I came across this ad on ebay Thailand today.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...m=260250340540
It doesn't look like for B20 but for B16 or something.
I am asking them if they make it themselves or not - if yes, they should be able to make for our car (A20A) with no problem. What do you think?
Or can you spot if it is made by well know supplier?
Last edited by epic1400cs; 12-08-2008 at 06:28 PM. Reason: my english!
dunno bout the a20a but looks like b20a at least, and b16/b18 as well
i think the a20's holes are like 0 00 0 instead of O O O O like B's
Last edited by A18A; 12-08-2008 at 01:33 AM.
good looking header, the B16 header does not fit the b20a but in a photo it is hard to tell. The shape and bolt patterns look the same but the dimensions are different. Even the B20xx header has to be drilled out and the end holes egged out to fit the B20a.
Do you guys think was this made by them? or does it look like the ones from other company like megan or something.
My intention is to find out if they can make header for A20A or not - this one is not for A20A, obvious from the shape of the flange and the port. Sorry if I wasn't clear.
It might fit B20A but the down pipe looks too short for our car - if you have B20A please let us know.
more than likely this is made by the same company that makes 99% of the headers on ebay. megan doesn't make their own, since most of the ones you get from ebay are teh same thing as a megan... you probably are not going to find anyone, especially an ebay store, to make a header for you. wishful thinking is all it is. and like i say in a lot of my posts, i'm not being a dick merely speaking the unfortunate truth.
also for this being a "nice looking header" i'm sad to tell you that it would more than likely crack at the welds as most of these ebay headers do. trust me i have a civic and have had 2 of these and 1 dc sports... i jumped a median with the dc and it still hasn't cracked... one of my ebay ones was cracked when i got it on the flange. my other one is holding up well but it's heat wrapped so i think that's helped.
dead white and blue
ive had many ebay headers on my cars, even shitty ass turbo manis too.. never had any crack, even at 15+ PSI..Originally Posted by stat1K
really? i'd figure you would have more with the salt spray and the colder environment in nor cal... i live in az maybe the dryness contributes... but i would put it more towards quality control you know?
dead white and blue
Thanks for your reply. However, I have seen quite few headers for B16, for example, with different pipe arrangement, flange shape, collector shape, welding sequence and pipe joint location. It made me think there must be at least more than one manufacturer/fabricator (apart from well known manufacturer such as DC, Spoon, Mugen) that design/fabricate these headers. I am thinking of these based on my experience working on Stainless Steel fabrication/machining/TIG welding for seven years as my job in the past.
In fact making header doesn't require such super special technique or facility - it is not easy job but with well equipped workshop and properly skilled people it is not that hard to produce one. In UK there are two individual companies that can make headers for A20A as "one-off". I have spoken to them to have their estimate but they are about $1000 and $1200 that is beyond my budget. Ideally I should make my own system (I did in the past) but I have now moved on and I don't have access to facility nor time (may be no money either) to do this, thats why I am looking for somebody who can make one at reasonable price but with good skill (I know thats may not be possible)
This is something I was wondering - some of the headers on the market has very narrow welding bead. The one I uploaded the picture has wide welding pitch. Both of these are to minimize the consumption of welding rod, simplify the welding procedure (=small welding is easier for welder to manage heat distortion = speed up production = economical).
On the other hand, DC headers seems to have rather wide and thick bead with very fine pitch that makes very solid and strong weld. But I assume it is rather hard for the welders to control the heat distortion during the fabrication. They say mild steel headers are more durable than SS headers - SS is very difficult with heat, it expands and warps harder like spring compare to mild steel. Is your DC header made out of Stainless Steel or mild steel? But if I can speak to the fabricator directly, even I might be able to ask them to change the welding pitch and width, that is another wish of mine
im in So. Cali
the cars ive had this on were in Colorado, where there's salt all over the roads during winter time. I just recently bought one of the cheapest header off ebay for my CB7, stainless steel. Hopefully this will hold up to all the daily driving i do with it....
That really does look like a Megan style/Ebay header. I've bought/installed for friends a lot of various headers for Hondas.
