Open-Loop Cam Test Dyno Results

[Justanothermike]

thanks for the comments guys. This motor wasn't built to be an all out NA build. So there is definately still room for improvement. You could go the other route of higher compression pistons without the welded combustion chambers, larger valves, maybe a larger TB, and the exhuast definately could be upgraded. With some of that stuff you loss driveablity tho but the race cam would definately benefit more from those mods. And more tuning flexibility would definately be needed. I think one of the most important aspect of this set up is the OBD1 conversion. Without it its pretty much impossible for these results to happen. And there is defiantely room for improvement with the ECU. We used a cheap chipped ecu. If we did some more ecu fine tuning with Hondata, or Chrome it would probably do better still.

[Cheeseburger]

so how much did u spend in all of ur engine mods?

[Justanothermike]

so how much did u spend in all of ur engine mods?

oh god, this car has passed the point where u could track all the money put into it long long long ago.

[Legend_master]

oh god, this car has passed the point where u could track all the money put into it long long long ago.

i feel you on that one .

[RobT5580]

Lol I stopped counting receipts after i hit the $15,000 mark........Sometimes i question it but at this point im to deep to give it up so i keep going.

Nice work Mike glad to see you guys are still around.

[bobafett]

Lol I stopped counting receipts after i hit the $15,000 mark........Sometimes i question it but at this point im to deep to give it up so i keep going.
Nice work Mike glad to see you guys are still around.

*gulp* I can't wait for that point...

[shepherd79]

Lol I stopped counting receipts after i hit the $15,000 mark........Sometimes i question it but at this point im to deep to give it up so i keep going.
Nice work Mike glad to see you guys are still around.

$15K, man that is a lot of money. wouldn't be better to buy a newer car that makes that kind of power.

[MessyHonda]

$15K, man that is a lot of money. wouldn't be better to buy a newer car that makes that kind of power.

yeah but then you would not have the pleasure to say i built that car with my own 2 hands....and still spank ppl with newer cars.

[rjudgey]

$15k huh thats nothing especially as you guy's pay about half price on all your parts and labour compared to rip off U.K.

Can't even imagine howmuch i've spent over the last 10 years on my Lude enough to buy a nearly new Z4M i should think. The below is what i can think of immediately so i'm sure there's quite a few thousand hidden out of sight and mind somewhere within 10 years. And yes all my mates thing i'm nuts and i probably am ;0)

In one year spent $3000 on custom front brakes alone, then another $3000 on a race flowed head with custom made bronze guides and 5 angle valve grind, $3000 on block re-build which then had to have 4 pistons/rings and bearings replaced because one of them melted (whole lot needed to be rebalanced to new pistons) that was another $2000, the Webers and inlet manifold came to about $2000 as well, and custom stainless steel exhaust system a year later was about $1000, then a Teg Gearbox conversion with all new internals, flywheel and competition clutch as last one fell apart was another $1500, originally had 4 new shocks and Jamex springs $1500 but had to be rebuilt again 7 years later with new rear arms, Koni shocks, AVO springs, all new bushes in front and rod ends, ball joints etc was about $2500.

During the 10 years i've also bought 4 whole cars for spares and kept one of them on the road as it had B20A, cost about $2000 in total. Also over last 10 years built numerous engines which i systematically blew up in the need for speed roughly re-built and blew up about 10 engines which all had certain amount of machining work done to them, like re-boring, skimming, decking etc. so maybe roughly $4000 in machining work over ten years, 4 gearbox re-builds over ten years at about $2000 including cost of two extra boxes.

This year have bought parts for the ultimate A20 build consisting of two sets of Eagle rods with ARP bolts, 2 sets of custom forged pistons on order, yet more ACL bearings and another full gasket kit, Full Race head as far as you can go no more flow job with custom stainless steel valves 33mm inlet and 37mm exhaust, bronze guides, welded injection recess, welded port in front of guide boss, radius valve seats and valve heads, custom spec camshaft from piper cams, Teg box re-built and new mainshaft as last one was badly corroded, Pacesetter Header primary's with custom secondaries with 2.25" main pipe leading to the pacesetter 2.25" system, custom stainless steel inlet manifold with 6.5" runners at 7.5 degree angle to weber DCOE 45's. estimated cost on this one will be about $4000 for everything.

And don't even go there with homuch it's cost me in insurance and fuel for the last 10 years just roughly probably about $70k which is quite a scary thought!!!! no wonder i haven't been able to afford to buy my own house!!!

Oh and i suppose we must not forget the dozens of wheels and tyres bought estimated around $2500 roughly probably more!!!

Next year plan on building the ultimate B20A which should hopefully disprove that the B20A is useless unless turboed should have similar spec as the A20 apart from having two race camshafts and even bigger valves than the A20 plus the fact theres 16 o them as well and i finally have some adjustable pulley's!!!!

Oh and this time last year bought a brand new BMW 120d Msport so add $60k to the above i think works out at well over $150k dollars for ten years of playing around in cars. Also had about $10k worth of car audio equipment that is now sitting in my room doing nothing, as all it does is slow the car down!!!

