89 carb crazy idle.

[carfreak_84]

i went out to start my car to go to school, it did its normal 2500 rpm while it was cold. i took off after it warmed up
and it was staying at 2500. i stopped at a red light, i had the clutch in and the car all of the sudden started revving to 4000 rpm. i tapped the gas and it would not go back down, so i got to the next red light and the idle was sitting at 1500rpm, the by itself without me touching the gas the idle went all the way up to 4000. i have been trying to figure this out for about 3 months...any ideas??

[FyreDaug]

Vacuum lines? Maybe your secondary is getting vacuum when it shouldnt

[A20A1]

https://www.3geez.com/showthread.php?t=44074

[lackej1971]

Hey, My 88 Accord is doing the same thing!!! No matter how warm it gets, the RPMs will not decrease. I am starting to think that it is the Fast Idle Unloader being stuck in place, but I am not sure. I removed the vacuum lines today that go to it and it they seemed to be REALLY stopped up with something hard. I cannot clear them out and to be honest, I am a bit scared to remove it because it's my only car that runs at all right now.
P.S. Can somebody please tell me where I can get a fast idle unloader for my car? Everywhere I call just says "A WHAT????". Then they tell me that their computer won't show them anything!!!! Alot of help that is.

[A20A1]

Some things found inside the vacuum ports are called "Vacuum Restrictors" They inserted into the vacuum port... they are a copper color when new but they turn black or dark brown/green when they get older.

If the vacuum line is hard then it should be replaced since the rubber isn't flexable and it doesn't always seal as tightly when you reinstall it.

[lackej1971]

Hmmmm? Never heard of those before. The hose is still flexible, but there is VERY LITTLE vacuum on either one of them. I really don't understand any of this stuff and at this point, i am grasping at straws. Parts stores don't know what the hell I need, so what do I do next? It just started doing this crap about a week ago!

[A20A1]

You might want to check "Majestic Honda" for parts
Also might want a rebuild kit.
https://www.3geez.com/showthread.php?t=5350

Also download the shop manual
https://www.3geez.com/showthread.php?t=25137


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[RamThis]

You might want to check "Majestic Honda" for parts
Also might want a rebuild kit.
https://www.3geez.com/showthread.php?t=5350

Also download the shop manual
https://www.3geez.com/showthread.php?t=25137


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That is the best thing ever!!!! I think Im going to like this site, such a wealth of Honda knowledge

[lackej1971]

OK, this past weekend, i went through hell with my Honda. It was running "so-so" on Sunday, BUT on Monday, I went outside to see how it would run and it would not even start. Whats more, when i would try to start it, something electrical was kicking out and I would have to reset it by removing the Battery Cable and replacing it. So I thought, "Bad Starter"?? So I looked on here for how to remove it. Haynes Manual was totally USELESS. Well, it was not really that much on here either so i had to go it alone. It took 3 hours to FINALLY remove it.
When I removed the hoses to get to the starter, the nastiest coolant came out of them. OK to limit this story, the starter was OK and it seems that I was not pushing the clutch in far enough. Now, I am in the process of cleaning my cooling system out. Any ideas or product recommendations would be nice.

This car had the head gaskets replaced and I told the mechanic to put new antifreeze in it. This stuff still had oil in the coolant!!!! SO, now I am starting to think that the "Thermovalves" have been gunked up and may be causing the crappy performance of my car.

What do you guys think? (My car idles up and down sometimes and sometimes it runs good)

Thanks, James

[RamThis]

If you have oil in your coolant, you either have a blown head gasket, or a cracked head........ Im not sure of any other ways oil can be introduced into your cooling system. Im a V-8 guy mostly so there may be other avenues for the oil to contaminate the coolant that I dont know about?? Either way, oil in the coolant is a BAAAADDDD sign. Usually means the head has to come off one way or another. Might check your coolant system for pressure or bubbles from exhaust gasses blowing by into your water jackets.
As for flushing out the system, pour in some of that Prestone radiator flush, drive it a couple days, drain it, start it and drive it another day, then what I did was drain it, refill with water, and start it and let it idle with the heater on full heat and the blower on low. Then I opened the rad drain just enough so it was draining a pencil sized stream of water, and had fresh water flowing in from the top a the same speed. I let the car run for a half hour or more like this, until the water that was cycling through looked crystal clear. Once you get to that point, shut the car off, let the radiator fully drain, tighten the drain, and dump in your coolant with some Prestone Rust Protection. My car was soooo rusted when I got it from the previous owner I had to replace the radiator in it, and flushed it time and time again to finally get it all out, and the method of draining while matching the flow with fresh water while it heats and circulates the whole system seems to work the best and the most thorough.