In terms of quality, I'd have to rank the Pacesetter as worst just because of the stupid black paint that burns off so you have to strip it first and then paint. Also, no flex pipe and the fact they give you junk gaskets is not helping either.
But the Megan/Ebay ones aren't much better. At least they give you a flex pipe and the SS seems to be holding up well. BUT the gaskets are garbage and the fitment is horrible. Like for my 90 Accord, you have to make a slight indent in the #1 pipe so it doesn't hit the AC line. This happened with both Megan and Ebay no name brand in 2 different 90 Accords. The head to manifold stud holes were also too big so you had to guess where the center was.
The Fujitsubo header was very nice quality BUT they also give you the sandwich type gasket for the manifold to downpipe and not the o-ring style. For a $800 header, you'd expect better. The gasket blew out after 1 month.
DC, Neuspeed, and Hedman ceramic headers were best bang for the buck. Fitment is good, can take quite a bit of abuse, flanges have the grooves for o-ring style gaskets so never had a leak problem, and usually priced well especially used ones. If there was a down side, it's the fact the ceramic coating sometimes flakes off after a couple years but that's not a big deal to me.
One thing I'd recommend for guys running them in places where they salt the roads, buy stainless bolts/nuts. If you ever have to remove the stuff, it'll come off just like you put it on yesterday even after a few years. The only header I had problems with salt was the Pacesetter where the black paint and the paint put on myself after had peeled off and the steel rusted.
Sorry, I was kinda off topic I think.
www.b20accord.com
not really off topic^^^
A good discussion of headers needs to be in all these threads, and yes the topic was inquring of materials and who makes headers.
The header pictured DOES look good. As to what it is really made of remains an unknown.
I recently got a Hedman Chickera (sp?) for a B20xx to go on a b20a, not a very good fit but I resolved that. Anyway I was not impressed with the quality compared to my DC. It is not the cereamic one btw , and it does not have grooves in the downpipe. The downpipe bolt pattern is identical to the DC though. Tubes were rather small IMO as well.
Sorry Yasu i highly doubt you'll get one made for cheap, only option is my guy or Hayward and Scott for a reasonable price, my guy will probably be a bit cheaper than H/S but not by much, and the pacestter you can get ceramic coated rather than painted but yes the ball joint is crap better of with cutting it off and putting on flexi. Other option is S&S if they have any left but that is a 4-1 so won't really suit your car. Other option is to port and flow your cast header, enlarge the downpipe ports at the bottom to suit the downpipe size and have a custom downpipe made up like mine in Stainless and suitable system with mandrel bends. Can get a downpipe made for £150 with a steel flange and stainless piping if you want stainless flange will be about £200 as the flange will have to be specially cut to shape. If you wanted a whole system and downpipe looking at around £500 maybe less if you are able to use any parts from your old system. What are you running in terms of an exhaust at the moment??
If you have been doing it that long i would suggest making it yourself no matter what. and i wouldn't consider spoon or mugen header manufactures as they get most of their designs from the same places... now dc is a header manufacturer and you can tell by the designs.
DC I know makes a stainless but the normal ones are mild steel. Mine is a mild steel ceramic coated. It's probably the best 80 dollars i have ever spent on the car (i know you guys hate me for my civic)On the other hand, DC headers seems to have rather wide and thick bead with very fine pitch that makes very solid and strong weld. But I assume it is rather hard for the welders to control the heat distortion during the fabrication. They say mild steel headers are more durable than SS headers - SS is very difficult with heat, it expands and warps harder like spring compare to mild steel. Is your DC header made out of Stainless Steel or mild steel? But if I can speak to the fabricator directly, even I might be able to ask them to change the welding pitch and width, that is another wish of mine
i thought your sig said nor cal that's why i said that either way i live in a super dry arid environment with no moisture so no rust typically. the only problem i would see with my climate is the heat. 115F easy in the summer plus the heat from the exhaust already would probably crack a header easily... especially if i hit some cool water like a puddle or something to cool it.im in So. Cali
the cars ive had this on were in Colorado, where there's salt all over the roads during winter time. I just recently bought one of the cheapest header off ebay for my CB7, stainless steel. Hopefully this will hold up to all the daily driving i do with it....
not really off topic^^^
A good discussion of headers needs to be in all these threads, and yes the topic was inquring of materials and who makes headers.