[rjudgey]

doh double post

[rjudgey]

I will gt a A20 to produce more than 200whp that is my mission ;0)

[RobT5580]

$15K, man that is a lot of money. wouldn't be better to buy a newer car that makes that kind of power.

Its not like it was a lump sum but i did lay that down in one summer. I like my car enough and i realize i wont get much of that back but when all is said and done i should have something pretty original on the streets. Last summer the few people that saw my B20A turbo gave me lots of props for doing what i did and now i know where the bugs were im pretty confident this time around she will be nice.

But the guys out there like Mike from openloop are great to have cause they put a lot of R&D into this accord and i give them a lot of respect for that.

[rjudgey]

Couldn't agree more i think that heads a beaut and the 3rd Gen Coupe is one of the best looking Hondas made except maybe my 2G B20A lude might just be slightly better (although both very similar) just a shame there selling the car and not going to develope the engine and the head any further as i said before with relatively cheap mods and parts they could easily see more power with the existing setup and a better tune on the ECU. But hey if someone offers them the right kinda money then hopefully they'll look after the car and maybe do some more work on the engine and take some of my advice on further mods would be good to see a 3rd Gen Coupe with 200whp!!! I just wish there wasn't the atlantic in the way otherwise Mike you'd have cash in your hand right now!! Damn sometimes i hate being stuck on the wrong side of the water :0(
Just out of interest howmuch would it cost to ship a car to U.K. any ideas?
A Mint Jap B20A with no mods would run me $3200 plus $1200 for shipping this is U.S. dollars BTW divide in 2 equals pounds.

[shepherd79]

yeah i know it is not big lump of money at ones, but it still hurts.
As for MIKE, I give him 2 big thumbs up.

[AccordEpicenter]

yeah i think for the results this build, while not being all out and over the top, sounded pretty cost effective, especially because na is usually way too expensive. My car im coming up on 10k spent but youll be hard pressed to find somthing that will go faster for the money when its done. Itll be VERY impressive when its running, i promise. SC6152S> you

[gosse]

Because it has more horse power dont means it faster.. New car weigh a lot with all the crap going into it..

[smufguy]

Mike those are really nice numbers. I like the torque curve on the 256/270 better than the race cam, even tho the race cam seems to rev a lot higher

Nice stout numbers you got there.

[Sporno]

well if they can pull off these kinds numbers , i think it is possible to have a 200HP NA 3g with a decent powerband, look at the mods on the openloop accord vs guynaboo ( the AOY) ... ya know

[bobafett]

yeah its all in the tune imo..

and they both have obd1 swap. I think that is key for making any sort of drivable power with an NA a20... and even more so for a reliable boosted a20.

[rjudgey]

Allready had one you can achieve 200hp with a mild camshaft you just need everything else done properly but not excessive and twin webers suitabley jetted for the setup. Was very driveble did 30k miles in just over a year on that engine before conrods broke. reasonable low end and excellent midrange power all the way upto 7.5k rpm this was on a ET1 with A20 internals. A20 being built at present but with much larger exhaust valves, and my exhaust to inlet valve conversion, combined with aftermarket rods re-bushed to 20mm, titanium pins, forged Higher CR pistons, some serious amounts of head work and custom 6.5" inlet manifold plus exhaust and header should be adding upto 230-240bhp hopefully maybe bit more if i go mad on a custom camshaft grind with 290 degree 11mm lift on inlet and 295 degree and 12mm lift on exhaust. Not sure on Colt cams i might be tempted and try a race version of there tri flow see how that runs!!

[bobafett]

165.7whp x 15% drivetrain loss = 190.56 (flywheel hp)

170 whp = exactly 200 hp assuming a clean 15% drivetrain loss... you are less than 5whp away guys! rofl...

[Justanothermike]

well if they can pull off these kinds numbers , i think it is possible to have a 200HP NA 3g with a decent powerband, look at the mods on the openloop accord vs guynaboo ( the AOY) ... ya know

Did guaynabo89 ever get any numbers for his motor?? I'm interested to see what his is capable of putting down. His setup seems pretty similar.

[MessyHonda]

Did guaynabo89 ever get any numbers for his motor?? I'm interested to see what his is capable of putting down. His setup seems pretty similar.

i wish...they are going to have a dyno test day out here....i saw it on craigslist...13 buck a run with a min of 3 runs. its in livermore...i might check it out

[Cheeseburger]

set up a meet foo

[Justanothermike]

165.7whp x 15% drivetrain loss = 190.56 (flywheel hp)

170 whp = exactly 200 hp assuming a clean 15% drivetrain loss... you are less than 5whp away guys! rofl...

Yeah we're definately up around where a stock H22 and ITR puts out and around moded GSRs and B16s. Head to head we'd definately have something on them except probably the ITR. Quartermile wise i'd say somewhere around high 14s. In a hatchback this setup should be good for mid to low 14s.