How does the lower front control arm mount to the subframe/kmember/engine cradle deal
In the fiasco of replacing a driver's side lower ball joint, we attempted to remove the lower control arm in order to get at that fork/arm bolt that is a PITA.
Anyway, the control arm bolt started to loosen, but then it just spins and spins. Won't get any tighter or back out.
I can't see how it is mounted to the engine cradle as its boxed on the one end. Is there a nut that WAS tack-welded inside there? I just don't want the whole suspension coming out from under this thing.
it sounds as though the bolt itself is seized to the bushing. This is a comon problem with cars that deal with snow and salt. Unfortunately if you dont have a blow torch the only way I have been able to get seized bolts off when they are seized in the bushing is either with a sawzall or a circular cutting wheel.
Just cut the bolt on both sides of the control arm between the control arm and the stamped steel subframe part. After you get it out if the bushing is still good you might try getting a shop with a blow torch to get it out of the bushing but most likely you will have to replace the bushing in the arm or get another arm from the junkyard with good bushings. Whichever is cheaper for you.
it sounds like a more serious problem,the bolt probably started to back out,but because it was frozen to the bushing,it probably stripped out the threads in the frame. if it won't tighten this is almost certainly the case. I'm not sure how you are going to fix this,but the car will probably be down for a while. the threads are in the frame itself. I'm not sure if there is a welded on nut or not. on one of my earlier hondas i had to replace an entire welded on subframe member due to this same problem. it's not safe to drive the car like this at all. find a way to get it fixed before you drive it again. thats why i wanted a southern accord,I've taken off every fastener on the suspension and nothing was even frozen. the honda before this was from indianna so you get the picture.
lostforawhile-that is not what i wanted to hear, but you sound like you are right-on with the diagnosis. Unfortunately, I'm going to have to drive it for a while as there aren't really any options at this point. I can't believe what a crappy design that is thought. The bolt hasn't moved out any in the past 500 miles or so but I know its still not a great idea to keep driving it.
I thought about getting a whole junkyard subframe but who knows if it will be any better being that I'm in the St. Louis area.
Another idea that I had was to cut the stamped steel with a torch or plasma cutter to see the end of the bolt. Then I could possibly weld a nut on the back, but really I don't know as I can't see it and who knows how much cutting out a spot would weaken the entire thing. Do you know if that lower control arm bolt is splined or is it a regular type bolt?
This sounds like a lot of work for a car that I paid $50 for...3.5 years ago.
you also have the option to pull your subframe out and see if someone can fix it, maby a body shop that deals with this kind of stuff. thats common collision damage. maby you can get to the back of it. I wonder if it can be helicoiled? that subframe does remove by the way. on my 81 it was part of the frame. it could be cut out and a nut welded, as long as steel of the proper gauge was welded back over the hole. just let a proffesional do this. some people say this will weaken the frame,but if the hole is welded back up properly it's plenty strong enough for a twenty seven hundred pound car.
your only other option is to get the bolt out somehow,then look to see if the nut is still welded in there,if it is you can helicoil it.
Re: How does the lower front control arm mount to the subframe/kmember/engine cradle deal
If the subframe is coming out, the car is going to the junkyard.
I checked on the bolt again today, it hasn't backed out any further since the last time (2 weeks) I checked it.
I'm wondering if a nut holds it on and the nut was tack welded inside the boxed part of the subframe. I sure hope that thing doesn't come out or break while I'm driving. On a side note, it looks like there is some support coming from all the other mounting points so hopefully it would be controllable.
Anyone else care to chime in?
If I recall its not a nut on the end, its a threaded part of the frame
Thanks for the replies guys.
Damn. Well, I guess maybe get it out by cutting it and helicoil the frame. Either way, sounds like a lot of work.Originally Posted by FyreDaug
Do you remember if that bolt is a splined or special type bolt?
if you can get the thing out i's not that big of a deal to helicoil it.
I think its just a heavy grade bolt. I could have had a pic for you, but I didnt see this thread in time. It only goes into the the frame about 1.5cm (from being totally out to putting it all the way in, goes about 1.5cm) I dunno if that helps any.
Yeah if you have to just cut it out, get the arm out and retap-helicoil the spot. If its stripped youd have to do it anyways, unless its the threads on the bolt... but even then... lawl dont listen to me. Just get it out and helicoil it.
Thanks guys, I'll have to talk to my buddy (whose idea it was to start turning that bolt anyway) to see what we can do as he's got all the tools.
If/when we get it fixed, I'll post up the results.
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