The header pictured DOES look good. As to what it is really made of remains an unknown.
I recently got a Hedman Chickera (sp?) for a B20xx to go on a b20a, not a very good fit but I resolved that. Anyway I was not impressed with the quality compared to my DC. It is not the cereamic one btw , and it does not have grooves in the downpipe. The downpipe bolt pattern is identical to the DC though. Tubes were rather small IMO as well.
it's Hedman Chikara for your spelling inquiry. The hedman are nice but they seem to have the same problem as the dc with the paint. other than that they are a thinner tube. Was the hedman you had the stepped version? because that's an interesting design to me but it seems like it would work well to create better flow. at least that's waht they say...
most 4-2-1 2 piece designs are going to be the same downpipe bolt pattern to save on cost of gaskets etc...
the best designed headers i have ever seen are from Bisimoto and RMF... both designs make large horse power gains with not very large diameter tubing... they achieve it through equal length designs and large collectors. the problem with a header is it's designed for a car in mass quantity. this means that it will be better than stock but not great for everything. this is why i think in your guys case the custom is going to be the best bet since that way you can tune it to your needs.
dead white and blue
Hi YK86, long time, nice to hear from you! Thanks for your insight. Its shame that DC Stainless Header is not available for our car! It is good to know your view about the Pacesetter - I hear mixed reputation about it.
Hi rjudgey, yeah, I am just trying to find cheaper option without sacrificing the quality much - I noticed the seller is from Thailand. I don't know much about the country apart from hot curry and smiley nice people but I just thought they might have great ability to produce fantastic header at affordable price
stat1K, yes I should make one myself but as I wrote I don't have damn time and facility at the moment apart from toy like MIG. If it takes 50years to save £600 for SS header, I might consider making one myself before I die. Please wish my good luck to find better job
After one week from sending my e-mail to the ebay seller, I haven't heard anything from them - I assume they are on holiday or they are not making it by themselves.
i would assume they don't speak english and ignored you. i can tell you right now that i have seen those same headers from about 20 different ebay sellers at least. if i had a welder i would be more than happy to make one for you and i wouldn't charge you 600 gbps either. just buy the dc any be happy with medocrity that's what i did with my civic.
dead white and blue
Can you suggest other ebay seller who sells identical item - I couldn't find other header with this reasonable level of finish. Especially 2-1 collector welding is very tidy.
Have you worked on 304 with TIG before?
As i said other options are let my guy make it for you but will have to have the car for a couple of days, i can get a gasket to him to make some flanges that's not a problem maybe if we do two at a time might be cheaper i have to see him see what he says, i'm sure i could get one made for maybe £450-500, other options are i could get you a downpipe made for the 2-1 section with a 2" collector like the one on my Red lude combined with some DIY porting and polishing on your stock cast 4-2 header would be worth 5-7bhp and a lot of torque!! My 1.8 produced 127lbft with stock cam and twin carbs so i would imagine your lightly tuned 2.0 should put down 130-135lbft maybe bit more, and certainly more with a header. Is the system you had made got mandrel bends or crush bends?? If it's crush bends i'd certainly suggest my guy cuts them out and replaces them at the same time this would be even better for torque and bhp. Last time he made me a Downpipe for the B20A cost £150 and was lovely was a real shame i had to give it to someone to use for another car really wanted to keep it lol!!
Sorry for the late reply my file server at work collapsed giving me exciting time. Yeah, £450-500 sounds realistic but can't afford at the moment, shame. The power gain you mentioned sounds very attractive while keeping my car MOT(test) friendly. Unfortunately the ex pipe is crush bends so replacing into mandrel ones would be great. Another things I am thinking is to swap the back box from 2inch single in single out to 2inch single in twin out to reduce some exhaust note (I have learned that back box with Y pipe inside reduces noise) as well as giving OEM like rear view.
Hmmm i wouldn't you heard how loud my red one is didn't you???
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