PROJECT , CARB JDM B20A

[mykwikcoupe]

so Im getting going again since im almost back up to speed with life again. The house is starting to get situated and the baby is sleeping throught the nights. well there hasnt been any real progress to speak of since the last post but alot of decision making has been done.

Thanks to Rob I know have a complete rebiuld set minus bearings and rings. Ive got the engine seperated from the auto tranny and the engine is on the stand awaiting teardown. The tranny is going to sit till further time in which I decide if its worth opening up.

Ive decidedthanks to help from a20a1 on all his carb info to go with the webwe 38/38 carb. Thats going to be mated to a ported intake manifold that will be port matched to the b20a head.

The head itself will remain mostly stock. I may have it bech tested for flow numbers to have a regrind cam made up.

Im going to get the lude dc sport header modified to fit the accord and am going to run 2.25 exhaust all the way back.

Ill run the msd 6a ignition with a blaster 2 coil for all ignition and timing modifications. This is going to be an experiment to see if with modest changes i can get a carbed b20a to make as much power as the FI B20a without dumping mad amounts of money into it. Ill need all i can get for the turbo project. If someone wants to send an email i can send pics for posting. Any info is appreciated most opinions will be thought about. Thanks guys. Mike

[Civvy]

what u gona do bout the alternators 4th pin? Have u got a carbed harness?
If so they have a built in regulator.
The B20 alt. already has a built in regulator.

[mykwikcoupe]

not too sure just yet, havent really planned on any wiring issues just yet. Im sure I can adapt the a20a1 alternator to the b20a with a combo of mounting brackets or something custom. Im planning on weber and the teg dizzy so there shouldnt be much of a difference with anything. Im planning on using the stock harness in the car.

[Civvy]

my b20 is running the a20 carb and the prelude 2nd gen dizzy with a modified mount.
I'm using the a18 lude alt. i've mounted it with two bolts at the bottom instead of the 1 long one it seems o.k. I had to have the pulley swapped from the B20 alt. and redrilled a small amount.

[mykwikcoupe]

cool man thanks for the info. Does it wobble or anything without having the long bolt in there? why did you chose the 2nd gen dizzy over the teg unit?

[RobT5580]

Isnt the carbed alternator the same fitment as the FI one? I thought it was but i cant say for sure so if thats the case just used the carbed 3-pin one as it bolts right up with no modification if you get the right belt. I think the belt you want is Napa # 25-030323 but make sure to check the rib count provided your pulley is the same as the FI alternator. Im not 100% this was the one i used but i swear i used this one for the alternator and then i got the powersteering belt at pep boys when i messed up my JDM Honda one.

I thank Carotman for the belt number help since i forgot all about it until the last minute and he took care of me. I had all the JDM belts but for some reason i got the wrong belt for the alternator as it had to many ribs and even the length was wrong.

Hope this helps and you get things going soon. Im hoping to have mine going for thanks giving break now that i know the piston rings were bad and im dropping the block back off tomorrow.

[mykwikcoupe]

so I take it that its not covered under waranty since the wrong sizes were used? Did mike lee install those?

[RobT5580]

The machine shop is going to take care of it since i told them to check the entire bottom end over and change the rings/bearing if need be. Im going to pay for the rings since it was not all their fault but i wish they just put new ones in anyway. But the bigger issue was the copper o-ring job they did which i feel was not going to hold up under boost since some of the ring was flush and others raised so i was not impressed with that at all. So im giving them my spare block and he is going to clean it up, bore it, notch the cylinders for the pauter rods and surface it. I didnt like the overbore mike lee had on it which would surely have piston slap on cold starts. So im trying to get a smaller bore if wiseco specs say i can. So this time i will start fresh on my own block and pray the rest goes better than last time. Mike Lee had a machine shop in Canada prep the block which all looked good and unless he used a std ring size as of oversized then this probably happened when he cranked his car over and the oil was full of fuel and washed them out.

And some good came out of this as i found i taped the autometer water temp sensor in the thermostat housing to close to the thermostat which would have prevented it from opening. Also the tial wastegate has a special washer/flange and i had it in wrong where it wouldnt have the wastegate closed all the way. Im checking on that part though because it fits better the other way but im sure its supposed to be closed all the way which it was not before. Other than that things look good and im tripple checking everything but the car started before so i should be in a decent situation round two.

[Civvy]

cool man thanks for the info. Does it wobble or anything without having the long bolt in there? why did you chose the 2nd gen dizzy over the teg unit?

I looked at 1st gen teg dizzy's and found they were totally sifferent to what u lot were talking about.
Must be a difference between countries issue.
it wouldnt even go in the hole was too fat.

[thegreatdane]

I looked at 1st gen teg dizzy's and found they were totally sifferent to what u lot were talking about.
Must be a difference between countries issue.
it wouldnt even go in the hole was too fat.

When you say 1st gen teg dizzy are you talking about the 88-91 civic ZC dohc engine? if not then you should try that out. Offtopic but can you get rjudgey to check his pm's?

[Civvy]

Prolly not he's crap at answering tho's LOL. but, i'll send him a text.

[thegreatdane]

I need info about that Hi-Spec custom brakekit he's got.. You know anything about it? By the way I meant 84-87 civic ZC engine

[Civvy]

Havent a clue. hav u tryed his cardomain?

