Possible ENgine build idea

[DDRaptor]

I had to post this twice the computers at work are gay with this website.

Here's my Idea

Twin Carbed Manifold
Accord FI/Prelude Header cut off and remade into a 4-2 with 2 indvidual reso, cats and mufflers

engine parts.
camshaft
a second a20 engine to rebuild
water pump
oil pump
new gas pump

umm can't think of anything else right now.

put up some opnions i'm expecting to spend ~$700 for all this.

THanks guys.

[MessyHonda]

what is your goal? im very lost. are you going to bore it out? do a stock rebuild or performance.

[A20A1]

It would be better to keep the 4-2-1 together at the header then split them with an X pipe where the cat is.

If you do go your way, don't get too large of exhaust pipe, 2" at most.
You really don't need the extra CFM of flow if you're only running on 2 cylinders per pipe, it's only about ~1000cc displacement.

Assuming a 2" pipe flows about 360 CFM, you'll have about 720 CFM flow total from the pipes, but your cat and muffler will determine how much restriction is added. 720CFM supports about 327 HP with little build up of backpressure.

The car will sound different because you'll hear the gap between the cylinders firing.

Check out this thread, I list the SMSP and other High flow Cats. Not cheap though.
https://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352

[3G Jester]

I had to post this twice the computers at work are gay with this website.

not gay, you ment to say you could not connect properly to the website.


and im with messyhonda. i really have no idea what goals you have in mind, or how your going to get there. Have you ever rebuilt an engine before? Are you going to have a shop do this? What numbers are you looking at putting down? are you just trying to slap something together better then what you have stock?

and with the "cant think of anything else right now line" i am worried. it means your not putting the required amount of thought and effort into rebuilding your engine. its a large under taking. dont half ass it.

[DDRaptor]

I just said cause that's all i could come up with at the time cause i worked 4 16 hour days so i'm a bit loopy to say the least.

hey a20 why is it better to split the pipe rather than piping the cylinders seperate?? would'nt that allow for more torque??

thanks for the answers.

[A20A1]

Hrm, Wouldn't there be more chances for vacuum in the primaries if all 4 were tied together at some point.
The length of the secondaries can be changed, so if you want to make the secondaries longer before they meet it will effect the tq. You're pretty much stuck with what you got in terms of primary length... I think you should lenghten those instead if you're going to split the exhaust up the way you do.

If you keep the same diameter pipe right of the secondaries all the way to the back, it will throw out any timing of the exhaust pulses. So if you run it your way , you might want to think about adding a step in the secondaries to create a pulse earlier... maybe use the cats as a step by upping their inlet diameter, that way when the secondaries meet the sudden increase in diameter of the cat pipe you get a pulse.

Chances for making the most of your setup right off the bat is slim... and you're not making it better by sticking to the primary length the header comes with. You should just build one from scratch with Y pipes. That way you can lenghten the primaries.

[shepherd79]

actually if you run dual exhaust from the head all the way back you will lose low end and but you will pick up top end.

[gfrg88]

actually if you run dual exhaust from the head all the way back you will lose low and but you will pick up top end.

yep. kinda like going with a 4" exhaust, sort of. you get the idea....

[DDRaptor]

damn i got it backward. I'm aiming more for torque top end i could care less for theres not place to really find out how fast i can go.

[gfrg88]

damn i got it backward. I'm aiming more for torque top end i could care less for theres not place to really find out how fast i can go.

youre looking for more torque at the top end?? what?!? im lost. i think you still have a lot of reading to do buddy.

[A20A1]

damn i got it backward. I'm aiming more for torque top end i could care less for theres not place to really find out how fast i can go.

1) Choosing Type of Header; 4-1 or 4-2-1
Plan where you want to make power and what kind of driving you will be doing.
Long pipes move the power up in the RPM, Short pipes move the power down in the RPM
- 4-2-1 offers more usable/broader rpm range and often more torque through cylinder pairing.
- 4-1 have longer primaries in most cases moving torque up in the powerband
- Long Tubed 4-2-1 Does the same as a 4-1 but offers the advantage of cylinder pairing.




So you'll make tq but chances are if you run it your way you'll have tq down low because of the really short primaries... but then once you're out of that narrow rpm range, who knows what will happen.

[A20A1]

youre looking for more torque at the top end?? what?!? im lost. i think you still have a lot of reading to do buddy.

You can do that... assuming the power is based on curves you can move the curve back or forward in the rpm range by adjusting the header pipe lenghts, valve timing, and ignition timing.

[DDRaptor]

It's called i don't proofread. I prefer more Torque than top end cause therse no room here for top end. I like leaving people in the dust.

lack of sleep is very bad.

[DDRaptor]

I just finized welding up the 2" Cherry bomb muffler it's very quiet. but i no longer have the block around 2000-2500 rpm so if that's just a 2" mufler imagine when the whole thing is piped

[MessyHonda]

adjustable cam gear FTW.....it helps you get low end....top end or just leave it stock....one of the best mods i ever did.

[DDRaptor]

true how much is one of those gears?

[DDRaptor]

OK i went looking through IPP now i have an idea of what want.

Stock REbuild (cause they don't have a High performance kit)
-HV oil pump
-HV Water pump

Camshaft (not sure by what company yet)
Cam Gear
Clutch (not sure what brand)
Flywheel
Header Pacesetter or custom built or modified stock.
Accel ignition kits (possible)

Pulley kit if available.

and then obviously i have to learn which 2 carbs to buy and have the manifold made, because i don't think i can do that but only time will tell.

obviously i also need a 5-speed tranny and all the parts for the tranny swap.

[MessyHonda]

man..you got alot of work...i say you sell your car and get a fuel injected 5 speed.

[cygnus x-1]

If you are looking for ideas and where to get stuff check my engine build thread over on Preludepower.

http://preludepower.com/forums/showthread.php?t=238337

I even listed part numbers and prices. $700 is not much money if you need any machine work done.

C|

[shepherd79]

yes they don't make HP rebuild kits but you can piece it all together. there are parts available, you just have to search and look for them. We have all the info on this site. Just don't expect to get all the info on the white plater with a blue ribon.

with ported head and medium grind cam with dual webers you can make about 130hp at the wheels easy.

[Jspec1]

Would it be possible to throw on a VTEC head off of a, say F22 and then just use some Weber DCOE's? I've seen similiar things done to a few Civic's on this other Honda forum that I post on.

[MessyHonda]

Would it be possible to throw on a VTEC head off of a, say F22 and then just use some Weber DCOE's? I've seen similiar things done to a few Civic's on this other Honda forum that I post on.

yeah...i dont think anyone has done that...i remember some one trying to put a DOHC head but they never got it to run. the best way to get DOHC and vtec is to do an engine swap.

[Jspec1]

yeah...i dont think anyone has done that...i remember some one trying to put a DOHC head but they never got it to run. the best way to get DOHC and vtec is to do an engine swap.

I was refering to the SOHC VTEC F22.

[MessyHonda]

I was refering to the SOHC VTEC F22.

why would you want to put a 140hp engine...the mounts would cost more money than its worth...best way is stick a b18 or b20

[Ichiban]

why would you want to put a 140hp engine...the mounts would cost more money than its worth...best way is stick a b18 or b20

I believe he was referring to the F22 SOHC head swap, not engine swap.