PROJECT , TURBO ( adams86lxi )

**adams86lxi** · 02-25-2005, 04:25 PM

Alright as some of you know. Im starting a turbo b20 project. Im also doing this as cheap as i can but still the best that i can do for the most part. Im starting this thread so you guys can see how im doing this if you want to try it for your self and also for the people who have already turboed there cars to tell me what im doing wrong. So this is going to be a big information thread lol.

Alright ive started with a td04 turbo from a wrx. I probbaly should of gone with something like a t3 since about every manifold you buy will bolt up to one but remember im learning as i go lol. Im planning on running 5 psi no more until i get the right fuel management and a nice intercooler.

I started with a cheap ebay ssautochrome h22 turbo manifold. I got this one because the stud holes didnt seem to far off and only the 2 inner runner were a tad bit off. I got the manifold and discoverd that it needed a little more hacking then i thought it would but i should be okay. I also discoverd with all the wrong tools how a pain in the ass cutting threw stainless steel is!!!!! Im using a 12:1 ratio fmu for now. My car runs real rich as it is right now since i dont have the ect sensor pluged in so im helping this will help me out a little too for now. Im using a external tial imitation wastegate with a 5psi spring. Im using check valves to trick the map sensor. Im still working on various flanges that will mate my turbo to the mani and every where else i need them. I havent got to line anything up yet in the engine bay but it looks like it should all fit just real tight. Im waiting to put everything in once i get it all together and have everything infront of me that i need.

Here are some pics of what i have so far. I also have a DSM BOV comming from ebay.

Thats how much i had to cut out of the manifold. I know it looks haggerd but im still working on it. Im going to use washers to hold the sides where i had to cut all the way threw. It should move around to much because the 2 upper holes on the out side were dead on so im hoping they will keep it from moving around. Porting out the 2 inner runner seemed harder then i thought since i started making them bigger and then found out that ssautochrome had the runners go all the way threw to the inside side of the flange.

BTW: does anyone know if i did this right? I think i did but im just curious. This is the home made check valve map sensor trick. (aka missing link) One end is going to connect up to the throttle body and the other end to the map sensor vaccum line.

**895spdforfree** · 02-25-2005, 05:47 PM

well since no one has commented, im just gonna say keep up the good work, i hope u dyno it i wanna see the numbers!!

**snow_man_20** · 02-25-2005, 05:58 PM

Well i don't know how you got budget and turbo in the same statment, but keep it up.

**adams86lxi** · 02-25-2005, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by snow_man_20

Well i don't know how you got budget and turbo in the same statment, but keep it up.

lol, well so far im only at the 500$ mark.

**adams86lxi** · 02-25-2005, 09:43 PM

BTW: I was planning on using the fuel line in the picture for the oil feed line. Its 5/16 id. Would this work alright? Or is it to big and it wouldnt build up enough oil pressure???

**AccordEpicenter** · 02-25-2005, 10:38 PM

fuel line will blow up, it wasnt designed to see 60psi of hot oil in it. I think napa has some high pressure tranny oil line that works good. Hmm i think 5/16" isnt too bad but id highly reccomend some good oil lines, its worth the peace of mind and not dumping all your oil... I run braided stainless Earl's lines from my stealthmode performance oil lines, -4an, it also came with a T fitting for the oil pressure sensor in the block, and an oil return line and fitting etc -10an(all of it was like $80). Dont use brass T fittings in the block, the tend to fatigue out and break off (leaving the end in the block... ugh). With the checkvalves you should be able to stick one end of the hose in your mouth and the other end pinch off with your hand and blow and have the air come out of the checkvalves.

**mykwikcoupe** · 02-25-2005, 11:29 PM

Im with accordepicenter. Its more expensib=ve but worth the cost to go stainless. Im not too sure about the turbo your using since Ive never heard of it but you may want to look into a rhb15 from a eclipse/talon. Most people junk them to upgrade. Also the t3 from a ford turbocoupe works well for a budget biuld.

A word of thought from a person whos read alot but hasnt actually done it. Please take this with a grain of salt.

