 1st place didn't make much more power and cost allot more, 1st place had about .6 more hp. It was a thermal research rebuildable muffler.

Jim.......I know mandrel bending is better, but i really can't see normal bends being that much worse, especially in a 2.25" pipe. I know what a mandrel bent piece of pipe looks like, and what a normal bent piece of pipe looks like. If you had 2 identical exhaust setups, with a dynomax super turbo (for instance), and one exhaust was mandrel bent and the other with normal bends, how much of a HP difference would there be with mandrel bending vs normal bending since exhaust flow restrictions through normal bends is very minimal?

PS: i'm really just trying to convince myself that i won't be dissapointed if i have to get normal bends in my exhaust.

[socal3rdgen]

i would like to know this one 2. cuz jim i know you had just regular bends and i would like to know whats your inspiration as why mandrel is way better. well i guess my questions is the same is it way better or just a little extra pep.

[Nate2310]

Everyone says pacesetter cat back systems are pos's but then again so are 3 gee accords

[Jims 86LXI HB]

Originally posted by jlaccord89lxi


Jim.......I know mandrel bending is better, but i really can't see normal bends being that much worse, especially in a 2.25" pipe. I know what a mandrel bent piece of pipe looks like, and what a normal bent piece of pipe looks like. If you had 2 identical exhaust setups, with a dynomax super turbo (for instance), and one exhaust was mandrel bent and the other with normal bends, how much of a HP difference would there be with mandrel bending vs normal bending since exhaust flow restrictions through normal bends is very minimal?

PS: i'm really just trying to convince myself that i won't be dissapointed if i have to get normal bends in my exhaust.

Sorry I did not see this post when you did it on the 5th.

Mandrel bends are better because of it's smooth bends promotes exhaust gas flow. I don't know of anyone that compaired the power differance between the them. Maybe that's because different shops vary in their ability to do crimp bends, some shops do them really well, others smash the piping at every turn of the pipe a whole bunch and that's when your effecientcy goes down. All I can add is I could not find a shop that would do mandrel, I had to do crimp bends, hey I tried, but I didn't loose any sleep over it. If any of you can get mandrel I'd to it, I mean you might as well, if not, oh well

How much you benefit from mandrel is still a open question.

[Jims 86LXI HB]

Originally posted by Nate2310
Everyone says pacesetter cat back systems are pos's but then again so are 3 gee accords

Pacesetter cat back don't last for their owners and they don't show power gains on the dyno, 1.6hp.

And I'm sure that calling 3rd gen accords a pos will be well received on the site didicated to them:ego:

[89AccordNate]

Hey Nate2310, keep up bitch boy, and we will have war. And you know what, you will be the one crying to your mommy!

Talk some more shit about our cars on OUR board and consider yourself banned, or let me refresh that....banished because every post you make, I will rape you down one side and up the other for being the dumb ass that you are.

Ill be hunting for your stupidity, oh wait, I already found it.

Nate.

[1988starter]

Originally posted by Nate2310
Everyone says pacesetter cat back systems are pos's but then again so are 3 gee accords

What a dick weed

[87AccordsterLx]

first off.. Nate2310 this is the second time that I have told you to stop posting... anyone lacking the common sence to know that everyone on this board is a 3g owner, should know better then to post as impertinently as you do. Not to mention the fact that you premote your name as one with such a rude nature... which so happens to be shared by myself along with 89AccordNate... thats just not going to continue...

Now... I currently have a custom 2.25inch non-mandrel bent catback exhaust piping... Although I have no other sources to contrast the power gains of a similar setup with my own, I can say that the restrictiveness of non-mandrel bent piping is "visually" evident.

Here are a couple facts to help your decision...

The term mandrel bend is due to an actual "mandrel" which goes inside the tubing and is held by a mandrel rod to support the tubing at the tangent point of the bend. The mandrel is then extracted after the bend is complete or within the last few degrees of bending. This results in the tubing being the same diameter through the straight tubing as in the bend radius. So if you started with a 2" pipe and bent it into a 90 degree bend it is still 2" through the entire bend radius.


Both pipes were cut in the middle of the bend... The mandrel bend offers up to 25% more flow than compression bent pipes.


Once again non-mandrel bend above and mandrel bend below..
*note* (this is one of the better non-mandrel bends that I have seen)

[jlaccord89lxi]

Originally posted by 87AccordsterLx
Now... I currently have a custom 2.25inch non-mandrel bent catback exhaust piping... Although I have no other sources to contrast the power gains of a similar setup with my own, I can say that the restrictiveness of non-mandrel bent piping is "visually" evident.