[carotman]

The carbed ans EFI alternator are the same except for the regulator. This part can be swapped betwee nthe alternators.

All you need to do is install your A20A alternator regulator on the B20A alternator.

Making a B20A run on a A20A carb should be pretty easy. All you need is a 86-87 Integra distributor or an European B20A distributor to match the vacuum advance it will need with the carb setup

[mykwikcoupe]

so in the last little while i was able to pik up a rebiuld kit "real honda parts from Japan" Thanks rob. Its got everything needed but rings and bearings.

I was able to find a new in box weber 38/38 dges for a whopping 255 shipped to my door. I also got a killer deal from a20a1 on a weber adapter manifold.

So Ive actually found a machine shop with a good reputation in my area for imports. Im looking at like 375 complete for machining work. Im reusing the stock pistons, rods, crank, Ill have to look at the head internals before i decide to reuse the stock spirings, vlaves and such. I am going with a 5 angle regrind.

Im thinking the stock efi cams on the b20a should be nice for a carbed motor. A little more top end maybe.

Im hoping justin gets his headers made so i can get one for the b20a with the single O2 bung. Id hate to have to hack up a nice new aftermarket.

So with the weber, a port-matched intake with a little help in the flow department. A smothed head with a little rework on the cc chambers and such. Aftermarket (justin header), 2.25 exhaust no resonator but a free flowing cat back to the supertrapp muffler and a MSD 6a. Im thinking Id pull in the 190-200 range.

So what do you think so far. Keep in mind this is for the wifeys car and its mainly a driver.

[rjudgey]

Get new pistons not worth doing all that and end up re-using old ones!! espcially as their not that expensive, also 190-200bhp probably a bit optimistic with the crappy inlet manifold that you have to use but at least the fuel and air will get nicely mixed up!!
The inlet valves are not bad quality the exhaust valves are Stainless steel and will just need cleaning, to be honest they work well as they are just need cleaning up and get a 20 degree backcut done on them if you having your seats race cut. The springs are pretty weak you could shim them to mae them a little stiffer but i don't know of any aftermarket springs for these heads so not sure where you could go for that, but if your using mild cam the springs should be fine, if you have a JDM B20A the cams will be not too sad anyway, a good head job will naturally increase the powerband and HP of the engine anyways. P.S A20 springs won't fit B20A tried that allready!! Maybe B18 or B16 springs might but haven't tried!!

[mykwikcoupe]

well you figure the only off the shelf pistons made for the b20a5 and the h23 are either 9.1 or 10.1 and since stock is 9.3 or 9.5 or something I thoght of going 10.1 but Im not going to see that gains without a cam and since I using the stock cams thats out. This isnt a major power engine its a daily driver. i just wanted to do a little extra to ensure when i stomp on it the power will be there. Her a20a1 is pretty tired and when you stop it doesnt jump it crawls. Im sure the auto doesnt help that any either. Ill keep the suggestions in mind though thanks. Whats your current b20a setup?

[AccordEpicenter]

this sounds really cool!

[mykwikcoupe]

well I hope to have it in the machine shop nest month. Im testing the waters. After reading about the problems robs having since were biulding very similar projects i want to make sure this guy knows as much as everyone says he does, If he does a great job on this one Ill let him do the turbo project.

I know the 200 is optomistic but since alot of projects have been done and the desktop dyno is usually pretty close in the past.

[A20A1]

I'm all thumbs up on the higher comp pistons.

If you still run with the stock A20 manifold and weather or not you decide to port it... you sould weld up as many unused vacuum ports as you can... also weld in the coolant hole so you'll be %100 sure it wont leak coolant into the manifold... then weld the adapter plates to the manifold to reduce the chance of vacuum leaks... and you'll minimize the amount of gaskets you need down to the one between the carb and adapter plate.

edit: oh and just incase... don't try and weld just the top plate to the manifold directly... I know it'll save on welding but having both plates helps the carb throttle linkage clear the manifold properly.

[rjudgey]

I'm not advising to replace as a preformance upgrade but if you can get 10:1 than fine, but you should never ever use secondhand pistons, you go spend all that money on re-building that block ans you go and use 2nd hand pistons 5-10K down the road and a piston lets go your gonna be sick as a pig!! If they were forged yeah fine worth taking risk but with cast you should allways replace as you don't know their past history!! ONly ever re-use 2nd hand cast pistons if you've just put them in yourself a few thousand miles ago if not replace same goes with anything else, if you don't know the history of it replace, allways skim block and head even though it looks okay and never ever use a 2nd hand clutch unless it's only done a few hundred miles.
just my little bit of advice that i've learn't the hard way!!

[carotman]

BTW, the Integra Type-R pistons will work with minor modifications and give you a nice increase in compression. All that needs to be done is enlarge the wristpin hole in the piston.

[thegreatdane]

BTW, the Integra Type-R pistons will work with minor modifications and give you a nice increase in compression. All that needs to be done is enlarge the wristpin hole in the piston.

Really? hmm, interesting. Never noticed they had the same bore diameter. What is the vrist pin diameter on the B18C? Do you know what the compression ratio increases to?

[rjudgey]

Hey Carotman can you drop us an e-mail on the piston info part no. if poss and bore sizes etc. Thanks need to get some B20A engine building going!!

[NXRacer]