[lackej1971]

Hey, Thanks for the reply. Yeah, I know that oil in the coolant is a BADDDD sign. Fact is that this car had a blown head gasket when I bought it for $200.00. I had it replaced and I told the mechanic to also flush the radiator too. He replaced the gasket but not the coolant. I have seen no sign of water in my oil (yet ) so I think that the oil was residual from when he did not change my coolant. It was probably in the engine and never came out for a long time. Anyway, i flushed it pretty good today and I am happy to report that it runs better than before. I really never thought that the coolant in a car mattered quite so much, but now I know better. I still have to flush this thing out a few more times to get it as clean as it needs to be, but for now, I am going to drive it a few days.
Man, the coolant was so rusty that it was the color of poop. Made me sick just looking at it! No wonder this car was stalling. I can't wait to get it running really good. my neighbors are starting to question my sanity for messing with this car, but I have to admit that I have a real soft spot for it. It is just fun to drive. I really don't ever want to sell it and it beats the hell out of a new car payment.
Come on baby, please keep running good. I have faith in ya.
James
P.S. How does junk in a cars coolant affect the "thermovalves" and how much/hard are they to replace if necessary?

[A20A1]

Other oil; If your automatic ATF can bleed into the base of the radiator.

[lackej1971]

Thanks for the reply. It is a stanrd shift car. Can the transmission oil do the same.
Oh, what kind of oil do you use in a manual tranny? When I replaced my oil oil, I was instructed to use gear oil. I did that a year ago and it still shift pretty good. What do you say?

James

[RamThis]

Other oil; If your automatic ATF can bleed into the base of the radiator.

Ahh yes, forgot about that.....

[stat1K]

first of all, isn't that idle a bit high to begin with... the normal idle for the a20 is supposed to be 750 +- 50 rpm i thought, but it sounds a lot like a vaccum line since that will cause the loping... i'd definitely check that problem before any others.

[lackej1971]

Thanks for the reply. I promise, I have looked until there are holes in my eyes for vacuum hoses that are off or damaged. While I too agree that the idle is too high on my car, and I know that it should be 700 - 800 rpm, I cannot seem to make mine go that low. When it gets down to about 1000 rpm (through adjustment), then when I start to drive the car, it will invariably start quitting on me when I turn corners or press the clutch in to stop at a sign, etc...

Most folks think that they have survived something if their car shuts off while they are in a turn and they have the mental capacity to get the car restarted and continue on down the road. Well, it's a normal thing for me. I start to tense up when I get to the turns in my trip home just so I can get ready for the shock of the car shutting off. I am a basket case!!!

I have adjusted the float level to the correct setting and it seems to be doing some better, but i am still having to "feather" the gas to keep it from quitting when I go into a right 90 degree turn (especially at night???). I also pulled the fuel line off the Carb and used the fuel pump to squirt some gas out of the line into a cup. Well, it had some water in it, so I put some IsoHeet in my tank and I am in the process of burning it out now.

I will consider any and all improvements suggested to try and make this car run as long as possible. Please help. Are there any valves that may need replacing that would help this car get a more steady idle?

Thanks, James

[RamThis]

Sounds like you need to drain your fuel tank and dry it out. Also, there is a tech post on here that shows how to remove the top had off the carb to gain access to the fuel bowl, you need to do that as well to get the water out of the fuel bowl. You also need to remove the fuel filters and blow out the lines with some compressed air and possibly some carb cleaner spray, and replace both your filters. Finally pop in some new spark plugs and the problem should go away.

The reason it dies on a turn is because you are sloshing the water in your fuel bowl over to the jets and you give your engine a nice shot of water in the cylinders and it basically grounds out the spark plug for a moment and makes your fuel vapor disappear and replaced with water vapor. This really isnt damaging to an engine, in fact, you probably have very nice clean cylinders from the water injection you are getting lol.

[lackej1971]

WOW! Thank You so much for explaining the turning problem to me. I was absolutely tripping out over this. Let me ask you something: Do you think that I could just inject some IsoHeet fuel/water drier into the fuel bowl so that it would bond with the water and burn it out?

Since I put that stuff in my tank, I have noted a marked improvement in the drivability of my car. I have another bottle that i am going to use also when I fill up again. Man!!! It is so nice to get this car running smoother. I still have to clean my radiator out again to get some more rust out of the system, but that isn't bad and it's a damn sight cheaper than a car payment!