Here are a couple facts to help your decision...

The term mandrel bend is due to an actual "mandrel" which goes inside the tubing and is held by a mandrel rod to support the tubing at the tangent point of the bend. The mandrel is then extracted after the bend is complete or within the last few degrees of bending. This results in the tubing being the same diameter through the straight tubing as in the bend radius. So if you started with a 2" pipe and bent it into a 90 degree bend it is still 2" through the entire bend radius.

Woah , thanks 87AccordsterLx, i think we all got a little bit smarter from your detailed description there. I've never seen a cross-section comparison of the 2 different pipe bending methods before. That picture really shows you how much of a difference there is between the two bends and how restrictive the non-mandrel bent piping looks to be. I agree with you that the non-mandrel bent pipe in the last picture is a very good bend. I've seen pipes that are severly crimped on the inside of the bend, and flattened out and stretched on the outside of the bend. If all normal bends were as good as the one in that picture, horsepower loss would be very minimal. When i get my exhaust done, i'm going to look very hard for a place that does mandrel bending. Thanks again 87AccordsterLx.

[87AccordsterLx]

no problem... Glad I could help

[Mantis88LX]

ordered the black pacesetter header from nopi yesterday, people that are waiting till december needs to go ahead and order. the customer service person said the wont have anymore in december. i dont know if he was bullshitting me or what. cant wait.

[A20A1]

What was the total cost?

[87AccordsterLx]

ya what was the price with ship. and all?

[Mantis88LX]

around $166 - 170 range, not sure on the total yet.
parents ordered it as Christmas present so im not really sure

[87AccordsterLx]

YOU LUCKY ASS!!!! hahaha I cant wait for this colt cam thing to go through and then get a pacesetter... damn its going to be awesome...

[Y3G]

I ordered my thew a shop in my area.It was back ordered for about a month.Warning the black paint burns off like the first couple times you drive it.I hade to get mine sand blasted then I painted it with plasti-coat header paint.I painted it the blue color. It looks like the airmass compblue.

[Mantis88LX]

yea im gonna stripp it and repaint before i put it on, too bad i dont get it till christmas,

[meanaccord]

These seem to be the only ones available for our cars unless i am blind and cant find anymore. But i was wondering. How does the pacesetter catback sound. Does it rumble or pat. Or is it deep and sound good. I just dont want my car to sound like a chain saw on steroids, can anybody help?

[dXsquared]

it has no sound... it sounds stock... get the cat back and a different muffler... a stainless BOMB muffelr sounds deep... and get it welded to the pacesetter pipes...

Travis

[Chrome_thangs]

I was thinking about getting headers and a hi flow cat. Can i run just 2.25 pipe from the cat to my muffler instead of a catback system??

[anchovies]

Originally posted by Chrome_thangs
I was thinking about getting headers and a hi flow cat. Can i run just 2.25 pipe from the cat to my muffler instead of a catback system??

What you described is already a catback system. The pacesetter is cheaper than to get a mandrel bend and weld it at the shop.
The pacesetter doesn't sound much louder than stock.

[86AccordLxi]

Originally posted by DXHATCHBACK
it has no sound... it sounds stock... get the cat back and a different muffler... a stainless BOMB muffelr sounds deep... and get it welded to the pacesetter pipes...

Travis

I disagree...i think that it's louder than stock and has quite a different note to it. You will def. hear a difference in sound (i.e. louder!) but not the biggest gain in performance. Jim will tell you that the Pacesetter makes less power than a custom catback from any muffler place, but I still felt a noticeable difference in the engine being able to pull in higher rpms. But the tip rusts quickly, so I had a stainless stell muffler welded on to the pacesetter piping, as many members have done.

Alex

[Whitehonda]

The bottom line is if you are going to get the Pacesetter, it is a must to cut off the pacesetter muffler and add one of your own. I did it with a stainless borla muffler and let me tell you, it is plenty loud!!!! Pacesetter is a good deal if you use it for the pipes only, but their muffler sucks.

Cameron

[1988starter]

I thought is was nice and loud not obnoxious and not a long wet fart but is was loud enough so you don't look like a little shit trying to make your car sound more agressive than it ever will be.

[2Fast_Fiero]

What is the use of cutting off the muffler? Whats the use of buying that exhaust if your going to cut off the muffler, thats the most expencive part of the exhaust. If you want loud, just cut off your stock muffler and throw on a cheap but good looking and sounding 3A Racing muffler like what I did, if you want performance, buy a Flowmaster or magnaflow muffler and get your own pipes made.