The FMU units are cheap for a reason. They are unreliable and are hard to tune. If you look you can find a s-afc for a few bills. For something that low of psi its be perfect. Id offer you mine since Im probably not going to use it but Im not 100% sure just yet.

Oh and if the 12:1 doesnt work out Ive got a 10:1 collecting dust

**RobT5580** · 02-26-2005, 07:02 AM

Just remember to brace that manifold and there are tons of pics on h-t and HMT. And make sure you have a boost gauge to watch for boost spike on that wastegate. TunerToys makes a really good oil supply fitting. As for the manifold it helps to have the right tools im glad my car is at my friends shop because the edelbrock victor x intake manifold i had to do a lot of work for it to fit.

Other than that keep collecting parts and you should be there soon. Its nice to see someone not breaking the bank like i did and should be nice to see how it turns out. The H22 man still seems like a nice option and its really minor for an off the shelf part.

And Justin should be able to give you pointers on the check valves since he used the vacuum advance setup on his for some time. Its basically the same setup so i dont see why it would work the same in your situation.

**AccordEpicenter** · 02-26-2005, 10:07 AM

yeah the fmu isnt great but hes running it at 5psi temporarily (should be ok at 5psi) but at as early as 7psi youd most likely detonate, especially using no timing control (statically retarded). Ive heard good things (surprisingly) about the fake tial-SSAC wastegate, they seem to be ok. His turbo is just fine for low boost

**adams86lxi** · 02-26-2005, 11:59 AM

Thanks for the info guys.

mykwikcoupe: My car runs real rich right now with the ect sensor unpluged. That and the fmu which i made sure i got the vortech one should be fine until i get good fuel management. Im not running any more boost till i get a safc, intercooler, and a msd btm. This is just a temporary setup for 5 psi. Also i already have this turbo so theis is the one im going to use. Thanks for the info though.

AccordEpicenter: alright cool i did the check valve trick fine then.

Rob: The maifold is braced all over it. I guess ssautoshit changed there design alittle to compensate for all the broken manifolds they had.

And everyone: Ok the fuel line is for fuel injection so it designed for high pressure, but if thats the wrong way to go then i wont do it. Can you guys send me some links for everything i would need for the oil feed lines? Ive looked at the steel braided on the internet before but im all confused on what the sizes are and what kind of connections i would need etc. Any help would be appreciated! THANKS!!!

**AccordEpicenter** · 02-26-2005, 12:15 PM

This is the one i used:

Stealthmode Performance

http://www.stealthmodeperformance.com/Stainless.htm

He uses earls lines and fittings and the oil line T is a great part, the best ive seen. Its one hell of a nice kit and includes the oil drain etc. Im not really sure what your ihi turbo uses for an oil inlet and drain, you might have to make up an adaptor...

**Elijah** · 02-26-2005, 01:48 PM

I have the same FMU I succesfully ran 10psi all last summer with it and know problems. Let me know when you want a BTM I will give you mine for cheap. I could have gave you the FMU for cheap to I was gonna post the stuff for sale to guess I should have ohwell.

**AccordEpicenter** · 02-26-2005, 02:01 PM

elijah how much timing were you pulling out on your BTM?

**Elijah** · 02-26-2005, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by AccordEpicenter

elijah how much timing were you pulling out on your BTM?

To tell you the truth I havent even had a chance to use it. I hooked it up the last track day of the year and my clutch was slipping so it came right home.

**AccordEpicenter** · 02-26-2005, 02:17 PM

me either... i was running static retarded timing (shitty) did you back the timing out manually like i did?

**system-f** · 02-28-2005, 09:57 AM

You really need a timing control of some sort at 5psi no intercooled. You can retard 10 degrees, but it will be slower at lower boost. I used the MSD boost control on my B20A.. Make sure that your exhuast ports match up as close as possible to the ports on the manifold, otherwise your just wasting precious energy.

Your fish tank map hack does look right, shouldn't be able to suck through the vavles, but can blow.

You WILL NEED a high flow fuel pump at 5psi..my engine was unhappy and unsafe because the stock pump could not supply the flow at preasure even with only 5psi. I got the holley pump I think for an integra..the one Tom Coleman sold with his kit. (it's been awhile)

Here are some examples of what you should see, actually better since these dyno charts are with the old fuel pump. This was actually a little less than 5psi.