Thanks for all the help so far, I really mean that to everybody!!!! BTW, does anybody know of a diagram for a cold air intake for these cars? I am a machinist/Tool and Die Maker by trade and would like to try and build my own from Aluminum Tubing. If you know of one, please post the link to it in your reply.

James

[RamThis]

I would still pull the carb airhat off just to be sure. Ive found that if you have water, chances are you also got some trash with it that for some ungodly reason gets past the filters. Water will also pit out an aluminum carb, so the more water you get out, the better. Ive seen water pit out a carb through .100" thick aluminum until it looked like swiss cheese. Then its either time for some JB Weld, or a new carb LOL.

I would also like to know if there is a CAI for these cars. Sure would be a sight easier to work around that that stupid big-ass flat airfilter housing thats on it now.....

[lackej1971]

MAN!!!! Today I was driving to work and my car was running fine. Then, for no reason, it just quit on me! Well, it gets worse! The starter would not even turn over. NOTHING, NADA, ZILCH!!!! It did this on Halloween and let me tell you, it's not a treat taking the starter off of these cars, IT SUCKS!

So I think my starter finally bit the dust after warning me it was about to go out on me. Damn! I had a new starter but I thought "since it turned over with it taken off the car, then it's OK". WRONG!!!!!!!!!!

So I am off to spend 80 bucks for a new starter 2morrow after the 50 it cost me to get it towed today. I hope that this fixes it. Let me ask you guys something: Is there some sort of clutch sensor or relay that can cause this to happen? It would be ALOT cheaper if that were the case.

Thanks, James

[VTEC_Inside]

The first thing I would do is check the choke plate position. The likelyhood is that its not opening.

I had all kinds of idle problems that were choke related. They went away when I changed the choke puller.

[lackej1971]

Thanks for the reply. Yeah, I have checked the choke plate and it seems to be fine. The fact is that the car seems to be RUNNING pretty good, it's just getting it started now that is a pain. The starter went out for good yesterday and now I have to take it off and get another one. I am just glad that I did this once before so I know pretty much what I need to do this time.

These older Hondas are so cramped when it comes to room to work, that you simply cannot get your hands in them. I don't think I could do this as a job because I would just freak out after a little while. Anyway, I am really hoping that the starter is the problem and that a new one will fix it.

I guess I am scared that with my luck the way it is, I will have a bad ignition switch or some mysterious sensor gone bad!

Thanks, James

[lackej1971]

Well, I removed my old starter today and went to get another one. While there, they went ahead and checked the old one and it was smoking when it would run. I bought a new one!!!! Well, it went on pretty easily and I said a quick prayer and just hit the ignition to see if it would start. It turned over and jumped to life.

I almost started breakdancing in my driveway!!! Reassembled everything and drained my antifreez from about 4 days ago so I could REALLY flush the system really good. I removed the bleeder valve from the thermostat housing and replaced it (temporarily) with a piece of clear 3/8 O.D. hose. I then put the hose into the radiator filler cap and turned it on. Once the car warmed up and the thermostat opened up, I could see muck flowing out of the coolant system through the hose. The water was staeming hot and was coming out strong.

I let it run like that until the water ran clear and then I opened the drain on the radiator and drain the water out. Refilled with Coolant and came to a real big conclusion: YOU MUST HAVE GOOD CLEAN ANTIFREEZE IN A HONDA.

My car is running stronger and better than ever before. The tires almost squeal when it takes off and i am not even trying to make them!!!

Thanks to everybody for their advice and I am sure I will have more questions later on.

Thanks Again, James

[RamThis]

Glad you got your problem sorted out. I think mine runs better now that I got all the rust flushed out of the system as well. At least, it seems to idle better for some reason. I know most everything in these cars are run on vacuum that is linked to so many other systems, that one thing not working just right can throw off a myriad of things. Crazy system, guess thats what you have to expect of a car from an era when they were trying to learn how to make it run clean enough for the C.A.R.B emissions laws, before the days of the Powertrain Control Modules......

[lackej1971]

Yeah, the vaccuum lines on these cars seem to go for miles and they all run off of one another (It Seems). I had a really bad problem with surging in my car some time ago and found it to be caused by a disconnected vacuum line. Another thing that seemed to make mine run better was to clean off the sensor that is mounted into the intake by 2 screws. When you take it out, it looks like a little black probe. I cleaned it with a spray of CRC Electronics Cleaner, and it really seemed to help. I don't know if it REALLY did ANYTHING, but it made me feel better.
What exactly is your car doing and I may be able to help.
James