**RobT5580** · 02-28-2005, 10:28 AM

system-f, Do you have any more info/pictures on your b20a setup. Its nice to see a few others working on different setups to see what works good. Iv definately been the test dummy for all my stuff but my research seemed to pay off.

**system-f** · 02-28-2005, 10:51 AM

I will look for some old pics...mine was pretty ghetto and I sold that car some time ago with hopes to do better on an A motor.

It was a basic low cost turbo setup. I was the first to purchase Tom Coleman's complete turbo kit for the 3g lude...the manifold was his newer log style and it had a T3 on it. I had 2.5" exhaust all the way back , flowmaster 50 series (no fart pipes here), and a cat ordered out of JC Whitney. I am not sure if Zdyne is still doing the ECUs for the 3g lude but I would recommend anyone to go that route, the computer issues I had with everyday driveablity were jsut stupid and I got sick of dealing with it nor did I have the money to upgrade. Or a homebrew chip would work..something to get the computer some maps so it understands what boost is and to add extra fuel and retard the timing if needed..

I beat the living crap out of my B20A, at times it would detonate (due to my carelessness) when I first hooked up the turbo it peaked at 10psi due to a vacuum line failure. When I finished with the JDM B20A it was pulled and sold to a guy wanting to rebuild a 3g lude...the block had lots of carbon build up from running rich but other than that all internals were in good shape. It's one tough closed deck aluminum block.

If you have an specifics PM me..and I will try to dig up those pics.

I do have this pic of a pissed off mustang owner... This drag track is notorious for making fun of import cars and I had some fun.

**Robs89LXi** · 02-28-2005, 01:25 PM

System-f, are you planning to boost your A20? If so, what are you planning to do for engine management?

**adams86lxi** · 02-28-2005, 03:25 PM

alright thanks for the help guys with this. Im working on looking for the lines now.

Im also having trouble finding a silicone adapter for something like 1 3/4 to something like 2 to 2 1/2 either should work. I need one for the turbo but cant find one.

**Cheeseburger** · 02-28-2005, 04:37 PM

nice bro i see that your dad finally got to you into puting a turbo in your car. When do you think you will have the turbo up and runing?

**adams86lxi** · 02-28-2005, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by Cheeseburger

nice bro i see that your dad finally got to you into puting a turbo in your car. When do you think you will have the turbo up and runing?

lol, yea he is the one that orignally wanted me to put one in. Funny part is he aint helping me worth a shit, not even my good car buddies that i help them put stuff in there car 24/7 are helping me. It really pisses me off. The only person helping me out is this guy named scott that lives a few blocks down from me. He is in his mid 40s and is really cool, i wouldnt be able to get this done if it wasnt for him. What really made me get one though was going to the local meets up's around here and everyone and there mom being turbo but me, and i mean everything turboed from bugs to bmw's. Everytime i turn around i hear and bov lol, it made me jelous lol. I just think how cool it will be when i roll up to the meets with the turbo and people see a 86 honda accord roll up and they here the bov! I want to start putting everything in very soon. Im just out of cash and waiting for a few more parts before i try to get everything in. Im going to hopefully have it in soon though.

**Cheeseburger** · 02-28-2005, 05:19 PM

cause springbreak is coming up and it would be a good time to have the dyno meet

**AccordEpicenter** · 02-28-2005, 07:25 PM

adam are you going intercooled or not? If youre not you need to pull out alot more timing like the other guy mentioned in his setup... if youre intercooled (strongly reccomended) you could get away with pulling out probably 3-5 degrees timing at 5psi

**adams86lxi** · 02-28-2005, 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by AccordEpicenter

adam are you going intercooled or not? If youre not you need to pull out alot more timing like the other guy mentioned in his setup... if youre intercooled (strongly reccomended) you could get away with pulling out probably 3-5 degrees timing at 5psi

dont know yet. I was going to run it un-intercooled for a little while till i could get one, but im just going to have to sit and wait. I might be getting a friends old one but i dont know yet. How much should i retard it for 5psi if it dont have a intercooler right away???